I will ask again....
What difference does it make if you have a dead spirit?
Or, no human spirit?
What is the difference?
Was Mary Sinless?
- Thread starter randyk
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What difference does it make if you have a dead spirit?
Or, no human spirit?
What is the difference?
The heart of that question is really this: What is the difference between a human who is spiritually dead and one who is
spiritually alive? And the answer is not abstract — Scripture treats it as the most decisive difference in human existence.
Here’s the clearest way to understand it.
In Scripture, death almost never means “ceasing to exist.” It means separation.
- Physical death = spirit separated from body
- Spiritual death = human spirit separated from God
“You were dead in your trespasses and sins…”(Ephesians 2:1)
A spiritually dead person still:
- thinks
- feels
- chooses
- loves
- creates
- worships (something)
Paul describes this bluntly:
“The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God…and he is not able to understand them.”(1 Corinthians 2:14)
A dead spirit:
- cannot hear God
- cannot desire God
- cannot obey God from the heart
- cannot produce spiritual life
- cannot regenerate itself
Paul again:“God… made us alive together with Christ.”(Ephesians 2:5)
A living spirit:
- responds to God
- recognizes truth
- desires righteousness
- is capable of faith
- is indwelt by the Holy Spirit
- is restored to communion with God
“You must be born again.”(John 3:7)
Not “should.”Not “might consider.”Must.
Because without spiritual birth, the human spirit remains dead.
This is Paul’s entire argument in Romans:- The law can restrain behavior
- But it cannot give life
- And without life, righteousness is impossible
- be moral
- be kind
- be generous
- be religious
- be disciplined
🌤
This is the ultimate difference.Paul says:
“He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.”(1 Corinthians 6:17)
A dead spirit:
- is alone
- is disconnected
- is spiritually inert
- is united to Christ
- receives His life
- receives His righteousness
- receives His mind
- receives His power
“Christ in you, the hope of glory.”(Colossians 1:27)
Not because God is cruel, but because death cannot inherit life.Paul again:
“Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.”(1 Corinthians 15:50)
Jesus says:
“Unless one is born of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”(John 3:5)
A dead spirit is simply incapable of participating in God’s life.
Everything.The difference between:
- blindness and sight
- silence and hearing
- exile and home
- slavery and freedom
- death and life
That is the difference.
Ecclesiastes 12:7 states that "the spirit returns to God who gave it," implying that the spirit continues to exist beyond physical life.
Why should God 'give the spirit?'
If we already had a dead one?
..... and the dust returns to the ground it came from,
and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
Ecclesiastes 12:7
You didn't read all of it then did you because I also said (which is why my testimony is irrelevant) that we learn from the word of God not experience. I could give you a brilliant story but you must still test it against the word for it to have any value otherwise I could be spinning any old yarn.
I'm not being disingenuous you don't seem to be understanding your own words. You are spiritually dead and unable to comprehend what is heard. So how can you understand the Gospel unless, according to you, you are born anew? You have compared recharging a battery to the new birth, so if one is to hear and comprehend that recharge needs to happen first. If it is not happening first, then explain how one comprehends while spiritually dead. If you don't know how one can hear and comprehend, let me give you a hint.
John 3:12
I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?
We all had a spirit that shall "surely die in dying."
new spirit and new heart verses
Psalm 51:10
Eze 11: 19
Eze 18:31 *note the question "why should you die?"
And Eze 36:26 "I will give you a new heart and a new spirit within you. I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh." And the conjunctive waw (et) begins Eze 36:27, "And I will put My Spirit within you..." A note of interest is the spelling of the conjuctive waw, "vav(final form);alef;tau," a picture of the final form of the (nun), which otherwise depicts the son, depicts a nail (which happens to join one thing to the other) joins us in the first, "alef," and the last, "tau."
new spirit and new heart verses
Psalm 51:10
Eze 11: 19
Eze 18:31 *note the question "why should you die?"
