Lordship salvation vs. "easy believism"

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throughfaith

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It was given in eternity (predestinated) Verse 9 and realized/ actuated in time. (salvation) verse 10.

Fits my view as well.
Actual Grace was given to you before you existed ? in what way? This sounds worse than calvinsm . its unconditional and not based on anything good God saw for them . Just determined for undisclosed reasons we don't know .
 

GraceAndTruth

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Satan knows the everything that is past.......he does not know the future'
He knows he is defeated. He knows he is bound from deceiving the 'nations' so that the gospel is not 'snatched away' from those God give the ears to hear.

Luke 8:11-12 “Now this is the parable: the seed is the word of God. 12 And those beside the road are the ones who have heard, then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.
YES, Satan knows the gospel to be true, BenjaminN.
 

throughfaith

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It was given in eternity (predestinated) Verse 9 and realized/ actuated in time. (salvation) verse 10.

Fits my view as well.
Could it be that what was given was that all those in christ
YES, Satan knows the gospel to be true, BenjaminN.
Does he believe the Gospel for the forgiveness of his sins . Believing from the heart that Jesus died for his sins ?If so which verse ?
 

BenjaminN

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Satan knows the everything that is past.......he does not know the future'
He knows he is defeated. He knows he is bound from deceiving the 'nations' so that the gospel is not 'snatched away' from those God give the ears to hear.

Luke 8:11-12 “Now this is the parable: the seed is the word of God. 12 And those beside the road are the ones who have heard, then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

Luke 8 (ESV)


11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 The ones along the path are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. 13 And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away. 14 And as for what fell among the thorns, they are those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by the cares and riches and pleasures of life, and their fruit does not mature. 15 As for that in the good soil, they are those who, hearing the word, hold it fast in an honest and good heart, and bear fruit with patience.


Matthew 7 (ESV)


21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.


Matthew 5 (ESV)


48 You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
 

throughfaith

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Luke 8 (ESV)


11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 The ones along the path are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. 13 And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away. 14 And as for what fell among the thorns, they are those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by the cares and riches and pleasures of life, and their fruit does not mature. 15 As for that in the good soil, they are those who, hearing the word, hold it fast in an honest and good heart, and bear fruit with patience.


Matthew 7 (ESV)


21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.


Matthew 5 (ESV)


48 You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
mathew 7 is talking about false teachers / prophets. The will of the father is to believe the Gospel. Perfect means complete.
 

BenjaminN

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Hebrews 8 (ESV)


10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into their minds, and write them on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they will bear fruit accordingly. Not "easy believism"...
 

throughfaith

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Matthew 7 (ESV)


23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'
He never knew them , is the point . If he never knew you ,then you were a false convert . He knows all those who are his . Mathew 7 begins with ' false prophets ' Who will SAY didn't we do this and that .
Gal 4.9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
 

throughfaith

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Hebrews 8 (ESV)


10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into their minds, and write them on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they will bear fruit accordingly. Not "easy believism"...
it says " that I will make with the house of Israel "
 

throughfaith

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Aug 4, 2020
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Hebrews 8 (ESV)


10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into their minds, and write them on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they will bear fruit accordingly. Not "easy believism"...
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into THEIR minds , and write them on THEIR hearts , and I will be THEIR God, and they shall be MY PEOPLE .
 

BenjaminN

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it says " that I will make with the house of Israel "
So then is it not applying to you, you are not of the commonwealth of Israel? You are not under the new covenant of grace, through God's gift of faith, for good works prepared by God?


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
 

GraceAndTruth

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Luke 8 (ESV)


11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 The ones along the path are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. 13 And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away. 14 And as for what fell among the thorns, they are those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by the cares and riches and pleasures of life, and their fruit does not mature. 15 As for that in the good soil, they are those who, hearing the word, hold it fast in an honest and good heart, and bear fruit with patience.


Matthew 7 (ESV)


21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.


Matthew 5 (ESV)


48 You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

And the will of the Father is to BELIEVE.

