Are the Scriptures plain to all Christians that read them?

[Scotth1960]

"Question II. Are the Scriptures plain to all Christians that read them?
"If the Divine Scriptures were plain to all Christians that read them, the Lord would not have commanded such as desired to obtain salvation to search the same: and Paul would have said without reason that God had placed the gift of teaching in the Church; and Peter would not have said of the Epistles of Paul that they contained some things hard to be understood. It is evident, therefore, that the Scriptures are very profound, and their sense lofty; and that they need learned and divine men to search out their true meaning, and a sense that is right, and agreeable to all Scripture, and to its author the Holy Spirit.
"So that as to those that are regenerated [in Baptism], although they must know the faith concerning the Trinity, the incarnation of the Son of God, His Passion, resurrection, and ascension into the the heavens, what concerneth regeneration and judgment -- for which many have not hesitated to die -- it is not necessary, but rather impossible, that all should know what the Holy Spirit manifesteth to those alone who are exercised in wisdom and holiness. ....." (page 507: The Confession of Dositheus. 1672. CREEDS OF THE CHURCHES: A Reader in Christian Doctrine from the Bible to the Present. Third edition. John H. Leith, editor. Louisville, KY: Westminster John Knox Press, 1982.).

 

[AnandaHya]

All Christians should have the HOLY SPIRIT which gives them Wisdom and Holiness to ALL who seek and pray faithfully with patience and perservance. there is only ONE mediator between God and Man and that is Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. To place any MAN between God and His Children is wrong.

Teachers and pastors are to be respected as Elders but they are to treat the younger Christians not as sons or daughters but brothers and sisters.

read this verse it says if you lack wisdom not to seek out a man to teach you but to PRAY TO GOD who will provide abundantly.

James 1:5
If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him.

 

[NiceneChristian]

All Christians should have the HOLY SPIRIT which gives them Wisdom and Holiness to ALL who seek and pray faithfully with patience and perservance. there is only ONE mediator between God and Man and that is Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. To place any MAN between God and His Children is wrong.

Teachers and pastors are to be respected as Elders but they are to treat the younger Christians not as sons or daughters but brothers and sisters.

read this verse it says if you lack wisdom not to seek out a man to teach you but to PRAY TO GOD who will provide abundantly.

James 1:5
If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him.

Its not placing a man before us and God to believe that gifted teachers are needed to "shepherd the flock of God". Its commanded by the Holy Spirit for us to follow the teachers an pastors who are set over us.


1Peter 5:1 The elders who are among you I exhort, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed;
2 shepherd the flock of God among you, overseeing not by compulsion, but rather willingly, not in fondness for dishonest gain, but rather eagerly;
3 nor as being masters over the flock under you, but rather being examples to the flock.



St Paul says in another passage regarding this "overseeing", "1Thessalonians 5:12 And we request of you, brothers, to recognize those who labor among you, and are over you in the Lord and instruct you,
13 and to regard them beyond all measure in love, because of their work. Be at peace among yourselves.



Not all have the gift of teaching. This simply means that not all have the ability to interpret Scriptures properly by the Holy Spirit.


1Corinthains 12:28 And those whom God has appointed in the church are: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, kinds of tongues.
29 All are not apostles, are they? All are not prophets, are they? Are all teachers? Are all workers of miracles?



For if what you are saying is true, then why are there over 28,000 Protestant denominations today? Is division a work of the Holy Spirit - certainly not. This is a work of error, of the spirit of error. And those who appoint themselves as teachers and infallible interpreters, just because they believe that they have the "Holy Spirit" to help them interpret it, these are self deceived and conceited. 2 Corinthians 10:18 "For not he who commends himself is approved, but he whom the Lord commends."

 

[zone]

YES THEY ARE

 

[shroom2]

YES THEY ARE

No, they aren't.

Prov 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

Acts 17:11 ...and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Matt 13:
10) And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11) He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

If the scriptures were plain, there wouldn't be thousands of denominations, all claiming to be right.

 

[jimmydiggs]

YES THEY ARE

Agreed wholeheartedly. When there are disagreeances over scripture, it is not the scripture to be blamed. Rather, it is the people. As when the two claim to contradictory truths, one or both are wrong; not the bible.

 

[zone]

No, they aren't.

Prov 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

Acts 17:11 ...and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Matt 13:
10) And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11) He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

If the scriptures were plain, there wouldn't be thousands of denominations, all claiming to be right.

EASY......easy easy.
BELIEVE WHAT IT SAYS AND LOOK FOR 2 MEANINGS.
one for those who are alive and one for those who are not.

