Clean Animals and Unclean Animals

WomanLovesTX · May 15, 2012

It's so sad to see people making lists and setting up rules and regulations again. I know some here are just trying to put people back under the law because of misunderstandings about national Israel, millenial reigns, and such. But don't fall for it. Anyone who puts themselves under the law again are bound to keep the whole law. If they fail in one point they have broken the whole law. They fail to see why Jesus had to come and fulfill the law on our behalf, and to take the punishment of the law that we deserved. He did it because we couldn't. Please, don't profane the work of Jesus with your filthy works. BTW, I am not speaking to the author of this thread, I don't know what she believes on those issues. But I hope she is not keeping the dietary laws in order to please God, it will do nothing but deny what our Lord Jesus has done to fulfill all of those laws.
God bless.

Tom

Tombo, have you read Ezekiel 40-48?

jonathanbchristian · May 15, 2012

ACTS 10:15 is proof it does not matter what you eat.

Laodicea · May 15, 2012

jonathanbchristian said:

Are you saying that we can eat anything we want?

Laodicea · May 15, 2012

It is good to go to the beginning.

Genesis 2:7
(7) And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Man was formed from the dust of the ground

Genesis 1:29-30
(29) And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
(30) And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.

Just as man was created from the ground, God gave man food which comes from the ground.

1Christianwarrior316 · May 15, 2012

Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well, Fare ye well.

Gal 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
Gal 2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Gal 2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
Gal 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

lydever91 · May 15, 2012

If we are not supposed to follow the Food Laws because it is in the OT, then do we not follow the
10 Commandments as well because it is in the OT?

Laodicea · May 15, 2012

lydever91 said:

Christ died to make us clean not to make unclean food clean. And yes we are to keep the 10 commandments because we love God.

Tombo · May 15, 2012

lydever91 said:

We are only bound to the moral laws of the Bible, which would include the ten commandments. Yet we don't do anything to try to earn our salvation, it is all of God's grace. When saved, we follow God out of love, not fear of punishment.
God bless.

Tom

lydever91 · May 15, 2012

As said earlier, the animals are clean, they are used for purposes that would make them unclean to eat. Their purpose hasn't changed since the Law has been given.

Bornfromabove · May 15, 2012

Its probably a good rule of thumb to avoid all scavengers.

1Christianwarrior316 · May 15, 2012

lydever91 said:

Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

It is my opinion that by following the letter of the law we bear false witness of the truth that Christ has redeemed us from the law, Gal 3:13. We have been made ministers of the New Testament, and not of the letter, but of the Spirit, the letter killeth, but the Spirit giveth life, 2Cor 3:6. And if we are led of the Spirit we are not under the law, Gal 5:18. If we are still under the law then it would be required of us to stone disobedient children, or stone an adulterous woman, or require and eye for an eye, etc. etc.
As the Father loves us he showed this love in Christ Jesus and our Lord showed his love for all mankind and it is by this same type of love as loving our neighbor as ourselves we are fulfilling the law.

Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Did you disregard the verses I posted above? Consider the following commentaries on Gal 2:12.

Albert Barnes’ Notes on the Bible
Gal 2:12 - He did eat with the Gentiles - Peter had been taught that in the remarkable vision which he saw as recorded in Acts 10. He had learned that God designed to break down the wall of partition between the Jews and the Gentiles, and he familiarly associated with them, and partook with them of their food. He evidently disregarded the special laws of the Jews about meats and drinks, and partook of the common food which was in use among the Gentiles. Thus he showed his belief that all the race was henceforward to be regarded as on a level, and that the special institutions of the Jews were not to be considered as binding, or to be imposed on others.

John Gill’s Exposition on the Entire Bible
Gal 2:12 -did eat with the Gentiles; which is to be understood, not of eating at the Lord's table with them, but at their own tables: he knew that the distinction of meats was now laid aside, and that nothing was common and unclean of itself, and that every creature of God was good, and not to be refused if received with thankfulness; wherefore he made use of his Christian liberty, and ate such food dressed in such manner as the Gentiles did, without any regard to the laws and ceremonies of the Jews; and in this he did well, for hereby he declared his sense of things, that the ceremonial law was abolished, that not only the Gentiles are not obliged to it, but even the Jews were freed from it, and that the observance of it was far from being necessary to salvation:

