Should unrepentant cohabitation (shacking up) result in church discipline and disfellowshipment?

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Is unrepentant cohabitation (shacking up) a reason for church discipline?

  • Yes, unrepentant cohabitation (shacking up) is a reason for church discipline/disfellowshipment.

    Votes: 18 94.7%
  • No, unrepentant cohabitation (shacking up) is not a reason for church discipline/disfellowshipment.

    Votes: 1 5.3%
  • I don't know.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    19

Melach

Well-known member
Mar 28, 2019
2,055
1,524
113
I totally agree with what you're saying. My husband lived almost a year in our home alone before we married. I didn't stay overnight. Temptation is just a normal part of being human. I think when we don't admit that, we fall. And I'm saying this because I'm not perfect and I know I can be tempted on many things. So I try, I try to stay away from things that cause temptation. We have to be careful of our appearance.
yes you said it so well i love you for that. thanks for doing what you did with your husband you were great examples for many people.

i also look at it like: i wont even put myself in the position to be tempted, thats when my chance of falling to that sin is close to 0.
 

Melach

Well-known member
Mar 28, 2019
2,055
1,524
113
Are you saying I am from Canada as if it changes what the Bible clearly states?
no but i just dont understand what yuo are saying. are you saying its ok today to have many wives? Jesus said its one man one wife in the beginning and should be like that now.

anyway with your point i kind of agree that it matters more what God thinks not what secular government. so if you are somewhere in the woods with someone you love and no government is present to make you a wife and husband you can just do it in front of God and commit and to me that would be completely valid. i dont think in the times of moses there was any government to marry people in the wilderness either.


but now that we have the possible way in this society to just get married the right way we should utilize that possibility that we got.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,131
29,444
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Christ didn’t rebuke the woman at the well, so maybe we shouldn’t either.
Jesus certainly "called her out" on her sinful lifestyle. She was impressed by how much He knew of her.
 
Nov 26, 2012
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I’m saying it’s foolish to think you can be fully commited to God with one wife. That commitment becomes less and less the more wives you have. It’s not illegal just stupid. Now to equate a couple living together monogamously to fornicating in a sinful sense, isn’t being intellectually honest. To excommunicate a church going couple or even shun them would be going against Christ’s law to love. It would be based on your church doctrine, not the Bible. We have reinvented the covenant of matrimony. Originally it was a legal covenant to make sure women wouldn’t starve to death because the men owned everything. Yes, it’s best when a man and a woman are monogamous and serve God together but what was originally planned was in a prefallen world. Also we were vegetarians then. Changes were made. One of them was God ordained sex slavery. That’s all I’m saying. If someone wants to judge another according to scripture I think they should fully understand scripture. To force a couple from a church God led them to would be worse than them living in a legal monogamous relationship....IMO.
 
Nov 26, 2012
3,095
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Jesus certainly "called her out" on her sinful lifestyle. She was impressed by how much He knew of her.
Jesus said to her, “woman go call your husband.” She said she had no husband, and Christ told her what she said was true.

He didn’t call her out, He addressed the man she was living with her....husband. 😛
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,131
29,444
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Jesus said to her, “woman go call your husband.” She said she had no husband, and Christ told her what she said was true.

He didn’t call her out, He addressed the man she was living with her....husband. 😛
You neglect to mention that Jesus told her the man she referred to as her husband was not in fact her husband, and that she had had five husbands.

"The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband." From John 4:18
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,128
3,689
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Jesus certainly "called her out" on her sinful lifestyle. She was impressed by how much He knew of her.
The woman at the well wasn’t part of the Church, the body of Christ. We are to judge those within. God will judge those outside His body.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,131
29,444
113
The woman at the well wasn’t part of the Church, the body of Christ. We are to judge those within. God will judge those outside His body.
She believed Jesus was the long awaited Messiah. She is actually the first He discloses this fact to.
 
