Are You Rapture Ready?

[Lovette]

Revelation 4:1
After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

This is the most absurd "prooftext" for pretrib rapture. If apostle John were raptured into heaven and forever with Lord Jesus, did he write the book of Revelation in heaven and drop it back to earth? Suppose he was really "raptured" into heaven, here's the bad news: by Rev. 13:1, he's back to the "sand of the sea" - "Then I stood on the sand of the sea" - watching the Beast rising from the sea and reigning the earth for 3.5 years, herein "sand of the sea" is a specific reference of Abraham's descendants, who'd be as numerous as the sand of the sea. It's so convenient of you to leave this part out. Have you considered the possibility that he was having a VISION of the apocalypse, meanwhile he was physically kept in the island of Patmos the whole time, not going anywhere, like all the OT prophets before him?

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I'm curious if there are any doctrinal differences wherein you would NOT consider the person who disagrees with you to be unsaved or apostate?

I'm not being cheeky, I'm genuinely curious if there are any.

When a person says they're Christian, aren't they to believe everything Jesus says and live accordingly? Especially if what He says is clear:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."

So I would think people would drop the false pre-trib doctrine and just go by what Jesus said and prepare for what is to come.

You seem shocked at what I said in my previous post, but I'm even more shocked that a person who says they are Christian would not believe Jesus and cling to false doctrine instead.

This is why I asked God how that can be possible, and He gave me that verse.

John 8:47 Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”

Jesus pretty much explains why people cling to false doctrine and don't accept what He says.

I accept what Jesus says but I'm not happy about it. It's actually tragic.


🕊

 

[Snackersmom]

When a person says they're Christian, aren't they to believe everything Jesus says and live accordingly? Especially if what He says is clear:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."

So I would think people would drop the false pre-trib doctrine and just go by what Jesus said and prepare for what is to come.

You seem shocked at what I said in my previous post, but I'm even more shocked that a person who says they are Christian would not believe Jesus and cling to false doctrine instead.

This is why I asked God how that can be possible, and He gave me that verse.

John 8:47 Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”

Jesus pretty much explains why people cling to false doctrine and don't accept what He says.

I accept what Jesus says but I'm not happy about it. It's actually tragic.


🕊

I wasn't shocked by what you said, I've seen you say it many times. I mean, I guess I find it a bit shocking how comfortable you are pronouncing people hellbound over minor disagreements, but if you're comfortable wielding that level of judgement then that's between you and God I suppose.

Regarding the verse you quoted, the context of it isn't talking about the tribulation or the rapture. I've always taken it as Jesus was referring to judgement day, and that those who are His will be raised up rather than cast down. Of course one day we'll know for sure what He meant.

For the record (before you pronounce me apostate ), I do believe Christians will go through tribulation before the rapture. Exactly how it will all shake down I do not worry about, I just try to keep my lamp full and wick trimmed.

Anyways, you never answered my question...... are we allowed to disagree with you about ANYTHING without being pronounced apostate? Like, I'm truly curious here.

 

[Edward429451]

When a person says they're Christian, aren't they to believe everything Jesus says and live accordingly? Especially if what He says is clear:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."

So I would think people would drop the false pre-trib doctrine and just go by what Jesus said and prepare for what is to come.

You seem shocked at what I said in my previous post, but I'm even more shocked that a person who says they are Christian would not believe Jesus and cling to false doctrine instead.

This is why I asked God how that can be possible, and He gave me that verse.

John 8:47 Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”

Jesus pretty much explains why people cling to false doctrine and don't accept what He says.

I accept what Jesus says but I'm not happy about it. It's actually tragic.


🕊

But I spoke with the Lord this morning, and He spoke to me, AND I HEARD HIM!

So now what, I'm a liar?

I do accept Jesus's words, it is your words that I do not accept.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

But I spoke with the Lord this morning, and He spoke to me, AND I HEARD HIM!

So now what, I'm a liar?

I do accept Jesus's words, it is your words that I do not accept.

If you really accept Jesus words, you'd be post-trib.

I wasn't shocked by what you said, I've seen you say it many times. I mean, I guess I find it a bit shocking how comfortable you are pronouncing people hellbound over minor disagreements, but if you're comfortable wielding that level of judgement then that's between you and God I suppose.

I know you're good friends with @Edward429451 so it's no surprise you take his side, but no one who clings to false doctrine ever seems to stand up for God and His word over their pet false doctrine. That's dangerous to them and to those they convince.

