Ball Earth conundrums

[Romans34]

Brother, Romans34, I'm sorry, I don't know what you mean by this. Would you please specify with a little detail what mean here?

We are told that we only see the one side of the moon because it rotates in sync with the earth such that we always only see that "face". Both Earth and Moon, both with some tilt, basically rotate on a vertical axis, so that both are spinning horizonally, basically. Now, if you view the moon in the morning and again in the evening, one is rotated approximately 90 degrees from the other, but on an axis that would be pointing toward the earth, which would be rotating vertically; hence now it is rotating BOTH directions at the same time. How does it rotate on two seperate axis two different directions at the same time, AND WE STILL ONLY SEE THE SINGLE "FACE" OF THE MOON?

 

[Magenta]

The moon completes one full rotation on its axis in the time it takes to
orbit the Earth. That means the same side is always turned toward us.

 

[posthuman]

But the sun and moon standing still at Joshua's request in Joshua chapter 10 AND bringing the shadow backward 10 degrees at Hezekiah's request in 2 Kings chapter 20 BOTH are consistent with the FE model. And that without killing everyone on the "planet" in the process, which of course, would have happened if you stopped the "spinning ball".

if God the Creator of all things can control the motion of the stars and planets as He wishes, what in the world makes you assume that He would accidentally kill everyone in the process?

 

[posthuman]

We are told that we only see the one side of the moon because it rotates in sync with the earth such that we always only see that "face". Both Earth and Moon, both with some tilt, basically rotate on a vertical axis, so that both are spinning horizonally, basically. Now, if you view the moon in the morning and again in the evening, one is rotated approximately 90 degrees from the other, but on an axis that would be pointing toward the earth, which would be rotating vertically; hence now it is rotating BOTH directions at the same time. How does it rotate on two seperate axis two different directions at the same time, AND WE STILL ONLY SEE THE SINGLE "FACE" OF THE MOON?

OK i think i understand how you're visualizing this. you're imagining the earth doesn't move.

the position you see the moon in the sky changes because it takes about two weeks for it to revolve around the earth, but it only takes the earth about 24hrs to do one revolution.

not because the moon is "rotating in both directions at the same time" but because the orbit of the moon has a period quite a bit longer than one day.


if you don't like the earth moving then assume the entire universe revolves around you every 24hrs. the moon just takes longer than the universe to orbit you, so you see it lagging behind everything else.

 

[Moses_Young]

The coriolis force isn't a "claim" it's demonstrated fact.

you falsely deny that Foucault's pendulums work, but that's just your categorical rejection of the truth for a lie. it is a very well known and documented simple machine.

It's disputed, and I believe not only by Flat Earthers. Certainly I believe Foucault himself was premature with his claim of "proof" after constructing only one such machine.

If you design a water experiment correctly, it will also show coriolis force.

Again, disputed. Certainly, the urban myths about toilet bowls and sinks etc. I'll have to look at some of the more carefully designed "proofs", and next time I'm North of the equator, do some more careful constructed tests.

 

[posthuman]

In the strictest technical sense - "maybe, maybe not" - however it absolutely beyond-a-shadow-of-any-doubt-whatsoever proves that the earth cannot possibly be a spinning ball.

No, it's not proof of any sort.

The event in Joshua is a miracle no matter what the topology of the universe is.
There is no reason to limit the power of God.

 

[posthuman]

We are told that we only see the one side of the moon because it rotates in sync with the earth such that we always only see that "face". Both Earth and Moon, both with some tilt, basically rotate on a vertical axis, so that both are spinning horizonally, basically. Now, if you view the moon in the morning and again in the evening, one is rotated approximately 90 degrees from the other, but on an axis that would be pointing toward the earth, which would be rotating vertically; hence now it is rotating BOTH directions at the same time. How does it rotate on two seperate axis two different directions at the same time, AND WE STILL ONLY SEE THE SINGLE "FACE" OF THE MOON?

the motion of the moon through the sky is not along an axis perpendicular to the earth's rotation. it's parallel to it. it moves along the ecliptic.

 

[Sculpt]

We are told that we only see the one side of the moon because it rotates in sync with the earth such that we always only see that "face". Both Earth and Moon, both with some tilt, basically rotate on a vertical axis, so that both are spinning horizonally, basically. Now, if you view the moon in the morning and again in the evening, one is rotated approximately 90 degrees from the other, but on an axis that would be pointing toward the earth, which would be rotating vertically; hence now it is rotating BOTH directions at the same time. How does it rotate on two seperate axis two different directions at the same time, AND WE STILL ONLY SEE THE SINGLE "FACE" OF THE MOON?

