What does born again mean?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
2,987
1,014
113
New Zealand
#81
And you’re a senior member?

You say it’s ok to read-write both sacred scripture and the eternal words of Christ?

Jn 3:5 now says: born of water and born again of spirit.

Instead of KJV Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Or is it really born of water and born again (baptismal regeneration) of water and the spirit?
Ez 36:25-27
Mk 16:16
acts 2:38
Acts 8:36-38
Acts22:16
Titus 3:5
Eph 1:13
1 pet 3:20-21
thanks
Regarding Titus 3:5.. that's regeneration of the Holy Spirit that washes away sin.

It's not a verse about immersion baptism.

The other thing is... you've put things as 'Protestant ' and opposed it.

So then you are either Catholic or non Protestant Baptist.

Non Protestant Baptists.. like myself.. reject baptismal regeneration.

So then are you catholic?
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,259
431
83
#82
How then do we become a new creation? Thanks
Acknowledge God "IS" & that you've sinned against His sovereign rule & deserve heavens sin payment "DEATH' (Rom 6:23).

Then place your faith in Christ's sin atoning death, burial & resurrection. Confessing Jesus as Lord & believing in your heart He rose from from death (Rom 10:9, 1 Cor 15:1-4)

Christ will then place/indwell/baptize you with His eternal life giving Holy Spirit. Imputing (See Lev chapter 4 & Rom 4) His righteousness onto you & your sins onto Himself. Whereby you become the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Cor 5:21). Amen
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,134
953
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
#84

Jesus being God incarnate is able to speak to the spirit.

John 1:14 . .The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.

Was the flesh an avatar?

The thing is: Jesus can be easily traced biologically to David; and from
thence to Adam and the very dust with which Adam was constructed. How
can a creature of design be God?
_
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
#85
John 1:14 . .The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.

Was the flesh an avatar?

The thing is: Jesus can be easily traced biologically to David; and from
thence to Adam and the very dust with which Adam was constructed. How
can a creature of design be God?
_
Avatar? No.
Are you denying that Jesus is God?
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,134
953
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
#86
.
The Word's flesh (John 1:14) came into the world as a Jewish guy
biologically related to David (Rom 1:3) and thru David biologically related to
Adam and the dust with which Adam was constructed. So then, as a creature
of design, the Word's flesh wasn't divine at first. (Phil 2:6-7)

In time; the status of the Word's flesh was greatly improved by endowing
him with the name, the rank, and the power of God. (Dan 7:13-14 & Phil
2:9-11)

To give a rough idea on how this works-- Pharaoh not only made Joseph a
grain czar, but also endowed him with his signet ring; thus in effect making
him Pharaoh's proxy: so much so that even Joseph's brothers had to obey
him the same as they'd obey Pharaoh. (Gen 41:40-44, Gen 44:18 & Gen
45:8-11)

FAQ: What about that place in the Bible where it says God will not share His
glory? With another?

REPLY: The "another" in that passage refers to tin gods. Well, the Word's flesh
isn't a tin god; he's God's descendant, i.e. the Father's next of kin: in point of
fact, according to John 1:14, John 1:18, John 3:16, John 3:18, and 1John 4:9,
Christ is the Father's one and only direct descendant, viz: the name and
rank of God is all in the family.

* Pharaoh's signet gave Joseph quite a bit of power in Egypt; but not
unlimited power. In contrast, the powers of God entrusted to the Word's
flesh are unlimited.

Matt 28:18 . . All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

John 5:22-23 . . For the Father judges no man, but hath committed all
judgment unto the Son: that all men should honor the Son, even as they
honor the Father.

Rev 1:20 . . I am the Living one; I was dead, and behold I am alive
forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

NOTE: Phil 2:9 says God elevated Christ to the "highest place" which of
course has to be the throne of God because there is no higher position than
that. God also gave Christ "the name" that is above all other names; which
most everyone knows to be Jehovah (a.k.a. Yahweh) (cf. Ps 45:1-7)

Ergo: just as people had to bend their knees to Joseph as they would to
Pharaoh, so people are now required to bend their knees to Christ as they
would to God: and refusal to do so is very serious because it insults the
dignity of God's name just as an Egyptian's refusal to honor Joseph's signet
would've dishonored Pharaoh's name; which more than likely would've
resulted in fatal consequences.

