in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb 'A SPECIFIC DURATION OF TIME'

[kleronomos]

Ezekiel 7:1 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

Ezekiel 7:2 Also, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD unto the land of Israel; An end, the end is come upon the four corners of the land.

Ezekiel 7:3 Now is the end come upon thee, and I will send mine anger upon thee, and will judge thee according to thy ways, and will recompense upon thee all thine abominations.

Ezekiel 7:4 And mine eye shall not spare thee, neither will I have pity: but I will recompense thy ways upon thee, and thine abominations shall be in the midst of thee: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

Ezekiel 7:5 Thus saith the Lord GOD; An evil, an only evil, behold, is come.

Ezekiel 7:6 An end is come, the end is come: it watcheth for thee; behold, it is come.

Ezekiel 7:7 The morning is come unto thee, O thou that dwellest in the land: the time is come, the day of trouble is near, and not the sounding again of the mountains.

Ezekiel 7:8 Now will I shortly pour out my fury upon thee, and accomplish mine anger upon thee: and I will judge thee according to thy ways, and will recompense thee for all thine abominations.

Ezekiel 7:9 And mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity: I will recompense thee according to thy ways and thine abominations that are in the midst of thee; and ye shall know that I am the LORD that smiteth.

Ezekiel 7:10 Behold the day, behold, it is come: the morning is gone forth; the rod hath blossomed, pride hath budded.


Jeremiah 50:25 The LORD hath opened his armoury, and hath brought forth the weapons of his indignation: for this is the work of the Lord GOD of hosts in the land of the Chaldeans.

Jeremiah 50:26 Come against her from the utmost border, open her storehouses: cast her up as heaps, and destroy her utterly: let nothing of her be left.

Jeremiah 50:27 Slay all her bullocks; let them go down to the slaughter: woe unto them! for their day is come, the time of their visitation.

Jeremiah 50:28 The voice of them that flee and escape out of the land of Babylon, to declare in Zion the vengeance of the LORD our God, the vengeance of his temple.

Jeremiah 50:29 Call together the archers against Babylon: all ye that bend the bow, camp against it round about; let none thereof escape: recompense her according to her work; according to all that she hath done, do unto her: for she hath been proud against the LORD, against the Holy One of Israel.

Jeremiah 25:14 For many nations and great kings shall serve themselves of them also: and I will recompense them according to their deeds, and according to the works of their own hands.

Ezekiel 9:10 And as for me also, mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity, but I will recompense their way upon their head.


2596. kata - down, against, according to
2596 katá (a preposition, governing two grammatical cases) – properly, "down from, i.e. from a higher to a lower plane, with special reference to the terminus (end-point)" (J. Thayer).
2596 /katá ("bring down exactly, complete") is "opposite" to 303 /aná ("bring up to completion").]

Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

1557. ekdikésis
Strong's Concordance
ekdikésis: vengeance, vindication
Definition: vengeance, vindication
Usage: (a) a defense, avenging, vindication, vengeance, (b) full (complete) punishment.

1557 ekdíkēsis (a feminine noun derived from 1537 /ek, "out from and to" and 1349 /díkē, "justice, judge") – properly, judgment which fully executes the core-values (standards) of the particular judge, i.e. extending from the inner-person of the judge to its out-come (outcome).



467. antapodidómi
Strong's Concordance
antapodidómi: to give back as an equivalent, recompense
Usage: I give in return, recompense.
467 antapodídōmi (from 473 /antí, "corresponding back" and 591 /apodídōmi, "give") – properly, "pay-back," recompense; return, as an equivalence, i.e. what is equitable (proportional, "fitting").



Isaiah 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw it, and it displeased him that there was no judgment.

Isaiah 59:16 And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him.

Isaiah 59:17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloak.

Isaiah 59:18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.

Isaiah 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.


REPAY
7999. shalam ►
Strong's Concordance
shalam: amends
Definition: to be complete or sound


Ezekiel 11:21 But as for them whose heart walketh after the heart of their detestable things and their abominations, I will recompense their way upon their own heads, saith the Lord GOD.

Hosea 12:2 The LORD hath also a controversy with Judah, and will punish Jacob according to his ways; according to his doings will he recompense him.

Numbers 5:7 Then they shall confess their sin which they have done: and he shall recompense his trespass with the principal thereof, and add unto it the fifth part thereof, and give it unto him against whom he hath trespassed.

