1Cor 1:26 - individual election

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BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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#41
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#41
posthuman said:
and Jesus chose him -- "have I not chosen you?" is what comes right before what you quoted.

Luke 22:3 & John 13:27 both say "Satan entered him" -- which to me eliminates the idea that Judas was Satan incarnate.
it is interesting tho, that John appears to recognize the beast in Revelation 17, who was, who is not, and who is to come. big subject.

what are we looking at, then? did Judas personally have an unavoidable destiny, or could any of the disciples have been the son of perdition if Judas had -by his own free agency - decided not to be? is that a choice Judas was free to make? what if he chose otherwise, and all the disciples chose otherwise -- then no one delivers Jesus to be crucified?

how does prophecy reconcile with the idea of human free will?
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I contend that Judas was the second person of the unholy Trinity, Satan being the 'father'.

Even of Jesus we read, "And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him. And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost" (John 1:32-33).

Satan, the father, entered Judas while the Holy Spirit descended upon and remained with Jesus.
 
G

garee

Banned
#43
Mar 28, 2016
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#43
BaptistBibleBeliever said:
Prophecy is merely a 'foretelling' of an event based upon the foreknowledge of God. God knowing about something before it happens does not necessitate that He 'caused' it to happen.
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That would limit its usage.

Prophecy is simply a synonym for word of God. It as it is written with the word it respresents the faith of God not seen it can point ahead or point back, or used to represent the present.

To prophesy is to declare prophecy, the word of God as it is written .

False prophecy is to declare the will of another mediator, the anti-christs. The poison of asps serpents. as a generation of vipers.
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

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#44
Sep 8, 2018
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#44
posthuman said:
same could be said of all those who think they chose God, never getting around to acknowledging their need to be first chosen by Him.
who say in their hearts, 'thank God i am not like these other men' because of all the good 'works' they do, that they think commend them to God, imagining God doesn't help those who don't first help themselves.
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I think we got a calvinist on our hands.

1 timothy 2:4 has already been posted. Calvinism refuted. That was quick. I have heard the embarrasing explanation of "context" for 1 timothy 2:4 saying its "ALL KINDS" of people, but it doesn't say all kinds of people. Calvinists adding to scripture there. It says to pray for kings and all in authority, but just before that it says pray for ALL MEN and that God will have ALL MEN to be saved.
The desperation for calvinists is real and evident with this particular verse, nobody reading the text gets from that "Hey it said pray for kings too, there, so it just means all KINDS of people you know, like kings and mcdonalds workers and stuff".

Shut it down. Lets bury calvinism to the garbage bin of history where it belongs. Tulip is a good flower, its name has been dragged through the mud.
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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#45
Sep 9, 2018
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#45
garee said:
That would limit its usage.

Prophecy is simply a synonym for word of God. It as it is written with the word it respresents the faith of God not seen it can point ahead or point back, or used to represent the present.

To prophesy is to declare prophecy, the word of God as it is written .

False prophecy is to declare the will of another mediator, the anti-christs. The poison of asps serpents. as a generation of vipers.
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Prophecy is also referred to a preaching . . . which is 'forthtelling'. Some preach truth - many preach error and doctrines of devils.

Some prophetic statements have a double fulfillment such as Isaiah 7:14 announcing the birth of Jesus Christ.

"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel"
(Isaiah 7:14).

This was both fulfilled in Ahab's day and at the birth of Christ.
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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#46
Sep 9, 2018
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#46
Hevosmies said:
I think we got a calvinist on our hands.

1 timothy 2:4 has already been posted. Calvinism refuted. That was quick. I have heard the embarrasing explanation of "context" for 1 timothy 2:4 saying its "ALL KINDS" of people, but it doesn't say all kinds of people. Calvinists adding to scripture there. It says to pray for kings and all in authority, but just before that it says pray for ALL MEN and that God will have ALL MEN to be saved.
The desperation for calvinists is real and evident with this particular verse, nobody reading the text gets from that "Hey it said pray for kings too, there, so it just means all KINDS of people you know, like kings and mcdonalds workers and stuff".

Shut it down. Lets bury calvinism to the garbage bin of history where it belongs. Tulip is a good flower, its name has been dragged through the mud.
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Tulips have gone the way of the rainbow . . . and we can't let that happen!
 
posthuman

posthuman

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#47
Jul 31, 2013
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#47
BaptistBibleBeliever said:
"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel"
(Isaiah 7:14).
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is this fulfilled because God looked ahead and time and thereby gained knowledge of what would be, or because God Himself brought it about?

