I am not understanding why you said "No, the first sins mentioned in the passage is meant 'qualitative' in reply to my suggesting that "perhaps 1JN 1:9 refers to confessing both sin and sins, and the main take away should be to confess/admit sinning ASAP in order to avoid committing a chain of sins--as A&E did at the beginning. We should welcome guilt trips as warning lights."
1John 1:9 Let's talk about it..
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That depends on any person's view what Hyper Grace is
I do not have to do nothing to be in yet believe in the risen Son for me? is that your view, people taking God for granted in the gift and got new life given us to abide in willingly, yet do not, taking advantage of this gift as the Corinthians did, that Paul wrote to them to straighten that out?
Really, I see God did it by Son the two as Won (One) for us the people that cannot be perfect of self ever. at least I see that in my own first born flesh. this I see as well, why it took so long for that final sacrifice for sin to save all that beleive God did this for them in love to them.
Why? The entire first (old) testament was revealing, revealed our demise, we are not perfect ever since the fall of Adam the first and all flesh dies since.
God sent Son, Adam the second to save our Souls, by us in belief he has done it for us all in love and mercy to us all to respond to that, Not make any other Doctrine out of it as people do that to this day, I am right you are wrong attitudes of the very flesh that does not please God, only Son's did that once for us all to respond to that in thanksgiving and praise over it. Then Ask Father God to lead as God Father did through Son Jesus for us to simply love all, taking on his yoke and burden, it is light and easy in the done work.
This is a gift, not of any more work from anyone to do, if is then we all have reason(s) to boast.
I have none, I accepted I believe, I am freed to love all even those that do not love me back, what a gift thank you Father and Son as Won (One)
That is Hyper grace and is nothing to boast about, to me anyways
I do not have to do nothing to be in yet believe in the risen Son for me? is that your view, people taking God for granted in the gift and got new life given us to abide in willingly, yet do not, taking advantage of this gift as the Corinthians did, that Paul wrote to them to straighten that out?
Really, I see God did it by Son the two as Won (One) for us the people that cannot be perfect of self ever. at least I see that in my own first born flesh. this I see as well, why it took so long for that final sacrifice for sin to save all that beleive God did this for them in love to them.
Why? The entire first (old) testament was revealing, revealed our demise, we are not perfect ever since the fall of Adam the first and all flesh dies since.
God sent Son, Adam the second to save our Souls, by us in belief he has done it for us all in love and mercy to us all to respond to that, Not make any other Doctrine out of it as people do that to this day, I am right you are wrong attitudes of the very flesh that does not please God, only Son's did that once for us all to respond to that in thanksgiving and praise over it. Then Ask Father God to lead as God Father did through Son Jesus for us to simply love all, taking on his yoke and burden, it is light and easy in the done work.
This is a gift, not of any more work from anyone to do, if is then we all have reason(s) to boast.
I have none, I accepted I believe, I am freed to love all even those that do not love me back, what a gift thank you Father and Son as Won (One)
That is Hyper grace and is nothing to boast about, to me anyways
The 1 book of John was/is a response to a letter John received from a Gathering of believers. John was on the Island of Patmos. He got a letter from the leader of the gathering of People, that were in disagreement over being forgiven by God through Son Jesus for them.
read it from verse 1. This letter he received was people there then did not believe Jesus came in the flesh.
Read it verses 1-3
Stated truth, we have tasted, touched ate with Jesus
1John 1
Authorized (King James) Version!John
That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us
that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
That was the purpose of that letter to correct the people now known as Gnostics, those that do not beleive Jesus Christ came to earth in the flesh, since they heard No Flesh can please God/ So they developed a belief, Christ could not have come here on earth in flesh and blood and therefore never was sacrificed for any sin.
Jesus the Son is the only one perfect, never born of Man, yet born of Woman, not Man (Hebrews 7:11-12)
When the real true Greek reading from the Greek inherent writing states, to have past tense forgiven us all our sin. That is done. If anyone does not admit to their sin(s) then they are not in willing trust to Father needing Father to teach them new and love all, yes even those that have harmed you. That does not mean one has to keep company with others. Free choice, just please see to not have anything against anyone, since God holds nothing against us by Son for us all (Romans 2:1-4) done once for everyone to trust God in belief to this amazing gift given free of charge. it is the risen Life that saves, not the death, the death was needed first though Wow, woe is me as in Isaiah 6:1-7
PS: there are at least forty other verses that state the forgiveness is now past tense, reconciliation given
Only one passage 1 John 1:9 that seems to state differently, and is mistranslated from original Greek
read it from verse 1. This letter he received was people there then did not believe Jesus came in the flesh.
Read it verses 1-3
Stated truth, we have tasted, touched ate with Jesus
1John 1
Authorized (King James) Version!John
That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us
that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.That was the purpose of that letter to correct the people now known as Gnostics, those that do not beleive Jesus Christ came to earth in the flesh, since they heard No Flesh can please God/ So they developed a belief, Christ could not have come here on earth in flesh and blood and therefore never was sacrificed for any sin.