2851. kolasis ►
Strong's Concordance
kolasis: correction
Definition: correction
Usage: chastisement, punishment, torment, perhaps with the idea of deprivation.
Cognate: 2851 kólasis (from kolaphos, "a buffeting, a blow") – properly, punishment that "fits" (matches) the one punished (R. Trench); torment from living in the dread of upcoming judgment from shirking one's duty (cf. WS at 1 Jn 4:18).


166. aiónios ►
Strong's Concordance
aiónios: agelong, eternal
Usage: age-long, and therefore: practically eternal, unending; partaking of the character of that which lasts for an age, as contrasted with that which is brief and fleeting.


John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Time and again GOD tells us how HE DISPENSES HIS JUDGMENT. Time and again it is IN PROPORTION.

DEATH IS NOT ETERNAL TORMENT

IT IS WRITTEN
And it was granted to them that not they should kill them but that they shall torment months five And the torment of them like torment of a scorpion when it might strike a man.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

We die and are raised and made a new creature so that the Holy Spirit has a place to dwell and yes I believe that is the 'seed' this flesh body provides the soil for so that when those who live and believe NEVER DIE experience the death of the flesh body they ascend and those who have not been made new creatures DIE at that point and descend awaiting the return of Christ when the dead will rise, just my opinion and what has been given from what is written

Thank you for sharing your views and beliefs God Bless

I was sort of trying to understand your views is why I was asking specific questions

“yes I believe that is the 'seed' this flesh body provides the soil for so that when those who live and believe NEVER DIE experience the death of the flesh body they ascend and those who have not been made new creatures DIE at that point and descend awaiting the return of Christ when the dead will rise, just my opinion and what has been given from what is written”

so you think a faithful Christian’s body doesn’t die ?

 

[kleronomos]

Isaiah 65:16 That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.

Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.


And He will wipe away every tear from the eyes of them and death 'NOT WILL EXIST ANY LONGER'....

1510. eimi ►
Strong's Concordance
eimi: I exist, I am
Original Word: εἰμί
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: eimi
Phonetic Spelling: (i-mee')
Definition: I exist, I am
Usage: I am, exist.
HELPS Word-studies
1510 eimí - the basic Greek verb which expresses being, i.e. TO BE

 

[kleronomos]

I was sort of trying to understand your views is why I was asking specific questions

“yes I believe that is the 'seed' this flesh body provides the soil for so that when those who live and believe NEVER DIE experience the death of the flesh body they ascend and those who have not been made new creatures DIE at that point and descend awaiting the return of Christ when the dead will rise, just my opinion and what has been given from what is written”

so you think a faithful Christian’s body doesn’t die ?

I know the flesh/natural/dust of the earth/earthen vessel/this tabernacle body goes back to dust, NEVER to be anything but dust of the earth ever again. Not to be raised up from the decay, just dust dirt a carcass, bird food, worm food, with the exception of being maybe spare parts for a body still pumping blood.

When the blood stops pumping WE EXIT THE BUILDING.

 

[kleronomos]

I was sort of trying to understand your views is why I was asking specific questions

“yes I believe that is the 'seed' this flesh body provides the soil for so that when those who live and believe NEVER DIE experience the death of the flesh body they ascend and those who have not been made new creatures DIE at that point and descend awaiting the return of Christ when the dead will rise, just my opinion and what has been given from what is written”

so you think a faithful Christian’s body doesn’t die ?

When it comes to death of the flesh body, I don't believe it matters whether you believe or you don't believe. No ONES decaying flesh body will be RAISED up to LIVE IN THE LORDS KINGDOM. That wouldn't be right.

THE DEAD will be raised meaning the spiritually dead, not the spiritually deads' 'dead' body.

As we have born the earthly we will bear the heavenly. THAT means everyone. ALL WILL BE CHANGED as in all BODIES will be spiritual bodies. Rise up from the grave or alive and remaining ALL will be in bodies that fit the 'spiritual realm'

Heaven has come to earth.
Matthew 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,

Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.


in place, here on earth, like it would have been had Christ not been rejected 2000 years ago


HENCE THE LAKE OF FIRE when 'the dead' stand at GWTJ.

Do you think man will be killing man in the Lords Kingdom? Where will they go? Satan being bound in the pit and all.

Won't we all 'be like the angels in heaven'.