Nov 26, 2012
3,095
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You neglect to mention that Jesus told her the man she referred to as her husband was not in fact her husband, and that she had had five husbands.

"The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband." From John 4:18
That’s not a rebuke. If said your birthday was July 5th and you had Captain Crunch for breakfast would I be telling you to eat better? Regardless, she didn’t seem shameful. Who knows why men kept dumping her? She sure felt accepted by Christ. Should we also extend that acceptance to those who choose to fellowship with us in search of the Ultimate Truth?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,131
29,444
113
That’s not a rebuke. If said your birthday was July 5th and you had Captain Crunch for breakfast would I be telling you to eat better? Regardless, she didn’t seem shameful. Who knows why men kept dumping her? She sure felt accepted by Christ. Should we also extend that acceptance to those who choose to fellowship with us in search of the Ultimate Truth?
Did I say it was a rebuke? No, I did not say it was a rebuke. I specifically said that Jesus called her out on her sinful lifestyle. You then claimed Jesus addressed the man she was living with as "her husband" when in fact Jesus told her the man was NOT her husband.
 
Nov 26, 2012
3,095
1,050
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Did I say it was a rebuke? No, I did not say it was a rebuke. I specifically said that Jesus called her out on her sinful lifestyle. You then claimed Jesus addressed the man she was living with as "her husband" when in fact Jesus told her the man was NOT her husband.
You are correct. You didn’t say it was a rebuke. My apologies.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,516
113
Anaheim, Cali.
I’m saying it’s foolish to think you can be fully commited to God with one wife. That commitment becomes less and less the more wives you have. It’s not illegal just stupid. Now to equate a couple living together monogamously to fornicating in a sinful sense, isn’t being intellectually honest. To excommunicate a church going couple or even shun them would be going against Christ’s law to love. It would be based on your church doctrine, not the Bible. We have reinvented the covenant of matrimony. Originally it was a legal covenant to make sure women wouldn’t starve to death because the men owned everything. Yes, it’s best when a man and a woman are monogamous and serve God together but what was originally planned was in a prefallen world. Also we were vegetarians then. Changes were made. One of them was God ordained sex slavery. That’s all I’m saying. If someone wants to judge another according to scripture I think they should fully understand scripture. To force a couple from a church God led them to would be worse than them living in a legal monogamous relationship....IMO.
There is a difference between church attendance and membership. There is another difference between membership and leadership. Leaders are to be beyond reproach. If sinners were banned from churches how many wouldn't get saved? Everybody that comes to Christ as adults are sinners when they/we walked through the door. Unlearning pre-existing beliefs and practices dosn't happen instantly. Monogamy wasn't required for the Jewish men who could have numerous wives and concubines at the time. Only wives were expected to be faithful to one husband and they had no legal rights to own property or get a divorce without the husbands consent.

It's totally unrealistic to expect new converts to live up to the standards set for Priests, (Pastors), Board members and Deacons. Even a non believer can get saved thru the belief of a spouse.

1st Corinth. 7:14 King James Bible
For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

Dosn't anybody recall that many people in America would decide to get married and live together in a common law marriage until the circuit riding preacher came to town, perform the ceremony and bless the couple?
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,516
113
Anaheim, Cali.
Circuit rider clergy, in the earliest years of the United States, were clergy assigned to travel around specific geographic territories to minister to settlers and organize congregations. Circuit riders were clergy in the Methodist Episcopal Church and related denominations, although similar itinerant preachers could be found in other faiths as well, particularly among minority faith groups. (co Wikipedia)
 

DB7

Junior Member
Dec 29, 2014
283
138
43
He announced he was getting married last week. I told him I was worried about that situation. He said he knew I would be.

Anyways I was glad to see the picture of him proposing to her on Facebook.
Marriage sounds like some concession, better than before, I imagine.
I'm glad you planted the seed of concern in his head, it should be sufficient to arouse his conscience, ...and clear yours!
 