And Eze 36:26 "I will give you a new heart and a new spirit within you. I will remove your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh." And the conjunctive waw (et) begins Eze 36:27, "And I will put My Spirit within you..." A note of interest is the spelling of the conjuctive waw, "vav(final form);alef;tau," a picture of the final form of the (nun), which otherwise depicts the son, depicts a nail (which happens to join one thing to the other) joins us in the first, "alef," and the last, "tau."
Rom 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Mar 2:7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?
1Ti 6:15-16 KJV 15 ...., the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Mary is a created being not a god.
Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Mar 2:7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?
1Ti 6:15-16 KJV 15 ...., the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Mary is a created being not a god.
Grace and mercy are not just for us. Grace and mercy are offered to ALL.The heart of that question is really this: What is the difference between a human who is spiritually dead and one who is
spiritually alive? And the answer is not abstract — Scripture treats it as the most decisive difference in human existence.
Here’s the clearest way to understand it.
In Scripture, death almost never means “ceasing to exist.” It means separation.
This is exactly what Paul means when he says:
- Physical death = spirit separated from body
- Spiritual death = human spirit separated from God
“You were dead in your trespasses and sins…”(Ephesians 2:1)
A spiritually dead person still:
But they do all of this cut off from the life of God.
- thinks
- feels
- chooses
- loves
- creates
- worships (something)
Paul describes this bluntly:
“The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God…and he is not able to understand them.”(1 Corinthians 2:14)
A dead spirit:
It’s like trying to tune a broken radio to a broadcast — the signal is there, but the receiver is dead.
- cannot hear God
- cannot desire God
- cannot obey God from the heart
- cannot produce spiritual life
- cannot regenerate itself
Paul again:
“God… made us alive together with Christ.”(Ephesians 2:5)
A living spirit:
This is why Jesus says:
- responds to God
- recognizes truth
- desires righteousness
- is capable of faith
- is indwelt by the Holy Spirit
- is restored to communion with God
“You must be born again.”(John 3:7)
Not “should.”Not “might consider.”Must.
Because without spiritual birth, the human spirit remains dead.
This is Paul’s entire argument in Romans:
A spiritually dead person can:
- The law can restrain behavior
- But it cannot give life
- And without life, righteousness is impossible
…but cannot be righteous, because righteousness requires union with God, and union requires life.
- be moral
- be kind
- be generous
- be religious
- be disciplined
🌤
This is the ultimate difference.
Paul says:
“He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.”(1 Corinthians 6:17)
A dead spirit:
A living spirit:
- is alone
- is disconnected
- is spiritually inert
This is why Paul says:
- is united to Christ
- receives His life
- receives His righteousness
- receives His mind
- receives His power
“Christ in you, the hope of glory.”(Colossians 1:27)
Not because God is cruel, but because death cannot inherit life.
Paul again:
“Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.”(1 Corinthians 15:50)
Jesus says:
“Unless one is born of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”(John 3:5)
A dead spirit is simply incapable of participating in God’s life.
Everything.
The difference between:
A dead spirit is separated from God.A living spirit is united to God.
- blindness and sight
- silence and hearing
- exile and home
- slavery and freedom
- death and life
That is the difference.
Natural: Greek 5591 psoo-khee-kos from 5590; sensitive, i.e. animate ( IN DISTINCTION on the one hand from) 4152 Greek; pnyoo--mat-ik-os- NON-CARNAL, WHICH IS THE HIGHER OR RENOVATED NATURE. So the natural man is the carnally natured man, not one with a HIGHER or RENOVATED nature. So the carnal(fleshly) man cannot receive things of the Spirit of God but the man with a RENOVATED( quickened?) nature(spirit) can. This proves that man HAS to have a spirit to be drawn by the Holy Spirit, it's impossible for Him to draw us by a carnal nature. Spirit to spirit, flesh to flesh.
