Did Isaiah speak in tongues in Isaiah 28:10
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The word states that receiving the Holy Ghost was evidenced by speaking in a tongue not known to the speaker. This is recorded in Acts 2. There is no mention of speaking from a new heart or perspective. Also consider that Paul, in his letter to the Corinthians, references that those who speak in an unknown tongue are actually speaking to God. Again, this negates the idea that those speaking in tongues speak in their own language from a new heart or perspective. Lastly, consider the reality that God takes control of the one thing man cannot tame/control in order to prove He has taken up residence in an individual. (Matt. 19:26, James 3:7-8)
"This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear." Acts 2:32-33
"For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries." 1 Cor. 14:2
"This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear." Acts 2:32-33
"For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries." 1 Cor. 14:2
After over 20 years? Paul traveled a lot. But there is no indication that he knew what language was being spoken when he spoke in tongues more than them all and yet his understanding was unfruitful. No one in over 20 years could identify what language. Because it wasn't a known language. Just like today.
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Are you familiar with 1 Cor 14 :21,22 the Law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord.” 22Thus tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers,
We know that Paul sees it as prophetic of speaking in tongues that was not my question. I was wondering more about the translation about "line upon line"
It's a pretty deep topic. I doubt many will understand what I am talking about.
We know that Paul sees it as prophetic of speaking in tongues that was not my question. I was wondering more about the translation about "line upon line"
It's a pretty deep topic. I doubt many will understand what I am talking about.
they had for generations been given his word and rejecting it twisting it refusing to hear it so he poured out a spirit of confusion and sleep and blindness on tbier mind and heart made tbier preaching senseless and showed thier judgement to be false against his
because of their rebellion for generations he brought the curses to Pass one was a spirit of confusion and ignorance to understand the word because they didn’t embrace it when he was with them
because of their rebellion for generations he brought the curses to Pass one was a spirit of confusion and ignorance to understand the word because they didn’t embrace it when he was with them
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Of course. But studying the bible itself in the purest form in order to hear what the Holy Spirit intended will always be studying what the writers who were inspired wrote with their own hands in their own language and what they were intending to communicate before someone translates it into another language.
And in this case it appears that Isaiah wrote something to the effect of
saw lasaw sal lasaw qaw laqaw qaw laqaw ze er sam ze er sam
Of course that is not the Hebrew characters that he wrote, and I don't know how to do that without a picture of the text. Which I will probably find by the time I am done researching this.
So my efforts to learn what the Holy Spirit intended is always to go to the original text. And in this case I have to wonder if any of the English translations were correct with "line upon line..." etc. Was Isaiah trying to describe sounds that made no sense as mimicking foreign language or did he really intend to say "line upon line, etc."
That is the first question. Once I have answered that one, I can then consider what the Holy Spirit is saying.
But either way, the whole "Study the Bible line upon line precept upon precept to learn doctrine" does not seem to be what Isaiah is saying here as it is so often taught. If people want to insist that it is, that is on them. I seek truth. I can't just steam roll over a bad interpretation like it's ok to go with it even though I have a "check" inside that I believe is from the Spirit telling me "don't teach it that way."
And in this case it appears that Isaiah wrote something to the effect of
saw lasaw sal lasaw qaw laqaw qaw laqaw ze er sam ze er sam
Of course that is not the Hebrew characters that he wrote, and I don't know how to do that without a picture of the text. Which I will probably find by the time I am done researching this.
So my efforts to learn what the Holy Spirit intended is always to go to the original text. And in this case I have to wonder if any of the English translations were correct with "line upon line..." etc. Was Isaiah trying to describe sounds that made no sense as mimicking foreign language or did he really intend to say "line upon line, etc."
That is the first question. Once I have answered that one, I can then consider what the Holy Spirit is saying.
But either way, the whole "Study the Bible line upon line precept upon precept to learn doctrine" does not seem to be what Isaiah is saying here as it is so often taught. If people want to insist that it is, that is on them. I seek truth. I can't just steam roll over a bad interpretation like it's ok to go with it even though I have a "check" inside that I believe is from the Spirit telling me "don't teach it that way."
Yes, I believe this is the same kind of message in this text.
Even if someone insists that it really should be translated "Line upon line, precept upon precept" The intended message based on the context would be that this is a judgment, they would not understand. The Word would be a list of dos and donts but they would never get the point. Darkness while claiming to follow the Law. This might be the meaning.
It certainly is not saying this is the way we ought to live for God or study the bible.
Even if someone insists that it really should be translated "Line upon line, precept upon precept" The intended message based on the context would be that this is a judgment, they would not understand. The Word would be a list of dos and donts but they would never get the point. Darkness while claiming to follow the Law. This might be the meaning.