What do you think the chances are that GOD would have flesh men living with ANGELS? Didn't go that well the last time. SURE, they weren't good angels to begin with, but the BABIES were the really big problem, weren't they.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

When it comes to death of the flesh body, I don't believe it matters whether you believe or you don't believe. No ONES decaying flesh body will be RAISED up to LIVE IN THE LORDS KINGDOM. That wouldn't be right.

THE DEAD will be raised meaning the spiritually dead, not the spiritually deads' 'dead' body.

As we have born the earthly we will bear the heavenly. THAT means everyone. ALL WILL BE CHANGED as in all BODIES will be spiritual bodies. Rise up from the grave or alive and remaining ALL will be in bodies that fit the 'spiritual realm'

Heaven has come to earth.
Matthew 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,

Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.


in place, here on earth, like it would have been had Christ not been rejected 2000 years ago


HENCE THE LAKE OF FIRE when 'the dead' stand at GWTJ.

Do you think man will be killing man in the Lords Kingdom? Where will they go? Satan being bound in the pit and all.

Won't we all 'be like the angels in heaven'.

What do you think the chances are that GOD would have flesh men living with ANGELS? Didn't go that well the last time. SURE, they weren't good angels to begin with, but the BABIES were the really big problem, weren't they.

“When it comes to death of the flesh body, I don't believe it matters whether you believe or you don't believe. No ONES decaying flesh body will be RAISED up to LIVE IN THE LORDS KINGDOM. That wouldn't be right.”

ok good I wasnt sure I must be missing your point

“Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.”
‭‭John‬ ‭18:36‬ ‭

“Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
‭‭John‬ ‭18:37‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh;

and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:3, 5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.

There is a natural body, ( flesh)

and there is a spiritual body. ( spirit )

And as we have borne the image of the earthy, ( flesh made of dust )

we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. ( spiritual made of Gods promise )

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:35, 44, 49-50‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“It is the spirit that quickeneth;

the flesh profiteth nothing:

the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭


We need to be born of spirit and water to enter this kingdom of spirit water of remission in death and spirit of new life in resurrection


“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬

“but ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, and to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel. See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭12:22-25‬ ‭

we’re going to spend time in heaven until the restoration of a new earth

“Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭6:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1

and then when the time is come the kingdom gathering in heaven now will restore the earth

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that city is what Hebrews is saying we’re called into this heavenly city until that day of restoration

“These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. ( our earthly life )

…But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.”( our promised land )
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:13, 16‬ ‭

one day THe things he’s doing in heaven are going to come and retire the earth but until then he’s tethering his people here

“After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; and cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭7:9-10, 14-17‬ ‭

and eventually that present heavenly kingdom is going to come to a new earth

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:1-5‬ ‭

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I know the flesh/natural/dust of the earth/earthen vessel/this tabernacle body goes back to dust, NEVER to be anything but dust of the earth ever again. Not to be raised up from the decay, just dust dirt a carcass, bird food, worm food, with the exception of being maybe spare parts for a body still pumping blood.

When the blood stops pumping WE EXIT THE BUILDING.

yes I look at it also like a rental home for the spiritual body we’re promised. I want to be faithful with my body now but also understand it’s only temporal God has a better one for me.

this is something when you get old that really hits the heart as our body does and this erosion of it becomes more evident with wrinkles and aches and scars of time , you sort of realize how temporary and temporal it is and how amazing his promises are just what we really need and hope for

 

[kleronomos]

we’re going to spend time in heaven until the restoration of a new earth

I don't presently think so.

Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

Revelation 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Revelation 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Revelation 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

Revelation 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

Revelation 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?



Hebrews 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

Hebrews 12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

Hebrews 12:27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

Hebrews 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.





You know who will be able to stand? Those who haven't taken the mark of the beast. THOSE who have endured to the end. Those who have STOOD and OVERCOME. Those who put on the gospel armor and withstood the fiery darts of Satan. Those who will be gathered by the angels not to go to HEAVEN because the LORD OF LORDS AND KING OF KINGS is coming to the earth and all the kingdoms of the world will be HIS and we will rule and reign for 1000 years. And after that GOD is coming here too.


Remember this EVENT? I know you do but I every refresh is good for me, but proves the point that we HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR

Daniel 3:1 Nebuchadnezzar the king made an image of gold, whose height was threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof six cubits he set it up in the plain of Dura, in the province of Babylon.

Daniel 3:2 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king sent to gather together the princes, the governors, and the captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, to come to the dedication of the image which Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up.

