Observations on hell and the rich man and Lazarus account in Luke 16:19-31

Many were raised by bible believing christian parents, that took them to a gospel preaching church that may even been a community asset. You may have heard the gospel before you read it. Not me. I read it first. I read the word and it caused me to believe. There are so many false churches and doctrines around we have to be careful before swallowing what they dish out. People that follow churches and leaders with out doubts or questions become statistics. Put it all to the test. The Word of God is what we have, The Bible is the only acceptable reference tool worth our reliance upon.

The word of God defines the word hell as a living suffering of those who cry out for deliverance and are delivered.

The sign as a wonder was fulfilled with the Son of man, Jesus thousands of years later suffered unto death. . The Holy Spirit using Jonas performing a living suffering crying out for rest to be compared to the Gethsemane account where the father first started pouring out the wrath of God intended for us sinners on His Sons Jesus corrupted flesh in order to destroy sin in the flesh depriving it of its power of serving the father of lies the god of this world. . . It is last sign and wonder or sign used as a wonderment that God would give to world. . Today he says it is evil generation natural unconverted man that does seek to walk by sight and not the faith that alone comes from hearing prophecy ….the word of God.

Jonah 2 King James Version (KJV) Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of "hell" cried I, and thou heardest my voice.

A living sacrifice one that works to give spirit life as did Christ in jeopardy of his own spirit. . There will be no hearing of those whose temporal corrupted spirit lived in a temporal corrupted body made from the dust . can work to hear.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Both were delivered in the same way suffering a living suffering called hell. Both were saved by the one who strengthened them enabling them to finish the thee day work

Then cometh Jesus with them unto a place called Gethsemane, and saith unto the disciples, Sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder. And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me. And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt. And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour? Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak. He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done. And he came and found them asleep again: for their eyes were heavy. And he left them, and went away again, and prayed the third time, saying the same words. Then cometh he to his disciples, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. Mathew 26:36-45

In the belly of the fish. Three days and three nights as a living suffering called hell , Just like the Son of man, Jesus a living sacrifice represented by three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth as a living sacrifice". God does not accept dead sacrifices. .

In the belly of the fish, in trouble with the wife. lol

Garee, where do your come up with these fanciful ideas?

There is no deliverance form Hades or Hell after death. And Jonah was a type of Christ.

The word hell does not mean dead or death (dead men cannot suffer) What will they suffer with seeing they feel no pain ?

Yes both the type and the actual demonstration is show as a living hell or suffering, or living sacrifice being delivered from another unseen entity from the death and destruction. This is where the literal blood is poured out and returns to the spiritless lifeless dust it was formed from and the temporal corrupted spirit returns to the Father of all spirits. They who have not received new spirit life will not be raised up on the last day to receive a new incorruptible body.

"Belly of hell" is in respect to a living work it is the same as saying "heart of the earth' dead man don't breath"( just as white man cannot jump. )

Jonah 2 King James Version (KJV) Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish's belly, And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.


He cried by reason because he can feel the pain of hell( affliction )

My bible KJV says hell.

Hades was the waiting place where the saved were safe in Abraham's Bossom.
The rich man actually was in what we call hell....there was no change for him after Jesus died.
However, there was a change for Lazarus...he left Abraham's Bossom (as did all who were waiting there)
and went to heaven after the gates were opened.

I think the title of the thread is OK.

Hades -- in the lower parts (or *the heart*) of the earth -- had TWO SECTIONS. One for the righteous dead, the other for the unrighteous. There was a huge chasm between the two. And they could communicate back and forth but could not cross over. So both went to Sheol/Hades (which should never have been called "hell", and Sheol should never have been called "the grave"). Hell (created for the devil and his angels) is the Lake of Fire, and is presently unoccupied.

Christ went to Hades for three days and three nights (Psalm 16:10; Acts 2:27) and preached to the spirits in prison, then took all the righteous dead with Him to Heaven. They are all presently in the New Jerusalem (Heb 12:22-24). But the unrighteous dead continue to go to Hades, and there is no deliverance from there. That is why is is imperative that the Gospel is preached to every creature and all are COMMANDED to obey the Gospel. There are no second chances, or reincarnation, or purgatory, or any fictitious Soul Sleep or Annihilation.

Just to complete...here's sheoul - which was believed the place of the dead in the O.T.

And, there is only ONE place in the N.T. that hell is correctly translated from the O.T. and N.T. manuscripts...
2 Peter 2:4 which would be "hell" as we understand it today.

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Dictionaries - Baker's Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology - Sheol
Sheol [N] [E]
Old Testament. The Hebrew word seol [l/a.v], "Sheol, " refers to the grave or the abode of the dead ( Psalms 88:3 Psalms 88:5). Through much of the Old Testament period, it was believed that all went one place, whether human or animal ( Psalms 49:12 Psalms 49:14 Psalms 49:20 ), whether righteous or wicked ( Eccl 9:2-3 ). No one could avoid Sheol ( Psalm 49:9 ; 89:48), which was thought to be down in the lowest parts of the earth ( Deut 32:22 ; 1 Sam 28:11-15 ; Job 26:5 ; Psalm 86:13 ; Isa 7:11 ; Ezekiel 31:14-16 Ezekiel 31:18 ).

