The Keys to the Kingdom

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Wansvic said:
Repentance requires admitting your sin and turning from it. That is exactly my point.
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Um no. It goes much deeper than this, in fact, it is impossible to turn from sin UNTIL you are saved. Until then you have not been given the true love of God, which allows you to love others. Your still stuck in self.

Thats my point.

You do not even understand what it means.

It is understood by reading Acts 2:17-36 that the individuals Peter spoke with believed who Jesus was and, upon realizing it, they asked WHAT THEY MUST DO. They are instructed to repent, get water baptized in Jesus name for the remission of sin and they will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (Acts 2:38)

If sins are remitted the instant one believes than those present at Pentecost would not have been told to repent of anything because there would be no sins requiring repentance. Why were they told to repent?
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I understand it completely. It is all through the NT, John spoke of it, Jesus spoke of it. Paul preached it.
It is you who do not understand my friend.
 
Waggles said:
We need to petition Robo Op for a new icon - 'this is so dumb'
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So instead of answering the question. You have to mock. (Although in reality I never expected anything different you did just what I knew you all would do)
You know, Go ahead, and try to earn your salvation and maintian it by your works. Feel free. You will end up in the same place as those jews who did the same thing

If you think otherwise. Your in more trouble than I thought.
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Let me ask you a question.

How did people in the OT From Adam until Christ get saved?
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After individuals were told what Jesus did and they BELIEVED He was their messiah, and became a believer,
What was the purpose of them repenting,
What was the purpose of being told to get water baptized in His name,
What was the purpose of receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost?
If you would be so kind as to answer the questions I requested in post #74 first.
Use scriptures please.
 
Wansvic said:
After individuals were told what Jesus did and they BELIEVED He was their messiah, and became a believer,
What was the purpose of them repenting,
What was the purpose of being told to get water baptized in His name,
What was the purpose of receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost?
If you would be so kind as to answer the questions I requested in post #74 first.
Use scriptures please.
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What is with people and refusing to answer questions.

If you do not want to answer (or can’t) then don;t bother man.

This response has noting to do with the question I asked and will be ignored! And considered non responsive!
 
Wansvic said:
After listening to Peter on the Day of Pentecost and believing that Jesus was the messiah whom was crucified, those present were upset and asked what they must do.

Peter DID NOT say, “Nothing else needed. You believe the message of the messiah. You are good to go." Rather, Peter gave instructions that everyone must follow after believing in the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ:

Acts 2:36-37
"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers."

Same message repeated to the Gentiles (Acts 10:44-48) and the Samaritans (Acts 8:12; 14-17)

Who did Jesus say would be given the keys (plural) of the kingdom?:
""And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven:" Matt 16:16-19
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My take on that is that God meets us where we are. As humans, we like the idea of having something to do. So if we ask what we can do to be saved, God will often give us an answer.

I think it's the story of the man who gets lowered through the ceiling. Jesus sees their faith and says your sins are forgiven.
 
eternally-gratefull said:
What is with people and refusing to answer questions.

If you do not want to answer (or can’t) then don;t bother man.

This response has noting to do with the question I asked and will be ignored! And considered non responsive!
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I asked you why Peter told people to repent, get baptized in Jesus' name for the remission of sin and receive the Holy Ghost if doing those things had no purpose.

Are we to believe that neglecting any portion of the stated instructions is permissible in God's eyes?

Scripture states that God's instructions are given for a reason whether one sees the reason or not. King Saul is a perfect example.
(1 Sam. 15:22)
 
Wansvic said:
I asked you why Peter told people to repent, get baptized in Jesus' name for the remission of sin and receive the Holy Ghost if doing those things had no purpose.

Are we to believe that neglecting any portion of the stated instructions is permissible in God's eyes?

Scripture states that God's instructions are given for a reason whether one sees the reason or not. King Saul is a perfect example.
(1 Sam. 15:22)
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I asked you what the gospel was from the time adam first sinned until Christ died.

Can you answer the question, or not?
 