Daniel 3:3 Then the princes, the governors, and captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, were gathered together unto the dedication of the image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up; and they stood before the image that Nebuchadnezzar had set up.

Daniel 3:4 Then an herald cried aloud, To you it is commanded, O people, nations, and languages,

Daniel 3:5 That at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king hath set up

Daniel 3:6 And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth shall the same hour be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:7 Therefore at that time, when all the people heard the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and all kinds of musick, all the people, the nations, and the languages, fell down and worshipped the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up.

Daniel 3:8 Wherefore at that time certain Chaldeans came near, and accused the Jews.

Daniel 3:9 They spake and said to the king Nebuchadnezzar, O king, live for ever.

Daniel 3:10 Thou, O king, hast made a decree, that every man that shall hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, shall fall down and worship the golden image

Daniel 3:11 And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth, that he should be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:12 There are certain Jews whom thou hast set over the affairs of the province of Babylon, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego; these men, O king, have not regarded thee they serve not thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

Daniel 3:13 Then Nebuchadnezzar in his rage and fury commanded to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego. Then they brought these men before the king.

Daniel 3:14 Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them, Is it true, O Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, do not ye serve my gods, nor worship the golden image which I have set up?

Daniel 3:15 Now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the image which I have made; well but if ye worship not, ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace; and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands?

Daniel 3:16 Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter.

Daniel 3:17 If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king.

Daniel 3:18 But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

Daniel 3:19 Then was Nebuchadnezzar full of fury, and the form of his visage was changed against Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego therefore he spake, and commanded that they should heat the furnace one seven times more than it was wont to be heated.

Daniel 3:20 And he commanded the most mighty men that were in his army to bind Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, and to cast them into the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:21 Then these men were bound in their coats, their hosen, and their hats, and their other garments, and were cast into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:22 Therefore because the king's commandment was urgent, and the furnace exceeding hot, the flame of the fire slew those men that took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego.

Daniel 3:23 And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:24 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonied, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellers, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king.

Daniel 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Daniel 3:26 Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the mouth of the burning fiery furnace, and spake, and said, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, ye servants of the most high God, come forth, and come hither. Then Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, came forth of the midst of the fire.

Daniel 3:27 And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellers, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

Daniel 3:29 Therefore I make a decree, That every people, nation, and language, which speak any thing amiss against the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, shall be cut in pieces, and their houses shall be made a dunghill because there is no other God that can deliver after this sort.

Daniel 3:30 Then the king promoted Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, in the province of Babylon.

 

[kleronomos]

“Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭6:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1

Don't you believe these have applied to ALL CHRISTIANS for the past 2000 years? Where do you think the NEVER DIE continue on living when they leave the earthen flesh vessel?

 

[kleronomos]

and eventually that present heavenly kingdom is going to come to a new earth

The Lords Day BEGINS when Jesus returns and His kingdom is set up on earth.

Remember when they handed Jesus the Scroll to read in the temple? And He read

Isaiah 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

Isaiah 61:2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,

And this is where He quit reading said something like

'this day is this prophecy fulfilled' (don't quote me)

THAT was the FIRST ADVENT

but HE HAD TO QUIT THERE BECAUSE THE 2ND advent was still YET FUTURE.

Future to us also BUT when He returns it is for


and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Isaiah 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that He might be glorified.

Isaiah 61:4 And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.

Isaiah 61:5 And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall be your plowmen and your vinedressers.

Isaiah 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.

Isaiah 61:7 For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them.

Isaiah 61:8 For I the LORD love judgment, I hate robbery for burnt offering; and I will direct their work in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them.

Isaiah 61:9 And their seed shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people: all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which the LORD hath blessed.

Isaiah 61:10 I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.

Isaiah 61:11 For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.


Now if you have some verses that we go off to heaven I would be happy to read them....

 

[kleronomos]

and eventually that present heavenly kingdom is going to come to a new earth

When do the New Heaven and earth begin?
AFTER THE GWTJ.
Which is after Satan is loosed from the abyss for a short season.
Which is after Satan was bound for 1000 years .
Which was when Christ came as LORD OF LORDS AND KING OF KINGS and His Brightness destroyed Satan.
Which was after the workings of Satan with lying wonders.
Which was when Satan stood where he ought not claiming to be God and killed the two witnesses.
Which was after taking the mark of the beast
Which was after the image set up to worship
Which was after the deadly wound.
Which was after the 2 witnesses arrived.
Which was after the beast rose up
Which was after today.