It certainly is not saying this is the way we ought to live for God or study the bible.
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when we put Verse 10 and 11 together =
ראה לאסו סאל לאסאו קוו לקוו קוו לקוו זי ער סאם זי ער סאם
Tzav la-tzav, tzav la-tzav, kav la-kav, kav la-kav z‘eir sham, z‘eir sham
צ"ב לצ"ב, "צו"ל לצ"ב, "קו"ל, "קו"ל"
Indeed, they will hear meaningless gibberish, senseless babbling, a syllable here, a syllable there.
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11 For with stammering lips and with a strange tongue shall it be spoken to this people;
...
we get a very confused unbeliever who claims to be a linguistic who has no idea what the Gift of Tongues is all about nor the reason for it!
ראה לאסו סאל לאסאו קוו לקוו קוו לקוו זי ער סאם זי ער סאם
Tzav la-tzav, tzav la-tzav, kav la-kav, kav la-kav z‘eir sham, z‘eir sham
צ"ב לצ"ב, "צו"ל לצ"ב, "קו"ל, "קו"ל"
Indeed, they will hear meaningless gibberish, senseless babbling, a syllable here, a syllable there.
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11 For with stammering lips and with a strange tongue shall it be spoken to this people;
...
we get a very confused unbeliever who claims to be a linguistic who has no idea what the Gift of Tongues is all about nor the reason for it!
It talks of Restoration of what;s been LOST. The Jews had lost pretty much ALL their understanding of God, and had substituted their OWN phony religious system in its place.
And the same thing is happening in the NEW Testament. The Catholic world religious systems, pretty much lost the truth of Jesus' Sacrifice, an salvation by FAITH, not works, and substituted their own PAGAN theologies in place of Biblical truth.
Then the reformation where FIRST "Salvation by FAITH" was restored then forward through the centuries when the Biblical truths are being restored "line upon line" and Precept upon precept.
What we call the "Charismatis outpouring" is the latest "Precept" added. but there's a way to go yet before we arrive at Eph 4:13.
And the same thing is happening in the NEW Testament. The Catholic world religious systems, pretty much lost the truth of Jesus' Sacrifice, an salvation by FAITH, not works, and substituted their own PAGAN theologies in place of Biblical truth.
Then the reformation where FIRST "Salvation by FAITH" was restored then forward through the centuries when the Biblical truths are being restored "line upon line" and Precept upon precept.
What we call the "Charismatis outpouring" is the latest "Precept" added. but there's a way to go yet before we arrive at Eph 4:13.
There is plenty of truth that God has been helping His true remnant restore the the truths that were known in the early church after the dark ages since the days of reformation and there is still more to restore. However I don't see the "line upon line" reference, (even it were the correct translation of the Hebrew that was actually written) to be a positive statement. It is not a "good thing" for them to hear "line upon line, precept upon precept" because it results in them falling backwards and being snared and judged. Not something one would wish upon other believers or tell them this is what we want to have happen to us.
I think we probably need to back away from the popular method of teaching it as the description of what we experience when we grow in the knowledge of the word or have our minds renewed by the scriptures inspired by the Spirit. That is a real thing that we can and should talk about but we probably should not be using this text to support that process.
It's not something I would argue with someone about, I just long to get to the intended message of Isaiah here because I sense in my spirit that it is a great message worth knowing and preaching if one can grasp it.
And if it is an example of gibberish it then also warns in advance that people would call speaking in tongues gibberish, which is what they do today. What an amazing thing if this is what Isaiah was saying.
"I will speak to them in other tongues, (Pentecost and 1 Cor 14) and they will say it is gibberish and be given over to their skepticism even though I did such an awesome thing for them."
I am probably wrong, but I can't shake it. I might be right.
I think we probably need to back away from the popular method of teaching it as the description of what we experience when we grow in the knowledge of the word or have our minds renewed by the scriptures inspired by the Spirit. That is a real thing that we can and should talk about but we probably should not be using this text to support that process.
It's not something I would argue with someone about, I just long to get to the intended message of Isaiah here because I sense in my spirit that it is a great message worth knowing and preaching if one can grasp it.
And if it is an example of gibberish it then also warns in advance that people would call speaking in tongues gibberish, which is what they do today. What an amazing thing if this is what Isaiah was saying.
"I will speak to them in other tongues, (Pentecost and 1 Cor 14) and they will say it is gibberish and be given over to their skepticism even though I did such an awesome thing for them."
I am probably wrong, but I can't shake it. I might be right.
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