Is the false teaching of pre-tribulation rapture, getting the power of "him" out of the way, who restrains the antichrist?
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We agree on the TIMING issue (His Second Coming Rev19) but that is His "RETURN" to the earth (NOT "our Rapture [IN THE AIR]" timing).
Additionally, Lk17 adds further detail, "and destroyed ALL" (vv.27,29); but that is not what takes place following "our Rapture" (Paul tells of the TWO opposite responses ppl will have [will come to "believe"] FOLLOWING our Rapture, when they are IN/EXPERIENCING the trib yrs, in his bookended section of 2Th1 & 2 [both chpts, on pretty much either end of this CONTEXT]).
So that "as the days of Noah" CONTEXTS parallel what happened back then, thus we can COMPARE:
--Matt24:36-42/Lk17:26-37 (what these say)
[compared with]
--Genesis 9:1 "FILL the earth" and Daniel 2:35 "and FILLED the whole earth"
... it was NOAH (and crew) who were "left" on the earth to go on and "FILL" it.
It was the "THEY" (those who PERISHED in the flood) who "KNEW NOT UNTIL" and thus they perished in the flood. (And it WASN'T because they'd never HEARD the warning [THEY DID], it's that they DISREGARDED God's Word via Noah, and thus perished [were "taken away IN JUDGMENT"]; by contrast, NOAH "KNEW" and PREPARED the ark [years'-worth of "preparing"] ! )
In the Second Coming to the earth time-slot, it is the ANGELS who "REAP" who will "GATHER *YE* FIRST the TARES" and who also "gather OUT all things that offend" (THIS is the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of "our Rapture [/THE Departure]" event, which has MUCH that will unfold upon the earth FOLLOWING it). That (the REAPERS/ANGELS) is "who" TAKES these (for "judgment"). The others are "LEFT" on the earth, FOR the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom (never having "lifted off" the earth), who will ENTER it in their mortal bodies capable of reproducing/bearing children ("FILL[ing] the whole earth").
[NOT a "Rapture" context]
"Noah" (and crew) pictures/represents those [saved] IN THE TRIB and who ENTER the earthly MK age;
"Enoch" (ONE MAN) pictures/represents the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY (ONE) who is caught UP/AWAY *BEFORE* the flood/judgment fell upon the earth.
Additionally, Lk17 adds further detail, "and destroyed ALL" (vv.27,29); but that is not what takes place following "our Rapture" (Paul tells of the TWO opposite responses ppl will have [will come to "believe"] FOLLOWING our Rapture, when they are IN/EXPERIENCING the trib yrs, in his bookended section of 2Th1 & 2 [both chpts, on pretty much either end of this CONTEXT]).
So that "as the days of Noah" CONTEXTS parallel what happened back then, thus we can COMPARE:
--Matt24:36-42/Lk17:26-37 (what these say)
[compared with]
--Genesis 9:1 "FILL the earth" and Daniel 2:35 "and FILLED the whole earth"
... it was NOAH (and crew) who were "left" on the earth to go on and "FILL" it.
It was the "THEY" (those who PERISHED in the flood) who "KNEW NOT UNTIL" and thus they perished in the flood. (And it WASN'T because they'd never HEARD the warning [THEY DID], it's that they DISREGARDED God's Word via Noah, and thus perished [were "taken away IN JUDGMENT"]; by contrast, NOAH "KNEW" and PREPARED the ark [years'-worth of "preparing"] ! )
In the Second Coming to the earth time-slot, it is the ANGELS who "REAP" who will "GATHER *YE* FIRST the TARES" and who also "gather OUT all things that offend" (THIS is the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of "our Rapture [/THE Departure]" event, which has MUCH that will unfold upon the earth FOLLOWING it). That (the REAPERS/ANGELS) is "who" TAKES these (for "judgment"). The others are "LEFT" on the earth, FOR the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom (never having "lifted off" the earth), who will ENTER it in their mortal bodies capable of reproducing/bearing children ("FILL[ing] the whole earth").
[NOT a "Rapture" context]
"Noah" (and crew) pictures/represents those [saved] IN THE TRIB and who ENTER the earthly MK age;
"Enoch" (ONE MAN) pictures/represents the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY (ONE) who is caught UP/AWAY *BEFORE* the flood/judgment fell upon the earth.