Unlike this world, Sheol is devoid of love, hate, envy, work, thought, knowledge, and wisdom ( Ecclesiastes 9:6 Ecclesiastes 9:10 ). Descriptions are bleak: There is no light ( Job 10:21-22 ; 17:13 ; Psalms 88:6 Psalms 88:12 ; 143:3 ), no remembrance ( Psalm 6:5 ; 88:12 ; Eccl 9:5 ), no praise of God ( Psalm 6:5 ; 30:9 ; 88:10-12 ; 115:17 ; Isa 38:18 ) — in fact, no sound at all ( Psalm 94:17 ; 115:17 ). Its inhabitants are weak, trembling shades ( Job 26:5 ; Psalm 88:10-12 ; Isa 14:9-10 ) who can never hope to escape from its gates ( Job 10:21 ; 17:13-16 ; Isa 38:10 ). Sheol is like a ravenous beast that swallows the living without being sated ( Prov 1:12 ; 27:20 ; Isa 5:14 ). Some thought the dead were cut off from God ( Psalm 88:3-5 ; Isa 38:11 ); while others believed that God's presence reached even to Sheol ( Psalm 139:8 ).

Toward the end of the Old Testament, God revealed that there will be a resurrection of the dead ( Isa 26:19 ). Sheol will devour no longer; instead God will swallow up Death ( Isa 25:8 ). The faithful will be rewarded with everlasting life while the rest will experience eternal contempt ( Dan 12:2 ). This theology developed further in the intertestamental period.

The New Testament. By the time of Jesus, it was common for Jews to believe that the righteous dead go to a place of comfort while the wicked go to Hades ("Hades" normally translates "Sheol" in the LXX), a place of torment ( Luke 16:22-23 ). Similarly, in Christianity, believers who die go immediately to be with the Lord ( 2 Cor 5:8 ; Php 1:23 ). Hades is a hostile place whose gates cannot prevail against the church ( Matt 16:18 ). In fact, Jesus himself holds the keys of Death and Hades ( Rev 1:18 ). Death and Hades will ultimately relinquish their dead and be cast into the lake of fire ( Rev 20:13-14 ).

The fact that theology develops within the Old Testament and between the Old Testament and the New Testament does not mean that the Bible is contradictory or contains errors. It only indicates progressive revelation, that God revealed more of himself and his plan of salvation as time went on. That some Old Testament saints believed in Sheol, while the New Testament teaches clearly about heaven and hell, is nor more of a problem than that the Old Testament contains a system of atonement by animal sacrifice now made obsolete in Christ ( Heb 10:4-10 ) or that the Old Testament teaches God is one ( Deut 6:4 ) while the New Testament reveals a Trinity.

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part 1 of 2


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Part 2 of 2


Gehenna

Dictionaries - Easton's Bible Dictionary - Gehenna
Gehenna
(originally Ge bene Hinnom; i.e., "the valley of the sons of Hinnom"), a deep, narrow glen to the south of Jerusalem, where the idolatrous Jews offered their children in sacrifice to Molech ( 2 Chronicles 28:3 ;33:6 ; Jeremiah 7:31 ; 19:2-6 ). This valley afterwards became the common receptacle for all the refuse of the city. Here the dead bodies of animals and of criminals, and all kinds of filth, were cast and consumed by fire kept always burning. It thus in process of time became the image of the place of everlasting destruction. In this sense it is used by our Lord in Matthew 5:22 Matthew 5:29 Matthew 5:30 ; 10:28 ; 18:9 ; Matthew 23:15 Matthew 23:33 ; Mark 9:43 Mark 9:45 Mark 9:47 ; Luke 12:5 . In these passages, and also in James 3:6 , the word is uniformly rendered "hell," the Revised Version placing "Gehenna" in the margin.

Good article!

I guess you could say: REVELATION IS PROGRESSIVE!

I read it first too. But then I am a reader and like to find things out for myself not just take other peoples word for it. People are different though, some people want to watch a movie and not bother to read the book it was based on. And you know with movies theres always a bit of creative license going on to fit the drama into two hours so the person watching doesnt fall asleep.

I knew a guy that thought Conan the Barbarian was a bible story. He asked me where it was in the Bible. The Greatest story ever told (the movie) was about the life and ministry of Jesus but the only resurrection scene I can find is that of Lazarus, not Jesus.

Dont watch the movie Noah if youve read the Bible. Arrgh so many things wrong with that movie how do I even begin.

Interesting thing about Lazarus was..he was also the brother of Mary and Martha and Jesus did raise him from the dead. Didnt know he was that poor though but there you go. Unless you think there were two different Lazaruses. And even when Lazarus was raised, the rich men, Pharisees etc didnt want to know.