When God makes something clear in the Bible He wants us to accept it and follow accordingly. What He says is always to protect us and grow into Christlikeness.

God doesn’t want us embracing false doctrine because ithey harm the Christian in some way.

In the case of the false pre-trib doctrine, it gives a false comfort that we don't have to gird up and strengthen our faith in Jesus to endure what is to come. But in the Bible, you see Jesus talk about the GT, how terrible it will be, and that He says to endure to the end as His instruction to us how to survive it with our fatth intact.

Just like how Noah took seriously all God's instructions in preparation for the Flood. So he was ready when the flood came. I'm sure there were people who claimed to have followed God back then, but did not join Noah in obedience. So what happened to those people? They drowned along with the other people.

And it will be like that for people who cling to the false pre-trib doctrine. They don't take Jesus seriously on that matter. Most of these people won't make it through the GT with their faith intact. They'll take the mark of the beast because they won't have any moral fortitude to refuse it. They will hang on to their money and things rather than stamd up for God and be martyred for Him.

So I thought if they knew

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."

that surely they will believe Jesus Himself, that He is coming for us post-trib. But to my shock, they are still clinging to what some girl said in the 1800s over Jesus whom they profess to follow.

And @Edward429451 right up front said he rejects it. I tried to tell him to please strengthen his faith to endure in Christ (at least) but he ignored that and like a pharisee, turned around and made it about me, that he doesn't like me (*shrug* So?).

I've read  

John 8:47 Whoever belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”

before, but when I asked God about @Edward429451 "s refusal to accept what Jesus said, that was the verse He gave me. Everything then made sense, and I no longer asked him why.

Regarding the verse you quoted, the context of it isn't talking about the tribulation or the rapture. I've always taken it as Jesus was referring to judgement day, and that those who are His will be raised up rather than cast down. Of course one day we'll know for sure what He meant.

Why would God wait until judgement day to raise us up rather than cast us down? That doesn't make sense.

Before judgement day, the millenial age occurs. Jesus reigns over the whole world and it will be filled with all His people.

So that means before the millenial age, Jesus came back on the last day (post-trib) to raise all His people up.

So the order is:

Last day (last trumpet is sounded) -> millenial age -> judgement day.

For the record (before you pronounce me apostate ), I do believe Christians will go through tribulation before the rapture. Exactly how it will all shake down I do not worry about, I just try to keep my lamp full and wick trimmed.

Anyways, you never answered my question...... are we allowed to disagree with you about ANYTHING without being pronounced apostate? Like, I'm truly curious here.

That's just a gotcha question. It's not like you're going to care how I answer it.


🕊

 

[Psalm1]

No, you're rejecting what God said which is pretty straight forward.

Now that we know where you stand, go ahead and continue to deceive the rest of the people God hasn't sent to Lord Jesus. None of God's people will believe you.


🕊

Postribs always without fail either make eschatology into salvation, go extra biblical, or go personal.
I have never seen any of them that could debate end times concepts.

 

[Psalm1]

If you really accept Jesus words, you'd be post-trib.




I know you're good friends with @Edward429451 so it's no surprise you take his side, but no one who clings to false doctrine ever seems to stand up for God and His word over their pet false doctrine. That's dangerous to them and to those they convince.

When God makes something clear in the Bible He wants us to accept it and follow accordingly. What He says is always to protect us and grow into Christlikeness.

God doesn’t want us embracing false doctrine because ithey harm the Christian in some way.

In the case of the false pre-trib doctrine, it gives a false comfort that we don't have to gird up and strengthen our faith in Jesus to endure what is to come. But in the Bible, you see Jesus talk about the GT, how terrible it will be, and that He says to endure to the end as His instruction to us how to survive it with our fatth intact.

Just like how Noah took seriously all God's instructions in preparation for the Flood. So he was ready when the flood came. I'm sure there were people who claimed to have followed God back then, but did not join Noah in obedience. So what happened to those people? They drowned along with the other people.

And it will be like that for people who cling to the false pre-trib doctrine. They don't take Jesus seriously on that matter. Most of these people won't make it through the GT with their faith intact. They'll take the mark of the beast because they won't have any moral fortitude to refuse it. They will hang on to their money and things rather than stamd up for God and be martyred for Him.

So I thought if they knew

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."

that surely they will believe Jesus Himself, that He is coming for us post-trib. But to my shock, they are still clinging to what some girl said in the 1800s over Jesus whom they profess to follow.

