Denomination threads?
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The only other Christian run site I was on for any length of time was CARM. They have a multitude of sub-forums, for every denomination imaginable LOL. I am just guessing that it is every denomination, since I don't think I know them all. I did learn of new ones while there 
I mostly spoke with non-believers while I was there
There is a sub-forum for them, also.
I mostly spoke with non-believers while I was there
There is a sub-forum for them, also.
BTW, there are hundreds of Christian denominations, so they probably didn't have all of them
If I were in charge (which obviously I'm not, LOL), I could see some reasonable groupings. There's an organization that does statistical studies of religious attitudes in the US -- it's called PEW, maybe you've heard of them. Anyway, they generally divide Christianity into some broad categories: - Catholicism, which includes Roman Catholic and also many Orthodox churches (Greek Orthodox, Russian Orthodox, etc.)
- Mainline Protestantism, which includes the more traditional protestants: Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, etc.
- Evangelical Protestants, which will be your more modern sects, like most (though not all) non-denominational congregations, Southern Baptists, plus a ton of smaller denomination
- "Historically Black Protestant," which includes the National Baptist Convention, the African Methodist Episcopal Church, and a few others
- Other organizations, such as Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses.
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try christian forums, it was a huge site and had every denomination imaginable, including catholic and mormon friendly forums and baptists, and even ones for gun nuts. It even had a gardening one. I know cos I was on it.
This one is much smaller, but still lively. I find this one a bit more managable. I have no interest in denoms though so I find it much better for me on here.
This one is much smaller, but still lively. I find this one a bit more managable. I have no interest in denoms though so I find it much better for me on here.
I'm sorry, I thought I answered that before, but I may not have, or you may have missed it. I understand it's easy to miss posts sometimes.
A Christian is someone who worships Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.
Catholics do this.
My question would be, when did they stop being Christians?
Catholicism was the only Christian church in the world for the first 1,000 years, and then the only Church in the Western World for the next 500. So my questions for you are:
1. Are you arguing that today's Catholics are not the same as the Catholics from the time of Peter until some point?
2. If so, when is that point?
3. What, specifically, happened at that point to make them cease to be Christians?
4. If your answer to #1 is no, then you're arguing that there were NO Christians on the entire planet for 1500 years (or more, depending on your view of Martin Luther, etc.). Correct? (If no, please explain the logic to me, because I don't see it.)
5. If that's the case, why do you trust the Bible that the Catholic Church wrote, translated, and protected, if you don't trust them?
I have to go help my son with his math homework. I would like to answer these questions, so if you give me ~12 hours, I'll get back to you, if that's okay. I, too, would like to discuss this matter with you in a respectful and open manner. Again, I wish to express for the record that I categorically disagree with many (most?) of the doctrines of the Catholic Church. But as I've also said, I disagree with many doctrines of many churches. That doesn't mean that they aren't Christian.
A Christian is someone who worships Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.
Catholics do this.
My question would be, when did they stop being Christians?
Catholicism was the only Christian church in the world for the first 1,000 years, and then the only Church in the Western World for the next 500. So my questions for you are:
1. Are you arguing that today's Catholics are not the same as the Catholics from the time of Peter until some point?
2. If so, when is that point?
3. What, specifically, happened at that point to make them cease to be Christians?
4. If your answer to #1 is no, then you're arguing that there were NO Christians on the entire planet for 1500 years (or more, depending on your view of Martin Luther, etc.). Correct? (If no, please explain the logic to me, because I don't see it.)
5. If that's the case, why do you trust the Bible that the Catholic Church wrote, translated, and protected, if you don't trust them?
I have to go help my son with his math homework. I would like to answer these questions, so if you give me ~12 hours, I'll get back to you, if that's okay. I, too, would like to discuss this matter with you in a respectful and open manner. Again, I wish to express for the record that I categorically disagree with many (most?) of the doctrines of the Catholic Church. But as I've also said, I disagree with many doctrines of many churches. That doesn't mean that they aren't Christian.
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I will look for that one. That seems to be more like what I am looking for. Thank you!
