Not By Works

Romans 11:17-22 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, DO NOT BOAST over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of UNBELIEF, and you stand by faith. DO NOT BE ARROGANT, BUT BE AFRAID. For if God did not spare the natural branches,HE WILL NOT SPARE YOU EITHER. Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, PROVIDED THAT YOU CONTINUE in his kindness. Otherwise, YOU ALSO WILL BE CUT OFF.

Correction, I should have said, Jesus won - sin lost, excuse me.

"OSAS, "FAITH ALONE",TITHINGS OF CHRISTIANS, PROSPERITY GOSPEL ARE FALSE DOCTRINES

Matthew 19 : 16-17
16 Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, "Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?"
17 "Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments."

Romans 6 : 16
16 Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves, you are slaves to the one whom you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

THE VERSES ABOVE CLEARLY SHOW THAT OBEDIENCE IS REQUIRED TO GET ETERNAL LIFE.

ACCORDING TO PAUL, OBEDIENCE LEADS TO RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH LEADS TO HOLINESS AND THE RESULT IS ETERNAL LIFE. (Romans 6:16-22)

Matthew 13 : 22
22 The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it unfruitful.

THE RICH MAN WALKED AWAY SAD AFTER RECEIVING INSTRUCTIONS FROM OUR LORD JESUS BECAUSE HE CANNOT WALK AWAY FROM HIS OTHER MASTER WHICH IS HIS WEALTH.

Matthew 6 : 24
24 "No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.

THE RICH MAN JUST LIKE JUDAS RECEIVED THE WORD (THE SEED) AND BELIEVED (HAD FAITH) IN JESUS BUT THEY WERE DECEIVED BECAUSE OF THEIR LOVE FOR MONEY (WEALTH). THEY WERE LIKE THOSE WHO RECEIVED THE SEED THAT FELL AMONG THE THORNS.

1 Timothy 6 : 9-10
9 People who want to get rich fall into temptation and a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction.
10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

THESE TWO SITUATIONS DO SHOW H
OW THE CHRISTIANS IN THIS AGE OR GENERATION WILL WALK AWAY AND BETRAY OUR LORD JESUS.

Luke 12 : 15
15 Then he said to them, "Watch out! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; a man's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions."

Hebrews 13 : 5
5 Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, "Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you."

1 Corinthians 5 : 11
11 But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

WHO THEN INTRODUCED THE COLLECTION AND GIVING OF TITHES?

AREN'T THEY THE SAME PEOPLE WHO TAUGHT FALSE MANMADE DOCTRINES SUCH AS "OSAS" AND "FAITH ALONE SAVES"?

Matthew 7 : 15-20
15 "Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.
16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?
17 Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

Matthew 24 : 10-13
10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other,
11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.
12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold,
13 but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

GREED IS SELFISHNESS BUT THE MESSAGE OF THE CROSS IS "SELFLESS LOVE".

NO GREEDY PERSON SHALL HAVE ETERNAL LIFE.

Excuse me, I should have said Welcome back to this Thread, "not by works" sorry we were all gone for one day, and it was a thought of happiness. I guess you did not read it that way.

Please Define how you KNOW he was BAPTIZED in the SPIRIT and what is it exactly? That is the WRONG TERM, so I need to ask.

Because that is NOT what the Bible calls Baptized BY the SPIRIT into the Spiritual Body of CHRIST. The HOLY SPIRIT is the BAPTIZER, who IMMERSES US into that spiritual body of CHRIST. I do not believe it was possible that he was Born Again?

Hi BillG, cannot tell you about Watchman Nee but if you are interested in foreign missions
James Hudson Taylor is a very good read, I cut and copied this from my Christian blog.

His Church planting is an example of what can be achieved by the power of God.
He has an amazing testimony.

Canton harbor, China -1850

The Power of Prayer
Chapter one

By: James Hudson Taylor
A Retrospect - 1894

J.Hudson Taylor

The following account of some of the experiences which eventually led to the formation of the China Inland Mission, and to its taking the form in which it has been developed, first appeared in the pages of China’s Millions. Many of those who read it there asked that it might appear in separate form. Miss Guinness incorporated it in the Story of the China Inland Mission a record which contained the account of God’s goodness to the beginning of 1894. But friends still asking for it in pamphlet form, for wider distribution, this edition is brought out.

That is what the discussion from Luke 8:13 is about.

Those who believe for a while, then fall away.

12 Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13


lest they should believe and be saved.


These in the first group, had the message of the Gospel stolen out of their heart by the devil, before they could believe and be saved.

In the next group, these did in fact believe, but while being persecuted, they departed from Christ, and no longer believed, choosing to save their natural life.

The context of that time involves unbelieving Jews, persecuting their fellow countrymen who are believers in Christ Jesus, in order to turn them back to Judaism.