UnitedWithChrist

Well-known member
Aug 12, 2019
3,739
1,928
113
Marriage sounds like some concession, better than before, I imagine.
I'm glad you planted the seed of concern in his head, it should be sufficient to arouse his conscience, ...and clear yours!
I posted a few facebook articles on the issue.

It wasn't much more than a few weeks that he proposed.

But, perhaps the two weren't related.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,791
113
Dosn't anybody recall that many people in America would decide to get married and live together in a common law marriage until the circuit riding preacher came to town, perform the ceremony and bless the couple?
I don't remember that happening. I'm not that old, and you probably are not either. I've never heard that was the custom. And I would imagine the more pious Methodists who had circuit riders would have been opposed to such a practice and would have insisted on waiting for the preacher to come to town.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,791
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If sinners were banned from churches how many wouldn't get saved? Everybody that comes to Christ as adults are sinners when they/we walked through the door.
You are assuming that people are supposed to be introduced to the Gospel in church. From reading the New Testament, we can surmise that this was not typical of the experience of new converts in the first century, who heard preaching in the temple, synagogues, or marketplaces. Since you mentioned American history, in the colonial period, George Whitfield preached outdoors to crowds of people. There were large campmeetings outdoors during the second great awakening also.
 

presidente

Senior Member
May 29, 2013
9,163
1,791
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This may come as a surprise to most of you because don’t read what the Bible is actually saying. You belong to group think and mold your thought according what was told to you by men. It was common to have wives and concubines when Christ was preaching. If you study what the words were translated from, wife and woman are interchangeable. So, the phrase, “Whoever looks at a woman, to lust after her, has already committed adultery” is better translated, “Whoever looks at a wife, to lust after her....” Polygamy isn’t a sin. Concubines were quite popular. The sin is taking another man’s wife. As Christians to be committed Spiritually, is to not serve the flesh. Paul suggested if someone will be tempted because of their libido, they should take a wife but only one. This has more to do with time management, not sin management. The same word was used for “Each man should have his own wife (woman), and each woman her own husband (man).” This was to keep lust at bay when questioned about abstinence. It is wise to follow this advice.
My understanding is that concubines were slaves who were then taken as wives. A man who had a slave girl might marry her or give her to his son in marriage. If I recall correctly, that was the scenario that was being set up in the movie Ben Hur before Ben Hur was arrested and taken away from his love interest.

Sleeping around before marriage was whoring around, too. The word for 'fornication' is the word for prostitution. It's the same thing. The girl in the Old Testament who was married off as a virgin, but had slept around first, could be put to death for fornicating, playing the harlot in her father's house.

What is a prostitute, in English. It's a woman who fornicates for money. Who is generally considered a lower class prostitute? The one who sleeps around for $5000 or the one who does so for $1? The $1 prostitute would generally be considered low class. Well, there are multitudes of people who whore around for zero dollars. That's really low class. But it's the same sin the prostitute engages in with those who hire her (or him) as the case may be.

Jesus said that if a man put away his wife (except it be for fornication) and married another he commits adultery. He based this on the fact that 'two...shall be one flesh.' Why would it be okay if there was no divorce in between wife one and wife two? Jesus pointed man back to the original intention. The sermon on the mount contains examples of requiring a higher standard. Except your righteousness exceed that of the scribes and Pharisees....

I guess the point is that Christ most likely stated lusting after married women is adultery.
Job wrote that he had made a covenant with his eyes not to look upon the virgin with lust.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,516
113
Anaheim, Cali.
You are assuming that people are supposed to be introduced to the Gospel in church. From reading the New Testament, we can surmise that this was not typical of the experience of new converts in the first century, who heard preaching in the temple, synagogues, or marketplaces. Since you mentioned American history, in the colonial period, George Whitfield preached outdoors to crowds of people. There were large campmeetings outdoors during the second great awakening also.
I in fact was very anti church until I met some Christians who were holding evening bible studies under a tree in a park. Before I attended the first church that I could actively be a part of or become saved.