You know: if only folks would discuss the "how" a man became God rather
than arguing over whether he's God, that would be very helpful.
_
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
4,816
2,806
113
#87
God had ministers / priests?
Can you be saved without a priest?
Thanks
Lord Jesus is the great High Priest. He saves. The gospel is the power of God to bring about salvation. The man who preached Jesus to me was not a priest in the religious sense. He was my superior at work. All Christians are priests, not just a select clergy class.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
4,816
2,806
113
#88
.
The Word's flesh (John 1:14) came into the world as a Jewish guy
biologically related to David (Rom 1:3) and thru David biologically related to
Adam and the dust with which Adam was constructed. So then, as a creature
of design, the Word's flesh wasn't divine at first. (Phil 2:6-7)


In time; the status of the Word's flesh was greatly improved by endowing
him with the name, the rank, and the power of God. (Dan 7:13-14 & Phil
2:9-11)


To give a rough idea on how this works-- Pharaoh not only made Joseph a
grain czar, but also endowed him with his signet ring; thus in effect making
him Pharaoh's proxy: so much so that even Joseph's brothers had to obey
him the same as they'd obey Pharaoh. (Gen 41:40-44, Gen 44:18 & Gen
45:8-11)


FAQ: What about that place in the Bible where it says God will not share His
glory? With another?


REPLY: The "another" in that passage refers to tin gods. Well, the Word's flesh
isn't a tin god; he's God's descendant, i.e. the Father's next of kin: in point of
fact, according to John 1:14, John 1:18, John 3:16, John 3:18, and 1John 4:9,
Christ is the Father's one and only direct descendant, viz: the name and
rank of God is all in the family.


* Pharaoh's signet gave Joseph quite a bit of power in Egypt; but not
unlimited power. In contrast, the powers of God entrusted to the Word's
flesh are unlimited.


Matt 28:18 . . All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

John 5:22-23 . . For the Father judges no man, but hath committed all
judgment unto the Son: that all men should honor the Son, even as they
honor the Father.


Rev 1:20 . . I am the Living one; I was dead, and behold I am alive
forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.


NOTE: Phil 2:9 says God elevated Christ to the "highest place" which of
course has to be the throne of God because there is no higher position than
that. God also gave Christ "the name" that is above all other names; which
most everyone knows to be Jehovah (a.k.a. Yahweh) (cf. Ps 45:1-7)


Ergo: just as people had to bend their knees to Joseph as they would to
Pharaoh, so people are now required to bend their knees to Christ as they
would to God: and refusal to do so is very serious because it insults the
dignity of God's name just as an Egyptian's refusal to honor Joseph's signet
would've dishonored Pharaoh's name; which more than likely would've
resulted in fatal consequences.


You know: if only folks would discuss the "how" a man became God rather
than arguing over whether he's God, that would be very helpful.
_
You are either ignorant or deliberately ignore what the Bible says. Lord Jesus was God before He came to this earth. Jehovah's Witnesses promote the same error as you do. Lord Jesus lived, ministered, died and rose again as a man, the Last Adam. That was the only way that He could save fallen mankind. But He never stopped being God. The Word was God and the Word became flesh.

Lord Jesus said that before Abraham existed, "I Am". You may remember that was "I Am" who spoke to Moses from the burning bush. A man did not become God. God put on the form of a man.
 

JBTN

Active member
Feb 11, 2020
211
74
28
#89
What do we need to do then to be born again? Thanks
“Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5‬:‭1‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/1jn.5.1.KJV

“Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves the child born of Him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5‬:‭1‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/2692/1jn.5.1.NASB2020

We need to believe that Jesus is the Christ. According to 1 John 5:1 once we have done that we have been born of God. If you are correct in what you have asserted doesn’t that make this verse false.
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
#90
.
The Word's flesh (John 1:14) came into the world as a Jewish guy
biologically related to David (Rom 1:3) and thru David biologically related to
Adam and the dust with which Adam was constructed. So then, as a creature
of design, the Word's flesh wasn't divine at first. (Phil 2:6-7)


In time; the status of the Word's flesh was greatly improved by endowing
him with the name, the rank, and the power of God. (Dan 7:13-14 & Phil
2:9-11)


To give a rough idea on how this works-- Pharaoh not only made Joseph a
grain czar, but also endowed him with his signet ring; thus in effect making
him Pharaoh's proxy: so much so that even Joseph's brothers had to obey
him the same as they'd obey Pharaoh. (Gen 41:40-44, Gen 44:18 & Gen
45:8-11)


FAQ: What about that place in the Bible where it says God will not share His
glory? With another?


