Can someone lose their salvation?

[ChosenbyHim]

How can someone lose their salvation? How does someone know if they've lost their salvation.

Selenah, this question is quite a popular one these days. The answer to your question is no. Absolutely not. A Christian, well a TRUE Christian and not just someone who professes to be one, but someone who has actually been truly converted by the power of God cannot lose their salvation. Even the big sin of suicide cannot cause the true Christian to lose his/her salvation. I am going to give you two links to give you some proof that is backed up by Scripture to prove what I am saying. These two links will take you to two great sermons on this important and very vital issue. The links are below:

Eternal Security by Bryan Denlinger:

Eternally Secure - SermonAudio.com


What Happens When A Christian Commits Suicide? by Bryan Denlinger:

What Happens When A Christian Commits Suicide? - SermonAudio.com





In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, - Ephesians 1:13 (Holy Bible)


And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. - Ephesians 4:30 (Holy Bible)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

salvation is by grace, but through faith...

if one truly stops having faith, then they have forfeited their salvation

How can someone lose faith? Jesus said faith as small as a mustard seed can move mountains. I have lost faith many times. even questioned my own salvation ( a trick satans loves to use to take us out of the battle we all are a part of) But as scripture makes perfectly clear,

if we are faithless, he remains faithfull, for he can not deny himself. For God to take back the eternal life he gave us based on grace, he would have to deny his promise, and thus deny himself.

this is different than denying him, a person who denies him is against him, or an antichrist. John speaks of them in his first epistle, and shows us they were "never of us" God did not take their salvation back, nore did they hand their salvation back to God. they never possessed it!

I might lack faith. But I would never totally lose it. (ever seen a mustard seed?)

No one who has tasted in reality Gods love and forgiveness and seen his mighty work could ever lose faith completely. I can not believe it!

 

[AnandaHya]

a Christian would not commit suicide because they would recognize that God has plans for them.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

a Christian would not commit suicide because they would recognize that God has plans for them.

what?? Thats like saying a Christian can not sin, because they would recognize the result of that sin and how bad it will be for them.

 

[AnandaHya]

what?? Thats like saying a Christian can not sin, because they would recognize the result of that sin and how bad it will be for them.

Really?

I said WOULD not kill themselves but if a Christian recognized the result of sin, then they would NOT do it either. It is out ignorance and lack of self control that many sin. God is able to enable people to resist sin and overcome temptation. do people always past the test? sadly no but the HOLY SPIRIT intercedes and picks the up when they stumble and tells them to keep walking forward towards that upward calling of God.

I strongly believe that God controls life and death and is able to keep alive His children and keep them from such despair as to take their own life.

Why would someone who has the HOLY SPIRIT, God's LOVE and Peace in their heart consider killing themselves? does that thought come from God? or from the Enemy?

to kill oneself is to take into your hands the power that GOD should only have,

It is wrong and tell someone that its ok that they are still saved, just encourages someone who is weak to go ahead and do it. that can be used to refer to either sin or suicide which is a sin that can not be repented of because the person is DEAD both physically and spiritually.

No rather one should ask if they were saved in the first place. one should ask the DO YOU have the Holy Spirit within you? Do you have a new heart seeking God's righteousness? Do you truly know what it means to be a child of God, adding to your faith virtue, godliness, self control, brotherly kindness, and love?
Do you have God's peace and joy within you?

one does not put a bandaid upon a deadly wound. one cleanses it FIRST through the baptism of repentance and then one wraps it in the bonds of love, through the Gospel of grace

 

[Red33]

The believer that loves the Lord is aware of the fact of the old sin nature within and the importance to hide the word in the heart and to have the heart established in grace. There is no desire for sin even though we have weaknesses in the flesh. Should we continually strive in the flesh against sin when it occupies us to the point of worry and fretting its possibility and potential? NO! That is not resting in Christ and the finished work. We walk by faith and if we stumble our heart is convicted and we confess it to God right away and walk in the newness of life through grace.

This is how we continue in our fellowship with Christ and with one another. We should have a place in our heart where we fear sin because that will surely lead to sin as easily as the law can strengthen sin. Our attitude of faith toward sin rests in what Christ has done to sin and we reckon ourselves to be dead to sin even when we are guilty of it. We must always put ourselves in a place through humility to receive grace so that God can exalt us and lift us up. Salvation is never an issue with God because the Son has secured that for the believer so that he can grow in grace and knowledge of Christ and walk by faith in the promises of God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Really?

I said WOULD not kill themselves but if a Christian recognized the result of sin, then they would NOT do it either.

lol, if this were true we would be sinless. You telling me you no longer sin? Guess what, you know the result of the sin is when you do it. so why do you still do it?

It is out ignorance and lack of self control that many sin. God is able to enable people to resist sin and overcome temptation. do people always past the test? sadly no but the HOLY SPIRIT intercedes and picks the up when they stumble and tells them to keep walking forward towards that upward calling of God.

