Are our Good Works, done with faith in Christ "filthy rags" (Isa 64:6) or "fine linen" (Rev 19:8).

[XavierJesusLovesIndia]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Look at the following and preceding verses in Isa 64:

Verse 5: "You come to the help of those who gladly do right, who remember your ways. But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved?"

So here the Prophet is speaking of those who go on continuing to sin, don't accept the Lord's Prophets etc. It is those bad works that he calls filthy rags, certainly not good works done with true faith in Christ, and out of pure love for God.

Verse 7: "No one calls on your name or strives to lay hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us and made us waste away because of our sins."

And this makes it even clearer. The Lord is angry with them because they are not even calling on the Name of the Lord, or clinging to Him in time of trouble. So He is angry with them either for their complete lack of faith and trust in Him, or at best for their dead faith and lukewarm trust in Him. Certainly, He is not angry with them for a Good Work, like e.g. Fasting, which the Lord commended in Isaiah itself just a few chapters prior in Isa 58, especially when accompanied by Prayer and Alms-giving etc. Before that, He rebuked them for bad fasts.

"6“Is this not the fast that I have chosen: To loose the bonds of wickedness, To undo the [c]heavy burdens, To let the oppressed go free, And that you break every yoke? 7Is it not to share your bread with the hungry, And that you bring to your house the poor who are [d]cast out; When you see the naked, that you cover him, And not hide yourself from your own flesh?

8Then your light shall break forth like the morning, Your healing shall spring forth speedily, And your righteousness shall go before you; The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard. 9Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’"

A final example will also illustrate further. If in Proverbs 28:9 it is said: "One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination." it cannot legitimately be concluded from that, obviously, that praying itself is an abomination, which would be absurd.

Only the refusing to obey God or God's Law was displeasing to God, and then even "praying" without wanting to do God's will became an abomination, and therefore that was written. Similarly, Isaiah speaks of "filthy rags" etc.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Romans 3:10-12
10As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 11There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 12They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

 

[Magenta]

Hebrews 11:6

 

[Evmur]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Look at the following and preceding verses in Isa 64:

Verse 5: "You come to the help of those who gladly do right, who remember your ways. But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved?"

So here the Prophet is speaking of those who go on continuing to sin, don't accept the Lord's Prophets etc. It is those bad works that he calls filthy rags, certainly not good works done with true faith in Christ, and out of pure love for God.

Verse 7: "No one calls on your name or strives to lay hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us and made us waste away because of our sins."

And this makes it even clearer. The Lord is angry with them because they are not even calling on the Name of the Lord, or clinging to Him in time of trouble. So He is angry with them either for their complete lack of faith and trust in Him, or at best for their dead faith and lukewarm trust in Him. Certainly, He is not angry with them for a Good Work, like e.g. Fasting, which the Lord commended in Isaiah itself just a few chapters prior in Isa 58, especially when accompanied by Prayer and Alms-giving etc. Before that, He rebuked them for bad fasts.

"6“Is this not the fast that I have chosen: To loose the bonds of wickedness, To undo the [c]heavy burdens, To let the oppressed go free, And that you break every yoke? 7Is it not to share your bread with the hungry, And that you bring to your house the poor who are [d]cast out; When you see the naked, that you cover him, And not hide yourself from your own flesh?

8Then your light shall break forth like the morning, Your healing shall spring forth speedily, And your righteousness shall go before you; The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard. 9Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’"

A final example will also illustrate further. If in Proverbs 28:9 it is said: "One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination." it cannot legitimately be concluded from that, obviously, that praying itself is an abomination, which would be absurd.

Only the refusing to obey God or God's Law was displeasing to God, and then even "praying" without wanting to do God's will became an abomination, and therefore that was written. Similarly, Isaiah speaks of "filthy rags" etc.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.

filthy rags are works that folk do in order [they think] to be saved. The glorious robes of righteousness are what we receive as a free gift when we are saved.

 

[Dirtman]

Uzzah tried to keep the ark of the covenant from falling on the ground and died. He thought he was doing a "good" work in the spirit.
The work of the spirit through is good. Our good works are looked on with grace. They are only as good as we are. You can take that for what its worth.

 

[presidente]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Look at the following and preceding verses in Isa 64:

Verse 5: "You come to the help of those who gladly do right, who remember your ways. But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved?"

So here the Prophet is speaking of those who go on continuing to sin, don't accept the Lord's Prophets etc. It is those bad works that he calls filthy rags, certainly not good works done with true faith in Christ, and out of pure love for God.

Verse 7: "No one calls on your name or strives to lay hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us and made us waste away because of our sins."