REPLY: The "another" in that passage refers to tin gods. Well, the Word's flesh
isn't a tin god; he's God's descendant, i.e. the Father's next of kin: in point of
fact, according to John 1:14, John 1:18, John 3:16, John 3:18, and 1John 4:9,
Christ is the Father's one and only direct descendant, viz: the name and
rank of God is all in the family.


* Pharaoh's signet gave Joseph quite a bit of power in Egypt; but not
unlimited power. In contrast, the powers of God entrusted to the Word's
flesh are unlimited.


Matt 28:18 . . All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

John 5:22-23 . . For the Father judges no man, but hath committed all
judgment unto the Son: that all men should honor the Son, even as they
honor the Father.


Rev 1:20 . . I am the Living one; I was dead, and behold I am alive
forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.


NOTE: Phil 2:9 says God elevated Christ to the "highest place" which of
course has to be the throne of God because there is no higher position than
that. God also gave Christ "the name" that is above all other names; which
most everyone knows to be Jehovah (a.k.a. Yahweh) (cf. Ps 45:1-7)


Ergo: just as people had to bend their knees to Joseph as they would to
Pharaoh, so people are now required to bend their knees to Christ as they
would to God: and refusal to do so is very serious because it insults the
dignity of God's name just as an Egyptian's refusal to honor Joseph's signet
would've dishonored Pharaoh's name; which more than likely would've
resulted in fatal consequences.


You know: if only folks would discuss the "how" a man became God rather
than arguing over whether he's God, that would be very helpful.
_
Neat way to dance around a question.
The was God, also.John chapter 1.
Sounds to me that you are denying that Jesus is God.
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,134
953
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
#91
.
Jehovah's Witnesses promote the same error as you do.

I am familiar with quite a few of the Watchtower Society's doctrines and can
assure you their "error" in this respect is very different than mine.

I allege and insist, that David's son has been endowed with the God-given
authority to be known, addressed, worshipped, and obeyed as Jehovah; they
don't. The Society is very possessive of "the name" and will in no way ever
allow Jesus to have it for his own personal identity.


You are either ignorant or deliberately ignore what the Bible says.

I highly recommend that you consider not speaking to people with those
kinds of words lest the hapless day arrive when you are forced to eat them.
_
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,134
953
113
Oregon
cfbac.org
#92
.
FAQ: Is Christ a demigod?

REPLY: Demigods are only 50% human; whereas Christ is 100% human.

FAQ: Is the Word a demigod?

REPLY: Demigods are a singularity consisting of 50% human and 50%
divine; whereas the Word is a plurality consisting of 100% human and 100%
divine; viz: the Word exists simultaneously as an eternal spirit being whose
origin is currently unknown, and as a temporal material being whose biological
origin is easily traced to David, and from thence to the first Man and the
dust from whence he was constructed per Gen 2:7.

* It has been my experience in the past 26 years of internet activity that the
average rank and file Christian is unable to discern the difference between
the Word and the flesh that the word became in John 1:14, and also unable
to comprehend that the Word left his divinity at the door per Phil 2:5-8 when
he came into the world as a human being.

John 17:4-5 . .And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory
I had with you before the world began.

FAQ: Why is Jesus so hard to figure out?

REPLY: No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the
Father except the Son; and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
(Matt 11:27)
_
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,249
25,719
113
#93
No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except
the Son; and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him. (Matt 11:27)
It certainly becomes a problem for those who do not believe that God reveals Himself to whom He chooses.
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
#95
Jesus spoke to a dead body. He didn't speak to Lazarus' spirit.
He called his name from out side where he was layed. He didnt speak to his body. He called to him which is his entire self. A body dont live with out a spirit.
 

Saul-to-Paul

Junior Member
Jun 5, 2017
341
57
28
#96
He called his name from out side where he was layed. He didnt speak to his body. He called to him which is his entire self. A body dont live with out a spirit.
WRONG!

Ezekiel 37: 4,7-10
Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD.

7So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone. 8And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them. 9Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live. 10So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.

Jesus commanded a DEAD BODY to rise, then Lazarus received his spirit. Lazarus was not with spirit before Jesus said "come forth".
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
11,744
4,779
113
#97
Context of Jn 3:5 “born again”

John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)

John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)(His disciples believed because the ever Virgin mother of God interceded Jn 2:11)

John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)

(Key verse! Actions speak louder than words: verse 22)

John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism / water)

John 4:1 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.