There is MORE THAN ONE "HARVEST" in Scripture (and in nature). [note: this is not saying more than one RAPTURE]
--WHEAT is harvested by means of a "tribulum" (harvesting implement)
--ANOTHER [crop] is harvested by means of "tossing up into the AIR, and blowing away the chaff"
There are TWO *distinct* "FIRSTFRUIT" in Lev23... the WHEAT is in the SECOND [mention] of these TWO references to "FIRSTFRUIT" in Lev23, namely in v.17 "TWO loaves" and "baken WITH LEAVEN" (which verse correlates with Rev14:4 re: "the 144,000" ['FIRSTFRUIT']).
Also, James 1:18 says, "a KIND of firstfruit" (meaning, there is MORE THAN *ONE* "KIND"
)
*WE* ("the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY"/the "ONE BODY") are NOT "the WHEAT"
--WHEAT is harvested by means of a "tribulum" (harvesting implement)
--ANOTHER [crop] is harvested by means of "tossing up into the AIR, and blowing away the chaff"
There are TWO *distinct* "FIRSTFRUIT" in Lev23... the WHEAT is in the SECOND [mention] of these TWO references to "FIRSTFRUIT" in Lev23, namely in v.17 "TWO loaves" and "baken WITH LEAVEN" (which verse correlates with Rev14:4 re: "the 144,000" ['FIRSTFRUIT']).
Also, James 1:18 says, "a KIND of firstfruit" (meaning, there is MORE THAN *ONE* "KIND"
)*WE* ("the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY"/the "ONE BODY") are NOT "the WHEAT"
Matthew 13 -
The Purpose of Jesus' Parables
(Mark 4:10-12)
10 And the disciples having approached, said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”
11 And answering He said to them, “Because it has been granted to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of the heavens [NOT speaking of: "UP IN Heaven"... not THAT], but to them it has not been granted. 12 For whoever has, to him will be given, and he will be in abundance. And whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 13 Because of this I speak to them in parables:
‘Because seeing they do not see,
and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.’
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah, saying:
‘In hearing you will hear and never understand;
and in seeing you will see and never perceive.
15 For the heart of this people has grown dull,
and they barely hear with the ears,
and they have closed their eyes,
lest ever they should see with the eyes,
and they should hear with the ears,
and they should understand with the heart,
and should turn,
and I will heal them.’b
The Purpose of Jesus' Parables
(Mark 4:10-12)
10 And the disciples having approached, said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”
11 And answering He said to them, “Because it has been granted to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of the heavens [NOT speaking of: "UP IN Heaven"... not THAT], but to them it has not been granted. 12 For whoever has, to him will be given, and he will be in abundance. And whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 13 Because of this I speak to them in parables:
‘Because seeing they do not see,
and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.’
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah, saying:
‘In hearing you will hear and never understand;
and in seeing you will see and never perceive.
15 For the heart of this people has grown dull,
and they barely hear with the ears,
and they have closed their eyes,
lest ever they should see with the eyes,
and they should hear with the ears,
and they should understand with the heart,
and should turn,
and I will heal them.’b
The "parables" in the gospels are majorly about Israel (and Israel's "future")... (thus, not about "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY")
[Hebrews 9:8-9a is pretty much the only "parable" about "[for] the present time," as that passage says, and as I put in a previous post, upthread (including the "furnishings" named in v.4 of that passage, things which DIFFERED from the "furnishings" of the Temple that came after the "tabernacle in the wilderness" being referenced there)]
[Hebrews 9:8-9a is pretty much the only "parable" about "[for] the present time," as that passage says, and as I put in a previous post, upthread (including the "furnishings" named in v.4 of that passage, things which DIFFERED from the "furnishings" of the Temple that came after the "tabernacle in the wilderness" being referenced there)]
"... "the first tabernacle [in the wilderness] yet having *A STANDING [stasis/stasin], which is A PARABLE for the PRESENT time..."
[*related to the "apo stasis / apo stasia" word in 2Th2:3 ]
"...the one restraining AT PRESENT,... UNTIL out of the midst he be come [/come to be], AND THEN [kai tote]..."
[*related to the "apo stasis / apo stasia" word in 2Th2:3
]"...the one restraining AT PRESENT,... UNTIL out of the midst he be come [/come to be], AND THEN [kai tote]..."
If you're talking about Matt25, I see the various versions have it as:
--"the wedding/marriage FEAST"
--"the wedding/marriage SUPPER"
--"the wedding/marriage FESTIVITIES"
--"the wedding/marriage HALL"
--"the wedding/marriage BANQUET"
--"the marriage-FEASTS"
I see none that say "marriage CHAMBER" (as though "FIVE VIRGINS [PLURAL]" were going in with Him THERE. NO.)