And this makes it even clearer. The Lord is angry with them because they are not even calling on the Name of the Lord, or clinging to Him in time of trouble. So He is angry with them either for their complete lack of faith and trust in Him, or at best for their dead faith and lukewarm trust in Him. Certainly, He is not angry with them for a Good Work, like e.g. Fasting, which the Lord commended in Isaiah itself just a few chapters prior in Isa 58, especially when accompanied by Prayer and Alms-giving etc. Before that, He rebuked them for bad fasts.

"6“Is this not the fast that I have chosen: To loose the bonds of wickedness, To undo the [c]heavy burdens, To let the oppressed go free, And that you break every yoke? 7Is it not to share your bread with the hungry, And that you bring to your house the poor who are [d]cast out; When you see the naked, that you cover him, And not hide yourself from your own flesh?

8Then your light shall break forth like the morning, Your healing shall spring forth speedily, And your righteousness shall go before you; The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard. 9Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’"

A final example will also illustrate further. If in Proverbs 28:9 it is said: "One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination." it cannot legitimately be concluded from that, obviously, that praying itself is an abomination, which would be absurd.

Only the refusing to obey God or God's Law was displeasing to God, and then even "praying" without wanting to do God's will became an abomination, and therefore that was written. Similarly, Isaiah speaks of "filthy rags" etc.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.

If Israel's works at the time were like used tampon rags (I have heard it refers to menstrual clothes), that doesn't mean the works of the redeemed are the same way.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Romans 3:10-12
10As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 11There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 12They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Paul’s quoting the Old Testament

“The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, There is none that doeth good. The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there were any that did understand, And seek God. They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: There is none that doeth good, no, not one.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭14:1-3‬ ‭

that’s different from this New Testament

“And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

things changed brother with Jesus stone of sacrifice for our sins and edification on the things of God we were not only washed clean of our past were also taught our future

this is the new

“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if a sinner without atonement does a good work they are already wearing filthy garments so everything is unclean

if a sinner repents and has remission of thier sins thier works are very valuable to Bring glory to Gods name and glory to his house

if we believe Jesus is our atoning sacrifice we can’t keep believing we’re wearing those same filthy garments he’s given us a change of clothes

“Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel. And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.”
‭‭Zechariah‬ ‭3:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if we sinned one time our clothing is stained forever we need a change of garments

And when we believe the gospel that’s what’s happening

“that ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;( filthy clothing )

and be renewed in the spirit of your mind; and that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.”( new clean garments )
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:22-24‬ ‭


If we reject the gospel no works we can ever do will be valid because we’re already condemned by sin if we repent and turn to the lord our works are those of Gods children and will last

 

[Mofastus]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Look at the following and preceding verses in Isa 64:

Verse 5: "You come to the help of those who gladly do right, who remember your ways. But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved?"

So here the Prophet is speaking of those who go on continuing to sin, don't accept the Lord's Prophets etc. It is those bad works that he calls filthy rags, certainly not good works done with true faith in Christ, and out of pure love for God.

Verse 7: "No one calls on your name or strives to lay hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us and made us waste away because of our sins."

And this makes it even clearer. The Lord is angry with them because they are not even calling on the Name of the Lord, or clinging to Him in time of trouble. So He is angry with them either for their complete lack of faith and trust in Him, or at best for their dead faith and lukewarm trust in Him. Certainly, He is not angry with them for a Good Work, like e.g. Fasting, which the Lord commended in Isaiah itself just a few chapters prior in Isa 58, especially when accompanied by Prayer and Alms-giving etc. Before that, He rebuked them for bad fasts.

"6“Is this not the fast that I have chosen: To loose the bonds of wickedness, To undo the [c]heavy burdens, To let the oppressed go free, And that you break every yoke? 7Is it not to share your bread with the hungry, And that you bring to your house the poor who are [d]cast out; When you see the naked, that you cover him, And not hide yourself from your own flesh?

8Then your light shall break forth like the morning, Your healing shall spring forth speedily, And your righteousness shall go before you; The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard. 9Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’"

A final example will also illustrate further. If in Proverbs 28:9 it is said: "One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination." it cannot legitimately be concluded from that, obviously, that praying itself is an abomination, which would be absurd.

Only the refusing to obey God or God's Law was displeasing to God, and then even "praying" without wanting to do God's will became an abomination, and therefore that was written. Similarly, Isaiah speaks of "filthy rags" etc.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.