Born again means Baptismal regeneration!


baptismal regeneration!
A new creation in Christ! 2 cor 5:17
Jn 1 JTB prepared the way by baptism!
Jn 2 the waters of purification are OT prefigurement of baptism!
Jn 3:5 born again means baptism
Jn 3:22 they immediately went to the river! Not to preach “accept Christ as personal lord and savior”
But to BAPTIZE!!!
But the water is an outward sign that signifies the washing of our souls by the grace of God thru the power of the spirit? Thanks
a to get baptized for remission of sins is a simple act of faith. We do it o my because we hear and believe what God established it for

a people are confused about John the Baptist he was filled with the holt spirit from the womb and sent by God to offer the promise of remission of sins preceding Christ the savior and New Testament doctrine

this is John the Baptist in prophecy he would immediately precede Christ and prepare the people through the knowledge of repentance and remission of sins to receive Jesus

The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

…and the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭40:3, 5‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭3:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: and he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭4:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s just a few places but this is when it was being fulfilled

“But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John. And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth. For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb. And many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God.

And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.

And he asked for a writing table, and wrote, saying, His name is John. And they marvelled all. And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying, …And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: For thou shalt go before the face of the Lord to prepare his ways; To give knowledge of salvation unto his people By the remission of their sins, Through the tender mercy of our God; Whereby the dayspring from on high hath visited us, To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, To guide our feet into the way of peace. And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, and was in the deserts till the day of his shewing unto Israel.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭1:13-17, 63, 67, 76-80‬ ‭KJV‬‬

John not his baptism of repentance and remission of sins isn’t a figure in any way it’s the reality of the baptism God promised would prepare people to receive salvation in repentance and remission of sins by a gods mercy he had promised to send Elijah the prophet before the lord Jesus appeared to prepare them calling them to repentance and giving them knowledge of remission of sins a long promised concept in scripture that had finally come

John is that Elijah that was promised This is Jesus speaking of John

“And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind? But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet. For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Which shall prepare thy way before thee. ( Malachi 3:1)

For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. And if ye will receive it, this is Elijah , which was for to come. ( Malachi 4:5-6) He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:7, 9-10, 13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The old testament ends with a promise of John the Baptists coming some day just before the messiah to prepare them for him through repentance and remission of sins

Jesus further explains that John is the promised Elijah that concludes the ot so this promise that ends the prophets

Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭4:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus explains when asked about it

“And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elijah must first come?

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elijah truly shall first come, and restore all things. But I say unto you, That Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. ( they imprisoned and beheaded John the Baptist ) Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. ( they would later crucify Jesus )

Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭17:10-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Which shall prepare thy way before thee. The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, Make his paths straight. John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. And there went out unto him all the land of Judæa, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.

And John was clothed with camel's hair, and with a girdle of a skin about his loins; and he did eat locusts and wild honey;”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:2-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the ot figure isn’t John it’s Elijah

“And they answered him, He was an hairy man, and girt with a girdle of leather about his loins. And he said, It is Elijah the Tishbite.”
‭‭2 Kings‬ ‭1:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

baptism isn’t a figure its why they continued doing it it’s the reality of where salvstion begins when our sins are remitted because we heard Gods word believe and act in faith

Like these folks who didn’t hear about baptism for remission of sins and then debate and question and remove it from doctrine but they heard and believed and acted as if it was true

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, ( what we do because we believe that promise )

and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. ( what Jesus does like John the Baptist said he would )

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:37 -38

It’s the ones who hear it and believe that are going to act on it

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,

when we hear it and then say “ no one needs to get baptized for remission of sins “ it just turned into a confusion and debate we’re meant to hear and believe the promises he made

“ repent and get baptized in my name and I will wash away all your sins and guilty stains “

its faith to hear what he’s saying and believe it that’s always going to lead us to act on it and receive his promise

baptism is an action produced of faith this faith

“So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

So when we hear this it should be believed not reasoned away like many of us do

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

there’s no reason for us to reject what he said and every benefit fornus to believe and trust him
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,181
1,177
113
#98
Salvation.


John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”

This "believing" is simply receiving God's free gift of Salvation. We then faithfully follow Him, but initially it is simply opening our heart's door to Jesus.

Revelation 3:20
“Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.”

What is your understanding of John 10:26-30?
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
WRONG!

Ezekiel 37: 4,7-10
Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD.

7So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone. 8And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them. 9Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live. 10So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.

Jesus commanded a DEAD BODY to rise, then Lazarus received his spirit. Lazarus was not with spirit before Jesus said "come forth".
Larzerus had a spirit before he died. He wasnt a golem or a xombie. He was a living man with a spirit who died, Jesus called to him from out side the tomb. Saying Lazerus come out.