Don't quote me kinda in a hurry got to go. But it's something to ponder and see if there is something that conflicts

 

[kleronomos]

yes I look at it also like a rental home for the spiritual body we’re promised. I want to be faithful with my body now but also understand it’s only temporal God has a better one for me.

this is something when you get old that really hits the heart as our body does and this erosion of it becomes more evident with wrinkles and aches and scars of time , you sort of realize how temporary and temporal it is and how amazing his promises are just what we really need and hope for

I don't know if it's the age and wrinkles so much as the wisdom and knowledge you receive from the study of Gods Words. I can guarantee you one thing, IF you read and study the words of God like we are supposed to then one day you will find that this world is BORING and the only place you want to be is in the words of God. I LITERALLY have to PRAY to leave them and go do the chores I have to do in this world. AND if I don't use the time I am given for that and I sit down and pick up the Bible I get lost all over again and nothing gets done. Which is why I have to go dig a ditch before the rain hits and takes out the drive again. God Bless

 

[Webers.Home]

.
PLAINTIFF: The creator depicted in your holy book knew ahead of time, by
means of precognition, that the human life he was about to create would all
have to die because of just one man's sin, plus:

. . . the human life he was about to create would become so bad that he
would have to exterminate most of it in a global deluge,

. . . and the human life he was about to create would be suffering with
diseases, poverty, wars, famines, and oppression,

. . . and much of the human life that he was about to create would end up in
Hell

. . . and to top it off: has the chutzpa to advertise himself as a god of love,
concern, compassion, and sympathy.

See: I can't respect the creator depicted in your holy book because he's
cruel, fiendish, and criminally insane.

REPLY: So in your honest opinion the creator depicted in the Bible is a
merciless tyrannical despot far more dangerous than Adolf Hitler, Joseph
Stalin, Benito Mussolini, Idi Amin, Mao Tse-tung, Pol Pot, Saddam Hussein,
Robert Mugabe, Xi Jinping, and Kim Jong Un?

PLAINTIFF: Yes!

REPLY: And yet you aren't afraid of such an one?

PLAINTIFF: What's to fear? Your holy book's god doesn't exist; he's a
fantasy; along with the likes of Mickey Mouse, Peter Pan, and Pikachu.

REPLY: Tthen I suggest utilizing whatever amount of time you have remaining
to begin preparing yourself for the worst. If things should work out for the
better, then great; but if not then at least you won't be taken by surprise.

• Prov 22:3 . . A sensible person foresees the danger ahead and takes
precautions; the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
_

 

[Webers.Home]

.
• Isa 66:22-24 . . From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to
another, all mankind will come and bow down before me-- speaks the Lord.
And they will go out and look upon the dead bodies of those who rebelled
against Me: their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched, and they
will be loathsome to all mankind.

That rather ghastly scene depicts a sort of tourist attraction similar to the La
Brea Tar Pits museum in Los Angeles where the remains of prehistoric
creatures, excavated from ancient asphalt deposits, are on display.

A worm that thrives in brimstone is pretty amazing, but not unreasonable.
The 4 inch Pompeii worm lives in sea water temperatures of 176°
Fahrenheit; hot enough to kill salmonella and sanitize an egg. So I guess if
God could create a worm like the Pompeii, it shouldn't be too difficult for Him
to create worms that like it even warmer.
_

 

[kleronomos]

.
PLAINTIFF: The creator depicted in your holy book knew ahead of time, by
means of precognition, that the human life he was about to create would all
have to die because of just one man's sin, plus:

. . . the human life he was about to create would become so bad that he
would have to exterminate most of it in a global deluge,

. . . and the human life he was about to create would be suffering with
diseases, poverty, wars, famines, and oppression,

. . . and much of the human life that he was about to create would end up in
Hell

. . . and to top it off: has the chutzpa to advertise himself as a god of love,
concern, compassion, and sympathy.

See: I can't respect the creator depicted in your holy book because he's
cruel, fiendish, and criminally insane.

REPLY: So in your honest opinion the creator depicted in the Bible is a
merciless tyrannical despot far more dangerous than Adolf Hitler, Joseph
Stalin, Benito Mussolini, Idi Amin, Mao Tse-tung, Pol Pot, Saddam Hussein,
Robert Mugabe, Xi Jinping, and Kim Jong Un?