Perfect - actually the bible word translated as 'perfect' is better rendered "COMPLETE".
1 Cor 13:10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away with.
When the perfect comes.....meaning that we will see clearly when we have the bible complete.
At that time they had the scripture of the Jews and letters of Paul and Peter circulating among the churches, that was the incomplete (partial) that would be put away for the complete bible.
 

BenjaminN

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And the will of the Father is to BELIEVE.

Perfect - actually the bible word translated as 'perfect' is better rendered "COMPLETE".
1 Cor 13:10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away with.
When the perfect comes.....meaning that we will see clearly when we have the bible complete.
At that time they had the scripture of the Jews and letters of Paul and Peter circulating among the churches, that was the incomplete (partial) that would be put away for the complete bible.
If we (truly) believe, completeness (perfectness) will follow with perseverance of the saints.
 

GraceAndTruth

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So then is it not applying to you, you are not of the commonwealth of Israel? You are not under the new covenant of grace, through God's gift of faith, for good works prepared by God?


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Ephesus was located in Asia Minor......definitely alienated from Israel.
They were Gentiles and had not received the word until Paul visited with them on one of his journeys and brought them the gospel, then later wrote this letter to them. Paul assures them that they are just as much a part of the salvtion plan as the Jews.
v 15 by abolishing in His flesh the hostility, which is the Law composed of commandments expressed in ordinances,
 

GraceAndTruth

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If we (truly) believe, completeness (perfectness) will follow with perseverance of the saints.
1 truly believe - yes
2 "complete perfection" - we will be made perfect when we are with the Lord, until that time life is a struggle between doing the right thing or not. Remember the apostle Paul at the end of his life, wrote from Rome, that he did the things that he should not and did not do the things that he should...calling himself a wretched man. We are all wretched men/women.

Romans 7
15 For I do not understand what I am doing; for I am not practicing what I want to do, but I do the very thing I hate. 16 However, if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, that the Law is good. 17 But now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that good does not dwell in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. 19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. 20 But if I do the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me. 21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good. 22 For I joyfully agree with the law of God in the inner person, 23 but I see a different law in the parts of my body waging war against the law of my mind, and making me a prisoner of the law of sin, the law which is in my body’s parts. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, on the one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but on the other, with my flesh the law of sin.
 

throughfaith

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So then is it not applying to you, you are not of the commonwealth of Israel? You are not under the new covenant of grace, through God's gift of faith, for good works prepared by God?


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Gentiles . We don't become Israel.
 

throughfaith

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Aug 4, 2020
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So then is it not applying to you, you are not of the commonwealth of Israel? You are not under the new covenant of grace, through God's gift of faith, for good works prepared by God?


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
So we've moved from hebrews to Ephesians now . different context, different book ?
 

throughfaith

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Remember you've got actual grace given to you before you existed , before Adam, before the fall , before the law , before God the Son became a baby, before his ministry as messiah, before his death burial and resurrection and before the giving of the Holy Spirit. Before the Gospel of grace is preached, before your parents were born , before you were born , before you heard the gospel, before you were saved by GRACE through FAITH , before you recieved Jesus , before you were in him , recieved the Holy Spirit, baptised into the body of christ ect ect ?????
Really? Let's see
Eph 2
11¶Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRSNGRS from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
 

OIC1965

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Remember you've got actual grace given to you before you existed , before Adam, before the fall , before the law , before God the Son became a baby, before his ministry as messiah, before his death burial and resurrection and before the giving of the Holy Spirit. Before the Gospel of grace is preached, before your parents were born , before you were born , before you heard the gospel, before you were saved by GRACE through FAITH , before you recieved Jesus , before you were in him , recieved the Holy Spirit, baptised into the body of christ ect ect ?????
Really? Let's see
Yep. That’s what 2 Timothy 1:9 says, champ. Grace given us before the world began.
 

throughfaith

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Yep. That’s what 2 Timothy 1:9 says, champ.
Strangers and without hope and without God . Sure this sounds like we were given grace before we were born? And i assume some were not given grace before they were born ?