BTW, there are hundreds of Christian denominations, so they probably didn't have all of them If I were in charge (which obviously I'm not, LOL), I could see some reasonable groupings. There's an organization that does statistical studies of religious attitudes in the US -- it's called PEW, maybe you've heard of them. Anyway, they generally divide Christianity into some broad categories:
BTW, there are hundreds of Christian denominations, so they probably didn't have all of them
If I were in charge (which obviously I'm not, LOL), I could see some reasonable groupings. There's an organization that does statistical studies of religious attitudes in the US -- it's called PEW, maybe you've heard of them. Anyway, they generally divide Christianity into some broad categories:- Catholicism, which includes Roman Catholic and also many Orthodox churches (Greek Orthodox, Russian Orthodox, etc.)
- Mainline Protestantism, which includes the more traditional protestants: Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, etc.
- Evangelical Protestants, which will be your more modern sects, like most (though not all) non-denominational congregations, Southern Baptists, plus a ton of smaller denomination
- "Historically Black Protestant," which includes the National Baptist Convention, the African Methodist Episcopal Church, and a few others
- Other organizations, such as Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses.
I hope you enjoy your time a CARM if you go there. It is quite an extensive site...
Or used to be. They were hacked quite a few years ago, and it kind of really messed things up for a while, after which, their format was changed, and I am not entirely certain of this, but they may have ads that disrupt the flow of conversations displayed (the hack and all that occurred after I had joined here over five years ago, and I basically had stopped posting at CARM, except for one notable time I remember when CC was down for a seemingly long while for maintenance or something). I have visited at least one or two other Christian chat sites very briefly during my time here, and that (disruptive ads) was certainly the case on the other sites. One of those other sites suddenly just went bye bye a while back. All in all, I do find Christian Chat to be superior
Ooh, are you Orthodox? We westerners do tend to be egocentric, seeing the world revolve around Rome, even if we're not Roman Catholic, and see that as the center of the universe sometimes, don't we?
But since the earliest Christian church was Jerusalem, which was decidedly east of Rome (east, even, of Greece!), if one church was seen to have "broken away" from the other, you would have to argue that Rome split from the Eastern churches, not the other way around.
I think most Historians, to be as unbiased as possible, say that the two parted ways at the Great Schism. But you are quite right in correcting me, because I did imply that the Roman church was the first, and the Eastern churches split away from Rome, and that is factually incorrect.
Seriously, if you are Orthodox, I would like to discuss more with you. I have great respect for the Orthodox churches (more than the RCC), and relish any opportunity to converse with members.
But since the earliest Christian church was Jerusalem, which was decidedly east of Rome (east, even, of Greece!), if one church was seen to have "broken away" from the other, you would have to argue that Rome split from the Eastern churches, not the other way around.
I think most Historians, to be as unbiased as possible, say that the two parted ways at the Great Schism. But you are quite right in correcting me, because I did imply that the Roman church was the first, and the Eastern churches split away from Rome, and that is factually incorrect.
Seriously, if you are Orthodox, I would like to discuss more with you. I have great respect for the Orthodox churches (more than the RCC), and relish any opportunity to converse with members.
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Well, that certainly is possible.
I currently own 5 different Bibles, not including a TaNaKh, which is in Hebrew, and an interlinear Greek/English New Testament.
All of my English-language Bibles have an "Old Testament" and a "New Testament."
The "Old Testament" (again, in all of the English-language Bibles ... the Hebrew Bible has a different order which I can share with you if you're interested) is separated into 4 parts:
The first is called the "Pentateuch," and includes Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.
The second part is called "The Historic Books" or sometimes "The Early Prophets," and includes Joshua, Judges, Ruth, 1 & 2 Samuel, 1 & 2 Kings, 1 & 2 Chronicles, Ezra, Nehemiah, and Esther.
The next section is called the "Writings" and includes Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Songs (sometimes called "Song of Solomon)
The final section is called "The Prophets" or "The Later Prophets," and includes Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel, Daniel, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, and Malachi.
The "New Testament" is also separated into 4 parts:
First, we've got the Gospels: Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.
Next, we have what one of my pastors liked to call, "Luke: The Sequel," The Acts of the Apostles.
After that, we have the Epistles (or "letters"): Romans, 1 & 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Thessalonians, 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon, James, 1 & 2 Peter, 1 2 & 3 John, and Jude.
Last but not least, we have the Revelation of John.
If this differs from your Bible at all, please let me know how it's different, and we can discuss it more. I would be very interested to hear how your Bible is different.