Jesus the Son is the only one perfect, never born of Man, yet born of Woman, not Man (Hebrews 7:11-12)
When the real true Greek reading from the Greek inherent writing states, to have past tense forgiven us all our sin. That is done. If anyone does not admit to their sin(s) then they are not in willing trust to Father needing Father to teach them new and love all, yes even those that have harmed you. That does not mean one has to keep company with others. Free choice, just please see to not have anything against anyone, since God holds nothing against us by Son for us all (Romans 2:1-4) done once for everyone to trust God in belief to this amazing gift given free of charge. it is the risen Life that saves, not the death, the death was needed first though Wow, woe is me as in Isaiah 6:1-7
PS: there are at least forty other verses that state the forgiveness is now past tense, reconciliation given
Only one passage 1 John 1:9 that seems to state differently, and is mistranslated from original Greek
but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. ( non believers don’t walk in the light or even know what it is )
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:6-10 KJV
Its kind of a ridiculous interpretation you gave there of johns letter
“My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.”
1 John 2:1-4 KJV
Again not for non believers
A few lines later
“I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.”
1 John 2:12 KJV
John is assuming that the church isn’t going to reject the teaching he just gave them about confessing sin and bieng forgiven
This line because it says your sins are forgiven does not erase the teschkng judt beforhand about acknolwedging and confessing our sins in him and having his promise to forgive our unrighteousness
the worst way to interpret the Bible is to take each verse and try to erase the other .
Again no apostle is writing these things to groups of non believers
“I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.”
1 John 2:14-17 KJV
only believers care about doing Gods Will non believers don’t believe there is a God or that he had anything to say kind of like modern day hypergrace ignores his word and claims another path to salvation
Not written to unbelievers
“Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.”
1 John 5:1-4 KJV
John was writing to the same people Paul and Peter were writing to for the same purpose of spreading the same gospel
Yes my dear brother in Christ, John was informing to the church that once one confesses to be a sinner, the work Jesus Christ did already forgave all past, present and future sins. Why and how is that possible you say... because it is no longer I who live but Christ lives in me!! So as you see it isn't hyper grace like you mentioned. People who bring up hyper grace need to examine their hearts.
I’d be more concerned if i rejected his words promising salvation though before he died for me
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
John 12:48-50 KJV
it’s sort of a faulty position to base an argument for us to need to either pick from what Jesus said will save us and what he did to atone for our sins and inherit all Power and judgement and authority.
Those two things work together his shed blood for our atonement and his word promising no condemnation to believers
Jesus blood shed and then resurrection doesn’t end tbis ,
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
John 5:24 KJV
His bloodshed and then resurrection from death confirms his authority and gives us the reason we should believe his word not an excuse to remove it and claim a different salvation
“For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
( someone’s word in thier will and testament only takes effect when they die then after it cannot be changed )
Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, ( the Old Testament Moses law )
he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, ( blood of animals ) saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.”
Hebrews 9:16-20 KJV
We have Jesus words in the gospel , and then Jesus bloodshed and sprinkled upon us according to his word and testament.
We inherit by his will and testament ( the gospel )
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.”
Hebrews 13:8 KJV
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
John 12:48-50 KJV
it’s sort of a faulty position to base an argument for us to need to either pick from what Jesus said will save us and what he did to atone for our sins and inherit all Power and judgement and authority.
Those two things work together his shed blood for our atonement and his word promising no condemnation to believers
Jesus blood shed and then resurrection doesn’t end tbis ,
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
John 5:24 KJV
His bloodshed and then resurrection from death confirms his authority and gives us the reason we should believe his word not an excuse to remove it and claim a different salvation
“For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
( someone’s word in thier will and testament only takes effect when they die then after it cannot be changed )
Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, ( the Old Testament Moses law )
he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, ( blood of animals ) saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.”
Hebrews 9:16-20 KJV
We have Jesus words in the gospel , and then Jesus bloodshed and sprinkled upon us according to his word and testament.
We inherit by his will and testament ( the gospel )
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.”
Hebrews 13:8 KJV
exactly each person has thier own level of knowledge regarding sin and righteousness. The more one knows the more thier conscience will recognize and repent over but it isn’t the same from one to the next at the same time it’s a process for all as we grow
The more we understand and grasp the more we become aware of our sins and then can be set free tbrough repentance
“Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of:
but the sorrow of the world worketh death.”
2 Corinthians 7:9-10 KJV
Godly sorrow would be sorrow because we become aware of our sin this leads to repentance . And a clearing of the conscience
“but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:7-10 KJV
The light is Christ and his word in the gospel Gods eternal Judgement for all Mankind. It reveals the things we need to change at the same time it’s promising salvation as we believe
“And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.”
