"Not by works" - false!

[eternally-gratefull]

No,i am not able to say by their works whether they are saved......only God knows.

To commit a murder is unthinkable in my spirit let alone carry one out.

If someone murdered unless because of war....I would question if they were saved...that is my belief..

They like to focus on these sins

They can’t fathom that saying a white lie makes you just as guilty as murder.

The penalty of SIN is death not just murder

As James said. If we keep the whole law yet stumble in one point we are guilty of all

If they want to attack one person they have to attack all sinners

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

If you really don't believe in God you will indeed go to hell.
Why is this even in doubt?
25 years ago this was not even in debate.
Freegrace doctrine is responsible for bringing this ear tickling doctrine into the church that says even your unbelief won't cause you to lose your salvation.

I hear you, but 25 years ago I also had to wait until I was 18 before using communion. I had to stand in front of the congregation and be approved by a bunch of old men that had no relationship with Christ.

In my opinion the church was always deceived.

 

[Judges1318]

.

Yeah @mailmandan correct lol

Judges. One again you just prove you do not understand our views

I know he won't speak up.

He believes that, by virtue of what faith is, that you must continue to believe to the very end, and can not live in sin, or you are not really saved to begin with.

 

[Judges1318]

I hear you, but 25 years ago I also had to wait until I was 18 before using communion. I had to stand in front of the congregation and be approved by a bunch of old men that had no relationship with Christ.

In my opinion the church was always deceived.

At least they had the part about unbelievers not inheriting the kingdom correct, lol.

 

[Fastfredy0]

I'm resigned to the truth that most people are very hardened and resistant to anything outside of their little doctrinal boxes they've built around themselves.

Agreed ... and most people that you refer to probably includes YOU and I.

I've spent a much effort building my "little doctrinal box". I've tried to use my capabilities fairly, honestly. I realize others have done the same work and come to varying conclusions. All think their doctrine is biblical. All are wrong to some degree.

 

[Chester]

John:27.
My sheep listen to my voice;I know them,and they follow me.
I give them eternal life,and they shall never perish;no one can snatch them out of my hand.
My Father who has given them to me,is greater than all,no one can snatch them out of my Fathers hand.
I and the Father are one.

Those verbs are Greek present tenses so it says that the sheep are continuing to listen and continuing to follow Christ. Hence if a person is not listening and not following they are not a sheep.

Where does this say: "a born again can never lose faith"?

It gives a wonderful promise of eternal life and never perishing and that no one is able to snatch the sheep out of the Father's hand. PTL! But I do not see anything about a "born again can never lose faith"? Faith is not even mentioned in the verse?

 

[jackrosie]

Romans:8

Life Through The Spirit.

Therefore,there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,because Through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit Of Life set me free from the law of sin and death.
For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature.
God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering.

Read all of Romans 8.

 

[jackrosie]

Those verbs are Greek present tenses so it says that the sheep are continuing to listen and continuing to follow Christ. Hence if a person is not listening and not following they are not a sheep.

Where does this say: "a born again can never lose faith"?

It gives a wonderful promise of eternal life and never perishing and that no one is able to snatch the sheep out of the Father's hand. PTL! But I do not see anything about a "born again can never lose faith"? Faith is not even mentioned in the verse?

Well..imo you don’t understand the scripture as a child of God does .....a born again who has eternal security...we will never lose our faith....so we will have to agree to disagree..respectfully.

 

[Judges1318]

Agreed ... and most people that you refer to probably includes YOU and I.

Not me, anymore.
I'm done with that.
I got called out on it and stopped locking myself in a tidy little doctrinal construct.
I don't measure things solely by my already established doctrinal beliefs.
I examine everything for whatever merit it has towards learning and discerning the truth.

Now I get called out for embracing bits of legitimate truth from other denoms, lol.
You know, because everyone thinks if a denom has one thing wrong then everything they believe is wrong, lol.

 

[Judges1318]

Therefore,there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus

That's why you should remain in Christ Jesus.

