I expect an answer from you so called learned Christians
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A
i haven't read the pages on pages just the first one and I think Stillwaters covered it and the responses to your objection to his text would be at fault.
1. The prophets DID know CHRIST, He spoke to them throughout the OT. they referred to Him as LORD.
2. They were never saved by following the Law, only by Faith. You make an exception for Abraham but that is not the exception but the case point that ALL were saved by FAITH not works of the law. How else do you explain the grace given to David who murdered a man so he could sleep with his wife?
It was by repentance and asking for forgiveness and GOd's grace and mercy that restored David. NOT his obedience to the law.
God's plan has always been the same but people reject the Holy Spirit and seek their own righteousness under the law. They repeat Mount Horeb again and again, rejecting the gospel and the Law of Grace and salvation for the law of Sin and Death.
They say place a veil over the Light for it shines too brightly. Do not have God speak to us lest we die. Give us priest, pastors, apostles, prophets, holy men to speak to us but You God Do NOT speak to us, for we can corrupt them and hide our secret sins in the darkness from their light. God do not speak to us lest we die for Your light would reveal our filth.
1. The prophets DID know CHRIST, He spoke to them throughout the OT. they referred to Him as LORD.
2. They were never saved by following the Law, only by Faith. You make an exception for Abraham but that is not the exception but the case point that ALL were saved by FAITH not works of the law. How else do you explain the grace given to David who murdered a man so he could sleep with his wife?
It was by repentance and asking for forgiveness and GOd's grace and mercy that restored David. NOT his obedience to the law.
God's plan has always been the same but people reject the Holy Spirit and seek their own righteousness under the law. They repeat Mount Horeb again and again, rejecting the gospel and the Law of Grace and salvation for the law of Sin and Death.
They say place a veil over the Light for it shines too brightly. Do not have God speak to us lest we die. Give us priest, pastors, apostles, prophets, holy men to speak to us but You God Do NOT speak to us, for we can corrupt them and hide our secret sins in the darkness from their light. God do not speak to us lest we die for Your light would reveal our filth.
A
Salvation through grace and faith are eternal commandments and convenant... the laws in Deuteronomy were temporal. Moses even states it that the commandments were for that generation NOT their children's "know today that I do not speak with your children" temporal until the fulfillment was accomplished. The Promise was given to the SEED not the seeds of Abraham.
Deuteronomy 11
1 “Therefore you shall love the LORD your God, and keep His charge, His statutes, His judgments, and His commandments always. 2 Know today that I do not speak with your children, who have not known and who have not seen the chastening of the LORD your God, His greatness and His mighty hand and His outstretched arm—
contrast that with these words:
Jeremiah 31:30-34
New King James Version (NKJV)
30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity; every man who eats the sour grapes, his teeth shall be set on edge.
31 “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them,[a] says the LORD. 33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”
once a covenant is broken by one party is the other obligated to keep it? Or are they held to the terms of the NEW covenant that the injured party renews with the offending party?
Deuteronomy 11
1 “Therefore you shall love the LORD your God, and keep His charge, His statutes, His judgments, and His commandments always. 2 Know today that I do not speak with your children, who have not known and who have not seen the chastening of the LORD your God, His greatness and His mighty hand and His outstretched arm—
contrast that with these words:
Jeremiah 31:30-34
New King James Version (NKJV)
30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity; every man who eats the sour grapes, his teeth shall be set on edge.
31 “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them,[a] says the LORD. 33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”
once a covenant is broken by one party is the other obligated to keep it? Or are they held to the terms of the NEW covenant that the injured party renews with the offending party?
Originally Posted by notIbutChrist
They went to paradise were Jesus went after His death and gave them the gospel/preached to those in prison. They went through Jesus to get to the Father
They went to paradise were Jesus went after His death and gave them the gospel/preached to those in prison. They went through Jesus to get to the Father
Originally Posted by notIbutChrist
They went to paradise were Jesus went after His death and gave them the gospel/preached to those in prison. They went through Jesus to get to the Father
They went to paradise were Jesus went after His death and gave them the gospel/preached to those in prison. They went through Jesus to get to the Father
1st Peter 4:6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
Just to go further with this point, I think the 'Law' was also given to us to show us a standard of holy living. If it was not a standard of holy living then it would also have no value in showing us how guilty we are because there would be nothing holy to transgress. So I think the purpose of the 'Law' was twofold - to show us how guilty we were and also to show us a standard of holy living we can conform our lives to.
A
born AGAIN, PAST lifetime. die with Christ, rise with CHrist.... hmmm wonder if any of that means anything?