Hmm... I'm not entirely sure what you're describing, but you can correct me if I misunderstood. Moses liked you post, so I assume he knows what you're saying. Maybe @Moses_Young can translate it? I pretty much always know what he's stating.

I'll give it a shot here.

You wrote, "Now, if you view the moon in the morning and again in the evening, one is rotated approximately 90 degrees from the other," I think I understand this part OK... looking like the diagram below?:



You continue, "but on an axis that would be pointing toward the earth, which would be rotating vertically; hence now it is rotating BOTH directions at the same time. How does it rotate on two seperate axis two different directions at the same time, AND WE STILL ONLY SEE THE SINGLE "FACE" OF THE MOON? "

Ok, the moon doesn't move that way between morning and evening. The Moon doesn't revolve around the earth in 24 hours. It makes one revolution around the earth in aprox 27.32 days and relative to the position of the sun in 29.53 days, which gives in its different phases of appearance.

One side of the moon always faces the earth due to the concept of 'center of mass'. The earth and moon both pull on each other. In the case of the earth pulling on the moon, it pulls more on the portion of the moon closest to the earth. This effect is also observed with most of the moons of Jupiter. The moon is also oblong, not a perfect sphere, again, due to the pull. The earth bulges slightly around the middle.

If I've understood your post correctly, I'd suggest checking out a video that explains the concept first. Here's one: Moon Phases: Crash Course Astronomy #4 - YouTube

 

[posthuman]

i find it common among flatologists that they have trouble visualizing geometry.

 

[Gideon300]

So how did that work exactly. We are made to understand that "time" as we know it is measured by the relationship between the sun, moon, (and throw the stars in as well), and the earth. The earth orbits the sun every year, the moon goes through all its phases every month, and day and night are regulated by the spinning of the earth, etc. Also, we are told that the earth cannot stop spinning at its 25,000 miles per day rate (at the equator) or it would kill us all. So how did the natural shadow go BACKWARD ten degrees without stopping or reversing the earth's rotation?

It's called a miracle. It happens from time.

 

[GaryA]

What will happen if you try to fly past it?

If I understand you correctly, you are referring to flying past the ice ring. If so, you would probably fly until you hit the dome - assuming that the severe cold and whatever condition of the air did not become a problem for you along the way...

 

[Gideon300]

Lol. This is what I mean about science. Have you ever tried it? I have. Water doesn't spin the other way North and South of the equator. Its nothing to do with some omnipotent government, just bad information to begin with, and those perpetuating the myth without verifying.

Perhaps you can explain why storms rotate. If you do the experiment correctly, you can demonstrate that water will drain the opposite direction in the southern hemisphere compared with the northern. Science? You are scientifically illiterate, worse, you will not admit it, worse still, you reject every bit of evidence that destroys your mythical FE theory. It may be true somewhere in the universe, but not on this planet.

 

[Gideon300]

Yeah, as soon as I said that I figured that's what you would say.

You give the government WAY too much credit. We can't even keep people from coming through our own borders, much less rigidly control a much, much larger outer perimeter.

Yeah, yeah, I know... "We're only pretending to try to keep them out. The government really wants them to come in, for cheap labor" or something like that. Tell that to the people ICE arrested.

Conspiracy theorist 101: "They would say that.............." to any truth that contradicts their false beliefs.

 

[Gideon300]

@Lynx - the 'ice ring' and the "edge" of the earth are two different things. No one will ever reach the "edge" of the earth (not in this life) - it is somewhere beyond the dome.

The phrase "edge of the world" can be confusing - for simplicity in/of understanding, I suggest that you just use 'ice ring' when referring to the "edge" of the habitable part of the earth.

For once we agree, but for different reasons. There is no edge of the earth, that's why no one has found it.

 

[Gideon300]

Fly out to the edge with a camera.

Then start a tour company. I'll be your first customer. I'd pay to see it.

Seriously. Why has NO fe person ever flown out there? We have jets. This should be a pretty easy thing to do.

You cannot get FE people to get into the real world. Their illusion would be shattered comparing an airliner's flight plan to the FE fantasy map.

