What do you guys think of Enoch, and the book of Enoch? What are your thoughts on this. Is the book of Enoch important, did it actually happen and is it true? Why isn’t it in the Bible? And what about other books in the Bible like the Book of Thomas? Why aren’t they in the Bible? I would love to hear your thoughts on all this. Feel free to add anything you want : )
Enoch and other “lost books” of the Bible
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The book of Enoch is more than what’s just quoted in the Bible. So that being said how can we know which one is false and which one is true.
I don’t really know a whole lot of things about the book of Enoch and it’s claims but for one, it flat out just says that the earth is flat. Which is a lie, so it couldn’t be a divine text because it holds a lie. There are many more in the book of Enoch.
I don’t really know a whole lot of things about the book of Enoch and it’s claims but for one, it flat out just says that the earth is flat. Which is a lie, so it couldn’t be a divine text because it holds a lie. There are many more in the book of Enoch.
O
This is my testimony of the book of Enoch...make of it what you will.
I played guitar with a friend at a New Year's Eve party in 1988. I met a woman. We talked and she invited me to her place for a drink in a few days.
I showed up and she let me in. She told me to sit at the dining room table while she went to the kitchen to get us some drinks. I sat down and saw a bible sitting in front of me. Though I'd had a salvation experience back in 1973 and still believed, I hadn't walked with the Lord or even touched a bible since the '70s. I never had anyone to disciple me. I didn't even know about such a thing!
I flipped it open and started reading. Then the strangest thing happened. The words jumped up off of the page and in front of my face. Poof! I found myself standing under a clear moon and star-lit sky. I was aware that someone was standing to my right, though I couldn't see who it was.
I was aware that I was standing on a cloud. It ended in front of me. Perhaps a few hundred yards further in front of me, more clouds started. On the clouds, and stretching to the horizon, was an army on horseback. I could see that the riders were holding weapons. Parallel to me was the front line of the army. These soldiers were holding musical instruments. My sight was zoomed in on one of the riders and I was surprised to see it was me!
Poof! I was sitting back at my friend's table. As she walked into the room, I said, "Woah!" She asked me why I said that. I told her what had just happened to me. She got angry (She was obviously scared). Though we dated on and off for a few years, we never talked about it again. For many years I had no idea what the vision was about.
I'd read the book of Jude, vv 14&15 many times, but it wasn't until I read 1 Enoch 1:9 in 2014 that I connected the above vision to this passage. I later concluded that the Lord did it this way to validate the book of 1 Enoch to me. BTW, I'm talking about the R.H. Charles translation.
Seven years later, to the week, I led the worship team for the first weekly Sunday morning service for our new church.
Our God is an awesome God
He reigns from Heaven above
With wisdom power and love
Our God is an awesome God - Rich Mullens
I played guitar with a friend at a New Year's Eve party in 1988. I met a woman. We talked and she invited me to her place for a drink in a few days.
I showed up and she let me in. She told me to sit at the dining room table while she went to the kitchen to get us some drinks. I sat down and saw a bible sitting in front of me. Though I'd had a salvation experience back in 1973 and still believed, I hadn't walked with the Lord or even touched a bible since the '70s. I never had anyone to disciple me. I didn't even know about such a thing!
I flipped it open and started reading. Then the strangest thing happened. The words jumped up off of the page and in front of my face. Poof! I found myself standing under a clear moon and star-lit sky. I was aware that someone was standing to my right, though I couldn't see who it was.
I was aware that I was standing on a cloud. It ended in front of me. Perhaps a few hundred yards further in front of me, more clouds started. On the clouds, and stretching to the horizon, was an army on horseback. I could see that the riders were holding weapons. Parallel to me was the front line of the army. These soldiers were holding musical instruments. My sight was zoomed in on one of the riders and I was surprised to see it was me!
Poof! I was sitting back at my friend's table. As she walked into the room, I said, "Woah!" She asked me why I said that. I told her what had just happened to me. She got angry (She was obviously scared). Though we dated on and off for a few years, we never talked about it again. For many years I had no idea what the vision was about.
I'd read the book of Jude, vv 14&15 many times, but it wasn't until I read 1 Enoch 1:9 in 2014 that I connected the above vision to this passage. I later concluded that the Lord did it this way to validate the book of 1 Enoch to me. BTW, I'm talking about the R.H. Charles translation.
Seven years later, to the week, I led the worship team for the first weekly Sunday morning service for our new church.