And @Edward429451 right up front said he rejects it. I tried to tell him to please strengthen his faith to endure in Christ (at least) but he ignored that and like a pharisee, turned around and made it about me, that he doesn't like me (*shrug* So?).

I've read  

John 8:47 Whoever belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”

before, but when I asked God about @Edward429451 "s refusal to accept what Jesus said, that was the verse He gave me. Everything then made sense, and I no longer asked him why.




Why would God wait until judgement day to raise us up rather than cast us down? That doesn't make sense.

Before judgement day, the millenial age occurs. Jesus reigns over the whole world and it will be filled with all His people.

So that means before the millenial age, Jesus came back on the last day (post-trib) to raise all His people up.

So the order is:

Last day (last trumpet is sounded) -> millenial age -> judgement day.




That's just a gotcha question. It's not like you're going to care how I answer it.


🕊

Quote
"If you really accept Jesus words, you'd be post-trib."

Both sides believe he returns postrib.

Jesus placed the rapture pretrib as does Revelation, and Paul.

So 3 witnesses against the postrib rapture impossibility.

Only those with the mark, and the Jews "go through" the trib.

Maybe reasearch why it is called "Jacob's trouble ", and not "churches" trouble.

 

[Psalm1]

"Taken" as in being swept away by the flood? From you, out of all people, who persistently accuses me of "omitting verse" and weaponizes Matt.24:40-41, yet being guilty of your own accusation.

For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark,and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. (Matt. 24:38-39)

If you change the setting?
"Buying, selling, eating, planning for the future......AHEM...ONE TAKEN, ONE LEFT BEHIND"
1) Your claiming the wicked taken before the flood ?
A pretrib wicked rapture?
Huh ?
2) Jesus says half are taken. Your doctrine now has half the world righteous and going through the flood? Again, a pretrib rapture of a made up theory that half the world is saved????, half the world is wicked and raptured pretrib??????
3) there never has been 50% righteous (born again) and never will be.
4) the Greek word for "taken" is to a good place. Your doctrine claims the opposite.
5) half of a group are taken?. ( or maybe you change that also?)
6) half of what group?
7) in the same breath as "half taken" before the flood, Jesus says half the righteous are taken in the 10 virgins.
Half of a small group.
8) you are aware that YOU ACTUALLY NEED THE RAPTURE POST FLOOD?????
9) Contrary to your beliefs, Noah RETURNS POSTFLOOD BACK TO EARTH WITH FAMILY, HAVING BEEN MILES ABOVE THE EARTH DURING THE TRIB.

ALL THAT, Is miles from your doctrine.
And Jesus words that you reject

 

[Psalm1]

Yes, ahead of the living, therefore I ask you again, where is this "zeroth" resurrection? Nobody dies or rises in Rev. 14, the 144,000 are sealed by God under his protection.

Bingo.
A gathering of the living , BEFORE THE DEAD IN CHRIST.

Again, you have , in your doctrine, the dead In Christ of first thesalonians 4, resurrected after the living of rev 14:14 are gathered.
Hard to wiggle out of what's written in the bible.
You going to change Paul's words?

 

[Psalm1]

Please do a study on Lev. 23 where "firstfruits" are defined. Only will the problem be solved when you stop denying Rev. 20:5, in whatever translation you prefer.

Kindergarten.
The point is, you never knew Jesus us the firstfruits.
Apparently you still can't bring yourself over the target.
Instead you divert to literal harvest.

....which you don't even connect the dots there either.

Ahem....FIRSTS FRUITS ...JESUS...POINTS TO THE RESURRECTION BEING IN PARTS.

You claim to define firstfruits. You claim you have scripture.
You fail to incorporate firstfruits into harvest.

Those dots are so basic to connect.
And you can not even understand it.

That is profound that that doctrine has you dodging the incredibly obvious.

Could it be firstfruits has sunk your deal?

That was too easy.

 

[Psalm1]

Which verse have I omitted, friend? Whover preaches pre-trib seems to be omitting the "dead shall rise FIRST" part.

...and yet you have the dead in christ raised AFTER the Rev 14:14 gathering.

You really do not realize the Rev 14:14 gathering is a separate coming??????

Huh????

Oh wait....you guys claim that there is only one coming, correct?

So Rev 14:14, is actually 2 witnesses against your made up beliefs.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Postribs always without fail either make eschatology into salvation, go extra biblical, or go personal.
I have never seen any of them that could debate end times concepts.