Matthew Henry’s Commentary on the Whole Bible
1. Peter's fault. When he came among the Gentile churches, he complied with them, and did eat with them, though they were not circumcised, agreeably to the instructions which were given in particular to him (Acts 10), when he was warned by the heavenly vision to call nothing common or unclean. But, when there came some Jewish Christians from Jerusalem, he grew more shy of the Gentiles, only to humour those of the circumcision and for fear of giving them offence, which doubtless was to the great grief and discouragement of the Gentile churches. Then he withdrew, and separated himself. His fault herein had a bad influence upon others, for the other Jews also dissembled with him; though before they might be better disposed, yet now, from his example, they took on them to scruple eating with the Gentiles, and pretended they could not in conscience do it, because they were not circumcised. And (would you think it?) Barnabas himself, one of the apostles of the Gentiles, and one who had been instrumental in planting and watering the churches of the Gentiles, was carried away with their dissimulation. Here note, (1.) The weakness and inconstancy of the best of men, when left to themselves, and how apt they are to falter in their duty to God, out of an undue regard to the pleasing of men. And, (2.) The great force of bad examples, especially the examples of great men and good men, such as are in reputation for wisdom and honour.
2. The rebuke which Paul gave him for his fault. Notwithstanding Peter's character, yet, when he observes him thus behaving himself to the great prejudice both of the truth of the gospel and the peace of the church, he is not afraid to reprove him for it. Paul adhered resolutely to his principles, when others faltered in theirs; he was as good a Jew as any of them (for he was a Hebrew of the Hebrews), but he would magnify his office as the apostle of the Gentiles, and therefore would not see them discouraged and trampled upon. When he saw that they walked not uprightly, according to the truth of the gospel - that they did not live up to that principle which the gospel taught, and which they had professed to own and embrace, namely, that by the death of Christ the partition-wall between Jew and Gentile was taken down, and the observance of the law of Moses was no longer in force - when he observed this, as Peter's offence was public, so he publicly reproved him for it: He said unto him before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of the Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

Act 11:6 Upon the which when I had fastened mine eyes, I considered, and saw fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
Act 11:7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat.
Act 11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.
Act 11:9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

The above verses prove that what was once considered unclean was cleansed by God and when Peter argued the voice from heaven corrected him. Scripture tell us that every creature of God is good and nothing to be refused which means rejected as common and unclean, as long as it is received with thanksgiving, 1Ti 4:4.

If you being led of the Spirit are not under the law, why would you want to bound yourself to the law when Christ has redeemed us from the law?

In Christ, 1Christianwarrior316

lydever91 · May 15, 2012

1Christianwarrior316 said:

Matthew Henry’s Commentary on the Whole Bible
1. Peter's fault. When he came among the Gentile churches, he complied with them, and did eat with them, though they were not circumcised, agreeably to the instructions which were given in particular to him (Acts 10), when he was warned by the heavenly vision to call nothing common or unclean. But, when there came some Jewish Christians from Jerusalem, he grew more shy of the Gentiles, only to humour those of the circumcision and for fear of giving them offence, which doubtless was to the great grief and discouragement of the Gentile churches. Then he withdrew, and separated himself. His fault herein had a bad influence upon others, for the other Jews also dissembled with him; though before they might be better disposed, yet now, from his example, they took on them to scruple eating with the Gentiles, and pretended they could not in conscience do it, because they were not circumcised. And (would you think it?) Barnabas himself, one of the apostles of the Gentiles, and one who had been instrumental in planting and watering the churches of the Gentiles, was carried away with their dissimulation. Here note, (1.) The weakness and inconstancy of the best of men, when left to themselves, and how apt they are to falter in their duty to God, out of an undue regard to the pleasing of men. And, (2.) The great force of bad examples, especially the examples of great men and good men, such as are in reputation for wisdom and honour.
2. The rebuke which Paul gave him for his fault. Notwithstanding Peter's character, yet, when he observes him thus behaving himself to the great prejudice both of the truth of the gospel and the peace of the church, he is not afraid to reprove him for it. Paul adhered resolutely to his principles, when others faltered in theirs; he was as good a Jew as any of them (for he was a Hebrew of the Hebrews), but he would magnify his office as the apostle of the Gentiles, and therefore would not see them discouraged and trampled upon. When he saw that they walked not uprightly, according to the truth of the gospel - that they did not live up to that principle which the gospel taught, and which they had professed to own and embrace, namely, that by the death of Christ the partition-wall between Jew and Gentile was taken down, and the observance of the law of Moses was no longer in force - when he observed this, as Peter's offence was public, so he publicly reproved him for it: He said unto him before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of the Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

I agree with this commentary as it tells you the reason Peter left, because they were uncircumcised and not because of what they were having for dinner. You've missed the entire meaning of what God was teaching Peter about thinking the uncircumcised were unclean. Again, this is not a heaven or hell matter, don't make it one. This is for those who see His food law as a gift and not a restriction nor regulation, just rules I choose and love to live by and I am free indeed, not in bondage to sicknesses from eating scavengers.