Our God is an awesome God
He reigns from Heaven above
With wisdom power and love
Our God is an awesome God - Rich Mullens
I have the book of Enoch,Jubliees,and Jasher.Only about half way finished on Enoch.There's a part in Enoch that talks about angels appearing as fire.Jesus appeared to me years ago during my 20's to comfort me.Satan was there to. Or at least his voice I was able to hear.At some point some musical instruments started playing softly and God's voice started speaking in scripture and I knew Jesus was going to appear because it happen in the same way before.I fell to my knees awaiting Jesus, and satan was getting angry telling me to get up.When he showed up I had a knowing that satan was pushed away from his presence.
He came with company and he told me who it was.A biblical angel.Who looked like this above my bed.Like a controlled fire dancing around.Not like how a earthly fire would move.
After they left God told me to pray because this angel had a message for me that he was trying to give. But satan was trying to prevent him from delivering it to me.So they were wrestling,And I was praying.After awhile the message was sent.You know what the message was?Keep praying!. I'm not gonna lie,I was mad.
The Bible,prayer, and worship is everything.In the Bible there are verses that contain worship,Verses for crying out for help.Or when your feeling weak in faith.To fight spiritual battles against the enemy.They're very powerful.
He came with company and he told me who it was.A biblical angel.Who looked like this above my bed.Like a controlled fire dancing around.Not like how a earthly fire would move.
After they left God told me to pray because this angel had a message for me that he was trying to give. But satan was trying to prevent him from delivering it to me.So they were wrestling,And I was praying.After awhile the message was sent.You know what the message was?Keep praying!. I'm not gonna lie,I was mad.
The Bible,prayer, and worship is everything.In the Bible there are verses that contain worship,Verses for crying out for help.Or when your feeling weak in faith.To fight spiritual battles against the enemy.They're very powerful.
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Probably would of been better of putting this thread in the Bible Forum......
I read the book of Enoch awhile ago. The few bits that I remember, if I remember correctly was, woman shouldn't wear make up or jewelry, and men shouldn't study war. (Correct me if I'm wrong) There was also something about angels, but don't remember that bit.
Recently bought The Didache, it's supposed to be the teaching of the Twelve Disciples. It's really short, not sure why I bought it though, since you can read it online for free.
The whole book can be read clicking on this link, but included Chapter 16 down below.
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/didache-roberts.html
Chapter 16. Watchfulness; the Coming of the Lord. Watch for your life's sake. Let not your lamps be quenched, nor your loins unloosed; but be ready, for you know not the hour in which our Lord will come. But come together often, seeking the things which are befitting to your souls: for the whole time of your faith will not profit you, if you are not made perfect in the last time. For in the last days false prophets and corrupters shall be multiplied, and the sheep shall be turned into wolves, and love shall be turned into hate; for when lawlessness increases, they shall hate and persecute and betray one another, and then shall appear the world-deceiver as Son of God, and shall do signs and wonders, and the earth shall be delivered into his hands, and he shall do iniquitous things which have never yet come to pass since the beginning. Then shall the creation of men come into the fire of trial, and many shall be made to stumble and shall perish; but those who endure in their faith shall be saved from under the curse itself. And then shall appear the signs of the truth: first, the sign of an outspreading in heaven, then the sign of the sound of the trumpet. And third, the resurrection of the dead -- yet not of all, but as it is said: "The Lord shall come and all His saints with Him." Then shall the world see the Lord coming upon the clouds of heaven.
O
"After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree." - Revelation 7:1
According to the above, the earth is square. Some say that Enoch says the earth is flat to promote their belief that it is so. Others say that he says it is flat so that Enoch is rejected. I find both approaches disingenuous.
According to the book of Jude, vv 14&15 in our bible, Enoch is a prophet. Otherwise the veracity of the bible is suspect.
According to the above, the earth is square. Some say that Enoch says the earth is flat to promote their belief that it is so. Others say that he says it is flat so that Enoch is rejected. I find both approaches disingenuous.
According to the book of Jude, vv 14&15 in our bible, Enoch is a prophet. Otherwise the veracity of the bible is suspect.
Where in the book of Enoch does it say, the earth is flat?
Enoch 18:1–5 reads,
And I saw the storehouses of all the winds, and I saw how with them He has adorned all creation, and I saw the foundations of the Earth.
