WHO ARE DENIED HEAVEN-ENTRY?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#61
I became a believer in Jesus as a child. Yet, I was not a baby. A baby is not a child, just as a child is not an adult. What Jesus is speaking of is our attitudes in this scripture. Children believe and accept and so must all who desire salvation. We are saved by faith and our entire walk is by faith.

Babies do not have the ability to comprehend salvation. You have come to a false understanding of what is being spoken of.
"These little ones believe in Me" in Mathew18:6 proves all babies believe in Jesus. The problem is not with God's creation. The problem is with humans who forsake faith in Jesus & choose the forbidden knowledge of good & evil as they grow up.
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#62
That doesn’t work for babies.

But try John 9:41 which applies to all people.

John 9:41
41Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Awareness and knowledge of sin causes sin to be imputed to people.

James 4:17
17Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

Clearly it seems that possessing knowledge of good and evil causes sin to be assigned to someone which babies are obviously exempt from up until an age of accountability.

Now to address the elephant in the room. If knowing what’s right and wrong can cause us to sin, why should we know anything at all?
The matter is, if all babies do not believe in Jesus from birth, did God make a mistake?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#63
Knowledge of good & evil comes through the moral law (Romans3:20). So deliverance from the moral law delivers one from the forbidden knowledge of good & evil.
God told Adam and Eve not to EAT of good and evil. That is making it a part of the body.
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#64
WHO ARE DENIED HEAVEN-ENTRY?

Those that come without their wedding garments
Adam and Eve lost God's presence by violating God's command in Genesis 2:17 & choosing the forbidden knowledge of good & evil.
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#66
God told Adam and Eve not to EAT of good and evil. That is making it a part of the body.
God said it became a part of their being & not their body: Genesis 3:22: "And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil".
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#67
"but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.” Genesis 2:17

Haven't you heard what God did to save us from this death? God gave us Christ, God called it giving blood on the altar. No one is saved except through blood given, and for about 4,ooo years it was only symbolic blood of Christ, it was the sacrificial system. Moses and the saints were saved in sleep until Christ was crucified. Matt 27:52-53.
and Lev. 17:11.
Is there forgiveness without confessing the sin of violating God's command in Genesis 2 :17 choosing the forbidden knowledge of good & evil?
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
#68
Mark10:15: "Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein". Jesus refers to all babies.
The following is for reference only,
Confucius was a great thinker and educator in China.
He believed that people's character was good In the beginning,When people were child, these characters were similar,But everyone learns is different when they grow up(sometimes learn good, sometimes learn bad), In order to keep people from being bad, the most important way is to focus on educating children.


Mark 9:37 Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.

Because God is good, So children's character is also good,But Jesus' words do not mean that all children believe in Jesus.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,679
113
#69
The matter is, if all babies do not believe in Jesus from birth, did God make a mistake?
Information about Jesus the Christ of Nazareth would fall into the facts and knowledge category which infants are primarily void of.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

As you can see, God's will is for all people to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. If babies are born with knowledge of Jesus, as you seem to be suggesting, then there is nothing further for anyone to do.

Babies aren't saved because they know about Jesus, but rather because they are sinless as the verses I just showed you in my previous post teach.
 

Aerials1978

Well-known member
Dec 10, 2019
1,707
986
113
#70
Does the Bible say babies are born with the knowledge of good & evil?
Psalm 51:5 states we are all born into iniquity. They don’t have the knowledge you’re talking about, but by their very nature they are at odds with God

“Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me”
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#71
Psalm 51:5 states we are all born into iniquity. They don’t have the knowledge you’re talking about, but by their very nature they are at odds with God

“Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me”
Adam and Eve were unclothed in God's most holy presence. Isn't that sinful seen through the knowledge of good and evil?
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#72
Information about Jesus the Christ of Nazareth would fall into the facts and knowledge category which infants are primarily void of.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

As you can see, God's will is for all people to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. If babies are born with knowledge of Jesus, as you seem to be suggesting, then there is nothing further for anyone to do.