The Way, John 14:6, has been given to reach out to God and find Him for every believer. Eph 2:10 tells us we are created in Christ Jesus unto good works, unprofitable to the world Luke 17:10 but in service to God. Which is our reasonable service Romans 12:1 nullifying anything against us walking in His righteousness Isaiah 54:17 and not our own. prospering us in all things Psalm 1:3, 3 John 1:2, Isaiah 55:12-13, 1 Timothy 4:8, Isaiah 61:10, bringing us the boldness, Hebrews 4:16, we acquire in serving Him having the help we petition from Him granted through our sufferings Philippians 1:29, Acts 14:22, for Him. which opens the door to His kingdom we are to enter in this life as well as the eternal life we are assured of John 10:10,27-28, 1 John 2:20,27, allowing every believer to stand 1 Cor 15:58 and become a helper of another's joy 2 Cor 1:24, 1 Peter 5:3 in service to Him, Colossians 3:17,23, because we know Him 2 Timothy 1:12 and are taught by Him, Eph 4:21, becoming willing even to die for Him, Philippians 3:10, knowing His love and fulness Eph 3:19, and without out Him we are nothing, John 15:5, 2 Cor 3:5. and I have given .001 percent of the references that say the same thing. Jesus is our light and in His light we are made free John 1:4, 8:12,32,36, Eph 5:14, 2 Peter 1:19. and in unity with Him and all believers, Eph 4:13, 1 Cor 6:17, John 17:21.

 

[Mofastus]

and I forgot to put this in since you used Rev.19:8, the result, Rev 19:10, 1 Cor 1:6. it's all about JESUS!

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

Paul’s quoting the Old Testament

If we reject the gospel no works we can ever do will be valid because we’re already condemned by sin if we repent and turn to the lord our works are those of Gods children and will last

A dead person can not reject the Gospel.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

filthy rags are works of the flesh. Works done not out of love or faith. but works done to serve self

I can be a christian and do works which are filthy rags because I am doing them out of the flesh. not out of love

If I am a non christian, and I am doing works in order to earn, keep or maitnain salvation. those are also filthy rags, because they are works not down out of love or faith. but they are done out of selfish gain.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

A dead person can not reject the Gospel.

What’s your definition of dead ? Is it the same as Gods ?

“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭20:38‬ ‭

“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”
‭‭John‬ ‭11:25-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:9‬ ‭

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭27:51-53‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: by which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭3:18-20‬ ‭

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

What’s your definition of dead ? Is it the same as Gods ?

“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭20:38‬ ‭

“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”
‭‭John‬ ‭11:25-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:9‬ ‭

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭27:51-53‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: by which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭3:18-20‬ ‭

An unsaved person can not believe on Jesus because that person has a dead soul. That person must be resurrected first to believe. And only God quickeneth the dead.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

An unsaved person can not believe on Jesus because that person has a dead soul. That person must be resurrected first to believe. And only God quickeneth the dead.

every sinner is under a sentance of death upon thier soul

“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭18:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬



We’ve all sinned before , everyone is under that condemnation that’s what the gospel is offering salvation from

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭

All are alive to God those who hear the gospel are hearing the word of life


it comes down to the gospel and whether you hear it or reject it

you can hear it and this is the promise

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

or reject it and this is the promise

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48‬ ‭

it’s really basic and simple the gospel is out in the world offered to anyone some Will hear it and it won’t be important enough to them because they won’t really believe what he gospel says so they will not follow or heed it they won’t really hear it

others will hear it and believe what’s said and it will become I oorts t enough for them to repent and follow the lord because they believe it is eternal salvation

it’s bekievers of the gospel who’ve received promises of the gospel that’s the only way even if you died in the flood you can hear the gospel or reject it

the o my thing that keeps a Christian from having a choice is they convince themselves they don’t have a choice

every action is a choice in Christ

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

every sinner is under a sentance of death upon thier soul

“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭18:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬



We’ve all sinned before , everyone is under that condemnation that’s what the gospel is offering salvation from

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭

All are alive to God those who hear the gospel are hearing the word of life


it comes down to the gospel and whether you hear it or reject it

you can hear it and this is the promise

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

or reject it and this is the promise

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48‬ ‭

it’s really basic and simple the gospel is out in the world offered to anyone some Will hear it and it won’t be important enough to them because they won’t really believe what he gospel says so they will not follow or heed it they won’t really hear it

others will hear it and believe what’s said and it will become I oorts t enough for them to repent and follow the lord because they believe it is eternal salvation

it’s bekievers of the gospel who’ve received promises of the gospel that’s the only way even if you died in the flood you can hear the gospel or reject it

the o my thing that keeps a Christian from having a choice is they convince themselves they don’t have a choice

every action is a choice in Christ

Again, only God quickeneth the dead. A person can't resurrect their own dead soul by deciding to accept the Gospel. It's God's decision who He wants to quickeneth.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Again, only God quickeneth the dead. A person can't resurrect their own dead soul by deciding to accept the Gospel. It's God's decision who He wants to quickeneth.

yeah who’s saying a person resurrects thier soul lol you know how your saying “Only God can do it ?” That’s why he sent the gospel to you and said believe it and live