No need to debate. I understand now why you can't accept what Jesus said.

-=<**>=-​

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."


🕊

 

[Psalm1]

Says you who have no understanding on the difference between the SHEAF of the first fruits and the harvest of first fruits.

Tie it in genius.
Tie in firstfruits to the resurrection.

You are busy holding a dog tail in your hand, not knowing it is connected to a dog, then asking people to define what a tail is.

Conecct YOUR BOO BOO to the subject.

Show us how the first resurrection DOES NOT INCLUSE JESUS AS THE FIRSTFRUITS OF THE FIRST RESURRECTION.

Jesus as FIRSTFRUITS, DEPICTS a multi part harvest.

YOUR BOO BOO that you are dancing around, is embarrassing.

Remember ....it is you that said firstfruits is wrapped up in the 144,000.

( which is a totally separate firstfriuts of ethnic Jews)

 

[Psalm1]

No need to debate. I understand now why you can't accept what Jesus said.

-=<**>=-​

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."


🕊

I accept you one verse .
It is not what you are hoping for.
But I do accept it.
The difference is, I do not reject 8 or 10 verses, omit them, and then dishonestly say they are nothing.

The tires are one component of many on the car. No tires ...car won't go.
No engine..no go.
No transmission...no go.


Other components can be removed, and it still goes.

Essentials are non negotiable.

IOW, your poor car has one tire.
And that one is flat.

 

[Psalm1]

I suppose I would say, Bye Bye, I wish you could have been raptured too...

One thing to note is that the Antichrist can arrive, and even arrest every Christian on the planet,
So there we are, in huge open air holding facilities.
All the Christians .
pre tribbers and post tribbers.
The mature saints with the carnal believers, all together in the same open air holding facility.
Then the rapture happens at that point.
Well, that is a pre-trib rapture.
The Antichrist arrived and a week later everybody's arrested.
....and then 3 days later while in those huge facilities the rapture happens .
At that point there has been no tribulation.
...and it is a pretrib rapture
What I forsee is those pretribbers mocking us, and belittling us, and saying ""ha ha ha. Where is your stupid pretrib rapture now????""
While pointing their hateful crooked fingers in our faces.
And at that point the rapture happens and they will be left behind to deal with the Antichrist.
With me in awe as we ascend up up up.
The groom gathering the bride

A 100% pretrib rapture.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I accept you one verse .
It is not what you are hoping for.
But I do accept it.
The difference is, I do not reject 8 or 10 verses, omit them, and then dishonestly say they are nothing.

The tires are one component of many on the car. No tires ...car won't go.
No engine..no go.
No transmission...no go.


Other components can be removed, and it still goes.

Essentials are non negotiable.

IOW, your poor car has one tire.
And that one is flat.

Jesus doesn't need all your twisted Bible passages They won't cause Him to come back pre-trib.

You don't believe Him when He says He will come back post-trib. And Jesus also told us why you won't.

Should people listen to you or Jesus?

Christians, if you belong to God, listen to Jesus and prepare:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."


🕊

 

[Psalm1]

"Taken" as in being swept away by the flood? From you, out of all people, who persistently accuses me of "omitting verse" and weaponizes Matt.24:40-41, yet being guilty of your own accusation.

For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark,and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. (Matt. 24:38-39)

Half the world is swept away before the flood? One taken, one left behind?
(Wicked preflood rapture)

 

[Psalm1]

Jesus doesn't need all your twisted Bible passages They won't cause Him to come back pre-trib.

You don't believe Him when He says He will come back post-trib. And Jesus also told us why you won't.

Should people listen to you or Jesus?

Christians, if you belong to God, listen to Jesus and prepare:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."


🕊

When is the last day.?

 

[Psalm1]

Jesus doesn't need all your twisted Bible passages They won't cause Him to come back pre-trib.

You don't believe Him when He says He will come back post-trib. And Jesus also told us why you won't.

Should people listen to you or Jesus?

Christians, if you belong to God, listen to Jesus and prepare:

John 6:39 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day."


🕊

Jesus comes back here;
1 thes 4
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Jesus comes back here;
Rev 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

Jesus comes back here;
Rev 19.
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.


Jesus comes back here;
Mat 25
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

Which one is the last day resurrection?

 

[Omegatime]

Dan 9:27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one week

How is this even possible??

Can only happen in a time like this

America is Israel best friend but the coming rapture will change the future

For Israel will seek peace and security and this leader will provide it till middle of the seven