 

[gb9]

Conspiracy theorist 101: "They would say that.............." to any truth that contradicts their false beliefs.

flat earth is a conspiracy theory.

the southern border being left on purpose is a fact.

 

[Sculpt]

Your guys are making the claim. Not me. Take it up with the heliocentrists who believe this is a real phenomena. If they come up with something scientific and convincing, I in turn will likewise examine their evidence with the same level of scrutiny. Until then, it's just a wild claim without any substance. I examined the claim's evidence at the level it was given, and found it to be false.

Okay, this was noted on the video. What do you think of their conclusion where based on controlled environments?

OK, Moses, here it is, what you asking for: two scientists setup this experiment with all the required controls. One in Sydny, AU, one Huntsville, AL, US. They started it at the same time to boot.

[A quick side note to keep in mind: hurricanes originating in the northern hemisphere spin counter-clockwise, while clockwise in southern. This is seen best with the countless number of hurricanes observed via satellite. It's also observed hurricanes do not cross the equator. Pretty interesting, eh? This is the same concept for this controlled water spin test.

Lastly, in WW2 the US Navy factored in the Coriolis Effect in ballistics for 8" guns and higher, comes into effect when shooting over a certain distance north in the northern hemisphere, and shooting south in the southern. If you're a fan of Navy ships here's a site referencing the effect (link). On that page near the top you see a hyper link (EXTRACTS OF RANGE TABLES FOR 8"/55 GUN) to the scanned pages of the actual ballistics book, noting the range tables (link).]

After watching the video of the experiment, what say you?

 

[GaryA]

Is your current post reply the first of a multi-post reply, or are you blatantly strawmaning this? If it's the former, you didn't mention that's what you're doing.

The trend as of late is me spending less-and-less-and-less time on CC while trying to accomplish other things IRL. And, in general, that really is what it comes down to...

While I usually enjoy a good discussion from time to time, I really don't have the time to chase everything anyone throws out there hoping I will latch onto it and spend a lot of time on it. I refuse to play that game.

To repeat something I have said before again-and-again, my stance is not to debate and prove the Flat Earth model; rather, it is to help others obtain a better understanding of the Flat Earth model if I believe they are sincere.

 

[Moses_Young]

OK, Moses, here it is, what you asking for: two scientists setup this experiment with all the required controls. One in Sydny, AU, one Huntsville, AL, US. They started it at the same time to boot.

[A quick side note to keep in mind: hurricanes originating in the northern hemisphere spin counter-clockwise, while clockwise in southern. This is seen best with the countless number of hurricanes observed via satellite. It's also observed hurricanes do not cross the equator. Pretty interesting, eh? This is the same concept for this controlled water spin test.

I'll have a look at the video when I get some time. With regards to the hurricanes and cyclones, the difference in direction is due to the sun. Both cyclones and hurricanes spin in a direction synchronised with the the movement of the sun (i.e. in the opposing direction), which makes sense with the theory about how they are formed. In the Northern Hemisphere, this direction is anticlockwise. In the Southern Hemisphere, the direction is clockwise. I can't see how the sun would have an effect on the drainage direction of water.

Lastly, in WW2 the US Navy factored in the Coriolis Effect in ballistics for 8" guns and higher, comes into effect when shooting over a certain distance north in the northern hemisphere, and shooting south in the southern. If you're a fan of Navy ships here's a site referencing the effect (link). On that page near the top you see a hyper link (EXTRACTS OF RANGE TABLES FOR 8"/55 GUN) to the scanned pages of the actual ballistics book, noting the range tables (link).

I'll save the videos for another day, but the effect of the Earth's spin has been claimed and refuted in projectile calculations for decades, if not centuries. I personally don't believe any calculation accommodation for alleged spin or Coriolis effect is necessary.

 

[posthuman]

'll have a look at the video when I get some time. With regards to the hurricanes and cyclones, the difference in direction is due to the sun. Both cyclones and hurricanes spin in a direction synchronised with the the movement of the sun (i.e. in the opposing direction), which makes sense with the theory about how they are formed. In the Northern Hemisphere, this direction is anticlockwise. In the Southern Hemisphere, the direction is clockwise. I can't see how the sun would have an effect on the drainage direction of water.

why would the sun effect the spin of a pendulum and of clouds, which are water, but not water, which is water?