Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

[SimpleGardner]

Lol same. I was busy myself. Just caught up this very hour.

Greetings Y & NayborBear!,

Been busy here too. Just stepped in to cool down, I know everyone thinks it is "September", but it is actually "August" both climatically and spiritually. I grow wheat, barley, flax and rye every year to get a better idea where we are in our Creators timeline rather that Pope Gregory's calendar timeline.

The Barley usually forms grain heads some time in early to mid March, but this year the heads did not appear until early June! Is that unusual? Yes, very. Now I have only been growing them for 6 years so I don't have a long historical database to compare it too, but everything is about 1.5 to 2 months late this year! There is a Civil calendar such as the Gregorian calendar, but there is a separate calendar for Gods festivals that runs according to His timeline that we reckon each year, I think!

Prattling on.

Good to see you here. Off to the fields again.

SG

 

[NayborBear]

Could you please explain the proper context so that all of us can be sure not to know right doctrine and keep ourselves from sin?

Romans 8:3
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: (aka precepts of men aka traditions)

Isaiah 29
13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of menmade WEAK through the flesh! aka: traditions/precepts of men)

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Its so sad when I see people that have "theology" that prevents them from coming to Christ RIGHT NOW and receiving His Blessings and Gifts.

Who's "prevent[-ing] [ppl] from coming to Christ RIGHT NOW and receiving His Blessings and Gifts"??

Read again Ephesians 1:3 (and context... speaking to/for/about "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY"), "3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the One having blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly realms"

 

[RickStudies]

Who's "prevent[-ing] [ppl] from coming to Christ RIGHT NOW and receiving His Blessings and Gifts"??

Read again Ephesians 1:3 (and context... speaking to/for/about "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY"), "3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the One having blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly realms"

Well, without prejudging I`m guessing Grandpa thinks we can`t get saved unless God breaks all his promises to Israel.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Well, without prejudging I`m guessing Grandpa thinks we can`t get saved unless God breaks all his promises to Israel.

yikes! lol

"By so much also, Jesus has become the guarantee [/a surety] of a better covenant." Hebrews 7:22

 

[RickStudies]

yikes! lol

"By so much also, Jesus has become the guarantee [/a surety] of a better covenant." Hebrews 7:22

The people who wrote King James translated the word covenant in some places and testament in other places. Both come from the same word. I was just going to talk about why that is because it`s another one of those things that few Christians understand. Another mistake on my part I guess

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

The people who wrote King James translated the word covenant in some places and testament in other places. Both come from the same word. I was just going to talk about why that is because it`s another one of those things that few Christians understand. Another mistake on my part I guess

I've quoted the following before:

[quoting Wm Kelly]

"...the sum is that "testament" is out of place everywhere [in Hebrews epistle] save [/except] in Hebrews 9:16-17, where alone special contextual bearing gives occasion to that sense; whereas the universal O.T. force prevails in every other." [<--meaning here, the word "covenant" instead]

--William Kelly, Commentary on Hebrews 7 [source: Bible Hub; bracketed inserts mine]

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

because it`s another one of those things that few Christians understand.

well, I can agree with you there ^ lol

 

[RickStudies]

well, I can agree with you there ^ lol

Don`t put all your trust in old commentaries. Luthor led an inperfect reformation, the truth of the early church was not fully restored.

 

[RickStudies]

I've quoted the following before:

[quoting Wm Kelly]

"...the sum is that "testament" is out of place everywhere [in Hebrews epistle] save [/except] in Hebrews 9:16-17, where alone special contextual bearing gives occasion to that sense; whereas the universal O.T. force prevails in every other." [<--meaning here, the word "covenant" instead]

--William Kelly, Commentary on Hebrews 7 [source: Bible Hub; bracketed inserts mine]

A testament is a will. A covenant is a contract. The contrast makes a difference. Insisting the two words are identical in meaning is a common form of replacement theology.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ That's the point Wm Kelly is making, as I see it.

 

[RickStudies]

^ That's the point Wm Kelly is making, as I see it.

What about the last supper? Also translated as the word testament and on topic with Hebrews 9.

Testament also appears in another place declaring us to be minister of the new testament.

 

[RickStudies]

^ That's the point Wm Kelly is making, as I see it.