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Israel was told they had to do all of these commands (be circumcised, Tithe, Follow the sabbath, Obey these ritual ceremonies. Sacrifice and burnt offering)

Did any ot these WORKS or any other works I did not mention, have ANY part in their salvation?
 
eternally-gratefull said:
So instead of answering the question. You have to mock. (Although in reality I never expected anything different you did just what I knew you all would do)
You know, Go ahead, and try to earn your salvation and maintian it by your works. Feel free. You will end up in the same place as those jews who did the same thing

If you think otherwise. Your in more trouble than I thought.
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Jews did not believe that Jesus was their Messiah. They insisted on continuing to adhere to OT laws in order to be acceptable to God. They refused the counsel of God not being water baptized by John the Baptist. (Luke 7:30)

I totally believe in Jesus as my personal savior who was the Son of God born of a virgin. Who died for all of mankind's sin (including mine), was buried, and resurrected bodily on the third day.
Further, in obedience to God's word I have followed the instructions GIVEN TO the NT church by Peter on the Day of Pentecost. And for this you imply I am in trouble with God. Interesting.
 
Wansvic said:
Jews did not believe that Jesus was their Messiah. They insisted on continuing to adhere to OT laws in order to be acceptable to God. They refused the counsel of God not being water baptized by John the Baptist. (Luke 7:30)

I totally believe in Jesus as my personal savior who was the Son of God born of a virgin. Who died for all of mankind's sin (including mine), was buried, and resurrected bodily on the third day.
Further, in obedience to God's word I have followed the instructions GIVEN TO the NT church by Peter on the Day of Pentecost. And for this you imply I am in trouble with God. Interesting.
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Do you think your water baptism had anything to do with your receiving eternal life and your salvation,

Or did you get baptized. Like you do all the others works you do. BECAUSE you were fully saved, and out of gratitude for Gods gracious gift of salvation, You obeyed his first command?
 
eternally-gratefull said:
I asked you what the gospel was from the time adam first sinned until Christ died.

Can you answer the question, or not?
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My not answering your question has nothing to do with an inability to do so. You keep avoiding questions that interfere with your interpretation of the word.
Evidently instead of answering my questions, you would rather argue and insist I answer yours.

Have a good day.
 
Wansvic said:
My not answering your question has nothing to do with an inability to do so. You keep avoiding questions that interfere with your interpretation of the word.
Evidently instead of answering my questions, you would rather argue and insist I answer yours.

Have a good day.
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No,

I ignore questions that have already been answered for you multiple times, You keep asking them as if you will get a different answer. Or they prove your point, Which they have not, and will not.

They do not interphere with my interpretation

It is your intperpretation that is skewed.

And I am asking questions to prove that point, But you do not wish to see that.. so fine..


 
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Waggles said:
NO just sothething completely different.
Jesus put an end to the OT Law and all its ordinances.
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No one ever saved by the law. I think Paul and the author of hebrews made that quite clear

So again. Your making your salvation more difficult than Noah, Adam and Eve, Noahs family. Abraham, and all OT people.

Shame on you
 
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Waggles said:
What's difficult about NT salvation?
it's just as simple as 1, 2, 3 or a, b, c
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Naaa,

You have people having to make decisions, Do works first.

Its not grace through faith with you. Its reward through works. You see a person in your view can have faith, But it is not until they have the opportunity or chose to be immersed in water until they are saved, I mean imagine if a child had faith, and before she had the opportunity to be baptized she was killed in a freak accident. You just sent that child to hell because she did not get baptized in time.

And i mean lets get serious here. Your faith is in your baptism in reality, Not God. If it was in God and God alone, the word baptism for salvation would never come out of your mouth. And I preceve that you think salvation can be lost also. WHich means in reality your faith is in self. You faith is in your ability to do whatever needs to be done to maintain your salvation.


You might fool yourself with this legalism, But you will not fool God.
 
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eternally-gratefull said:
Um no. It goes much deeper than this, in fact, it is impossible to turn from sin UNTIL you are saved. Until then you have not been given the true love of God, which allows you to love others. Your still stuck in self.
Thats my point.
You do not even understand what it means.
I understand it completely. It is all through the NT, John spoke of it, Jesus spoke of it. Paul preached it.
It is you who do not understand my friend.
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This post is so pompous. "You do not even understand" "I understand it completely"

My friends, this member must be God.
Once you get this far, little wonder you can put everyone straight. I wonder the day
when a Job experiences happens to this individual.

Imagine, for an moment they are wrong over one point. How hard a heart is here that
will refuse to change or break. It is why in all things we need to be open, humble, meek,
listening to Jesus and our brothers and sisters in Christ, because we so easily make a mistake,
so subtle, we end up stumbling and falling, as lucifer did from such a privileged place.

3 Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.
Matt 5

Believers such as this are very quick to call people legalistic and lost, while they struggle in
sin and their walk, which to them is the reality we have in Christ rather than a purified cleansed
heart rejoicing in Christ. Amen
 
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