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭

why would you now say “ only Hod can quicken the dead ? What point are you attempting to make ? This is how the dead are quickened Gods already established it in the earth

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

…..Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63, 68-69‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s why this was sent to you , myself and everyone else in the world who will believe the gospel

“And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:14‬ ‭

God has already made the way now he’s said to every creature for all time until the end

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You continue to repeat “ only God can do this “ Ehat I’m saying is God has done it d now is beckoning people of any nationality to believe the gospel being preached in the world the exact same gospel Jesus preached first and sent to everyone that’s “ how “ only Hod can quicken a person to try to convince your own self you have no choice is like a man set free from a prison cell but he thinks he has to stay on because the door used to be locked

your not the same when you come to the gospel You are being given a choice when you hear what the lord said and the other choice is what the world tells you anything opposed to what the lord said the choice is every persons

now does this mean everyone is going to choose the good ? No some people have too Much corruption within thier soul and heart and they simply will never repent and believe this doesn’t mean they didn’t have a choice it means they decided on who t they are and what they love more good or evil

No one is saved against thier own Will when they are born again they are born free and able to choose not forced ever in any way at any point but taught the truth and called to heed his word

 

[Komentaja]

Fine Linen.

The filthy rags quoters tend to be the "not of works" people, the folks who don't know that "works" refer to the works of the law of Moses, not a faith that works by love. Gotta make sure you not earning that salvation now.

 

[EDENgate]

Dear Friends, let's discuss these two verses: Isa 64:6 and Rev 19:8.

Isa 64:6

"All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

http://web.mit.edu/jywang/www/cef/Bible/NIV/NIV_Bible/ISA+64.html

Rev 19:8

"She has been given the privilege of wearing fine linen, dazzling and pure." (The fine linen represents the righteous deeds of the saints.)"

https://biblehub.com/isv/revelation/19.htm

Now, on surface appearance, these two verses seem to be saying different saying things because what is fine linen is surely not the filthy rag, but the exact opposite. And likewise what is a filthy rag is definitely not fine linen that is a privilege to wear. So how do we understand?

My own understanding, in brief: I've seen some Pastors use this verse to teach "Total Depravity" (the "T" in the Calvinist Theory of TULIP), or something very close to it). I disagree. The Prophet Isaiah is speaking of works done without faith, or even of those who go on sinning after knowing the Truth, and without calling on the Name of the Lord, as is clear from the context.

Look at the following and preceding verses in Isa 64:

Verse 5: "You come to the help of those who gladly do right, who remember your ways. But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved?"

So here the Prophet is speaking of those who go on continuing to sin, don't accept the Lord's Prophets etc. It is those bad works that he calls filthy rags, certainly not good works done with true faith in Christ, and out of pure love for God.

Verse 7: "No one calls on your name or strives to lay hold of you; for you have hidden your face from us and made us waste away because of our sins."

And this makes it even clearer. The Lord is angry with them because they are not even calling on the Name of the Lord, or clinging to Him in time of trouble. So He is angry with them either for their complete lack of faith and trust in Him, or at best for their dead faith and lukewarm trust in Him. Certainly, He is not angry with them for a Good Work, like e.g. Fasting, which the Lord commended in Isaiah itself just a few chapters prior in Isa 58, especially when accompanied by Prayer and Alms-giving etc. Before that, He rebuked them for bad fasts.

"6“Is this not the fast that I have chosen: To loose the bonds of wickedness, To undo the [c]heavy burdens, To let the oppressed go free, And that you break every yoke? 7Is it not to share your bread with the hungry, And that you bring to your house the poor who are [d]cast out; When you see the naked, that you cover him, And not hide yourself from your own flesh?

8Then your light shall break forth like the morning, Your healing shall spring forth speedily, And your righteousness shall go before you; The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard. 9Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’"

A final example will also illustrate further. If in Proverbs 28:9 it is said: "One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination." it cannot legitimately be concluded from that, obviously, that praying itself is an abomination, which would be absurd.

Only the refusing to obey God or God's Law was displeasing to God, and then even "praying" without wanting to do God's will became an abomination, and therefore that was written. Similarly, Isaiah speaks of "filthy rags" etc.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.

Personally, I don't feel obliged to be or assume the identity the Old Testament may imply.

I'm a New Covenant born again Christian. Not a Jew. ❤️

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

No one is saved against thier own Will when they are born again they are born free and able to choose not forced ever in any way at any point but taught the truth and called to heed his word

John 5:21
For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

"Filthy rags" applies to works done to merit salvation. "Good works" applies to Christian works AFTER salvation. It is the PURPOSE for which good works are done that determines their value. No one can earn salvation through any good works.