Not By Works

let me answer you like this-

this is from a pastor, heard it many years ago ( paraphrase )

" when a person truly comes to Christ, they receive the Holy Sprit. so, they have the Sprit and the flesh. so, then what does the person do? which one do they exercise?

if one exercises the Sprit, then the flesh get weaker and weaker. if one does the opposite, then the opposite happens.

so, a lot of people are truly saved, but they have a strong flesh, and a weak Sprit. we all should have the opposite'"


so, there you are.

Make no mistake....you challenge NOTHING.....!!

let me answer you like this-

this is from a pastor, heard it many years ago ( paraphrase )

" when a person truly comes to Christ, they receive the Holy Sprit. so, they have the Sprit and the flesh. so, then what does the person do? which one do they exercise?

if one exercises the Sprit, then the flesh get weaker and weaker. if one does the opposite, then the opposite happens.

so, a lot of people are truly saved, but they have a strong flesh, and a weak Sprit. we all should have the opposite'"


so, there you are.

I like this ... sums it up nicely!!

This is why OSAS cannot safely be preached. It leads to this careless attitude. Granted you are the only one to let the cat out the bag. But this is what most popular OSAS pastors on TV are saying. I dare not say most OSAS advocates, since I cannot know the hearts and minds of people, but based on what is going on in professing Christianity today, I can make an educated guess. Christian yoga? No problem, all things are lawful. Name the sin "all things are lawful, no problem". For anyone to even suggest fornication is lawful and a Christian is not a fornicator if he fornicates is just...unbelievable and shows where we are. I cannot believe someone would say that? Never in Church history ......

Did you check the context btw, it does not say fornication is lawful to you. This is a serious error, I hope you read the entire chapter and notice that just prior to saying that Paul gives many warnings about what happened to israel and how God slayed them in the wilderness and tells us its a warning for US as well. Here is the context:

19Am I suggesting, then, that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? 20No, but the sacrifices of pagans are offered to demons, not to God. And I do not want you to be participants with demons. 21You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot partake in the table of the Lord and the table of demons too. 22Are we trying to provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than He?
All to God’s Glory
23“Everything is permissible,” but not everything is beneficial. “Everything is permissible,” but not everything is edifying. 24No one should seek his own good, but the good of others.
25Eat anything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience, 26for, “The earth is the Lord’s, and the fullness thereof.”


If we fornicate we are indeed fornicators, God is not playing games, God called out fornicators in the church, read Revelation chapter 2, 1 cor 6:9, letters to the churches. Paul's warnings are sent to Churches, as the letters themselves declare, what you are saying is gnosticism. Where all sin is in the flesh, but the soul/spirit spotless, so you can sin and it wont affect the soul. Text-book gnosticism. Very dangerous early heresy, debunked the epistles of John, I suggest everyone reads those. It was defeated but has made a comeback recently with Christian TV, and people don't recognize it since so much time has passed from the gnostic "hay-day".

But doesn’t answer the question. I agree with that too, but it doesn’t answer the question

How come you guys never seem to exegete scripture. You give stories, analogies, philosophical points. But what is 1 Peter 1:5 about? What does it mean we are kept by the power of God through faith? What is the purpose of Jesus’ High Priestly ministry? Forget about you believe and what I believe. Just Look at the texts with a clear, open mind, setting aside what you are trying to argue. Let the scripture speak for itself

Quick question. David, a man after Gods own heart, committed fornication, adultery and murder all during the time that he was a man after God's own heart.

David also had many wives and many concubines. Do you think David was a fornicator in God's eyes, do you think he was a good Christian or a lost person? Did you know that David was a Christian?

But doesn’t answer the question. I agree with that too, but it doesn’t answer the question

How come you guys never seem to exegete scripture. You give stories, analogies, philosophical points. But what is 1 Peter 1:5 about? What does it mean we are kept by the power of God through faith? What is the purpose of Jesus’ High Priestly ministry? Forget about you believe and what I believe. Just Look at the texts with a clear, open mind, setting aside what you are trying to argue. Let the scripture speak for itself

Did David have the same blessings and benefits we have? Heb 11:40.

why are you always firing off questions? why don't you just state your beliefs ?

and. I do not build theology around individual verses. bad theology to do that. far better to use the N.T. as a whole.

and, just so you won't whine, what I posted above was a fancy way of saying " walk in the Sprit, and you will not fulfill the lust of the flesh.'

and, if you keep reading 1st Peter 1 , he says basically the same thing. so, there is your Scripture.

let me answer you like this-

this is from a pastor, heard it many years ago ( paraphrase )

" when a person truly comes to Christ, they receive the Holy Sprit. so, they have the Sprit and the flesh. so, then what does the person do? which one do they exercise?

if one exercises the Sprit, then the flesh get weaker and weaker. if one does the opposite, then the opposite happens.

so, a lot of people are truly saved, but they have a strong flesh, and a weak Sprit. we all should have the opposite'"


so, there you are.

Quick question. David, a man after Gods own heart, committed fornication, adultery and murder all during the time that he was a man after God's own heart.

David also had many wives and many concubines. Do you think David was a fornicator in God's eyes, do you think he was a good Christian or a lost person? Did you know that David was a Christian?

They have a strong flesh and a weak spirit because they are taught that that is one of thei options, instead of being told what God has provided for them. As soon as they get out of the watered down gospel, they will grow and learn to walk in the Spirit, because the Bible not only says it is possible, it expects it. Do you want verses

A very good question indeed

Many reject that David was saved even though he speaks of his salvation in the present tense....they also deny that he had the crap whipped out of him (chastened) for the things he did that was contrary.....the Psalms also speak to disease in his old age....one of the biggest O.T. pictures of Jesus can be seen in the INNOCENT SON of David taking his place in death under the law for the murder of Uriah.....fast forward to the N.T.....thou SON OF DAVID have mercy on me cried the old man.....!

if you want to. I have read the Bible through about 20 times, I know what it says. and what it does not say.

Then how did you think that I could put a time limit on regeneration? How could someone put a time limit on something that is instantaneous with faith. If you don’t know that, you don’t understand regeneration

Just like UG thought I said regeneration maintained by sin confession when I said fellowship maintained...

the issue is this- you think ( wrongly) that regeneration means one starts instantly bearing fruit ( and we know how the fruit thing went for you, empty apple buckets and all).

so, I will leave this thread, and you, with this-

when 2 people come to Christ, one can instantly show a massive transformation , one can struggle with breaking free of certain sins for years.

if both are true believers , both are saved, even though it does not look the same.

that is why lordship salvation is bunk.

gb9 out.

the issue is this- you think ( wrongly) that regeneration means one starts instantly bearing fruit ( and we know how the fruit thing went for you, empty apple buckets and all).

so, I will leave this thread, and you, with this-

when 2 people come to Christ, one can instantly show a massive transformation , one can struggle with breaking free of certain sins for years.

if both are true believers , both are saved, even though it does not look the same.

that is why lordship salvation is bunk.

gb9 out.