Not By Works
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E
And I have been hearing the exact same rubbish for 30 years.
Hebrews makes it perfectly clear. IF A PERSON CAN FALL AWAY, they CAN NOT BE RENEWED.
So much for being saved, losin git, being resaved losint it, being resaved. Etc etc
The context of Heb is the law. The law states one can lose their salvation, And a sacrifice must be given every year. Or else they would be lost. Why do you think it puts jesus to open shame?
Hebrews makes it perfectly clear. IF A PERSON CAN FALL AWAY, they CAN NOT BE RENEWED.
So much for being saved, losin git, being resaved losint it, being resaved. Etc etc
The context of Heb is the law. The law states one can lose their salvation, And a sacrifice must be given every year. Or else they would be lost. Why do you think it puts jesus to open shame?
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Thanks, I have undone it. I misunderstood you. I left CARM because of all this. I think I will stay and fight it out this time!
Crucifying Jesus over again so you can be forgiven a second time when the apostate comes back begging forgiveness is worse that what JW's do to Jesus.
Crucifying Jesus over again so you can be forgiven a second time when the apostate comes back begging forgiveness is worse that what JW's do to Jesus.
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1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
Hebrews 10:39
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Wheat and tares
John 15
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
there are two sorts of brances here
branches that bare fruit
_____
"every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit"
"He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit"
and branches void of any fruit
____
"If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned"
"As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself"
this whole thing is largely an example of the power of CHRIST in His own
compared to the lack of power in fakers
this was said after judas already betrayed Jesus and was said to make a point before the conclusion of the betrayal of judas
.....
this is about two separate sorts of men/women who claim to be in Him and are part of the congregation
nothing to do with how to earn or keep salvation
(it is a gift by grace through faith)
men can't see all like God
man may say "where is this persons fruit" through a series of poor encounters
but God may know them and be working in them already
... even peter denied Jesus 3 times
there were men who could have clearly stated "he is not a believer"
but God knew better
God made His promises clear
Philippians 3:9
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith
Romans 3:22 - Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
____
If you think it is your righteousness that will help you get to heaven...
You are sorely mistaken.
_____
Romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
romans 10
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
John 3:15-17
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Acts 13:39
39 And by Him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses
john 6
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
Hebrews 10:39
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Wheat and tares
John 15
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
there are two sorts of brances here
branches that bare fruit
_____
"every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit"
"He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit"
and branches void of any fruit
____
"If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned"
"As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself"
this whole thing is largely an example of the power of CHRIST in His own
compared to the lack of power in fakers
this was said after judas already betrayed Jesus and was said to make a point before the conclusion of the betrayal of judas
.....
this is about two separate sorts of men/women who claim to be in Him and are part of the congregation
nothing to do with how to earn or keep salvation
(it is a gift by grace through faith)
men can't see all like God
man may say "where is this persons fruit" through a series of poor encounters
but God may know them and be working in them already
... even peter denied Jesus 3 times
there were men who could have clearly stated "he is not a believer"
but God knew better
God made His promises clear
Philippians 3:9
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith
Romans 3:22 - Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
____
If you think it is your righteousness that will help you get to heaven...
You are sorely mistaken.
_____
Romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
romans 10
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
John 3:15-17
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Acts 13:39
39 And by Him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses
john 6
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
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Hebrews 6:4-6 - It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
These are people who:-
1. Have tasted the heavenly gift.
2. Have shared in the Holy Spirit.
3. Have tasted the goodness of the word of God.
It is impossible for them to return.
These are people who:-
1. Have tasted the heavenly gift.
2. Have shared in the Holy Spirit.
3. Have tasted the goodness of the word of God.
It is impossible for them to return.
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E
He forgets
According to the law. Which is what those people were going back to which caused them to be apostate. It only took one sin. As james said, break one command, your finished.
So hebrews is in this context. But they refuse to hear it. Because they need their interpretation to hold onto their system.
According to the law. Which is what those people were going back to which caused them to be apostate. It only took one sin. As james said, break one command, your finished.
So hebrews is in this context. But they refuse to hear it. Because they need their interpretation to hold onto their system.
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E
1. The never ATE or DIGESTED the HS
2. Anyone who is in company of any saved person. Let alone MANY saved persons (church) whether they are saved or not, have shared in the HS.
3. See Number 2, They also have tasted the goodness of the word as they see people being blessed by God
This does not make them saved.
Why do you all leave out the next few verses?
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Why do you ignore the NEAR to being cursed part? (See also 1 cor 12. Where a person is sved even as through fire..
2. Anyone who is in company of any saved person. Let alone MANY saved persons (church) whether they are saved or not, have shared in the HS.
3. See Number 2, They also have tasted the goodness of the word as they see people being blessed by God
This does not make them saved.
Why do you all leave out the next few verses?
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Why do you ignore the NEAR to being cursed part? (See also 1 cor 12. Where a person is sved even as through fire..
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Still confused.... you think people can be born again..... again?
No.
IF it were possible (and it is not)
to lose salvation...
It is gone for good.
This clearly destroys the efforts of the hebrews who would teach something similar to the modern teachings of revolving door salvation.
It is a garbage doctrine....
I've heard a man say you can be saved and unsaved 1000+ times a day based on your works🤦♂️
so ridiculous...
No.
IF it were possible (and it is not)
to lose salvation...
It is gone for good.
This clearly destroys the efforts of the hebrews who would teach something similar to the modern teachings of revolving door salvation.
It is a garbage doctrine....
I've heard a man say you can be saved and unsaved 1000+ times a day based on your works🤦♂️
so ridiculous...
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