Judaism is a religion that rejects Jesus as Messiah, claiming He is a false prophet.

They are in the process of rebuilding the third Temple in Jerusalem, because they believe if they build it, their “messiah” will come, whom they believe is alive on earth today.

We know from the scriptures that this Temple is one of the signs Jesus taught us to watch for, to know His coming is at hand.

He said -

Those who endure to the end, will be saved. Matthew 24:13


JPT

So you believe a Christian does not have to continue to believe, to the end, to be saved?


They can reject Christ, and convert to Judaism or Islam, while being persecuted, and on the Day of Judgement still be saved, even though the no longer believed?


Please just answer yes or no, so we all can see and know where you stand.


JPT

1 Timothy 6 : 3-8
3 If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching,
4 he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions
5 and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
7 For we brought nothing into the world, and we can take nothing out of it.
8 But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that.

2 Timothy 2 : 11-19
11 Here is a trustworthy saying: If we died with him, we will also live with him;
12 if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us;
13 if we are faithless, he will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself.
14 Keep reminding them of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.
15 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.
16 Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly.
17 Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus,
18 who have wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.
19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness."

Oh I have never thought of "Gone for a Day" as being absent. See, I want to spend about 2 hours a day on this site, MOSTLY later in the evening, and occasionally on breaks from what ever project, I am doing to fix the home up. Right Now I am insulating putting up side boards in my Garage.




That half is done, the second half is ready to paint.

I have answered 500 times in the is thread....

Jesus deals faith by measure
Jesus begins the work of faith in us
Jesus finishes the work of faith in us
Jesus completes the work of faith in us

Too bad you believe Jesus fails.....there is NO such thing as continue to believe to the end to remain saved....it is a one off event with eternal consequence.......Eternal life is not temporary life based upon what we do...

If we believe NOT (after belief) HE ABIDES faithful because HE cannot deny HIMSELF

You should trust JESUS....he saves ETERNALLY.....not temporarily.....

Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13



But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.
Matthew 13:20-21

• believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

• but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

I asked you to plainly for all to see, answer the simple question, so we know where you stand.


So you believe a Christian does not have to continue to believe, to the end, to be saved?


They can reject Christ, and convert to Judaism or Islam, while being persecuted, and on the Day of Judgement still be saved, even though the no longer believed?

1. No, a believer who rejects Jesus as Christ, and departs from Him, and converts to Islam, is no longer saved, because he no longer believes.

JPT

See what I mean, dcontroversal, just answered you. It reveals that YOU KNOW VERY LITTLE about our beliefs, and I assume your pastor told you that we believe those CRAZY things, but it appears he knows even LESS than you do about TRUE Eternal Security Beliefs. Like I said, Asks us politely, and we will be willing to explain our Beliefs to you. Once favor though, Please take your PAST assumptions about Eternal Security and Once Saved, Always Saved, and TRASH CAN THEM. I think if you really listen to why we believe what we Believe, you will find that our beliefs are not that far from what you belief. So ask this old Horse for an explanation of why I believe that our beliefs are BIBLICAL, and I will give you a straight answer. If you do not choose to believe the same way, c'est la vie. At Least you will not be mis-representing our beliefs, a form of disrespect; because you will have "Gotten It From The Horses Mouth."

Is that Okay by you?

He didn't answer a simple question, but went on about his beliefs, trying twist what is being discussed, claiming that I think Jesus fails...

Too bad you believe Jesus fails.

Click to expand...

This is because he is ashamed of answering a simple straightforward question with a simple straightforward answer.



How about you, can you answer?


I asked you to plainly for all to see, answer the simple question, so we know where you stand.


So you believe a Christian does not have to continue to believe, to the end, to be saved?


They can reject Christ, and convert to Judaism or Islam, while being persecuted, and on the Day of Judgement still be saved, even though the no longer believed?

1. No, a believer who rejects Jesus as Christ, and departs from Him, and converts to Islam, is no longer saved, because he no longer believes.

JPT

Please read these plain words from Jesus -

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13



But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.
Matthew 13:20-21

• believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

• but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.

• But he who endures to the end shall be saved. Matthew 24:13

JPT

21 And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled 22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— 23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister. Colossians 1:21-23

• if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel

JPT

Matthew 24 is not about salvation....geesh man...learn context....

Ok Thanks, nice work shop, my work shop is a music studio where my computer sits, so all I have to do is pick up my gitar and start practicing "New Tunes" or going over "Older Tunes" that are wonderful praise songs from long ago. I particularly like "Crown Him with Many Chrowns" and "Come Thou Fount" - "Crown Him", was written in 1851, and "Come thou Fount" was written in 1757, still beautiful praise song today.

God bless

So what..salvation is not in question....