Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
J

JohnW34

Banned
#120,921
Jan 5, 2020
263
60
28
#120,921
dcontroversal said:
WASHED clean by baptism of JOHN AHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH
Click to expand...
Luke 3:3-4
He went into all the country around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.
As is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet: "A voice of one calling in the desert, 'Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him."

Mark 2:5-7
When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven."
Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves,
"Why does this fellow talk like that? He's blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?"

Being cleansed is testified as the ministry of John, and Jesus.

Luke 1:76-79
And you, my child, will be called a prophet of the Most High; for you will go on before the Lord to prepare the way for him, to give his people the knowledge of salvation through the forgiveness of their sins,
because of the tender mercy of our God, by which the rising sun will come to us from heaven to shine on those living in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the path of peace."

Of Zechariah and Elizabeth, Johns parents it is written
Luke 1:6 (NET)
They were both righteous in the sight of God, following all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blamelessly.

A theology can contradict Gods revelation. The test is do we change our views and ways to accept Gods ways or insist we are right and scripture is wrong. This is the eternal question, is Christ truly dwelling in us, or are we from a different Kingdom.
 
D

Discern

Banned
#120,922
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
113
#120,922
Judges1318 said:
This just made me realize that you too believe that a person can go back to unbelief and they are still saved. Because you believe that the unbelief will not be permanent in the one who has genuinely believed and been saved.

I only believe that there is still hope for the person who has gone back to unbelief if they respond to whatever attempt, if any, God makes to bring them back. But after that......they're out for good with no opportunity to come back. That's why we shouldn't play around with unbelief, like the Galatians did. We will find out one day if they responded to God's call to come back to faith in Christ for justification. Paul wondered if they would. He didn't say they wo
Click to expand...
Judges1318 said:
Right.
Your belief makes Jesus' faithfulness applicable to you.
Faith is how you access the faithful and never ending ministry of Christ (Romans 5:1).
That's why you have to continue to believe in it to continue to have the benefit of it.
That's what he told the Galatians.


Believers do not lose the choice to hold fast to Christ in faith.
The saved Galatians exercised their freedom to depart from faith in Christ for justification and went back to the law for justification.
And Paul expressed concern that he had wasted all his effort on them.
Which shows us he did not believe 1) that they remained saved despite their rejection of Christ, or 2) that they would categorically and without exception come back to faith in Christ.
See, in osas, there would be no consideration whatsoever about having wasted time and effort on saved people who fall because they always, in the end, will be saved. Obviously, Paul did not believe that.
Click to expand...
the Galatians were being deceived. Satan tries to deceive the Elect. We agree that he will not succeed. He may suceed for a season, but he will not suceed in causing the elect to fall permenently. We agree on this

Our difference is this. You believe they are elect because they continue in the faith once delivered to the Saints. I believe they continue because they are elect.

I feel led not to participate in these forums anymore. Nothing against anyone here, but I feel that it’s time for me to move on. I am about to embark on something that needs my full attention. May God grace you all.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#120,923
#120,923
JohnW34 said:
Luke 3:3-4
He went into all the country around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.
As is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet: "A voice of one calling in the desert, 'Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him."

Mark 2:5-7
When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven."
Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves,
"Why does this fellow talk like that? He's blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?"

Being cleansed is testified as the ministry of John, and Jesus.

Luke 1:76-79
And you, my child, will be called a prophet of the Most High; for you will go on before the Lord to prepare the way for him, to give his people the knowledge of salvation through the forgiveness of their sins,
because of the tender mercy of our God, by which the rising sun will come to us from heaven to shine on those living in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the path of peace."

Of Zechariah and Elizabeth, Johns parents it is written
Luke 1:6 (NET)
They were both righteous in the sight of God, following all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blamelessly.

A theology can contradict Gods revelation. The test is do we change our views and ways to accept Gods ways or insist we are right and scripture is wrong. This is the eternal question, is Christ truly dwelling in us, or are we from a different Kingdom.
Click to expand...
The problem comes when we replace the baptism of God with the baptism in water, and hence attributing to man the work of God.

we are in serious danger.

i am not saying your doing this,just making a basic remark, I am not sure yet what you believe here,


circumcision was a huge sign in the OT. But that’s all it was a sign, NT jews demanded we must be circumcized to be cleansed,

sadly, many churches have replaced the physical act of circumcision with the. Physical act of water baptism.

paul makes it clear in Col 2. Is if the spiritual circumcision done by the hand of God through the spiritual baptism of the HS, that cleanses us (see also titus 3, it is the washing of regeneration of the HS which saves us)
 
D

Discern

Banned
#120,924
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
113
#120,924
eternally-gratefull said:
Again

works are not necessary, they are natural

saying they are necessary makes them a requirment for salvation. Makes it salvation by works.

Don’t be fooled by Ralphie here, he is promoting works as amens of maintaining salvation, not as the natural result of entrusting our lives to Christ and learning to trust him in areas of our life. Ie, true saving faith not just mere belief.
Click to expand...
I have already said that saying something is required and saying something will occur as a result of what God is doing in us and has done in us are two different things. Don’t worry. My position on this has not changed. In general, you and I believe the same.

I don’t think I will be posting for a while, because I am embarking on things that are going to keep me busy. We’re going to spend more time taking it to the streets. Pray for us.
 
Rosemaryx

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
#120,925
May 3, 2017
3,758
4,120
113
63
#120,925
PS said:
Provided the sheep do not think the grass is greener on the other side.

If you have ever watched sheepdog trialling, you will know how wilful sheep can be.
Click to expand...
That is why I love that the LORD Jesus is my master , and will NOT lose any of His , I have no worries , I am in the palm of His hand , and His Father's hand also , double security , how wonderful is that :love:
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#120,926
#120,926
Discern said:
I have already said that saying something is required and saying something will occur as a result of what God is doing in us and has done in us are two different things. Don’t worry. My position on this has not changed. In general, you and I believe the same.