Unfortunately, for the pour child of God who is unable to resist the sin of taking his own life. He has lost his chance to walk forward anymore. But they are still my spiritual sibling.

I strongly believe that God controls life and death and is able to keep alive His children and keep them from such despair as to take their own life.

God will not remove free will. If we are set on taking our life. God is not going to force us from doing it anymore than he is going to stop me from telling a lie, or lusting after someone or something. They are all sin, and we all fall. I believe it is harder for a child of God, but not impossible to take his own life.

Why would someone who has the HOLY SPIRIT, God's LOVE and Peace in their heart consider killing themselves? does that thought come from God? or from the Enemy?

It comes from the flesh. It comes from satan and his lies. What if a child of God got around some faulty teachings, and is not able to learn the truths. And the lies he has been told is a part of his downfall?? I have seen many a person trapped in legalsim take his or her life, why? because they can't match up, why bother trying. My life is a failure. Oh, and all the struggles and pain, it is because of my sin, and since I can't stop sinning, I have no place to turn..

Why do you think I HATE LEGALISM SO MUCH!!! I HAVE SEEN IT, and I grew up in it!

to kill oneself is to take into your hands the power that GOD should only have,

To commit fornication is to take into my hands the power of someone elses body which only God should have, the same could be said of any sin. Which is my point.

It is wrong and tell someone that its ok that they are still saved, just encourages someone who is weak to go ahead and do it. that can be used to refer to either sin or suicide which is a sin that can not be repented of because the person is DEAD both physically and spiritually.

if I am talking to a brother. I am not even going to mention salvation. Why> It is already sealed. I am going to show him the love of God, and try to help him. It is a danger to mention salvation. Why sould someone say, go ahead, you will still be saved? No one I know would say this, even though we believe it to be true. Think sis, what your saying makes no sense, and no one in their right mind would say such a thing.

No rather one should ask if they were saved in the first place. one should ask the DO YOU have the Holy Spirit within you? Do you have a new heart seeking God's righteousness? Do you truly know what it means to be a child of God, adding to your faith virtue, godliness, self control, brotherly kindness, and love?
Do you have God's peace and joy within you?

one does not put a bandaid upon a deadly wound. one cleanses it FIRST through the baptism of repentance and then one wraps it in the bonds of love, through the Gospel of grace

Well, If I did not know the person. yes I would say this. But if I know him. Saw his salvation. Saw the fruits of his faith. Then saw him fall. I would not need to ask this, I already know he has tasted Gods love.

Again, you need to think of what your saying. Satan is powerfull. Do you think he goes after unbelievers? You don't know him very well then. He goes after children of God. And he CAN and does have victory. And he can and does talk gods children into taking their own life as they listen to him and lose faith in God for WHATEVER REASON. And guess what. That child is removed from the battle, no longer able to be used by God, Satan has a victory. Why would satan have one of his children commit suicide or talk him into it? They are not hurting him. The enemy does not attack himself, he would be hurting himself.

 

[Zilla64007]

Satan's power is limited... and he's not the only enemy you're fighting.

you're also fighting your own flesh... something you CAN resist

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Satan's power is limited... and he's not the only enemy you're fighting.

you're also fighting your own flesh... something you CAN resist

I assume this is directed against me, if I am wrong forgive me,

Satan is limited, But he is not powerless. Anyone who thinks so is in danger himself of coming under his spell. If he did not have so much power. God would not have spent so much time warning us against his power.

As for me? I fight my flesh every day, Just like paul did. Just like WE ALL HAVE TO. If your not fighting your flesh, you are also in danger.

Forgive me if I am so sick of these holier than thou comments and threads that give God a bad name, and are nothing but attempts to boast our own righteousness, and inability to see our own sin, and how truely unworthy we ALL are. no matter who we are. God called a murdurous adulterer a man after his own heart. Who am I to say I am better than that man?

 

[Zilla64007]

i never said he was powerless... i just said he's not the only thing we are fighting.

and with your OSAS, you are giving this "holier than thou" attitude, with saying you can sin all you want and still be saved... this antinomian jargon is disgusting

 

[Tombo]

i never said he was powerless... i just said he's not the only thing we are fighting.

and with your OSAS, you are giving this "holier than thou" attitude, with saying you can sin all you want and still be saved... this antinomian jargon is disgusting

No one who holds to the biblical doctrine of, once saved always saved, ever teaches that we can sin all we want. I have never taught it, and I know eternally-gratefull has not taught it either. Show me one post of anyone teaching that. And if you think that's what this doctrine encourages, you are wrong in your understanding of it.
You have never follwed your argument (that we can lose our salvation) to it's logical conclusion. If we are given eternal life when we're saved, how can one lose eternal life??? Are you saying that God is lying when He told us that we have eternal life. Eternal means you can't lose it, or eternal doesn't mean eternal.