1 Peter 4
1 Therefore, since Christ suffered for us[a] in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind, for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles—when we walked in lewdness, lusts, drunkenness, revelries, drinking parties, and abominable idolatries. 4 In regard to these, they think it strange that you do not run with them in the same flood of dissipation, speaking evil of you. 5 They will give an account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. 6 For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
those who spend their time in the flesh after the lusts of men are not doing the will of God, and God will judge between the two not in outward appearances but by the inward heart. men who live in the flesh will speak evil of you but God judges according to the spirit.
1 Peter 4
1 Therefore, since Christ suffered for us[a] in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind, for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles—when we walked in lewdness, lusts, drunkenness, revelries, drinking parties, and abominable idolatries. 4 In regard to these, they think it strange that you do not run with them in the same flood of dissipation, speaking evil of you. 5 They will give an account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. 6 For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
those who spend their time in the flesh after the lusts of men are not doing the will of God, and God will judge between the two not in outward appearances but by the inward heart. men who live in the flesh will speak evil of you but God judges according to the spirit.
Before Christ's Arrival:
The FATHER, told the people to go forth & multiply; Love Each Other & ALWAYS give Praise unto ME, YAH.
The people did NOT comply: So The Father, ADDED The Law as a Nescessaty, WITH the promise of a coming Messiah.
Israel whined & complained to GOD THE FATHER that they desired a king, just like all the other Gentiles/Nations had.
So because they doubted The Father's PROMISE, of the coming King of Israel; He gave them a king in His WRATH
So before Christ/Yeshua; It was the same then as it is NOW.
Love GOD The Father; Love Each Other; Obey The Commandments Forever and Obey whatever Statutes & Ordinances that Christ didn't nail to the cross with Him.
And MOST Imporantantly: BELEIVE in The coming Messiah; MELCHEZIDEK/JESUS THE CHRIST/YESHUA MESSIAH
THE SON of Get Over Death; The FATHER, YAHAVAH.
JESUS/YESHUA being THE ONLY way to Him; Not that many religous christian's seem to care.
About THE FATHER; Its ALL The Son how very sad it IS.
Forever in Christ
The FATHER, told the people to go forth & multiply; Love Each Other & ALWAYS give Praise unto ME, YAH.
The people did NOT comply: So The Father, ADDED The Law as a Nescessaty, WITH the promise of a coming Messiah.
Israel whined & complained to GOD THE FATHER that they desired a king, just like all the other Gentiles/Nations had.
So because they doubted The Father's PROMISE, of the coming King of Israel; He gave them a king in His WRATH
So before Christ/Yeshua; It was the same then as it is NOW.
Love GOD The Father; Love Each Other; Obey The Commandments Forever and Obey whatever Statutes & Ordinances that Christ didn't nail to the cross with Him.
And MOST Imporantantly: BELEIVE in The coming Messiah; MELCHEZIDEK/JESUS THE CHRIST/YESHUA MESSIAH
THE SON of Get Over Death; The FATHER, YAHAVAH.
JESUS/YESHUA being THE ONLY way to Him; Not that many religous christian's seem to care.
About THE FATHER; Its ALL The Son
how very sad it IS.Forever in Christ
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[/QUOTE]
Jesus was also called out of Egypt, yes but he was faithful up to the end. Therefore he has recieved his reward by the ressurrection. This depicts Israel coming out of Egypt. But Israel failed. They end up worshiping Baalim (Jesus didn't)
You quoted Hosea 11:1 but you failed to quote verse 2.
Hosea 11:1 When Israel wa a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt. (Israel)
Hosea 11:2 As they called them, so they went from them: they sacrificed unto Ballim, and burned incense (this did not happen to Jesus) to graven images.
Jesus was also called out of Egypt, yes but he was faithful up to the end. Therefore he has recieved his reward by the ressurrection. This depicts Israel coming out of Egypt. But Israel failed. They end up worshiping Baalim (Jesus didn't)
You quoted Hosea 11:1 but you failed to quote verse 2.
Hosea 11:1 When Israel wa a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt. (Israel)
Hosea 11:2 As they called them, so they went from them: they sacrificed unto Ballim, and burned incense (this did not happen to Jesus) to graven images.
C
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by cronjecj
The word says that Christ was slain before the foundation of the world Revelation 13:8 (KJV)
All the saints in the OT was saved because they believed God, through Christ they were saved.
Moses, Isaiah and all the prophets knew about the messiah which was still to come.
We have an E-Sword moment lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by cronjecj
The word says that Christ was slain before the foundation of the world Revelation 13:8 (KJV)
All the saints in the OT was saved because they believed God, through Christ they were saved.
Moses, Isaiah and all the prophets knew about the messiah which was still to come.
We have an E-Sword moment lol