Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
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It was yesterday morning, he claimed the only slaves to sin were those who choose to sin, he gave the fool who says in his heart, there is no God, as the example. Therefore nobody else who sins is a slave to sin, as if nobody else ever chooses to sin in his view, their sins must be called something else, perhaps oopsies is what I suggested, to highlight how ridiculous what he said was... ridiculous and completely anti-Biblical, the record front to back in the Bible is that man has an incurably wicked heart, he says no, heishere says no, so many, all these free willers, deny this Biblical fact, they will claim such universal axioms as there are none good do not mean what they say, we have been told that man is not such a bad guy after all, on and on their nonsense goes. That bad tree in their theology can produce good fruit. I have him on ignore, his level of dishonesty is off the charts, he lied to me for months on end about another matter, refusing to admit he had been in error, I have seen this behaviour from him since, also, honestly he would rather say God raped Mary than admit she was not asked as he erroneously claimed, he cannot even handle mild reproof, he goes right off the deep end with his wicked behaviour.
Here it is. he is here essentially agreed with him, of course.
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...xercise-free-will.218061/page-75#post-5526510
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...xercise-free-will.218061/page-75#post-5526510
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Re "lies for which he then expects YOU to seek peace with him over": No, misunderstandings for which he asks forgiveness and seeks reconciliation regarding, but y'all ignore:
TOJ #36: Admit your faults as you forgive others theirs. [Matt. 6:12//LK 11:4a] The second part of this teaching echoes #14. Genuine saving Faith motivates loving forgiveness. Confession is the key to having a right relationship with God (1John 1:9), which is manifested by mercy (TOJ #148). {MK 11:25, MT 18:15-17}.
TOJ #148: Faith in/love for God is manifested by loving behavior toward people. [Matt. 25:31-46] The evidence of saving Faith is loving behavior. {JN 13:35, 15:12-13} It is the fruit of the Spirit {JN 15:4-8} (also see GL 5:22-23), rather than ability to work miracles (MT 24:24). This love is the basis for essential unity among all Christians {JN 15:17, 17:20-23}. Faith without love is counterfeit (JM 2:17). Satisfying GRFS is manifested by any type of personality (introverted, extroverted, etc.) as long as one is loving, but no good work merits salvation (EPH 2:8-9), because no one is perfect (PHP 3:12) except God (HB 5:7-9; TOJ #106).
TOJ #42: Temper reproof with love so you will not be judgmental. [Matt. 7:1-5//LK 6:37, 38b, 41-42] Jesus condemned hypocrisy (TOJ #134) or having a spiritual superiority complex (TOJ #31) more than any other sin (MT 23). However, he did not condemn repentant sinners (TOJ #53), and saints/Believers should be very careful that their explanation of divine wrath does not impugn God’s love as taught by Paul in Romans 5:5-10.
Jesus exemplified this teaching when He reproved the adulterous woman {John 8:11}. [Note that the NIV questions the reliability of MT 7:53-8:11, but the story certainly seems compatible with the character and TOJ.] As John 3:17 states, “God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world.” Note that this teaching does not mean saints should not be discerning or reproving (JN 7:24, 1CR 12:10, 2CR 13:6; cf. TOJ #101).
TOJ #100: Communicate! [Matt. 18:15-17a] Or in the words of Paul, speak the truth in love (EPH 4:15). This TOJ is closely related to the next one. Communication is the method for converting Sinners (RM 10:14) and for maturing saved sinners (HB 5:11-6:1). Note the four steps for resolving disagreements: talk privately, include a neutral third party to facilitate the discussion, enlist mature church representatives to act in lieu of a court, and then excommunicate the person who is acting like a pagan (TOJ #102).
TOJ #101: Watch yourself before rebuking fellow sinners. [Luke 17:3a] The location of this TOJ, found in the gospels only in Luke, seems to fit between the TOJ regarding communication and excommunication. Those who obey this command should first be sure they are obeying Jesus’ commands not to be judgmental (Matt. 7:3-5, TOJ #42) and to forgive (v.17:3b, TOJ #14), lest they become hypercritical and hypocritical. Paul also taught self-examination (2CR 13:5-8) and rebuking (in his “pastoral” epistles, 1TM 5:20, 2TM 4:2, TIT 2:15). The motive for a rebuke must be divine love (RV 3:19), so the words conveying reproof should be gentle or redemptive (GL 6:1).
TOJ #36: Admit your faults as you forgive others theirs. [Matt. 6:12//LK 11:4a] The second part of this teaching echoes #14. Genuine saving Faith motivates loving forgiveness. Confession is the key to having a right relationship with God (1John 1:9), which is manifested by mercy (TOJ #148). {MK 11:25, MT 18:15-17}.