God Bless

Tombo · May 15, 2012

lydever91 said:

I was going to invite you have a nice vulture dinner with me, too. Your loss

.
But seriously, if you only follow those dietary laws because you think they're
healthy, and not out of a sense of disobedience, then by all means do. It is only
those who follow the OT regulations in order to be saved that I have a problem with.
God bless.

Tom

1Christianwarrior316 · May 15, 2012

lydever91 said:

Actually I did not miss any message. While in part is does have to do with the uncircumcised, it also has to do what God has cleansed due to the reference of fourfooted beasts, wild beasts, creeping things, fowls of the air, slay and eat, and nothing unclean entering Peters mouth.
If you have certain rules that you choose to live by than by all means live by them. But I was understanding by your post which said,"If we are not supposed to follow the Food Laws because it is in the OT, then do we not follow the10 Commandments as well because it is in the OT?" that your were insinuating that even though we apply the 10 Commandments of the OT in our lives that we are to apply the OT food laws to our lives also.
If I misunderstood this then please forgive me. But as scripture says "why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as the Jews?

In Christ, 1Christianwarrior316

loveme1 · May 16, 2012

How deflating it is to see how people will use scripture to allow themselves to eat that which is unclean, instead of being obedient to Yahvah God.

What is with all this, don't do it out of obedience talk?

Being under grace as gone to some of your heads and not heart.

What gives any one this type of hope?

Hope she is not, because you are not?

Tombo · May 16, 2012

loveme1 said:

You are a person who is under the law, and you want to lead others away from Jesus Christ and back under the law. You misunderstand verses in Ezekiel and Revelation, that are symbolic, and contrive a whole convoluted teaching about national Israel, and Jesus coming back to reign on this sin cursed earth for 1000 years with sacrifices and cermonies being followed again. THAT IS FALSE.
This is why you flaunt Hebrew names, you think you will partake of that bogus 1000 year reign. You take things so literally that you can't even see how it contradicts so much of the Bible.
Why don't you pray for truth and wisdom, instead of trying to sound wise with sayings like, "Hope she is not, because you are not?" What does that even mean?

Tom

hislastwalk · May 16, 2012

"For if you are trying to make yourselves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God's grace." -Galatians 5:4

What is Paul saying? He is simply saying; you can't have the law AND grace. Romans 7 talks about this. Paul used the analogy that if a woman is married, and her husband (The Law) dies, then she is free to marry a new husband.. (Christ) now, wouldn't trying to keep both be considered adultery? According to Paul's analogy.

"I do not treat the grace of God as meaningless. For if keeping the law could make us right with God, then there was no need for Christ to die." -Galatians 2:21

Paul quit trying to follow the law: "For when I tried to keep the law, it condemned me. So I died to the law--I stopped trying to meet all its requirements--so that I might live for God." -Galatians 2:19

Tombo · May 16, 2012

hislastwalk said:

Excellent post. But we are not teaching antinomianism (in the sense of abandoning the moral principles laid down in the OT) but we do speak against trying to keep the ceremonial and sacrificial laws. While no one now keeps the sacrificial laws (I hope!

), there are many who teach that it will be reinstated at a later time, during the millenial reign, which is flase. Jesus would have no reason in the world to come back to this sin cursed earth, and set back up what He Himself tore down for us. I worry about people who want to follow certain dietary laws, Sabbaths, etc. Those things were a shadow of the good things to come and were fulfilled in Christ.
God bless.

Tom

loveme1 · May 16, 2012

Tombo said:

If only you would stop and listen to your own advice and seek truth.

I pray the day never comes when I pray for your idea of wisdom.

Do not accuse another of leading people away from the Messiah Yahshua.

You have accused me of something of which I am not guilty of.

I'm under Yahvah God and Yahshua the Messiah always and forever.

loveme1 · May 16, 2012

hislastwalk said:

Your understanding of which Law people were trying to make themselves right with Yahvah God and the 10 commandments.

Seek understanding of Ceremonial Law and the Commandments of Yahvah God.

Throwing these verses around without understanding is in vain...

Clean Animals and Unclean Animals

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