I currently own 5 different Bibles, not including a TaNaKh, which is in Hebrew, and an interlinear Greek/English New Testament.
All of my English-language Bibles have an "Old Testament" and a "New Testament."
The "Old Testament" (again, in all of the English-language Bibles ... the Hebrew Bible has a different order which I can share with you if you're interested) is separated into 4 parts:
The first is called the "Pentateuch," and includes Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.
The second part is called "The Historic Books" or sometimes "The Early Prophets," and includes Joshua, Judges, Ruth, 1 & 2 Samuel, 1 & 2 Kings, 1 & 2 Chronicles, Ezra, Nehemiah, and Esther.
The next section is called the "Writings" and includes Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Songs (sometimes called "Song of Solomon)
The final section is called "The Prophets" or "The Later Prophets," and includes Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel, Daniel, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, and Malachi.
The "New Testament" is also separated into 4 parts:
First, we've got the Gospels: Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.
Next, we have what one of my pastors liked to call, "Luke: The Sequel," The Acts of the Apostles.
After that, we have the Epistles (or "letters"): Romans, 1 & 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Thessalonians, 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon, James, 1 & 2 Peter, 1 2 & 3 John, and Jude.
Last but not least, we have the Revelation of John.
If this differs from your Bible at all, please let me know how it's different, and we can discuss it more. I would be very interested to hear how your Bible is different.
Well, first of all, the Pharisees were Jews, not Catholics. But that's not really the point. You are correct that the word "Catholic" is not in any Bible I know of.
Neither is the word "Protestant."
So, by your logic, are "Protestants" also not Christian?
Here are a few other words that aren't in the KJV Bible:
The word "Christian" only pops up in the KJV 3 times:
Are there Christians who don't follow Jesus 100% of the time? I think all of them probably fit in this definition. Are there followers of Jesus who aren't Christians? I would argue the answer is "no."
The KJV does say, "Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life."
Hopefully, you have read that verse at least once or twice in your life. If you need me to give you BCV, I'm happy to oblige, but I think you can find it yourself.
Granted, it does not say, "Whosoever believeth in him will be a Christian." Though to be honest, I guess I've always seen "Christian" and "saved" as kind of synonymous. But I'll admit I could be wrong. I could always be wrong. I ain't god!
I will grant: It is possible that there is some group of people -- let's just call them "X" for now -- who are not Christian, but who do have eternal life. For example, this group X could include people like Catholics and Mormons, people who clearly have false doctrines, but they most certainly do believe in Jesus. So, according to the Bible, they have eternal life. But depending on how you define "Christian," they may not qualify for that.
Maybe that's where you're going with this?
The only other possibilities are that YOU are wrong, or that THE BIBLE is wrong.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I know which one I'm going with.
You had also asked for other references or websites or any other evidence or "proof" that Catholics are Christian. I offer the following:
Secular sites:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris...anches,widely diverging beliefs and practices.
http://www.mesacc.edu/~thoqh49081/handouts/denominations.html
https://www.history.com/topics/religion/history-of-christianity
https://hobart.k12.in.us/ksms/worldreligions/Christian/denominations.htm
https://kids.kiddle.co/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members
Protestant and Evangelical sites:
https://www.churchrelevance.com/2012/06/22/qa-list-of-christian-denominations-and-their-beliefs/
https://www.christianity.com/church/denominations/
http://hirr.hartsem.edu/denom/homepages.html
General religious sites (non-partisan):
https://www.learnreligions.com/comparing-christian-denominations-beliefs-part-1-700537
https://www.churchfinder.com/christian-denominations
https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/
In fact, I could not find any site that did not list Catholicism in a list of Christian denominations. So I think at this point the onus is on you to explain how Catholics are NOT Christian.
Again, I'm not saying Catholics are correct on any of their doctrine. (Well, they have a few doctrines which are correct. I bet even you would agree with them on their position on abortion, am I wrong?) I'm simply saying that they fit into the category of "Christian." They worship Jesus, which is the only requirement, according to Scripture.
If you think there are additional requirements for someone to be "Christian," I would like to hear them, and (1) Why you believe that, despite the Bible's teaching to the contrary, (2) what authority you have for that belief, since the Bible says otherwise, and (3) why this source should be accepted by anyone else?