And I saw the cornerstone of the Earth. And I saw the four winds which support the Earth and the sky.
And I saw how the winds stretch out the height of Heaven, and how they position themselves between Heaven and Earth; they are the Pillars of Heaven.
And I saw the winds which turn the sky and cause the disc of the Sun and all the stars to set.
And I saw the winds on the Earth which support the clouds and I saw the paths of the Angels. I saw at the end of the Earth; the firmament of Heaven above.
And I saw the cornerstone of the Earth. And I saw the four winds which support the Earth and the sky.
And I saw how the winds stretch out the height of Heaven, and how they position themselves between Heaven and Earth; they are the Pillars of Heaven.
And I saw the winds which turn the sky and cause the disc of the Sun and all the stars to set.
And I saw the winds on the Earth which support the clouds and I saw the paths of the Angels. I saw at the end of the Earth; the firmament of Heaven above.
https://answersingenesis.org/astronomy/earth/book-enoch-and-flat-earth/
The link above sort of talks through how the Book of Enoch proves and disproves a flat earth. Flat earth believers are grasping at straws, so please don't make this another flat earth thread, we have to many already. lol
From a concave earth perspective, I like how it mentions how the sky turns and causes the disc of the sun and all the stars to set.
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My thoughts regarding the four corners of the earth meaning would be.....
Never Eat Sour Wheat
A popular Concave Earther (not mentioning any names) says, the earth has magnetic positions, that suspends the heavens in mid air. There is something to magnetism and our earth, just not exactly sure how it all works. There were magnetic tests done by France, U.S., and I believe China that all concluded that the center of magnetism was four thousand miles up, so to suspend heaven maybe that's how everything is held into place?!?!
https://www.lockhaven.edu/~dsimanek/hollow/mcnair.htm
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Simply put if we are to believe the Bible is the word of God then there are reasons why other books were not included and are not meant for the edification of Christians.
Doesn't mean they are not worth reading to gain additional enlightenment about the history of the times, but I would be careful about seeing them as being inspired words from God.
Doesn't mean they are not worth reading to gain additional enlightenment about the history of the times, but I would be careful about seeing them as being inspired words from God.
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These are all apocryphal books. Not divinely inspired therefore excluded from the Bible. There is also a real hazard in reading the Gnostic writings such as the gospel of Thomas. Unless a person is fully grounded as a Christian, all these books should be avoided. First get a grasp of the Bible itself (which many Christians do not have).
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Sources: https://answersingenesis.org/astronomy/earth/book-enoch-and-flat-earth/
And…
The Book of Enoch
I think before reading this you should just read the article and scroll through it really quick. Read the headlines, the verses, what the site has to say about them, etc.
“The Book of Enoch is an important source for those who promote the notion that the earth is flat. A few portions of this rather long book teach that the earth is flat, but other passages are ambiguous about the earth’s shape. Flat earthers are selective about which portions of the Book of Enoch that they cite, because other passages clearly contradict aspects of the flat-earth model promoted today. The book of Enoch almost certainly is pseudepigraphal because there is considerable doubt that the patriarch Enoch wrote it, despite the claim within the book that he did. The Book of Enoch is not canonical. Therefore, it ought not be used to interpret Scripture, particularly in claiming the Bible teaches that the earth is flat.”
Enoch 18:1–5 reads,
Enoch 18:6–12 reads,
But get this, not only does the Book of Enoch say the Earth is Flat (you should check out the link), it also CONTRACTS itself and has some verses Flat-Earthers DON’T want to talk about. As I’ve said, check out the link and read the headline “Parts of the Book of Enoch Flat-Earthers don’t want to talk about”
So in conclusion, the book of Enoch claims the Earth is flat and is used by Flat-Earthers to defend their Flat Earth claims. This alone make the Book not cannon and unreliable. But it also contradicts itself just further making it unreliable. If a book goes against facts we know to be true, unreliable. If a book like the book of Enoch contradicts itself, it’s just as unreliable. You should check the link out. I’ll look the link you have sent in.
And…
The Book of Enoch
I think before reading this you should just read the article and scroll through it really quick. Read the headlines, the verses, what the site has to say about them, etc.
