Understanding God’s election
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Ahhhh, okay got it, the verse doesn't actually say what it clearly says - yeah, right.
It was hard for me to actually believe that anyone could be serious with such an absurd comment. You are the one lying and corrupting the clear word of God without any hesitation or fear in so doing.
Guess the same verse taken from all these translations also missed the subtlety that you alone, based upon your singular superior
biblical insight, could identify. Amazing how they all got it wrong. Quite a coincidence, wouldn't you say?
[Eph 2:8 NIV] 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
[Eph 2:8 ESV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
[Eph 2:8 NKJV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God,
[Eph 2:8 CSB] 8 For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God's gift --
[Eph 2:8 NASB20] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this [is] not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 NASB95] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 LSB] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 NET] 8 For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 RSV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God--
[Eph 2:8 ASV] 8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 YLT] 8 for by grace ye are having been saved, through faith, and this not of you -- of God the gift,
[Eph 2:8 DBY] 8 For ye are saved by grace, through faith; and this not of yourselves; it is God's gift:
[Eph 2:8 WEB] 8 For by grace are ye saved, through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
It was hard for me to actually believe that anyone could be serious with such an absurd comment. You are the one lying and corrupting the clear word of God without any hesitation or fear in so doing.
Guess the same verse taken from all these translations also missed the subtlety that you alone, based upon your singular superior
biblical insight, could identify. Amazing how they all got it wrong. Quite a coincidence, wouldn't you say?
[Eph 2:8 NIV] 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
[Eph 2:8 ESV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
[Eph 2:8 NKJV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God,
[Eph 2:8 CSB] 8 For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God's gift --
[Eph 2:8 NASB20] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this [is] not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 NASB95] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 LSB] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 NET] 8 For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 RSV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God--
[Eph 2:8 ASV] 8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
[Eph 2:8 YLT] 8 for by grace ye are having been saved, through faith, and this not of you -- of God the gift,
[Eph 2:8 DBY] 8 For ye are saved by grace, through faith; and this not of yourselves; it is God's gift:
[Eph 2:8 WEB] 8 For by grace are ye saved, through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
Matthew 6:9
6 But thou when thou shalt pray, enter into thy chamber, and having shut the door, pray to thy Father in secret: and thy Father who seeth in secret will repay thee. 7 And when you are praying, speak not much, as the heathens. For they think that in their much speaking they may be heard. 8 Be not you therefore like to them, for your Father knoweth what is needful for you, before you ask him. 9 Thus therefore shall you pray: Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name.10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
6 But thou when thou shalt pray, enter into thy chamber, and having shut the door, pray to thy Father in secret: and thy Father who seeth in secret will repay thee. 7 And when you are praying, speak not much, as the heathens. For they think that in their much speaking they may be heard. 8 Be not you therefore like to them, for your Father knoweth what is needful for you, before you ask him. 9 Thus therefore shall you pray: Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name.10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Ask yourself why Peter wrote to the saints that God was longsuffering toward THEM when you say that God is not willing for anyone in the entire world to perish. Logically, God should be patient with the world that he doesn't want to perish. But that isn't what the text says. Neither is Peter's epistle directed to the world! It's written to God's saints, primarily messianic Jews. And these believing Jews were under attack by false teachers and false prophets, which is why Peter is calling his recipients to persevere in the faith.
Context really counts.
Context really counts.
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No one is foolish enough to argue that faith is not a gift of God. My breakfast was the gift of God.
The argument is whether God is jamming faith down someone's throat whether they want it or not.
And whether God pre-programmed saving faith in some before they were ever born, far beyond their will or choice, yet others were created with the premeditated intent of casting them into the lake of fire for eternity.
The argument is whether God is jamming faith down someone's throat whether they want it or not.
And whether God pre-programmed saving faith in some before they were ever born, far beyond their will or choice, yet others were created with the premeditated intent of casting them into the lake of fire for eternity.
I don't think so.....the context is very clear in the preceding verses.
And there goes your hyper-Calvinite-ism right down the tubes in verse 5.
I could post dozens and dozens similarly.
[2Pe 3:3 KJV]
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
[2Pe 3:4 KJV]
And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of the creation.
[2Pe 3:5 KJV]
For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
[2Pe 3:9 KJV]
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
And there goes your hyper-Calvinite-ism right down the tubes in verse 5.
I could post dozens and dozens similarly.
[2Pe 3:3 KJV]
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
[2Pe 3:4 KJV]
And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of the creation.
[2Pe 3:5 KJV]
For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
[2Pe 3:9 KJV]
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
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According to Peter (and many other writers of Scripture) its is to be earnestly sought for.
[2Pe 1:5 KJV]
And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
[2Pe 1:6 KJV]
And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
[Eph 1:17 KJV]
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
[Eph 3:4 KJV]
Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
[Rom 1:28 KJV]
And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
[Rom 10:2 KJV]
For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
[Rom 15:14 KJV]
And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another.
[1Co 1:5 KJV]
That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and [in] all knowledge;
[1Co 12:8 KJV]
For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
[2Pe 1:5 KJV]
And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
[2Pe 1:6 KJV]
And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
[Eph 1:17 KJV]
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
[Eph 3:4 KJV]
Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
[Rom 1:28 KJV]
And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
[Rom 10:2 KJV]
For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
[Rom 15:14 KJV]
And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another.
[1Co 1:5 KJV]
That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and [in] all knowledge;
[1Co 12:8 KJV]
For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;