Revelation 20:1-10 discussion

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#81
So the FURIOUS REBUKES aren't enough. The 7 bowls will be even more furious than this?
Then if so still, THEY WILL KNOW THAT HE IS THE LORD, correct?
Amazingly. They still do not come to him, for when Christ returns, he destroys them. Jesus said the suffering and tribulation would be so severe if he did not intervine no flesh (not just human flesh, any flesh) would survive, but for the sake of the elect, he puts and end to it with his return.. So tell me, when did Christ return and put an end to it if all these things have already happened?

so again, what does this have to do with redemption, does the great suffering of people in the last days cause one to get saved?
 
Dec 1, 2012
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#82

Isreal will have no kingdom in Heaven. It will be a kingdom of all people. Not to mention. Jesus knew what they were talking about (an earthly kingdom) if he wanted them to know it was heaven, he would have told them

All people ARE Israel.
 
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1still_waters

Guest
#83

Isreal will have no kingdom in Heaven. It will be a kingdom of all people. Not to mention. Jesus knew what they were talking about (an earthly kingdom) if he wanted them to know it was heaven, he would have told them
New heavens.
New EARTH.

In the renewed Earth.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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#84
Is that your place, Zone? Lord forgive me for my envy.
hi Bookends.
no, but mine is nearly identical. that's why i selected that one.
the West Coast is beautiful...i'm looking out the glass door at deer in the snow right now. and they're lookin' at me.
they want me to throw them apples:eek: < spoiled brats.

could someone do me a favor and embed this video?

Dog Flip - YouTube! <click

i think Grandpa left something at my place....and i dunno whose soup that was:)

love zone
 
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Jun 24, 2010
3,822
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#85
lol, thanks for the warning. I am just trying to give another opinion. people are free to choose what they want. This is not a MAJOR doctrine. so not worth getting all huffy and puffy over what people believe :)
Your wrong and it is major in every aspect from the first coming of Christ to the great white throne judgment. If we get this wrong which involves Israel, the mystery of the church, the resurrections, the judgments, the tribulation period, apostasy, the wrath of God, two great battles, the 1,000 year reign and what God does with Satan, the beast, the false prophet and those that take the mark of the beast, then what in the world makes you think that we have the right gospel and the right understanding about the cross and blood of Christ and how God justifies the sinner and the kind of salvation we have been given and the role grace plays in our life through the word and the Holy Spirit? The scriptures are all inspired and make up one book giving us one faith and one hope which we can not add to or take away from or even privately interpret. It is not only a MAJOR doctrine but is essential to our faith and what we believe about God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ. Should I even have to say this to believers who profess to have the Spirit that is to guide them into ALL truth?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#86
Your wrong and it is major in every aspect from the first coming of Christ to the great white throne judgment. If we get this wrong which involves Israel, the mystery of the church, the resurrections, the judgments, the tribulation period, apostasy, the wrath of God, two great battles, the 1,000 year reign and what God does with Satan, the beast, the false prophet and those that take the mark of the beast, then what in the world makes you think that we have the right gospel and the right understanding about the cross and blood of Christ and how God justifies the sinner and the kind of salvation we have been given and the role grace plays in our life through the word and the Holy Spirit? The scriptures are all inspired and make up one book giving us one faith and one hope which we can not add to or take away from or even privately interpret. It is not only a MAJOR doctrine but is essential to our faith and what we believe about God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ. Should I even have to say this to believers who profess to have the Spirit that is to guide them into ALL truth?
No, I am not wrong. No one will be saved or not saved because they believe one way or the other.

Scripture does not say believe in the last day 1000 year reign of Christ and the return of Isreal to her land and you will be saved.


what makes us think we got the gospel right? Because I have brothers and sisters who all place their faith in my gospel. but we are miles apart on what we believe about this subject. Are they saved and I not, or am I saved and they are not??
even though we trust the same gospel. But differ in this doctrine>
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#87
New heavens.
New EARTH.

In the renewed Earth.
yes, but the old earth has to be destroyed first. and this happens after the events of the restoration of Isreal and end times prophesies. not before.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#88
All people ARE Israel.
No, they are not.

romans 11. How can Isreal be my enemy for the gospel, but loved for the promises? if all Israel is the church? Is the church my enemy??

The Church did not take over Isreals promises. God made an eternal covenant with them separate from the one he made with the church, based on Gods promise of a redeemer through Abraham.
 