Neither is the word "Protestant."
So, by your logic, are "Protestants" also not Christian?
Here are a few other words that aren't in the KJV Bible:
- Bible
- Fundamentalist
- Evangelical
- Charismatic
- Spirit-filled
- America
The word "Christian" only pops up in the KJV 3 times:
- Acts 11:26, disciples were called "Christians" first in Antioch
- Acts 26:28, Agrippa mentioned being persuaded to become "a Christian"
- 1 Peter 4:16, Peter encourages people who suffer for being "Christian"
Are there Christians who don't follow Jesus 100% of the time? I think all of them probably fit in this definition. Are there followers of Jesus who aren't Christians? I would argue the answer is "no."
The KJV does say, "Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life."
Hopefully, you have read that verse at least once or twice in your life. If you need me to give you BCV, I'm happy to oblige, but I think you can find it yourself.
Granted, it does not say, "Whosoever believeth in him will be a Christian." Though to be honest, I guess I've always seen "Christian" and "saved" as kind of synonymous. But I'll admit I could be wrong. I could always be wrong. I ain't god!
I will grant: It is possible that there is some group of people -- let's just call them "X" for now -- who are not Christian, but who do have eternal life. For example, this group X could include people like Catholics and Mormons, people who clearly have false doctrines, but they most certainly do believe in Jesus. So, according to the Bible, they have eternal life. But depending on how you define "Christian," they may not qualify for that.
Maybe that's where you're going with this?
The only other possibilities are that YOU are wrong, or that THE BIBLE is wrong.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I know which one I'm going with.
You had also asked for other references or websites or any other evidence or "proof" that Catholics are Christian. I offer the following:
Secular sites:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris...anches,widely diverging beliefs and practices.
http://www.mesacc.edu/~thoqh49081/handouts/denominations.html
https://www.history.com/topics/religion/history-of-christianity
https://hobart.k12.in.us/ksms/worldreligions/Christian/denominations.htm
https://kids.kiddle.co/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members
Protestant and Evangelical sites:
https://www.churchrelevance.com/2012/06/22/qa-list-of-christian-denominations-and-their-beliefs/
https://www.christianity.com/church/denominations/
http://hirr.hartsem.edu/denom/homepages.html
General religious sites (non-partisan):
https://www.learnreligions.com/comparing-christian-denominations-beliefs-part-1-700537
https://www.churchfinder.com/christian-denominations
https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/
In fact, I could not find any site that did not list Catholicism in a list of Christian denominations. So I think at this point the onus is on you to explain how Catholics are NOT Christian.
Again, I'm not saying Catholics are correct on any of their doctrine. (Well, they have a few doctrines which are correct. I bet even you would agree with them on their position on abortion, am I wrong?) I'm simply saying that they fit into the category of "Christian." They worship Jesus, which is the only requirement, according to Scripture.
If you think there are additional requirements for someone to be "Christian," I would like to hear them, and (1) Why you believe that, despite the Bible's teaching to the contrary, (2) what authority you have for that belief, since the Bible says otherwise, and (3) why this source should be accepted by anyone else?
Okay, let's see if you can keep up here.
I said that Jesus was Jewish, and then: "I'm not sure what that (Jesus' Jewishness) has to do with anything."
You responded:
And remember, by "it," we're talking about Jesus being Jewish.
So, being confused, I asked, "Being Jewish has everything to do with people who claim to Christians when they are not? Do you care to explain that?"
And then you responded:
So you're saying that Jesus was Catholic?!?!?!?
I disagree, but okay, for argument's sake, let's go with your assumption and pretend that Jesus is Catholic.
What on earth would Jesus' Catholicism have to do with people who claim to {be} Christians when they are not?
I said that Jesus was Jewish, and then: "I'm not sure what that (Jesus' Jewishness) has to do with anything."
You responded:
And remember, by "it," we're talking about Jesus being Jewish.
So, being confused, I asked, "Being Jewish has everything to do with people who claim to Christians when they are not? Do you care to explain that?"
And then you responded:
So you're saying that Jesus was Catholic?!?!?!?
I disagree, but okay, for argument's sake, let's go with your assumption and pretend that Jesus is Catholic.
What on earth would Jesus' Catholicism have to do with people who claim to {be} Christians when they are not?