A very concise explanation. To you, does " born of the Spirit" mean that you're then given a spirit or that the spirit you have is then quickened?The heart of that question is really this: What is the difference between a human who is spiritually dead and one who is
spiritually alive? And the answer is not abstract — Scripture treats it as the most decisive difference in human existence.
Here’s the clearest way to understand it.
In Scripture, death almost never means “ceasing to exist.” It means separation.
This is exactly what Paul means when he says:
- Physical death = spirit separated from body
- Spiritual death = human spirit separated from God
“You were dead in your trespasses and sins…”(Ephesians 2:1)
A spiritually dead person still:
But they do all of this cut off from the life of God.
- thinks
- feels
- chooses
- loves
- creates
- worships (something)
Paul describes this bluntly:
“The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God…and he is not able to understand them.”(1 Corinthians 2:14)
A dead spirit:
It’s like trying to tune a broken radio to a broadcast — the signal is there, but the receiver is dead.
- cannot hear God
- cannot desire God
- cannot obey God from the heart
- cannot produce spiritual life
- cannot regenerate itself
Paul again:
“God… made us alive together with Christ.”(Ephesians 2:5)
A living spirit:
This is why Jesus says:
- responds to God
- recognizes truth
- desires righteousness
- is capable of faith
- is indwelt by the Holy Spirit
- is restored to communion with God
“You must be born again.”(John 3:7)
Not “should.”Not “might consider.”Must.
Because without spiritual birth, the human spirit remains dead.
This is Paul’s entire argument in Romans:
A spiritually dead person can:
- The law can restrain behavior
- But it cannot give life
- And without life, righteousness is impossible
…but cannot be righteous, because righteousness requires union with God, and union requires life.
- be moral
- be kind
- be generous
- be religious
- be disciplined
🌤
This is the ultimate difference.
Paul says:
“He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.”(1 Corinthians 6:17)
A dead spirit:
A living spirit:
- is alone
- is disconnected
- is spiritually inert
This is why Paul says:
- is united to Christ
- receives His life
- receives His righteousness
- receives His mind
- receives His power
“Christ in you, the hope of glory.”(Colossians 1:27)
Not because God is cruel, but because death cannot inherit life.
Paul again:
“Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.”(1 Corinthians 15:50)
Jesus says:
“Unless one is born of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”(John 3:5)
A dead spirit is simply incapable of participating in God’s life.
Everything.
The difference between:
A dead spirit is separated from God.A living spirit is united to God.
- blindness and sight
- silence and hearing
- exile and home
- slavery and freedom
- death and life
That is the difference.
Can't answer the question I see...The heart of that question is really this: What is the difference between a human who is spiritually dead and one who is
spiritually alive? And the answer is not abstract — Scripture treats it as the most decisive difference in human existence.
Here’s the clearest way to understand it.
In Scripture, death almost never means “ceasing to exist.” It means separation.
This is exactly what Paul means when he says:
- Physical death = spirit separated from body
- Spiritual death = human spirit separated from God
“You were dead in your trespasses and sins…”(Ephesians 2:1)
A spiritually dead person still:
But they do all of this cut off from the life of God.
- thinks
- feels
- chooses
- loves
- creates
- worships (something)
Paul describes this bluntly:
“The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God…and he is not able to understand them.”(1 Corinthians 2:14)
A dead spirit:
It’s like trying to tune a broken radio to a broadcast — the signal is there, but the receiver is dead.
- cannot hear God
- cannot desire God
- cannot obey God from the heart
- cannot produce spiritual life
- cannot regenerate itself
Paul again:
“God… made us alive together with Christ.”(Ephesians 2:5)
A living spirit:
This is why Jesus says:
- responds to God
- recognizes truth
- desires righteousness
- is capable of faith
- is indwelt by the Holy Spirit
- is restored to communion with God
“You must be born again.”(John 3:7)
Not “should.”Not “might consider.”Must.
Because without spiritual birth, the human spirit remains dead.