PLAINTIFF: Yes!

REPLY: And yet you aren't afraid of such an one?

PLAINTIFF: What's to fear? Your holy book's god doesn't exist; he's a
fantasy; along with the likes of Mickey Mouse, Peter Pan, and Pikachu.

REPLY: Tthen I suggest utilizing whatever amount of time you have remaining
to begin preparing yourself for the worst. If things should work out for the
better, then great; but if not then at least you won't be taken by surprise.

• Prov 22:3 . . A sensible person foresees the danger ahead and takes
precautions; the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
_

You lost me

 

[kleronomos]

.
• Isa 66:22-24 . . From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to
another, all mankind will come and bow down before me-- speaks the Lord.
And they will go out and look upon the dead bodies of those who rebelled
against Me: their worm will not die, nor will their fire be quenched, and they
will be loathsome to all mankind.

That rather ghastly scene depicts a sort of tourist attraction similar to the La
Brea Tar Pits museum in Los Angeles where the remains of prehistoric
creatures, excavated from ancient asphalt deposits, are on display.

A worm that thrives in brimstone is pretty amazing, but not unreasonable.
The 4 inch Pompeii worm lives in sea water temperatures of 176°
Fahrenheit; hot enough to kill salmonella and sanitize an egg. So I guess if
God could create a worm like the Pompeii, it shouldn't be too difficult for Him
to create worms that like it even warmer.
_

WHEN, exactly, did Satan fall from?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I don't presently think so.

Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

Revelation 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Revelation 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Revelation 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

Revelation 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

Revelation 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?



Hebrews 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

Hebrews 12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

Hebrews 12:27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

Hebrews 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.





You know who will be able to stand? Those who haven't taken the mark of the beast. THOSE who have endured to the end. Those who have STOOD and OVERCOME. Those who put on the gospel armor and withstood the fiery darts of Satan. Those who will be gathered by the angels not to go to HEAVEN because the LORD OF LORDS AND KING OF KINGS is coming to the earth and all the kingdoms of the world will be HIS and we will rule and reign for 1000 years. And after that GOD is coming here too.


Remember this EVENT? I know you do but I every refresh is good for me, but proves the point that we HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR

Daniel 3:1 Nebuchadnezzar the king made an image of gold, whose height was threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof six cubits he set it up in the plain of Dura, in the province of Babylon.

Daniel 3:2 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king sent to gather together the princes, the governors, and the captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, to come to the dedication of the image which Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up.

Daniel 3:3 Then the princes, the governors, and captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, were gathered together unto the dedication of the image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up; and they stood before the image that Nebuchadnezzar had set up.

Daniel 3:4 Then an herald cried aloud, To you it is commanded, O people, nations, and languages,

Daniel 3:5 That at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king hath set up

Daniel 3:6 And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth shall the same hour be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:7 Therefore at that time, when all the people heard the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and all kinds of musick, all the people, the nations, and the languages, fell down and worshipped the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up.

Daniel 3:8 Wherefore at that time certain Chaldeans came near, and accused the Jews.

Daniel 3:9 They spake and said to the king Nebuchadnezzar, O king, live for ever.

Daniel 3:10 Thou, O king, hast made a decree, that every man that shall hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, shall fall down and worship the golden image

Daniel 3:11 And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth, that he should be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:12 There are certain Jews whom thou hast set over the affairs of the province of Babylon, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego; these men, O king, have not regarded thee they serve not thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

Daniel 3:13 Then Nebuchadnezzar in his rage and fury commanded to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego. Then they brought these men before the king.

Daniel 3:14 Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them, Is it true, O Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, do not ye serve my gods, nor worship the golden image which I have set up?

Daniel 3:15 Now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the image which I have made; well but if ye worship not, ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace; and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands?

Daniel 3:16 Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter.

Daniel 3:17 If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king.

Daniel 3:18 But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

Daniel 3:19 Then was Nebuchadnezzar full of fury, and the form of his visage was changed against Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego therefore he spake, and commanded that they should heat the furnace one seven times more than it was wont to be heated.

Daniel 3:20 And he commanded the most mighty men that were in his army to bind Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, and to cast them into the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:21 Then these men were bound in their coats, their hosen, and their hats, and their other garments, and were cast into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:22 Therefore because the king's commandment was urgent, and the furnace exceeding hot, the flame of the fire slew those men that took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego.