Babies aren't saved because they know about Jesus, but rather because they are sinless as the verses I just showed you in my previous post teach.
Mathew18:6: "these little ones which believe in me". Jesus says humans believe in Him from birth.
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#73
The following is for reference only,
Confucius was a great thinker and educator in China.
He believed that people's character was good In the beginning,When people were child, these characters were similar,But everyone learns is different when they grow up(sometimes learn good, sometimes learn bad), In order to keep people from being bad, the most important way is to focus on educating children.


Mark 9:37 Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.

Because God is good, So children's character is also good,But Jesus' words do not mean that all children believe in Jesus.
Adam and Eve stayed unclothed in God's most holy presence & which was sinful seen through the knowledge of good and evil.
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
#74
Adam and Eve stayed unclothed in God's most holy presence & which was sinful seen through the knowledge of good and evil.
Knowledge of good and evil does not make people do the right thing after When child grows up,Lies, temptations and jealousy,hatred can lead people to make wrong choices, even if the knowledge of good and evil is sealed in our memory.


Some things, when you were a child, no one taught you, you knew what was wrong.That knowledge is the fruit of the tree of good and evil.

When people teach you that this is right and that it is wrong, this knowledge does not come entirely from the fruit of the tree of good and evil.

Even if Adam and Eve ate the fruit of the tree of good and evil,Nor can they fully understand good and evil like God.so do we.
It's not like the serpent said that eating this fruit can distinguish good and evil like God.

So we need the Bible.we need Jesus, he is the tree of life.It has nothing to do with whether has eat the fruit of the tree of good and evil.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
6,031
1,733
113
#75
Adam and Eve lost God's presence by violating God's command in Genesis 2:17 & choosing the forbidden knowledge of good & evil.
Why, then, did God come looking for them?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,601
13,017
113
#76
Original sin seems to pass the responsibility to Adam!
Adam passed the "virus" of sin and death to all mankind (Rom 5:12). But every person is responsible for obedience to the Gospel.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,679
113
#77
Mathew18:6: "these little ones which believe in me". Jesus says humans believe in Him from birth.
This is the context and it doesn’t mean what you’re suggesting. The child, innocent and without pretense, full of trust and faith in his parents, is like how Jesus said we should be toward Him - toward God. This is a comparison to illustrate a point.

Matthew 18:1-6
1At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven? 2And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, 3And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. 4Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me. 6But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,679
113
#78
Mathew18:6: "these little ones which believe in me". Jesus says humans believe in Him from birth.
If you don’t mind, a question. What do you think Jesus meant when He made references to the Kingdom of Heaven?
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
4,966
2,560
113
London
christianchat.com
#79
So it's ok if one does not confess the sin of violating God's command in Genesis 2:17?
you are saying that BILLIONS of human souls who never once heard the gospel are in hell .... I don't believe it, not for a minute. The woman who was a great sinner is not recorded as having confessed but she showed in her actions her penitence and Jesus said she was forgiven because she loved much not because she confessed.

ALL children will be in the kingdom.

You overlook too many scriptures.
Romans 2-14
For when the Gentiles which have not the law do by nature the things contained in the law, these having not the law are a law unto themselves which shew the work of the law written in their hearts. Their consciences also bearing witness, their thoughts the meanwhile accusing or else excusing one another

In the day when GOD SHALL JUDGE the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

A great burden is lifted off our shoulders when we stop judging who is to be sent to hell. We may warn the wicked with confidence that they will be judged.
 
Sep 14, 2019
1,336
50
48
#80
you are saying that BILLIONS of human souls who never once heard the gospel are in hell .... I don't believe it, not for a minute. The woman who was a great sinner is not recorded as having confessed but she showed in her actions her penitence and Jesus said she was forgiven because she loved much not because she confessed.

ALL children will be in the kingdom.

You overlook too many scriptures.
Romans 2-14
For when the Gentiles which have not the law do by nature the things contained in the law, these having not the law are a law unto themselves which shew the work of the law written in their hearts. Their consciences also bearing witness, their thoughts the meanwhile accusing or else excusing one another

In the day when GOD SHALL JUDGE the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

A great burden is lifted off our shoulders when we stop judging who is to be sent to hell. We may warn the wicked with confidence that they will be judged.
1) Romans2:14 never says adult humans will be saved apart from Jesus who alone is the way, truth & life.

2) Acts4:12: "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name (of Jesus) under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved".