Did God occupy any space before creation?

[PaulThomson]

He encompasses all of creation not because He is able to be measured in terms of His creation, but because creation does not even have existence outside of Him, much less does it have volume, mass, inertia or electrical charge.

God is not an amount of electron-volts. He is The Creator of electrons, of space, of mass, of energy and of time.

Where did you get this scientific knowledge about what God is like. How did He communicate this about Himself to you?

If creation has no existence outside of God, God must be immanent within all of creation and extend beyond the limits of all of creation. That means having a size greater than all of creation. Infinite size, I'd say, otherwise there would be some space beyond the limits of God.

 

[PaulThomson]

time and space are both created things. they are pillars of the physical universe. the qualities of God are testified of by the created physical universe, but God cannot be measured in terms of the created physical universe.

Where does God say time and space are cteated things. What in scripture says that things were not created withn time and space that already existed?

 

[SilverFox7]

He encompasses all of creation not because He is able to be measured in terms of His creation, but because creation does not even have existence outside of Him, much less does it have volume, mass, inertia or electrical charge.

God is not an amount of electron-volts. He is The Creator of electrons, of space, of mass, of energy and of time.

When I saw the question posed for this forum and your response, I thought of the same verses Pilgrim quoted above from the apostle Paul:

Colossians 1:15-17

New International Version

The Supremacy of the Son of God
15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

I like the NIV translation of verse 17 especially that in Christ "all things hold together" verses the KJV "all things consist". God is spirit and the source of life that transcends this physical universe that He created, which is a representation of God's "attributes" and "eternal power" (Rom. 1: 20).

To try and grasp the infinite (God) with our finite minds is an exercise in futility from a scientific perspective. God is the Alpha and Omega--He is eternal. We are not, nor is the cosmos. For example, think about infinity into the past--it just doesn't make sense and goes beyond scientific methodology because there has to be a beginning point. But. whatever that beginning is, what caused that and so on into eternity past as the argument goes.

When God revealed himself in the Old Testament, He described Himself as YHWH (the Lord), perhaps the "Eternal" is a better English translation like James Moffatt used. And, look at how God answered Moses before the Exodus out of Egypt:

Exodus 3:13-14

New International Version

13 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell them?”
14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am.[a] This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

God named Himself as "I am." He has and always will exist--that's eternity. Time, space, and everything else that makes up our lives and this physical universe were created by God and they "hold together" and "consist" in Him. All that we perceive is made possible by the source of life--the Eternal God Almighty.

 

[Lifted_by_the_word]

The Spirit of the Lord was hovering over the waters.There's a separation from the water below to the waters above.It's a physical and spiritual thing.When God separates you from the world you are separated from the waters below.
Everything in this physical existence,even all that is out in space that you can't see,is the waters below.

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among men.God who was above the waters in another dimension,or heaven,said "let there be light".
When he spoke this he was probably in heaven and the Word became flesh/physical.

 

[PaulThomson]

He encompasses all of creation not because He is able to be measured in terms of His creation, but because creation does not even have existence outside of Him, much less does it have volume, mass, inertia or electrical charge.

God is not an amount of electron-volts. He is The Creator of electrons, of space, of mass, of energy and of time.

I have not in any way implied or stated that God is his creation. He does, however, occupy the all the space His creation also occupies, and infinitely more.

 

[PaulThomson]

When I saw the question posed for this forum and your response, I thought of the same verses Pilgrim quoted above from the apostle Paul:

Colossians 1:15-17

New International Version

The Supremacy of the Son of God
15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

I like the NIV translation of verse 17 especially that in Christ "all things hold together" verses the KJV "all things consist". God is spirit and the source of life that transcends this physical universe that He created, which is a representation of God's "attributes" and "eternal power" (Rom. 1: 20).

To try and grasp the infinite (God) with our finite minds is an exercise in futility from a scientific perspective. God is the Alpha and Omega--He is eternal. We are not, nor is the cosmos. For example, think about infinity into the past--it just doesn't make sense and goes beyond scientific methodology because there has to be a beginning point. But. whatever that beginning is, what caused that and so on into eternity past as the argument goes.

When God revealed himself in the Old Testament, He described Himself as YHWH (the Lord), perhaps the "Eternal" is a better English translation like James Moffatt used. And, look at how God answered Moses before the Exodus out of Egypt:

Exodus 3:13-14

New International Version

13 Moses said to God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ Then what shall I tell them?”
14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am.[a] This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

God named Himself as "I am." He has and always will exist--that's eternity. Time, space, and everything else that makes up our lives and this physical universe were created by God and they "hold together" and "consist" in Him. All that we perceive is made possible by the source of life--the Eternal God Almighty.

What do you mean by eternal? Outside of all time, atemporal? Or enduring throughout all time, without beginning or end, infinite time? He calls Himself ."I am". Why do that if He is not at all temporal? Hebrew can say "outside of time", or "i do not age". But He calls Himself the Ancient of days".

 

[posthuman]

I have not in any way implied or stated that God is his creation. He does, however, occupy the all the space His creation also occupies, and infinitely more.

not in such a way that He can be measured by it though - if you draw a 1d dot on a 2d piece of paper, the paper "saturated" the entire dot, but the paper can't be described by only the one dimension the dot has. a volume can't be measured in a plane.

 

[SilverFox7]

What do you mean by eternal? Outside of all time, atemporal? Or enduring throughout all time, without beginning or end, infinite time? He calls Himself ."I am". Why do that if He is not at all temporal? Hebrew can say "outside of time", or "i do not age". But He calls Himself the Ancient of days".

Eternal--without beginning or end

"I am"--another way of saying Eternal. Always has existed and always will

 

[Cameron143]

not in such a way that He can be measured by it though - if you draw a 1d dot on a 2d piece of paper, the paper "saturated" the entire dot, but the paper can't be described by only the one dimension the dot has. a volume can't be measured in a plane.

That was plane to see.

 

[Lifted_by_the_word]

The Spirit of the Lord was hovering over the waters.There's a separation from the water below to the waters above.It's a physical and spiritual thing.When God separates you from the world you are separated from the waters below.
Everything in this physical existence,even all that is out in space that you can't see,is the waters below.

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among men.God who was above the waters in another dimension,or heaven,said "let there be light".
When he spoke this he was probably in heaven and the Word became flesh/physical.

If Jesus is in the image of the invisible God and all things consist by him,then what I said in this quote makes sense.
Spiritually,the Holy Spirit is like a firmament.Grow in the spirit and be separate as scripture says.We were born of the water,and must be born again.Spirit,water,blood.And you can 'see' it separate us from the waters above.
The waters below,water.(this physical existence)
the waters above,blood.(heaven)
The firmament,Spirit.

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

He came in the flesh and made peace through the blood of his cross.Through his crossing over.There is nothing new under the sun.
There's a firmament that hovers above the waters,separating the waters that are below from the waters that are above.

 

[Lifted_by_the_word]

If Jesus is in the image of the invisible God and all things consist by him,then what I said in this quote makes sense.
Spiritually,the Holy Spirit is like a firmament.Grow in the spirit and be separate as scripture says.We were born of the water,and must be born again.Spirit,water,blood.And you can 'see' it separate us from the waters above.
The waters below,water.(this physical existence)
the waters above,blood.(heaven)
The firmament,Spirit.

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

He came in the flesh and made peace through the blood of his cross.Through his crossing over.There is nothing new under the sun.
There's a firmament that hovers above the waters,separating the waters that are below from the waters that are above.

The way I said all this is kinda weird lol.
What I mean is that when he spoke everything in this physical existence,he said it from heaven.And the 'Word' came down and was made flesh.

 

[posthuman]

Where does God say time and space are cteated things. What in scripture says that things were not created withn time and space that already existed?

Genesis 1:1

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

No coherent question is ridiculous.

SO ask one.

 

[PaulThomson]

PaulThomson said:
Where does God say time and space are created things. What in scripture says that things were not created within time and space that already existed?

Genesis 1:1

Please, cite a translation of Genesis one and highlight the words "time" and "space".

 

[PaulThomson]

PaulThomson said:
No coherent question is ridiculous.

SO ask one.

I asked several in the OP. You could start there.

 

[PaulThomson]

not in such a way that He can be measured by it though - if you draw a 1d dot on a 2d piece of paper, the paper "saturated" the entire dot, but the paper can't be described by only the one dimension the dot has. a volume can't be measured in a plane.

God fills all dimensions, not just the highest one. Everythng in every dimension exists within God.

 

[Obedience]

When a computer program creates a virtual world, does it occupy the space of the virtual world itself?Do computer programs take up space in the real world?

 

[PaulThomson]

When a computer program creates a virtual world, does it occupy the space of the virtual world itself?Do computer programs take up space in the real world?

Computer worlds occur within the real world. They appear on computer screens. that have dimensions. Their programmes exist in hard drives that have dimensions.

 

[Obedience]

Computer worlds occur within the real world. They appear on computer screens. that have dimensions. Their programmes exist in hard drives that have dimensions.

What are the bytes in the program? Does it take up space? Did the program bytes exist before the computer, so did they take up space?

 

[posthuman]

PaulThomson said:
Where does God say time and space are created things. What in scripture says that things were not created within time and space that already existed?



Please, cite a translation of Genesis one and highlight the words "time" and "space".

"beginning"

"heavens and the earth"