The Tabernacle in the Wilderness

I agree that the Word should always be the final authority. My prayer is that people will consider and study out scripture on it's own merit. One's affiliation to a denomination is of no importance and personally is the furthest thing from my mind. I don't have a desire to know someone's denomination because it often hinders an open exchange of the Word

An interesting example of God's lack of interest in one's denomination:

Our church purchased pews and upon arriving to get them a discussion ensued. The sellers shared that they were "Bapticostals." Well that certainly peaked interest. This was their testimony:
The group of men decided to come together and pray to strengthen their walk with Jesus. As they sincerely cried out in prayer, to their amazement, the entire group was filled with the Holy Ghost and began to speak in tongues. Afterward, they were so filled with joy they could barely contain their excitement as they waited to share the good news with the members of their church.

Sunday came and the men proudly stood before the congregation and relayed their experience. "We were all infilled and spoke in tongues just like the others on the Day of Pentecost. We could hardly believe it ourselves! There is no doubt that what happened to us was from God," they said with smiles beaming from ear to ear.

They went on to say you could have heard a pin drop, when the pastor ushered them to the door and told them they were no longer welcome to fellowship with his church.

The men were surprised by the response of their congregation. However they decided not to be discouraged and to go forward and share the true plan of salvation. They began a church and still refer to themselves as "Bapticostals."

I enjoy this testimony because it gives God all the glory! Our Lord and Savior will honor those who sincerely seek Him.

We used to play these doctrine games in grade 6 religious instruction catechism classes … what if?

Just stick to the Bible scriptures and do it …
And what does the NT teach all of us on how to be saved?
It really is pretty straightforward and uncomplicated:


37 Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,
and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.”
Acts 2: (ESV)

Stop arguing with the Word of God (Jesus) and become a doer of the Word instead.
And yes you will speak in a new tongue - praying in the Spirit - as Jesus promised to those who would believe the gospel.
Now the real question for you @bluto is, Are you a believer of the gospel?

Are there more than one way to be saved?

Either baptism is necessary for all or it is not necessary at all.

How can Scripture instruct that baptism is necessary for salvation and also be silent on the consequences of not complying?

How can this be your prayer when YOU ARE PROMOTING FALSE DOCTRINE?

Now you have two options: (1) Believe what God has revealed about salvation, and which has been discerned by the majority of Christians here or (2) continue to promote false teachings and face the consequences.

It is no light matter when someone comes along and tries to confuse people about the true Gospel of God. The eternal destiny of souls is at stake, and for you to continue pushing water baptism as ESSENTIAL for salvation is in reality opposition to God and Christ. Think about that before you tender another post.

The only way to be saved is through Jesus.

Jesus was given all authority when He conquered death.

He commanded us to repent and be baptized. He commanded us to take up our cross and follow Christ. Teaching His Gospel and making disciples.

If churches teach that baptizm is not necessary to follow Christ, who gave them such authority to overrule the authorithy given to Jesus? Only those who believe in Jesus Christ the Son of God shall be saved. If your pastors teachings contradict Christ you are on your own. You are following man. Those who remain in the vine belong to Him. A branch cannot produce fruit on its own. A branch does not remain in the vine because you go to a denominational church. No matter what the denomination is. We remain in the vine by following Christ and walking in the Holy Spirit. Doing the will of the Father and being obedient to the Word.

My response was to bluto's post concerning the possibility that one was unable to get water baptized for some reason.

God the Father and Jesus are the ones insisting on water baptism as essential to believing and obeying the gospel of salvation.
The word of God has numerous verses on water baptism which is also to be accompanied by Holy Spirit baptism.

The majority of Christians follow the teachings of men and women who have over the centuries departed from the faith.
However, Jesus is merciful and full of grace and there is the hope and promise of salvation for all Christians who will
eventually appear before the judgement throne of God.
But the Pentecostal Christian is without doubt the return to the original true gospel written of in our NT Bibles on being
born new again through by water and Spirit, and walking on in the power of God daily.
Oh and also praying in the Spirit (tongues) as part of the full armour of God.

So if a person trust Jesus but can not be baptized for medical reasons or dies before baptism is administered, that person will go to hell.

A simple yes or no answer would be appreciated.

Will you answer my question?
How can Scripture state baptism is necessary and at the same time not state the cunsequences ,
If Scriptures states that baptism is necessary than the consequences of not being baptized should be obvious.

The Word states everyone is to believe in Jesus and His sacrifice, repent, get water baptized and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. These instructions were provided on the day the New Testament church was birthed. Some people think they get birthed into the church in a different way. All must make their own choice.

I agree with what you say minus the pentecostal part. That comes across as "set tripping". Basically boasting and feeling superior because of ones personal membership to a specific church.

The church is ONE. There is no divison in the body and we all play a role in the body of Christ. Paul shares this in 1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

He continues on to teach more about that topic. So id maybe keep that pentecostal boasting to a minimum. I mean let me ask, are you opposed to other denominations? Like baptists or apostolics? Theres no need to boast or feel superior that just creates hostility and internal conflict within the body of believers.

God bless you brotha.

If a church teaches that baptism must come first before one is saved, and it is what washes our sins away, then that church is in error. And is NOT a church of God.

No church I have ever witnessed teaches against baptism They ALL (as with all of Gods NT commands) preach one should be baptised AFTER they are saved in obedience to God.. Just like with every command.

One is not boasting.
I merely reaffirm that the Pentecostal Christian life and faith most closely emulates the church of the first century:
the church that is described and taught of in Acts and all the epistles.
Not only that, but in Pentecost the saints do walk daily in the power of God with all of us having testimonies to first being
converted by the baptism of the Holy Spirit and to the many miracles, healings and blessings that we enjoy.
Further the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are readily distributed with evidence within the body of Christ for our growth and
encouragement.
And as commanded to do in the scriptures we also operate the voice gifts of the Holy Spirit at our meetings.

This is not a matter of boasting but of declaring our submission to the word of God and seeking to believe and live according
to what the scriptures teach us to do.
It is God who often boasts of his Spirit-filled church in the gifts of prophecy.

If only that were true.

How would you know? You are not a member of my church.

Well for one im not God so who gave me such authority to answer who goes or does not go to heaven? Im merely a man like you..

But if the person recieves the Holy Spirit before he dies God will not forsake His own. God knows the heart. Because He gives us a new heart when we recieve the Holy Spirit. Its the new covenant circumcision of the heart.

John the baptist even told Christ, I should be the one baptized of you. Because we need the Holy Spirit. The water baptism is being obedient to God and washing this temple for God to come and dwell in us... when we are submerged we are declaring this body is dead! And we are raised up in Christ with new life! The body is dead and all the corruption that our flesh continues to battle with our New heavenly Spirit. The Spirit of God. The Holy Spirit.

So i cant answer your hypothetical question. I can only tell you baptizm is a command. Ordered by God the Father, through the prophet John the baptist and Authorized by Jesus Christ.

I hear you speak about your church, thats all I need to know

I belief there is only one way to be saved.
NO EXCEPTIONS!
Baptism is not necessary.
I am honest enough to tell every one what I believe.

If you belief that baptism is necessary for all, with no exceptions, why will you not be honest and say so.
If you believe that baptism is necessary with exceptions, why will you not be honest and say so.
It there are exceptions, than why will you not be honest and say that there are more than one way to salvation.

Stop beating around the bush and give an honest yes or no.