Daniel 3:23 And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

Daniel 3:24 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonied, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellers, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king.

Daniel 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Daniel 3:26 Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the mouth of the burning fiery furnace, and spake, and said, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, ye servants of the most high God, come forth, and come hither. Then Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, came forth of the midst of the fire.

Daniel 3:27 And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellers, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

Daniel 3:29 Therefore I make a decree, That every people, nation, and language, which speak any thing amiss against the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, shall be cut in pieces, and their houses shall be made a dunghill because there is no other God that can deliver after this sort.

Daniel 3:30 Then the king promoted Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, in the province of Babylon.

Revelation 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places

what do all those scriptures have to do with believers going to heaven ? And how do they even connect to each other ?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I don't know if it's the age and wrinkles so much as the wisdom and knowledge you receive from the study of Gods Words. I can guarantee you one thing, IF you read and study the words of God like we are supposed to then one day you will find that this world is BORING and the only place you want to be is in the words of God. I LITERALLY have to PRAY to leave them and go do the chores I have to do in this world. AND if I don't use the time I am given for that and I sit down and pick up the Bible I get lost all over again and nothing gets done. Which is why I have to go dig a ditch before the rain hits and takes out the drive again. God Bless

“I don't know if it's the age and wrinkles so much as the wisdom and knowledge you receive from the study of Gods Words.”

yeah what I’m saying is as a person gets old , believer or not , it becomes evident that your body is temporary because your seeing it fade ect

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The Lords Day BEGINS when Jesus returns and His kingdom is set up on earth.

Remember when they handed Jesus the Scroll to read in the temple? And He read

Isaiah 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

Isaiah 61:2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,

And this is where He quit reading said something like

'this day is this prophecy fulfilled' (don't quote me)

THAT was the FIRST ADVENT

but HE HAD TO QUIT THERE BECAUSE THE 2ND advent was still YET FUTURE.

Future to us also BUT when He returns it is for


and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Isaiah 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that He might be glorified.

Isaiah 61:4 And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.

Isaiah 61:5 And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall be your plowmen and your vinedressers.

Isaiah 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.

Isaiah 61:7 For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them.

Isaiah 61:8 For I the LORD love judgment, I hate robbery for burnt offering; and I will direct their work in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them.

Isaiah 61:9 And their seed shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people: all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which the LORD hath blessed.

Isaiah 61:10 I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.

Isaiah 61:11 For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.


Now if you have some verses that we go off to heaven I would be happy to read them....

“The Lords Day BEGINS when Jesus returns and His kingdom is set up on earth.”

you aren’t following me at all

heaven is a place current earth is a place current they are occurring simultaneously pretty basic . I’m not sure your willing rob hear anything g but what you already think but

“And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them.




Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭12:10-12, 17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if you look at revelation 12 your seeing Jesus being taken into heaven at that time Satan was cast out of heaven and bound in earth never allowed to return to heaven

the kingdom is in heaven now right now , Jesus and the spirits of believers lresdy in heaven

can you acknowledge that heaven and earth are concurrent at least ?

heaven and earth are part of one creation they exist simultaneously Christ is already in heaven on the throne and Satan has already been cast out of heaven into earth.

what I’m saying is simple in heaven salvstion has already come as people die in this world believers enter that heavenly kingdom but the earth continues on until the day what’s already in heaven comes to earth

Heaven and earth have always existed

“The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD's:

But the earth hath he given to the children of men.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭115:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

his kingdom is already in heaven

“And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: “

while on earth

“Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you,”

you have the kingdom in heaven at peace filled with people who came through the world and we’re saved by the gospel

“And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.”

revelation is showing events in heaven and in earth they are happening simultaneously while heaven is at peace and the kingdom has come in heaven

the earth is fighting against Satan and all the evil here and walking in faith hoping to enter the kingdom

Ask yourself where this guys is

“And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭23:43‬ ‭KJV‬‬

where Jesus ?

“But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭7:55‬ ‭

where’s new Jerusalem ?

“Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭3:

“And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Godnis already making new things already gathering his people into his kingdom it’s just not visable yet we see this world and the earthly doomed things where Satan is ruling look around at this world and then look up into heaven where the kingdom is come and one day will come

 

[kleronomos]

Revelation 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places

what do all those scriptures have to do with believers going to heaven ? And how do they even connect to each other ?

No heaven to go to.
When you say 'believers' going to heaven which Scriptures are you referring to?