I don’t think I will be posting for a while, because I am embarking on things that are going to keep me busy. We’re going to spend more time taking it to the streets. Pray for us.
Click to expand...
I know you do bro, I know it

but when you keep agreeing with these people, you as much as telling they they are right.

If they get one word wrong, it’s a different gospel. And as Paul said the gospel is no gospel,at all

thats what worries us bro. God bless you In your endeavors,
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,927
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
#120,927
Luke 13
23 Then one said to Him, “Lord, are there few who are saved?”

And He said to them, 24 “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ 26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ 27 But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#120,928
#120,928
Rosemaryx said:
That is why I love that the LORD Jesus is my master , and will NOT lose any of His , I have no worries , I am in the palm of His hand , and His Father's hand also , double security , how wonderful is that :love:
Click to expand...
This is why you will Never lose faith, it may waver, and may even be low in areas of your life, but as far as salvation, you are secure, because your trust is in Christ, not in how good,or faithful YOU are,
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#120,929
#120,929
I love how people post the passage about how we must strive to enter the narrow gate, and few their are that do

then goes on the teach the same gospel most world religion teaches, that our salvation is essentially based on our works and our obedience. and rejects the work of Christ and his obedience as the means of salvation

i am so glad I am part of the (few) and give all glory and credit where it is due, my savior.
 
RebuildJesussChurch

RebuildJesussChurch

Active member
#120,930
Nov 24, 2019
395
196
43
Virginia
www.youtube.com
#120,930
dcontroversal said:
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!
New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Click to expand...
The cords of death encompassed me; the torrents of destruction assailed me; the cords of the grave entangled me; the snares of death confronted me.
In my distress I called upon the Lord; to my God I cried for help. From His temple He heard my voice, and my cry to Him reached His ears.

That was the state He found us in - overwhelmed by sin and powerless to save ourselves. But thank God He bore our sin in His body on the cross that we would be released from its power. He has taken it away and removed ungodliness from within us. He has justified us freely by His grace and Jesus Christ is our righteousness. He has cast all our sins in to the depths of the sea and our consciences have been cleansed.

The Lord has dealt with me according to my righteousness; according to the cleanness of my hands He rewarded me. He has equipped me with strength and made my way blameless. He made my feet like the feet of a deer and set me secure on the heights. He is my stronghold. As His son, His Spirit leads me. As His sheep, I obey His voice abiding in Him and His love. This is the Way.

For those God foreknew He also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of His Son, that He would be the firstborn among many brothers.
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#120,931
Jan 18, 2011
12,394
6,734
113
#120,931
Chris1975 said:
Luke 13
23 Then one said to Him, “Lord, are there few who are saved?”

And He said to them, 24 “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ 26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ 27 But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’
Click to expand...
the narrow path is trusting and believing in Christ for salvation.

the broad path is the path of religion, what you push. the broad path is " believe in Jesus and...…..".

you indicated that you accept the definition of " believe". accept also that the narrow path is to believe only.
 
J

JohnW34

Banned
#120,932
Jan 5, 2020
263
60
28
#120,932
gb9 said:
the narrow path is trusting and believing in Christ for salvation.

the broad path is the path of religion, what you push. the broad path is " believe in Jesus and...…..".

you indicated that you accept the definition of " believe". accept also that the narrow path is to believe only.
Click to expand...
Phil 3:8
More than that, I now regard all things as liabilities compared to the far greater value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things – indeed, I regard them as dung! – that I may gain Christ,

2 Peter 1:8
For if these things are really yours and are continually increasing, they will keep you from becoming ineffective and unproductive in your pursuit of knowing our Lord Jesus Christ more intimately.

John 14:15
If you love me, you will obey my commandments.

Rom 6:17-18
But thanks be to God that though you were slaves to sin, you obeyed from the heart that pattern of teaching you were entrusted to,
and having been freed from sin, you became enslaved to righteousness.
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,934
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
#120,934
gb9 said:
the narrow path is trusting and believing in Christ for salvation.

the broad path is the path of religion, what you push. the broad path is " believe in Jesus and...…..".

you indicated that you accept the definition of " believe". accept also that the narrow path is to believe only.
Click to expand...
Post 120933
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,936
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
#120,936
gb9 said:
I do not care what some dude who received " a prophecy" about 10,000 fires engulfing new York has to say.

he, like you, is a false teaching works salvationist.
Click to expand...
Your tongue is quick to slander a true man of God.
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#120,937
Jan 18, 2011
12,394
6,734
113
#120,937
definition of apostasy - a falling away, a deception.

a falling away from what? a deception about what?

well, what saves?


belief in Jesus.

so, to fall away from that or be deceived away from believing in Jesus is what is warned against.

so, do not let these lying work salvationists deceive by trying to paint a picture that struggling with sin will cause you to " lose your salvation.

do not fall for this religious con game.
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,938
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
#120,938
gb9 said:
the narrow path is trusting and believing in Christ for salvation.

the broad path is the path of religion, what you push. the broad path is " believe in Jesus and...…..".

you indicated that you accept the definition of " believe". accept also that the narrow path is to believe only.
Click to expand...
You say you "believe" in Jesus. Do you believe His words?
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#120,939
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113
#120,939
eternally-gratefull said:
A sheep is still sheep, and belongs to god

a dog is still a dog, and belongs to satan, he enjoys eating his vomit (the fruit of his sin)
Click to expand...
Don't be silly.

Sheep have different masters. That is stupid. People are people, but not many belong to the Father.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.