This is Paul’s entire argument in Romans:
A spiritually dead person can:
- The law can restrain behavior
- But it cannot give life
- And without life, righteousness is impossible
…but cannot be righteous, because righteousness requires union with God, and union requires life.
- be moral
- be kind
- be generous
- be religious
- be disciplined
🌤
This is the ultimate difference.
Paul says:
“He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.”(1 Corinthians 6:17)
A dead spirit:
A living spirit:
- is alone
- is disconnected
- is spiritually inert
This is why Paul says:
- is united to Christ
- receives His life
- receives His righteousness
- receives His mind
- receives His power
“Christ in you, the hope of glory.”(Colossians 1:27)
Not because God is cruel, but because death cannot inherit life.
Paul again:
“Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.”(1 Corinthians 15:50)
Jesus says:
“Unless one is born of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”(John 3:5)
A dead spirit is simply incapable of participating in God’s life.
Everything.
The difference between:
A dead spirit is separated from God.A living spirit is united to God.
- blindness and sight
- silence and hearing
- exile and home
- slavery and freedom
- death and life
That is the difference.
What difference does it make if you have a dead spirit?
Or, no human spirit?
That was the question....
Note!
5591 psyxikós (an adjective, derived from 5590 /psyxḗ, "soul, natural identity") – properly, soulish, i.e. what is natural, as it relates to physical (tangible) life alone (i.e. apart from God's inworking of faith).
"Naturalk man" gets translated according to a traditional idea that has been passed down to us.
We don't speak this way normally...
But, it can be translated as follows:
Instead of - the natural man?
The soulish man!
the "psuchikos man"/"soul-ish man"
[psuchikos - the breath/"immaterial substance" that men
have in common with animals - a unbeliever with only a soul]
Only a soul = no human spirit.
But the soulish man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." 1 Corinthians 2:14
.......
Let me ask you this, when, or if, you first received Christ, did you really understand the Gospel? I heard the preached Word, was convicted and stirred in my spirit, received Christ as my Savior but I didn't comprehend the Gospel. At twelve years old I only knew that I was a sinner who needed a Savior. In my soul I was reluctant, but my deadened spirit was quickened or recharged, THEN and only THEN could I BEGIN to start understanding God's Word. " So then faith cometh by HEARING, and HEARING by the Word of God." Rom 10:17 ": and with all thy getting get UNDERSTANDING." Pro 4:7. Hearing and understanding( or comprehending) don't come at the same time, although you repeatedly pair them up. Faith comes by hearing, but you pursue understanding. You say that I am "spiritually dead and can't comprehend what is heard." Well, as I said, I heard the Word of God, the Gospel, and comprehended that I was a sinner in need of a Savior and I am born again, so I guess that's not good enough for you. But my faith isn't in you( I'd still be in my sin), and that's all I need to please God, my faith in Him, not what YOU say.
" Who knoweth the SPIRIT OF MAN that goeth upward, and the SPIRIT OF THE BEAST that goeth downward to the earth." Ecc. 3:21. It seems that the Bible attributes to man AND beasts a spirit. Explain THAT away Nezzie. P.S. I guess the beasts are saved since the only way you get a spirit is through salvation, according to you guys. What you posted is that man and animals have a soul. I posted, from scripture, that man and animals have spirits. BTW, what are your sources? I got the 5591, it's the same one I used, but I put what Strong's has verbatim, I don't know WHAT you have. But give me your psuchikos source, to see if these things be true, the first one wasn't. You'll go to any length try to be right, won't you Nezzie? You should be ashamed.
A song a day!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Your days must be quite enjoyable. Creating anything.. something tangible, a new thought, discovering a new interpretation / understanding of from within His prophecies is so rewarding. But they are all to frequent- at least for me.
Well, carry on! I am a fan. By the way, if you or others reading these comments are interested in the Book of Daniel, I recently completed a new commentary that is unlike those thousands that essentially copy the same interpretations produced by scholars dying the past 200 years- nothing new, just their own voice on them.