John 3:19-21 KJV
The way to “do the truth and come come into and walk in the light “
“Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
….Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
John 8:12, 31-32 KJV
As we become Jesus disciples and begin to learn from his teachings it’s like a light begins to shine in our darkness within our hearts the things we think and desire and do that are against the will of god
as we hear and believe it shines light here where our issue is
“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: all these evil things come from within, and defile the man.”
Mark 7:21-23
the gospel reproves us of our sins and calls is to repentance if we don’t hide away in the shadows and refuse to give up sin and choose the lords light
The more we understand and grasp the more we become aware of our sins and then can be set free tbrough repentance
“Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of:
but the sorrow of the world worketh death.”
2 Corinthians 7:9-10 KJV
Godly sorrow would be sorrow because we become aware of our sin this leads to repentance . And a clearing of the conscience
“but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:7-10 KJV
The light is Christ and his word in the gospel Gods eternal Judgement for all Mankind. It reveals the things we need to change at the same time it’s promising salvation as we believe
“And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.”
John 3:19-21 KJV
The way to “do the truth and come come into and walk in the light “
“Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
….Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
John 8:12, 31-32 KJV
As we become Jesus disciples and begin to learn from his teachings it’s like a light begins to shine in our darkness within our hearts the things we think and desire and do that are against the will of god
as we hear and believe it shines light here where our issue is
“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: all these evil things come from within, and defile the man.”
Mark 7:21-23
the gospel reproves us of our sins and calls is to repentance if we don’t hide away in the shadows and refuse to give up sin and choose the lords light
Just to be clear to everyone dropping the hyper grace into this thread, please understand what hyper grace is.. best way to put what hyper grace.....antinomianism + Liberalism = hyper grace, believing that no matter what you do moving forward you are covered under Gods grace. That is a heresy..
The POINT i was explaining in this thread was many believers today think that 1John 1:9 means to confess to God every time you sin so you can be forgiven for it... That is not what it means at all and why i am trying to help...
If you keep going to God looking for forgiveness every time you sin you would never be able to get off your knees!!!
Go to God always to confess your sin(s) but the forgiveness has already been given!! Jesus is no longer on our cross!!
Does this mean we can do what we want then and God will just keep on forgiving?? NO, Frist off, God will not be mocked, second if you are thinking this way i urge you to examine your heart and where you stand in faith.
I hope this helps
The POINT i was explaining in this thread was many believers today think that 1John 1:9 means to confess to God every time you sin so you can be forgiven for it... That is not what it means at all and why i am trying to help...
If you keep going to God looking for forgiveness every time you sin you would never be able to get off your knees!!!
Go to God always to confess your sin(s) but the forgiveness has already been given!! Jesus is no longer on our cross!!
Does this mean we can do what we want then and God will just keep on forgiving?? NO, Frist off, God will not be mocked, second if you are thinking this way i urge you to examine your heart and where you stand in faith.
I hope this helps
Indeed brother , I can’t pretend anymore
“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;
but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
2 Corinthians 5:10-11 KJV
“But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, And every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.”
Romans 14:10-12
that last part there ? Through the gospel we can repent and do that now and be forgiven rather than later when it’s too late ……
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
christians have access to the throne of Jesus daily and can confess the things that become apparent to our own hearts that we’ve done wrong and be forgiven through the process of repentance and remission of sins offered to all mankind in Christ Jesus
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.”
Luke 24:46-47 KJV
It all begins when we acknolwedge that we all have to answer for our ongoing deeds when we believe the rest then makes sense and becomes effective to bring believers towards God and to repentance
“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;
but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
2 Corinthians 5:10-11 KJV
“But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, And every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.”
Romans 14:10-12
that last part there ? Through the gospel we can repent and do that now and be forgiven rather than later when it’s too late ……
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
christians have access to the throne of Jesus daily and can confess the things that become apparent to our own hearts that we’ve done wrong and be forgiven through the process of repentance and remission of sins offered to all mankind in Christ Jesus
“and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.”
Luke 24:46-47 KJV
It all begins when we acknolwedge that we all have to answer for our ongoing deeds when we believe the rest then makes sense and becomes effective to bring believers towards God and to repentance
That’s not at all what he’s saying he’s telling the church “ if you walk in the light , and confess your sins Jesus is faithful and will forgive all
Unrighteousness “
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, ( when we know we have ) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
There’s no reason for us to reject that . Or try to remove it it’s something that saves sinners
Unrighteousness “
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, ( when we know we have ) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
There’s no reason for us to reject that . Or try to remove it it’s something that saves sinners
No one is dead to God dead people hear his word too and also have to answer
“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
Luke 20:38 KJV
“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth;
they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life;
and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
John 5:28-29 KJV
Gods word is what gives us a new heart when we accept the gospel ….
“For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.”
Luke 20:38 KJV
“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth;
they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life;
and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
John 5:28-29 KJV
Gods word is what gives us a new heart when we accept the gospel ….