God's foreknowledge is an interesting subject - though it's hard to accept how some people explain it as though omniscient God has a crystal ball, or is really good at counting cards & calculating probabilities. if He were to play poker, i don't imagine He'd win because He's shrewd; i imagine He'd win because He created the universe and everything that lives in it. there's a difference. the house always wins because the house fixes the games, sets the rules and defines the payouts.
in the case of Isaiah 7:14, for example, i don't think He is able to foretell this because He has a time machine. i think He knows what will be because it is His will, and He does all His will.

The lot is cast into the lap; ​
but the whole disposing thereof is of the LORD.
(Proverbs 16:33)​
 
BaptistBibleBeliever

BaptistBibleBeliever

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#49
Sep 9, 2018
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#49
posthuman said:
you mean they are in the heavens, proclaiming the faithfulness of God to keep the covenant He declared with all living creatures?

:D
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I mean the term was stolen to represent something reprehensible as in the case of the sodomites theft of God's sign.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#50
Aug 17, 2015
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#50
BaptistBibleBeliever said:
Prophecy is merely a 'foretelling' of an event based upon the foreknowledge of God. God knowing about something before it happens does not necessitate that He 'caused' it to happen.
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I think you cannot consistently hold the idea that everything is predestined and on the other hand to think that its not God who did it.
 
posthuman

posthuman

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#54
Jul 31, 2013
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#54
Hevosmies said:
I think we got a calvinist on our hands.

1 timothy 2:4 has already been posted. Calvinism refuted. That was quick. I have heard the embarrasing explanation of "context" for 1 timothy 2:4 saying its "ALL KINDS" of people, but it doesn't say all kinds of people. Calvinists adding to scripture there. It says to pray for kings and all in authority, but just before that it says pray for ALL MEN and that God will have ALL MEN to be saved.
The desperation for calvinists is real and evident with this particular verse, nobody reading the text gets from that "Hey it said pray for kings too, there, so it just means all KINDS of people you know, like kings and mcdonalds workers and stuff".

Shut it down. Lets bury calvinism to the garbage bin of history where it belongs. Tulip is a good flower, its name has been dragged through the mud.
Click to expand...

what do you personally mean when you say the word 'Calvinism' ?
that God doesn't choose people; instead, people choose God?
what does John 15:16 say about that? Romans 3:11? Isaiah 53:6? Psalm 146:8? Psalm 94:11? Psalm 14:1-3? Job 14:4? Isaiah 65:1-2? Matthew 11:27? 1 Corinthians 2:14? John 14:17? Matthew 13:11?

the real truth is the truth that reconciles all these things.
 
posthuman

posthuman

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#55
Jul 31, 2013
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#55
trofimus said:
I am not sure that that means.
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i think it means God predestines what He looks into His crystal ball and sees is already going to happen anyway.
like, He predestines those who predestine themselves.

((???))
 
posthuman

posthuman

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#56
Jul 31, 2013
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#56
BaptistBibleBeliever said:
Yes . . .
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that was meant as an 'A or B' kind of question, not a 'yes or no'

did God read tomorrow's newspaper and see a headline saying 'virgin birth!'
-- so, appearing to be smart ((but really it's just b/c He has a divine time machine)) He said before it happened, 'this will happen!'

or

did God say, "I will do this" and then at just the right time, do exactly what He said He would do?



​
The lot is cast into the lap, ​
but its every decision is from the LORD.
(Proverbs 16:33) ​

does this say, God is really good at physics calculations, so when the dice are cast He is able to do the math and figure out how they will land before it happens?
or
does this say, God wills that a 5 & and a 2 be rolled, and so they are, though mankind in our vanity and ignorance think it's randomness?
 
J

John146

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#57
Jan 13, 2016
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#57
KJV1611 said:
Don’t know how you got that out of that verse. It’s talking about calling people to be in Christ, it doesnt say anything about a believers works.
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21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

Those that are called are the Jews and Greeks who believed the preaching of the gospel. The believers display the power and wisdom of God. Take a look at each other brethren, not many among us are wise after the flesh, mighty, or noble (according to the flesh).

Maybe I'm wrong, idk.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#58
Nov 23, 2013
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#58
John146 said:
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

Those that are called are the Jews and Greeks who believed the preaching of the gospel. The believers display the power and wisdom of God. Take a look at each other brethren, not many among us are wise after the flesh, mighty, or noble (according to the flesh).

Maybe I'm wrong, idk.
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You're good, I may have misunderstood you. :)
 
P

pottersclay

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#59
#59
I believe that the whole history of the Earth was settled before the foundation was ever built and was established at creation.
I believe that when God rested on the seventh day that was the day he gave all atthority and power to his only begotten.
That is what inspired the writing of revelation.
All of what God has said and done are the undeniable footsteps of the Lord in the pages of history.
All is known that can be known as a testament that there is a Devine presence in control.
All is known except one thing........when he shall return......that my friends is even hidden from his son.
The reason of why is for us to keep looking up for our redemption draws near. Even so come quickly Lord Jesus.
 
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