Is the Great Commission irrelevant for the church now?

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Guojing

Banned
#121
Jan 12, 2019
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#121
TLC209 said:
Yes that applies to the church. If you do not forgive you will not be forgiven. Jesus taught us that. Paul cannot save your soul Guojing.
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I realized Jamuej and you are fond of changing what Bible verses are saying, and then patronizing people by claiming that you are saying the same thing as what they are saying.
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

Senior Member
#122
Nov 17, 2015
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Guojing said:
So you do agree that the 12 understood that the GC was meant for the Jews first, then to the Gentiles.

The fundamental question I was asking in this thread is, why do the Gentile Church think that the GC is meant for them, if the Jews as a nation, have already rejected Christ?

Surely if they take the GC seriously, they should start, as the 12 did, with Jerusalem (Luke's version of the GC). But that option is no longer open.
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Why the option of witnessing to all nations is no longer open where in fact the Parallel passage of the so called GC is intended for such. Actually the passage you mention in trying to justify and discredit the worldwide missionary effort to evangelize and make disciples had no bearing. There’s no witnessing mentioned, there’s no gospel mentioned. In short, it falls short to the intended meaning as written by the other gospel writers.
 
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Guojing

Banned
#123
Jan 12, 2019
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#123
fredoheaven said:
Why the option of witnessing to all nations is no longer open where in fact the Parallel passage of the so called GC is intended for such. Actually the passage you mention in trying to justify and discredit the worldwide missionary effort to evangelize and make disciples had no bearing. There’s no witnessing mentioned, there’s no gospel mentioned. In short, it falls short to the intended meaning as written by the other gospel writers.
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I am talking about Jerusalem. How can one start from Jerusalem to preach the Gospel to the Jews now? You will probably be arrested or deported from Israel if you were to do so.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#124
#124
Guojing said:
Some arguments why
  1. The term "Great Commission" was never in the Bible, and Bible translators only added that in the heading.
  2. Matthew's version, the most popular one, had Jesus instructing them to teach others to follow "everything" he has taught them, which if you read the entire Gospel of Matthew, had instructions which are clearly incompatible with Paul's Gospel. "Sell all you have'. 'do not go into the Gentiles' 'I was only sent to the lost sheep of Israel', 'Follow what the Pharisees instruct you as they sat on Moses's seat' etc.
  3. John's version had an instruction that only the Roman Catholic church practiced, 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.” No Protestant church that I know of practice this.
  4. Mark's version said you must believe AND be baptized to be saved, safe to say, not many churches follow the latter. Furthermore, no church would tell their Gentile believers to pick up serpents as a sign now.
  5. Luke's version say you must start from Jerusalem, obviously from what Paul said in Romans 9-11, that avenue is now closed since the vast majority of the Jews rejected the gospel.
What do the rest of you think?
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Is everyone on the earth saved? Then that's your answer. Simple. Go reach the Lost!!
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#125
#125
Guojing said:
I am talking about Jerusalem. How can one start from Jerusalem to preach the Gospel to the Jews now? You will probably be arrested or deported from Israel if you were to do so.
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Guojing said:
I am talking about Jerusalem. How can one start from Jerusalem to preach the Gospel to the Jews now? You will probably be arrested or deported from Israel if you were to do so.
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Nope, not true. Just had a couple in our church last Sunday that spent years in Israel evangelizing and are headed back as soon as they can. They use to hold worship services and said many people came to ask questions and then began to attend regularly. They absolutely love Israel.
 
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corazondeldei

Active member
#126
Apr 17, 2019
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#126
notuptome said:
Context is essential for understanding. We as believers do not have the authority to forgive sin. We can and certainly should forgive those who sin against us but there is a bigger issue present in the passage.

Read Mat 16:18-19 in conjunction with this passage. The keys are the word of God. Christians go about declaring the testimony of Christ to every man. Those who receive the word of God will have their sins forgiven by Christ. Those who reject the word of God will be forever bound to their sin in eternal condemnation.

God is not so capricious as to entrust the forgiveness of sin into the hands of men who themselves are first of all sinners.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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OSAS view right?
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#127
Jan 12, 2019
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#127
kaylagrl said:
Is everyone on the earth saved? Then that's your answer. Simple. Go reach the Lost!!
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Yes, reaching the lost is good, but not thru the instructions given by the Great Commission.
 