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peterT

Guest
#89


kettle's on.
don't worry about Roger...
(he's amillennial, but he's had his shots:))



Revelation 20
The Thousand Years
1Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding in his hand the key to the bottomless pita and a great chain. 2And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, 3and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he might not deceive the nations any longer, until the thousand years were ended. After that he must be released for a little while.

4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

The Defeat of Satan
7And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison 8and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heavenb and consumed them, 10and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
So when do you think the 1000 years started Zone???
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#90
yes, but the old earth has to be destroyed first. and this happens after the events of the restoration of Isreal and end times prophesies. not before.
Only if you believe certain presuppositions. :p
 
Jun 24, 2010
3,822
19
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#91
No, I am not wrong. No one will be saved or not saved because they believe one way or the other.

Scripture does not say believe in the last day 1000 year reign of Christ and the return of Isreal to her land and you will be saved.

what makes us think we got the gospel right? Because I have brothers and sisters who all place their faith in my gospel. but we are miles apart on what we believe about this subject. Are they saved and I not, or am I saved and they are not?? even though we trust the same gospel. But differ in this doctrine>
Do you believe that all scripture is given by inspiration or not? Are we exhorted in those inspired scriptures to be all of the same mind and same judgment or not? Are we to let this mind be in us as it is in Christ Jesus or not? Can two walk together except they be agreed or not? If amillennialism was spawned from an unfruitful work of darkness should we have fellowship with that unfruitful work or not, and better yet, should we rebuke it or just let others believe it and allow it to leaven their faith? I'm being very specific, do you like that or should I water it down a little for you?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#93
Do you believe that all scripture is given by inspiration or not? Are we exhorted in those inspired scriptures to be all of the same mind and same judgment or not? Are we to let this mind be in us as it is in Christ Jesus or not? Can two walk together except they be agreed or not? If amillennialism was spawned from an unfruitful work of darkness should we have fellowship with that unfruitful work or not, and better yet, should we rebuke it or just let others believe it and allow it to leaven their faith? I'm being very specific, do you like that or should I water it down a little for you?

lol.. So God is going to condemn all those people who do not get this right? is that what your saying?

We are talking about end times things, we ALL might be wrong. hows that!
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#94
i have noticed that the narrative of revelation 20...like most of revelation's narrative...is written in the past tense until verse six...in verses six through eight john suddenly switches to the future tense...

i wonder why that is...

i doubt john did this by accident or for no reason...so maybe it is some kind of chronological hint?
 
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Abiding

Guest
#95
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvLghiF7kdw#[/video]
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#96
Your wrong and it is major in every aspect from the first coming of Christ to the great white throne judgment. If we get this wrong which involves Israel, the mystery of the church, the resurrections, the judgments, the tribulation period, apostasy, the wrath of God, two great battles, the 1,000 year reign and what God does with Satan, the beast, the false prophet and those that take the mark of the beast, then what in the world makes you think that we have the right gospel and the right understanding about the cross and blood of Christ and how God justifies the sinner and the kind of salvation we have been given and the role grace plays in our life through the word and the Holy Spirit? The scriptures are all inspired and make up one book giving us one faith and one hope which we can not add to or take away from or even privately interpret. It is not only a MAJOR doctrine but is essential to our faith and what we believe about God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ. Should I even have to say this to believers who profess to have the Spirit that is to guide them into ALL truth?

Im not following this Red are you saying that if Amil is right then your up a creek?
Do u really believe that?

Understandably it will cause a different worldview. Has a different idea who is a true jew and a true Israelite.
But to marr any fundamantal part of the gospel, our walk, or doctrines, i just cant see it happening.
What is it you see?
 
Dec 1, 2012
375
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#97
No, they are not.

romans 11. How can Isreal be my enemy for the gospel, but loved for the promises? if all Israel is the church? Is the church my enemy??

The Church did not take over Isreals promises. God made an eternal covenant with them separate from the one he made with the church, based on Gods promise of a redeemer through Abraham.

By the SAME operation that says that not for anything we have done, but for HIS name's sake.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#98
i have noticed that the narrative of revelation 20...like most of revelation's narrative...is written in the past tense until verse six...in verses six through eight john suddenly switches to the future tense...

i wonder why that is...

i doubt john did this by accident or for no reason...so maybe it is some kind of chronological hint?

the first 6 verses are not past tense. John is stating what he is seeing in order.