 

[shroom2]

Agreed wholeheartedly. When there are disagreeances over scripture, it is not the scripture to be blamed. Rather, it is the people. As when the two claim to contradictory truths, one or both are wrong; not the bible.

Yes, the bible is never wrong. But the truth is not always plain. The question was:

Are the Scriptures plain to all Christians that read them?

Obviously, the answer is no, or we would all agree on everything.

 

[jimmydiggs]

Yes, the bible is never wrong. But the truth is not always plain. The question was:

Are the Scriptures plain to all Christians that read them?

Obviously, the answer is no, or we would all agree on everything.

The bible is pretty straight forward. It's we who have the problem.

 

[shroom2]

EASY......easy easy.
BELIEVE WHAT IT SAYS AND LOOK FOR 2 MEANINGS.
one for those who are alive and one for those who are not.

It just isn't that cut & dried, zone.

1 Cor 13:10) But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

I am Christian, as are you. Yet we disagree on what that verse means, and its implications, which are HUGE.

 

[NiceneChristian]

YES THEY ARE

2Peter 3:16 "as also in all his letters, speaking in them about these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the unlearned and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures."


2Peter 1:20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture comes about from one's own interpretation,
21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke, being brought along by the Holy Spirit.

 

[zone]

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF.
I THOUGHT YOUR CHURCH KNEW EVERYTHING

 

[jimmydiggs]

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF.
I THOUGHT YOUR CHURCH KNEW EVERYTHING

I lol'd....

 

[zone]

It just isn't that cut & dried, zone.

1 Cor 13:10) But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

I am Christian, as are you. Yet we disagree on what that verse means, and its implications, which are HUGE.

PAUL IS TALKING ABOUT THE COMPLETELY REVEALED WILL OF GOD IN CANON.
not the Second Advent.

but NO ONE IS WILLING TO READ THE BIBLE FOR WHAT IT IS, they think its all about mememememememememememememememememe

do you think God in UNABLE TO REVEAL TO HIS SERVANTS WHAT HE SAID?

only if you believe He is hiding something until the 2nd Advent.

 

[zone]

The bible is pretty straight forward. It's we who have the problem.

its completely straight forward. EVEN FOR THE LOST.

for the saved, the Truth is revealed.

if people stop acting pious and religious and just read it they'll get it.

but NOPE.....its about MY spirituality...MY belief.....MY church.

 

[shroom2]

PAUL IS TALKING ABOUT THE COMPLETELY REVEALED WILL OF GOD IN CANON.
not the Second Advent.

And there we have the problem... NO, HE ISN'T.

 

[zone]

And there we have the problem... NO, HE ISN'T.

its EASILY PROVEN that's what he meant,
but JESUS CHRIST APPARENTLY MUST BE LAID AGAIN AND AGAIN.

i do not know why people are not terrified by the prospect of NOT BELIEVING THAT SCRIPTURE IS AN HISTORICAL RECORD.

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

it is kind of ironic to be posting scripture to support the claim that not everyone can properly interpret scripture...

but it does show that even people who do not agree with 'sola scriptura' unconsciously acknowledge scripture as the ultimate authority...

 

[MissCris]

When I read my Bible, when I come across a passage that really speaks to me in whatever situation/struggle I'm dealing with at the time, I tend to have 4 different reactions almost all at once:

1. Immediate understanding of the passage.
2. Nearly immediate recoiling from the strong conviction I feel.
3. Nearly immediate scrambling to determine if the words could possibly mean anything other than what they plainly say.
4. Realization that even as a Christian, when God's Truth sinks in, it's not always comfortable.

Acceptance of that Truth generally comes a little while later.

Is the Bible plain to all Christians? I'd say yes.

But people don't like to be bluntly told that they are doing something wrong, so they begin to twist God's Word to fit into their sinful lives.

And to say that understanding the Bible requires a pastor, preacher, scholar, whatever...well, what a convenient way for Satan to spread The Twisted Word.

 

[shroom2]

its EASILY PROVEN that's what he meant,

No, it isn't, because that is NOT what he meant.

but JESUS CHRIST APPARENTLY MUST BE LAID AGAIN AND AGAIN.

...not sure why you say that. Jesus Christ accomplished his Father's will perfectly. One time.

i do not know why people are not terrified by the prospect of NOT BELIEVING THAT SCRIPTURE IS AN HISTORICAL RECORD.

I believe that scripture is an historical record.

Anyway, the subject of this thread is "Are the Scriptures plain to all Christians that read them?"

Obviously, the answer is no.