If interested in a free copy let me know and I will give you / anyone a secondary email address where we can communicate. It is an easy to read, detailed and transparent study on Daniel that provides over 50 new / sound / sometimes unbelievable new interpretations. Alternatively, I can provide some he ISBN # where you could purchase it online on Amazon. But for now, free is good! God bless.
Of course I pair hearing and understanding, who in their right mind wouldn't? If you are not understanding what you are hearing what good is it to you and how can you understand if you haven't heard? Knowing you are a sinner and in need of saving does not equate to believing in the Saviour. We are saved through faith, not knowledge but if we do not know, we cannot believe hence, Pauls' argument in Romans 10. A friend of mine knows she is a sinner and realises she needs saving but is not saved. Why? She doesn't believe the Gospel.
You have consistently failed to recognise that the word of God is not only spiritual but has a moral and ethical quality as well. We understand the latter which is why Christ can speak of earthly things that we understand but it is not until we believe and are born spiritually that we understand the spiritual dynamic of the word. I have explained to you several times how God draws us to Himself, that is Christ, even while we are dead in our sin. Christ spoke of the Spirit being in the world (note, not in believers but in the world) to convict of righteousness, sin and judgement. Jn.16:8 How can that happen while we are dead?
Once again you recognise that one with a "deadened spirit" (your terminology) still cannot understand the spiritual implications of the Gospel yet you have them believing it before they are born from above. You still have not explained how this can be.
And no, you are right, it is not good enough that you know something to be true, you must rely upon it for your existence to be true ie. believe. The Romans 1 type knew God exists but they rejected the knowledge in favour of their own preference. Rom.1:19-20 No-one is born from above simply because they know a Saviour exists, they must believe in the Gospel which is that Christ died for our sin and rose again on the third day. If you don't believe He rose from the dead, you are not believing the Gospel and are therefore not born again.
To be honest, I don't think you have put anywhere near enough thought into the practical details of how salvation occurs from it's beginning (ie. the drawing process) until the point one is actually born of the Spirit. You are like most Christians I met when I first became a Christian, full of platitudes and "right speak" but little understanding of the actual mecahnics of what makes it right.
You have a nice day. I'm not continuing with our conversation as it has repaeated itself enough.
grace and peace.
The way I understand it... is that we have a choice. To follow the flesh or the Spirit.
The flesh is the carnal man, the feelings and emotions, the animal nature in us that has been corrupted by sin.
The flesh needs to be crucified, it needs to die.
The flesh can not do good because it is selfish, and lustful.
The Spirit is God's power in us.
It is the act of the will. A choice to follow the flesh or the Spirit.
The acts of the flesh and Spirit are ... Gal 5:19-23
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
The Spiritual works are from God not our own works but we must crucify the flesh in order to follow the Spirit.
We live and walk in the Spirit When we choose to follow God rather then self.
You can give verbatim and not know what you are talking about.
That's the problem.
You have an agenda to prove.
Everything is filtered through your bias.
You can present the term "team spirit" and show how it is used to make your point... if your bias is strong enough.
I did not use any particular source.
I just explained what I have learned from qualified men of God over many years.
Just do an internet search.
You can spend hours finding out what some already have known.
Here is one example.
https://www.ministryvoice.com/psuchikos-in-greek/
And also....
Look how various translations render the term "natural man."
https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/1 Corinthians 2:14
The translators, having varying degrees of skill and understanding, will simply state "the man having not the spirit."
Man will have no human spirit until the Holy Spirit gives birth to one in someone God has entered into salvation.
Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’
John 3:6-7
See?
Two births!
"Birth!"
Not, resurrecting a dead spirit.
Resurrection is not birth!
"Born again." = two births.
T
TruthDefender
Guest
Do you mean that we were dead while being in the world, but now we are alive in Jesus? Because He is in us; He is life. The world doesn’t know Him, because they are dead in the spirit.