Tom

 

[IMINJC]

eternally-gratefull



YOU SAID: God called a murdurous adulterer a man after his own heart. Who am I to say I am better than that man?


You would be better than that man if He continued to Murder and commit adultery even after God judged Him for it.

 

[IMINJC]

Tombo


YOU SAID: No one who holds to the biblical doctrine of, once saved always saved, ever teaches that we can sin all we want.


Brother Tombo...can you expound on this for me please.

 

[AnandaHya]

EG there is too much to address in your post and I haven't the time right now. today is one of few days my husband is actually off work so when he wakes up we are going to have a family day.

However, here is one thought:

What would you say to someone who is fighting suicidal thoughts?

Don't worry you'll be saved even if you kill yourself?

Personally I would tell them they have strongholds in their mind that are warring against the knowledge of God and need to pray, read the Bible and talk to someone in order to tear them down.

That head knowledge is different from heart knowledge. they can "know" the results of sin in their heads but may not "KNOW" and Believe in their hearts. In like manner they can KNOW about grace and joy and peace but not have it abiding in their hearts.

IF people knew the results of their actions before doing them or stopped and prayed before speaking, how often would people NOT do it or stop their tongue from speaking the words?

Anyway I hope we all seek wisdom from above and not from anything below

James 3
13 Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show by good conduct that his works are done in the meekness of wisdom. 14 But if you have bitter envy and self-seeking in your hearts, do not boast and lie against the truth. 15 This wisdom does not descend from above, but is earthly, sensual, demonic. 16 For where envy and self-seeking exist, confusion and every evil thing are there. 17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy. 18 Now the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.

 

[Grandpa]

i never said he was powerless... i just said he's not the only thing we are fighting.

and with your OSAS, you are giving this "holier than thou" attitude, with saying you can sin all you want and still be saved... this antinomian jargon is disgusting

That just comes from your own misconceptions. The bible says salvation is by grace and not of works. Obviously losing salvation would be by grace and not of works too. This cannot be the case because grace gives and does not take away.

What would it be called to give someone a gift and then if they didn't work to keep it, it would be taken away? It couldn't be called a gift, could it? It would have to be called something else.

We are saved by the Power of God Himself. Not by ourselves or by our actions or our works. Thank God for that!!!

 

[Zilla64007]

eternal life is eternal life, but the possession of it is not eternal... our possession of it is based upon our faith

OSAS would say and does say otherwise

 

[Zilla64007]

That just comes from your own misconceptions. The bible says salvation is by grace and not of works. Obviously losing salvation would be by grace and not of works too. This cannot be the case because grace gives and does not take away.

What would it be called to give someone a gift and then if they didn't work to keep it, it would be taken away? It couldn't be called a gift, could it? It would have to be called something else.

We are saved by the Power of God Himself. Not by ourselves or by our actions or our works. Thank God for that!!!

by the power of God THROUGH FAITH!!

1 PETER 1:5 SAYS WE ARE SAVED THROUGH FAITH!
if you quit having faith, you GIVE UP YOUR SALVATION

and if you deny Jesus Christ, He will deny you
2 Timothy 2:12

some of you truly are blind

 

[eternally-gratefull]

i never said he was powerless... i just said he's not the only thing we are fighting.

and with your OSAS, you are giving this "holier than thou" attitude, with saying you can sin all you want and still be saved... this antinomian jargon is disgusting

You have it all wrong my friend. A licentious gospel is no gospel at all. One does not have to be licentious to believe in OSAS.

I do not believe I can sin all I want. I believe I will always be a sinner and in need of grace. A HUGE DIFFERENCE.

What you teach is a works based Gospel. No matter how you stack it up. You are saved by your works, and not by grace, anyone who does not teach OSAS is teaching salvation must be earned and it is not freely given. Period! And that my friend is disgusting, Because it is leading people astray to a false gospel. which will not save anyone!

 

[AnandaHya]

how can you quit having faith if Faith is a gift from God?

James 3
5 Even so the tongue is a little member and boasts great things.

See how great a forest a little fire kindles! 6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity. The tongue is so set among our members that it defiles the whole body, and sets on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire by hell.

Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.

anyway my posts were addressing someone who might be suicidal, but I see the conversation changed directions again addressing a different topic..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

eternally-gratefull



YOU SAID: God called a murdurous adulterer a man after his own heart. Who am I to say I am better than that man?


You would be better than that man if He continued to Murder and commit adultery even after God judged Him for it.

Hmm. Did David divorce ALL his wives except for the first one he married? Well scripture shows he had other children by his adulterous lover. I guess he did continue in sin. and he continued in it till he died.

As for murder? we don't know if he killed someone wrongfully after this (either by self or by his army) so we do not know if he continued in this.

The point was. he was a sinner saved by grace just like I am. Who am I, or anyone else to say we are better than him?

Don't people read the word with an open mind anymore?