Didn`t catch it at first my attention is divided at moment

 

[RickStudies]

Guy accused me of being a Sabbath keeping judaizer today. Meanwhile it`s the Sabbath and I spent most of last night and today workin at putting posts up on this board Seems about par for around here.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Didn`t catch it at first my attention is divided at moment

… I can SEE WHY!!



____________

[yeah, Wm Kelly was far from being "Lutheran" LOL... and I agree with you that "Luthor led an inperfect reformation" as you put it!! ]

 

[posthuman]

Romans 8:3
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: (aka precepts of men aka traditions)

Isaiah 29
13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of menmade WEAK through the flesh! aka: traditions/precepts of men)

if it's about 'traditions/precepts of men' then why does it say 'the law' ?
Paul certainly has a big enough Greek vocabulary to use the word for 'traditions of men'

aren't we talking about 'the law'? is it supposed to be, 'for what the completely uninspired, totally man-made & unscriptural traditions could not do, in that they were weak through the flesh.. ' ?
surely you don't believe it's like PS says, the Torah is actually all Moses speaking for a false pagan god?

 

[RickStudies]

if it's about 'traditions/precepts of men' then why does it say 'the law' ?
Paul certainly has a big enough Greek vocabulary to use the word for 'traditions of men'

aren't we talking about 'the law'? is it supposed to be, 'for what the completely uninspired, totally man-made & unscriptural traditions could not do, in that they were weak through the flesh.. ' ?
surely you don't believe it's like PS says, the Torah is actually all Moses speaking for a false pagan god?

His post just went over your head. That`s all.

20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;

22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?

 

[DeighAnn]

If someone "suggests, states, teaches" etc. that a person may be
"under the law of Moses " as in these things
or " if you follow one law you must follow all"
or "break one law you have broken them all"
or "be under the ministry of death"
or "to be in bondage to sin"
or "to be under the curse of the law"
or "heavy laden"
or "under a heavy yoke"
or "any of the things that were associated with the old covenant"

would that be like denying all the accomplishments of Christ ? in essence denying Christ altogether?

I am asking for clarity on this, because I just seems to me,
if the work that Christ did for the Father, bringing in the" New Covenant", and the New Covenant was only made possible
by the blood that He shed on that cross which
brought about the law of the kingdom of God and
not only abolished but got rid of the curse of the old law and
brought in the age of forgiveness of sin
freeing us from the sting of death by defeating it and
commenced this age under grace

it just seems to me that the use of "statements" that pertained to the old "Jewish" ways, used as if they apply to the way we should be living today, would come across more as deception, than of telling of the truth of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[posthuman]

post just went

is Romans 8:3 about law or purely human traditions of totally non-divine origin?

you said this verse was taken all out of context. i asked you what the right context is. you didn't bother. he answered me, but not clearly.

 

[RickStudies]

If someone "suggests, states, teaches" etc. that a person may be
"under the law of Moses " as in these things
or " if you follow one law you must follow all"
or "break one law you have broken them all"
or "be under the ministry of death"
or "to be in bondage to sin"
or "to be under the curse of the law"
or "heavy laden"
or "under a heavy yoke"
or "any of the things that were associated with the old covenant"

would that be like denying all the accomplishments of Christ ? in essence denying Christ altogether?

I am asking for clarity on this, because I just seems to me,
if the work that Christ did for the Father, bringing in the" New Covenant", and the New Covenant was only made possible
by the blood that He shed on that cross which
brought about the law of the kingdom of God and
not only abolished but got rid of the curse of the old law and
brought in the age of forgiveness of sin
freeing us from the sting of death by defeating it and
commenced this age under grace

it just seems to me that the use of "statements" that pertained to the old "Jewish" ways, used as if they apply to the way we should be living today, would come across more as deception, than of telling of the truth of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Well the fact is that much of what is expected of a serious Christian is in the Law. Law is found in the teaching of Christ, Paul etc.. The epistles quote the law dozens of times. It has a lot to teach us and it`s a worthy topic of interest for many reasons.

None of that threatens or denys Christ. This "if you follow one law you must follow all" is false doctrine when it`s used to call keeping a law of God sin or a threat to salvation. A lot of what has been said about it on this thread is just unreasonable.