TOJ #148: Faith in/love for God is manifested by loving behavior toward people. [Matt. 25:31-46] The evidence of saving Faith is loving behavior. {JN 13:35, 15:12-13} It is the fruit of the Spirit {JN 15:4-8} (also see GL 5:22-23), rather than ability to work miracles (MT 24:24). This love is the basis for essential unity among all Christians {JN 15:17, 17:20-23}. Faith without love is counterfeit (JM 2:17). Satisfying GRFS is manifested by any type of personality (introverted, extroverted, etc.) as long as one is loving, but no good work merits salvation (EPH 2:8-9), because no one is perfect (PHP 3:12) except God (HB 5:7-9; TOJ #106).
TOJ #42: Temper reproof with love so you will not be judgmental. [Matt. 7:1-5//LK 6:37, 38b, 41-42] Jesus condemned hypocrisy (TOJ #134) or having a spiritual superiority complex (TOJ #31) more than any other sin (MT 23). However, he did not condemn repentant sinners (TOJ #53), and saints/Believers should be very careful that their explanation of divine wrath does not impugn God’s love as taught by Paul in Romans 5:5-10.
Jesus exemplified this teaching when He reproved the adulterous woman {John 8:11}. [Note that the NIV questions the reliability of MT 7:53-8:11, but the story certainly seems compatible with the character and TOJ.] As John 3:17 states, “God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world.” Note that this teaching does not mean saints should not be discerning or reproving (JN 7:24, 1CR 12:10, 2CR 13:6; cf. TOJ #101).
TOJ #100: Communicate! [Matt. 18:15-17a] Or in the words of Paul, speak the truth in love (EPH 4:15). This TOJ is closely related to the next one. Communication is the method for converting Sinners (RM 10:14) and for maturing saved sinners (HB 5:11-6:1). Note the four steps for resolving disagreements: talk privately, include a neutral third party to facilitate the discussion, enlist mature church representatives to act in lieu of a court, and then excommunicate the person who is acting like a pagan (TOJ #102).
TOJ #101: Watch yourself before rebuking fellow sinners. [Luke 17:3a] The location of this TOJ, found in the gospels only in Luke, seems to fit between the TOJ regarding communication and excommunication. Those who obey this command should first be sure they are obeying Jesus’ commands not to be judgmental (Matt. 7:3-5, TOJ #42) and to forgive (v.17:3b, TOJ #14), lest they become hypercritical and hypocritical. Paul also taught self-examination (2CR 13:5-8) and rebuking (in his “pastoral” epistles, 1TM 5:20, 2TM 4:2, TIT 2:15). The motive for a rebuke must be divine love (RV 3:19), so the words conveying reproof should be gentle or redemptive (GL 6:1).
Thanks sister, yesterday morn will make it easier. I do feel a bit sorry for them, we can stand on our own two feet but they need to gang up and bully people into agreeing with them. I feel sickened by it all but concerned for them at the same time, it's lovely knowing the Lord will end the evil when the time is right.
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The first man had one commandment of what NOT to do and he disobeyed, he was not deceived, he did it deliberately is the other option, that looks rather bad, God certainly was not pleased with it, and then that first man's first son killed his next born brother, that too looks pretty bad to me, also, but another will say, oh, man did not get bad until the flood. Eh? How bad does bad have to be before it is called bad? There are none good is repeated throughout the Bible but many essentially claim it is overstated, like cv5 yesterday saying only the fool chooses to sin, like nobody else has ever been caught in deliberate flagrant despicable sin! Just unbelievable what these people propose.
The term "posse non peccare" refers to the ability not to sin, a concept rooted in Augustine's theology regarding human nature and sin.
- In Augustine's view, after the original sin, humanity lost the ability to not sin (non posse non peccare) but retained the ability to sin (posse peccare).
- The state of "posse non peccare" represents a condition where a person has the ability to choose not to sin, which is seen as a state of moral integrity.
- Ultimately, the highest state is "non posse peccare," where the will is aligned with divine will, rendering sin impossible.
This framework illustrates the progression of human will in relation to sin and grace, emphasizing the transformative power of divine grace in restoring the ability to choose righteousness.
Interesting how Truth does this.
For one thing these folks don't seem to understand the function of conscience in unsaved human beings. Next level of how the human will is intact to deal with this struggle in conscience. Next level of how God has established into all people knowledge about Himself. And more...
The battle rages within because He has not left Himself without witness to a corporate creature who freely chose against Him.
For one thing these folks don't seem to understand the function of conscience in unsaved human beings. Next level of how the human will is intact to deal with this struggle in conscience. Next level of how God has established into all people knowledge about Himself. And more...
The battle rages within because He has not left Himself without witness to a corporate creature who freely chose against Him.
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This is the crux of the conversation, such as it is, for it is out of man's nature that he makes choices ... and the free will proponents assert that the wicked heart of the natural man is free to choose to believe that which he is not only opposed to, but that which he can neither receive/accept nor comprehend. They reject what Jesus said about it being impossible for a bad tree to bring forth good fruit. But they reject a whole slew of Scriptures from beginning to end of the Bible. All in favor of a doctrine that has zero support in the Bible, with not one verse articulating what they prefer over what is actually said. In fact they routinely contradict and deny what is explicitly stated.