“The Book of Enoch is an important source for those who promote the notion that the earth is flat. A few portions of this rather long book teach that the earth is flat, but other passages are ambiguous about the earth’s shape. Flat earthers are selective about which portions of the Book of Enoch that they cite, because other passages clearly contradict aspects of the flat-earth model promoted today. The book of Enoch almost certainly is pseudepigraphal because there is considerable doubt that the patriarch Enoch wrote it, despite the claim within the book that he did. The Book of Enoch is not canonical. Therefore, it ought not be used to interpret Scripture, particularly in claiming the Bible teaches that the earth is flat.”
Enoch 18:1–5 reads,
And I saw the storehouses of all the winds, and I saw how with them He has adorned all creation, and I saw the foundations of the Earth.
And I saw the cornerstone of the Earth. And I saw the four winds which support the Earth and the sky.
And I saw how the winds stretch out the height of Heaven, and how they position themselves between Heaven and Earth; they are the Pillars of Heaven.
And I saw the winds which turn the sky and cause the disc of the Sun and all the stars to set.
And I saw the winds on the Earth which support the clouds and I saw the paths of the Angels. I saw at the end of the Earth; the firmament of Heaven above.
And I saw the cornerstone of the Earth. And I saw the four winds which support the Earth and the sky.
And I saw how the winds stretch out the height of Heaven, and how they position themselves between Heaven and Earth; they are the Pillars of Heaven.
And I saw the winds which turn the sky and cause the disc of the Sun and all the stars to set.
And I saw the winds on the Earth which support the clouds and I saw the paths of the Angels. I saw at the end of the Earth; the firmament of Heaven above.
Enoch 18:6–12 reads,
And I went towards the south, and it was burning day and night, where there were seven mountains of precious stones, three towards the east and three towards the south.
And those towards the east were of coloured stone, and one was of pearl, and one of healing stone; and those towards the south, of red stone.
And the middle one reached to Heaven, like the throne of the Lord, of stibium, and the top of the throne was of sapphire.
And I saw a burning fire, and what was in all the mountains.
And I saw a place there, beyond the great earth; there the waters gathered together.
And I saw a deep chasm of the earth, with pillars of heavenly fire, and I saw among them fiery pillars of Heaven, which were falling, and as regards both height and depth, they were immeasurable.
And beyond this chasm, I saw a place, and it had neither the sky above it, nor the foundation of earth below it; there was no water on it, and no birds, but it was a desert place.
The last verse is interesting. Similarly, Enoch 21:1–2 reads:And those towards the east were of coloured stone, and one was of pearl, and one of healing stone; and those towards the south, of red stone.
And the middle one reached to Heaven, like the throne of the Lord, of stibium, and the top of the throne was of sapphire.
And I saw a burning fire, and what was in all the mountains.
And I saw a place there, beyond the great earth; there the waters gathered together.
And I saw a deep chasm of the earth, with pillars of heavenly fire, and I saw among them fiery pillars of Heaven, which were falling, and as regards both height and depth, they were immeasurable.
And beyond this chasm, I saw a place, and it had neither the sky above it, nor the foundation of earth below it; there was no water on it, and no birds, but it was a desert place.
And I went round to a place where nothing was made.
And I saw a terrible thing, neither the High Heaven nor the firm ground, but a desert place, prepared and terrible.
And I saw a terrible thing, neither the High Heaven nor the firm ground, but a desert place, prepared and terrible.
But get this, not only does the Book of Enoch say the Earth is Flat (you should check out the link), it also CONTRACTS itself and has some verses Flat-Earthers DON’T want to talk about. As I’ve said, check out the link and read the headline “Parts of the Book of Enoch Flat-Earthers don’t want to talk about”
So in conclusion, the book of Enoch claims the Earth is flat and is used by Flat-Earthers to defend their Flat Earth claims. This alone make the Book not cannon and unreliable. But it also contradicts itself just further making it unreliable. If a book goes against facts we know to be true, unreliable. If a book like the book of Enoch contradicts itself, it’s just as unreliable. You should check the link out. I’ll look the link you have sent in.
Not being in the Bible is not the same as "not being divinely inspired" -- God speaks in many ways. All of God's speaking is "divinely inspired". The Bible is our covenant. The book of Enoch is not in the Bible because it is not our covenant with God. It is referenced by the Bible because it is relevant to our covenant. Enoch prefigures the rapture. His son Methuselah was a harbinger of the coming judgement. Just because the book is not part of our covenant does not mean it isn't divinely inspired or helpful to the edification of Christians. However, it does mean that it is not necessary. You can have a full salvation and close walk with the Lord without ever reading the book of Enoch.