 

[EleventhHour]

Not me, anymore.
I'm done with that.
I got called out on it and stopped locking myself in a tidy little doctrinal construct.
I don't measure things solely by my already established doctrinal beliefs.
I examine everything for whatever merit it has towards learning and discerning the truth.

Now I get called out for embracing bits of legitimate truth from other denoms, lol.
You know, because everyone thinks if a denom has one thing wrong then everything they believe is wrong, lol.

Oh its "demons" by the way not "denoms"

 

[jackrosie]

That's why you should remain in Christ Jesus.

No....he remains in us....we are nothing without him...

 

[Rosemaryx]

How is it eternal when it is a present assurance?
I am presently assured but I may not be assured in the future. That for me creates a sense of doubt and places a lot of pressure on me.
What are the sins that can make me loose the Faith?

Hi Pulie...
Doubt comes from Satan , God is not a God of confusion ...
All Christians go through stages of doubt , the whispers of the devil " Did God really say " ,
...xox...

 

[Chester]

Well..imo you don’t understand the scripture as a child of God does .....a born again who has eternal security...so we will have to agree to disagree..respectfully.

Well, that is OK - if in your opinion I do not understand the Scripture as a child of God does - you are entitled to your opinion.

I will just continue to read and take the Scriptures for what they say at face value.

 

[Judges1318]

Agreed ... and most people that you refer to probably includes YOU and I.

I've spent a much effort building my "little doctrinal box". I've tried to use my capabilities fairly, honestly. I realize others have done the same work and come to varying conclusions. All think their doctrine is biblical. All are wrong to some degree.

Most people think there is no other way to view the scriptures upon which they have based their doctrinal beliefs on. I have found this to be especially true of Calvinist leaning people.

Bring your osas verses to the table and I will show you that your way of understanding it is not the only possible way to see it. You don't have to agree with the other views. I just want to show you there are other legitimate and honest ways to view the scriptures that you are sure can only be understood one way.

 

[jackrosie]

Well, that is OK - if in your opinion I do not understand the Scripture as a child of God does - you are entitled to your opinion.

I will just continue to read and take the Scriptures for what they say at face value.

Ok...God Bless.

 

[EleventhHour]

Oh its "demons" by the way not "denoms"

I am glad someone here has a sense of humor!!

 

[Rosemaryx]

Good morning, sis.
I mean, it's morning here, lol.

I'm curious, if God gives us our believing, why does he give us inferior believing?
I've posed this question several times in the forum.

Ok I have to admit , what is inferior believing lol...
All I know is one day I was not a believer , then I was...
I mean , I was once God`s enemy , then I was His child...
It is only looking back now that I see my days when I was His enemy to the days I now believe wholeheartedly , and it has not come from me but from Him...
...xox...

 

[Chester]

That's why you should remain in Christ Jesus.

No....he remains in us....we are nothing without him...

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit (KJV)
Romans 8:1

The text says we are in Christ Jesus, not that Jesus remains in us. Of course there are other texts that talk about Jesus and the Holy Spirit being in us, so both are true.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

"7so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life." - Titus 3:7
'Might become' is a subjunctive verb. It means the action (becoming an heir) may or may not occur depending on circumstances.

You can verify what I'm saying here: https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/tit/3/7/t_conc_1132007

Justification is the sure thing that has occurred (you can also confirm that in the link I provided). What is not sure is the justified person becoming an heir. You must continue to believe to the very end for that to happen.

Far to many passages refute this thinking

If I am justified I am justified

Titus 3 : 5 says I
Am saved by gods
Mercy not that I might be saved

2 John destroys your theory. They were never of us

Who are they?

Antichrists

What makes one an antichrist?

Well Let’s just let John tell us

1 John 2:22–23 (NKJV): Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

Who Denys the son? Well
Anyone who does not BELIEVE

So just because somebody me is in church today does Not mean they are saved. Many do
Not have true faith and will be exposed when they leave in denial due to
Unbelief