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Guojing

Banned
#129
Jan 12, 2019
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#129
Nehemiah6 said:
So now you believe you are wiser than God?
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As stated many times here, there are people who rightly divide the word according to different dispensations.

You are of course free to reject that method of understanding the Bible.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#130
#130
Guojing said:
Yes, reaching the lost is good, but not thru the instructions given by the Great Commission.
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So what instructions given in the GC do you think we shouldn't be doing?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#131
Jan 12, 2019
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#131
kaylagrl said:
So what instructions given in the GC do you think we shouldn't be doing?
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John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”

Are you aware that this verse is part of the great commission too? Do you still practice this?
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#132
#132
Guojing said:
John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”

Are you aware that this verse is part of the great commission too? Do you still practice this?
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I'm not following... What part of the GC are you saying is not for today? In practical usage what should we not be doing since you believe the GC doesn't apply. You reach the lost how? That was my question. Or are you saying we have the power to forgive sins and save people?
 
JosephsDreams

JosephsDreams

Senior Member
#133
Dec 31, 2015
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I have often had confusion about this one. We can forgive sins? I am not so sure, one way or another, about this, but tend to come closer to the side that we can not. Anyone want to clear this up for me?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#134
Jan 12, 2019
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#134
kaylagrl said:
I'm not following... What part of the GC are you saying is not for today? In practical usage what should we not be doing since you believe the GC doesn't apply. You reach the lost how? That was my question. Or are you saying we have the power to forgive sins and save people?
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You asked me for an example of
So what instructions given in the GC do you think we shouldn't be doing?
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I have provided you with John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”

The fact that you replied with
Or are you saying we have the power to forgive sins and save people?
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I think it shows that you yourself agree that this particular part of the GC is not meant for the church today. Is that a correct interpretation?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#135
Jan 12, 2019
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#135
JosephsDreams said:
I have often had confusion about this one. We can forgive sins? I am not so sure, one way or another, about this, but tend to come closer to the side that we can not. Anyone want to clear this up for me?
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As I have said in the opening post of this thread, the Roman Catholics took that verse seriously in their concept of absolution. In early Acts, I can see Peter practicing that by basically condemning Ananias and Sapphira to their deaths for lying to the Holy Spirit.

Nowadays of course, no Protestant Church that I know of, take that verse seriously. It showed that certain instructions provided for under the GC, are no longer relevant for the current dispensation of Grace.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#137
#137
Guojing said:
You asked me for an example of

I have provided you with John 20:23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”

The fact that you replied with

I think it shows that you yourself agree that this particular part of the GC is not meant for the church today. Is that a correct interpretation?
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Am I to assume you're Catholic? Either way only God can forgive sins. Someone who is not sinless themselves cannot forgive sin. So no, you've got a wrong interpretation.
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#138
Jan 12, 2019
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#138
kaylagrl said:
Am I to assume you're Catholic? Either way only God can forgive sins. Someone who is not sinless themselves cannot forgive sin. So no, you've got a wrong interpretation.
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Your reading comprehension is very strange.

If I am RC, why would I suggest that John passage as one that we should not be doing? :)
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#139
#139
Guojing said:
As I have said in the opening post of this thread, the Roman Catholics took that verse seriously in their concept of absolution. In early Acts, I can see Peter practicing that by basically condemning Ananias and Sapphira to their deaths for lying to the Holy Spirit.

Nowadays of course, no Protestant Church that I know of, take that verse seriously. It showed that certain instructions provided for under the GC, are no longer relevant for the current dispensation of Grace.[/QUOTE
Guojing said:
Your reading comprehension is very strange.

If I am RC, why would I suggest that John passage as one that we should not be doing? :)
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Let's start again. We agree only God can forgive sin. No human can forgive sin, nor ever could in any dispensation. Let's get that out of the way first.
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Guojing

Banned
#140
Jan 12, 2019
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#140
But you cannot deny that Jesus gave that set of instructions to his original 11 apostles. So it must have been valid for them during the early Acts period when they were fulfilling the GC. But now, we don't follow those instructions, even though it was part of the GC found in the book of John.

So do you now agree that not all of the instructions in the GC is valid for the church today?
 
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