Where are you seeing that particular word??
Ex: "the wedding FEAST at Cana" had in attendance MULTIPLE "guests [plural]" [vv.1,2], and "servants [plural]" [vv.5,6] and even present with them there was "the master of the banquet/feast [or] headwaiter" [v.8] (TONS OF PPL!!)... NONE OF THESE speaks of "the marriage CHAMBER" which was an INTIMATE affair, pertaining SOLELY TO the WEDDED COUPLE THEMSELVES! ]
When Jesus (in this John 2 passage) says to His mother, "mine hour is not yet come," He was referring to the fact that it was the "bridegroom's" responsibility to provide the wine for his OWN "wedding FEAST/SUPPER" per vv.9b-10a/b of John 2 (note also what Jesus states in Matthew 26:29 ['accompanying you']--Compare also Lk22:16,18,30 with Matt19:28 [and then 25:31-34 for its TIMING]).
ALL DURING the trib years is when the "[Rev19:9] having been INVITED" will have taken place, that is, the INVITATION (of the "guests [plural]") TO the earthly MK age (the wedding FEAST/SUPPER/FESTIVITIES). Those folks never lift off the earth, but are present on the earth upon His "RETURN" there (because this is NOT "rapture-[timing-]related" at all).
____________
Lk12:36-37,38,40,42-44 [parallels in Matt24] "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding" (as "ALREADY-WED"!)... THEN the meal [G347]
--"the wedding/marriage FEAST"
--"the wedding/marriage SUPPER"
--"the wedding/marriage FESTIVITIES"
--"the wedding/marriage HALL"
--"the wedding/marriage BANQUET"
--"the marriage-FEASTS"
I see none that say "marriage CHAMBER" (as though "FIVE VIRGINS [PLURAL]" were going in with Him THERE. NO.)
Where are you seeing that particular word??
Ex: "the wedding FEAST at Cana" had in attendance MULTIPLE "guests [plural]" [vv.1,2], and "servants [plural]" [vv.5,6] and even present with them there was "the master of the banquet/feast [or] headwaiter" [v.8] (TONS OF PPL!!)... NONE OF THESE speaks of "the marriage CHAMBER" which was an INTIMATE affair, pertaining SOLELY TO the WEDDED COUPLE THEMSELVES!
]When Jesus (in this John 2 passage) says to His mother, "mine hour is not yet come," He was referring to the fact that it was the "bridegroom's" responsibility to provide the wine for his OWN "wedding FEAST/SUPPER" per vv.9b-10a/b of John 2 (note also what Jesus states in Matthew 26:29 ['accompanying you']--Compare also Lk22:16,18,30 with Matt19:28 [and then 25:31-34 for its TIMING]).
ALL DURING the trib years is when the "[Rev19:9] having been INVITED" will have taken place, that is, the INVITATION (of the "guests [plural]") TO the earthly MK age (the wedding FEAST/SUPPER/FESTIVITIES). Those folks never lift off the earth, but are present on the earth upon His "RETURN" there (because this is NOT "rapture-[timing-]related" at all).
____________
Lk12:36-37,38,40,42-44 [parallels in Matt24] "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding" (as "ALREADY-WED"!)... THEN the meal [G347]
I find it interesting that you go to such lengths to think a wedding is ONLY festivities and it would be strange to apply intimacy with the bride and groom.
I said chamber because it is a ROOM WITH A DOOR.
W e have
Bride
Groom
A room with a door
Door shut (for privacy)
And finally those refused because the groom has not known them (no intimacy)
Even though they had small oil,lamps, light,and were waiting for Jesus.
The last supper dialog has Jesus reenacting the Jewish betrothal and saying he goes to prepare a place in his fathers mansions for his bride.
To think the bride/groom component intimacy is something to be challenged is amazing.
You went to lengths to take the obvious off the table
""Ex: "the wedding FEAST at Cana" had in attendance MULTIPLE "guests [plural]" [vv.1,2], and "servants [plural]" [vv.5,6] and even present with them there was "the master of the banquet/feast [or] headwaiter" [v.8] (TONS OF PPL!!)... NONE OF THESE speaks of "the marriage CHAMBER" which was an INTIMATE affair, pertaining SOLELY TO the WEDDED COUPLE THEMSELVES! ]""
Room with a door.
Door shut for privacy.
You serious?
Wedding.
What is a wedding?
Festivities?
Intimacy is an impossibility?
]""Room with a door.
Door shut for privacy.
You serious?
Wedding.
What is a wedding?
Festivities?
Intimacy is an impossibility?