Who was Jesus praying to in the garden of Gethsemane?

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

This translation is closer to Hebrew.

Isaiah 9:6

Complete Jewish Bible

6 (7) in order to extend the dominion
and perpetuate the peace
of the throne and kingdom of David,
to secure it and sustain it
through justice and righteousness
henceforth and forever.
The zeal of Adonai-Tzva’ot
will accomplish this.

Yeshayah 9:6

Orthodox Jewish Bible

6 (5) For unto us a yeled is born, unto us ben is given; and the misrah (dominion) shall be upon his shoulder; and Shmo shall be called Peleh (Wonderful), Yoetz (Counsellor), El Gibbor (Mighty G-d), Avi Ad (Possessor of Eternity), Sar Shalom (Prince of Peace).

Isaiah 9:6 YLT: For a Child hath been born to us, A Son hath been given to us, And the princely power is on his shoulder, And He doth call his name Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace.

"
Linguistically, – Ab carries the meaning of “possessor, “founder,” or “source.” For example, 2 Sam. 23:31 speaks of Abialbon– “father (or possessor) of strength,” strong one. In Exodus 6:24, “Abiasaph”– “father [possessor] of gathering,”

As with Malachi 2:10, – corresponding with that meaning, the term “father” carries the idea of “possessor,” “founder,” “source”- as with His role as Creator (cf. Duet. 32:6; Isa. 64:8; Mal. 2:10). So, the Messiah “possesses,” that is, the source of eternity—He is the Creator of all things .

5) Syntactically, the Hebrew term ab (“father”) precedes the word translated “eternal.” Thus, abiad (אֲבִיעַ֖ד), from the Hebrew ab (“father”) and ad (“forever, ever perpetuity”). Thus, literally, “father eternal” (not “eternal father”)—indicating the eternal nature of the Messiah.

Targums of Isa 9:6[3]: “For us a child is born, to us a son is given . . . and his name will be called the Wonderful Counselor, the Mighty God, existing forever [or “HE who lives forever”]. The Messiah in whose days peace shall increase upon us” (Targum Johnathan). " https://christiandefense.org/onenes...father-the-error-of-oneness-theology-refuted/

Father of Eternity is the basic reading in Hebrew.,

"The phrase that is used for what is usually translated Eternal Father is Aviad. The first part is Avi, which would be translated “Father of” or “my Father.” In Hebrew, av is father. Avi is used in a construct form throughout the Bible. Many names start out with “father of” or “my father” such as Abimelech. " https://faithfuldevotionals.wordpress.com/2015/08/02/commentary-on-isaiah-96-father-of-eternity/

Basically, oneness people will claim Jesus is the Father whereas those who read Hebrew understand the title as meaning "father of" or creator of all. Col 1

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

This is the edit for the Didache a historical source, church manual dating to around 110 AD

Chapter 7. Concerning Baptism
And concerning baptism, baptize this way: Having first said all these things, baptize into the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, Matthew 28:19 in living water. But if you have not living water, baptize into other water; and if you can not in cold, in warm. But if you have not either, pour out water thrice upon the head into the name of Father and Son and Holy Spirit. But before the baptism let the baptizer fast, and the baptized, and whatever others can; but you shall order the baptized to fast one or two days before.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Acts 13:2
World English Bible
2 As they served the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, “Separate Barnabas and Saul for me, for the work to which I have called them.”

The I in the above text is ego, the hallmark of personhood.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Mem said:

I am only showing that the doctrine of the Trinity is historically the view of the early church.

I could post many of the early church fathers quotes supporting the trinity if it is needed.

Sabellianism did not come around as a false teaching until around 200 to 300 AD.
https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0713.htm
https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/10448a.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabellius#Theology

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

This only a handful of early fathers supporting the trinity as mainline doctrine.

Polycarp (70-155/160). Bishop of Smyrna. Disciple of John the Apostle.

“O Lord God almighty . . . I bless you and glorify you through the eternal and heavenly high priest Jesus Christ, your beloved Son, through whom be glory to you, with Him and the Holy Spirit, both now and forever” (n. 14, ed. Funk; PG 5.1040).

Justin Martyr (100?-165?). He was a Christian apologist and martyr.

“For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water” (First Apol., LXI).

Ignatius of Antioch (died 98/117). Bishop of Antioch. He wrote much in defense of Christianity.

“In Christ Jesus our Lord, by whom and with whom be glory and power to the Father with the Holy Spirit for ever” (n. 7; PG 5.988).
“We have also as a Physician the Lord our God Jesus the Christ the only-begotten Son and Word, before time began, but who afterwards became also man, of Mary the virgin. For ‘the Word was made flesh.’ Being incorporeal, He was in the body; being impassible, He was in a passable body; being immortal, He was in a mortal body; being life, He became subject to corruption, that He might free our souls from death and corruption, and heal them, and might restore them to health, when they were diseased with ungodliness and wicked lusts.” (Alexander Roberts and James Donaldson, eds., The ante-Nicene Fathers, Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1975 rpt., Vol. 1, p. 52, Ephesians 7.)

Irenaeus (115-190). As a boy he listened to Polycarp, the disciple of John. He became Bishop of Lyons.

“The Church, though dispersed throughout the whole world, even to the ends of the earth, has received from the apostles and their disciples this faith: . . . one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are in them; and in one Christ Jesus, the Son of God, who became incarnate for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit, who proclaimed through the prophets the dispensations of God, and the advents, and the birth from a virgin, and the passion, and the resurrection from the dead, and the ascension into heaven in the flesh of the beloved Christ Jesus, our Lord, and His manifestation from heaven in the glory of the Father ‘to gather all things in one,’ and to raise up anew all flesh of the whole human race, in order that to Christ Jesus, our Lord, and God, and Savior, and King, according to the will of the invisible Father, ‘every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth, and that every tongue should confess; to him, and that He should execute just judgment towards all . . . ‘” (Against Heresies X.l)

Tertullian (160-215). African apologist and theologian. He wrote much in defense of Christianity.

“We define that there are two, the Father and the Son, and three with the Holy Spirit, and this number is made by the pattern of salvation . . . [which] brings about unity in trinity, interrelating the three, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. They are three, not in dignity, but in degree, not in substance but in form, not in power but in kind. They are of one substance and power, because there is one God from whom these degrees, forms and kinds devolve in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit.” (Adv. Prax. 23; PL 2.156-7).

Origen (185-254). Alexandrian theologian. Defended Christianity and wrote much about Christianity.

“If anyone would say that the Word of God or the Wisdom of God had a beginning, let him beware lest he direct his impiety rather against the unbegotten Father, since he denies that he was always Father, and that he has always begotten the Word, and that he always had wisdom in all previous times or ages or whatever can be imagined in priority . . . There can be no more ancient title of almighty God than that of Father, and it is through the Son that he is Father” (De Princ. 1.2.; PG 11.132).

“For if [the Holy Spirit were not eternally as He is, and had received knowledge at some time and then became the Holy Spirit] this were the case, the Holy Spirit would never be reckoned in the unity of the Trinity, i.e., along with the unchangeable Father and His Son, unless He had always been the Holy Spirit.” (Alexander Roberts and James Donaldson, eds., The Ante-Nicene Fathers, Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1975 rpt., Vol. 4, p. 253, de Principiis, 1.111.4)

“Moreover, nothing in the Trinity can be called greater or less, since the fountain of divinity alone contains all things by His word and reason, and by the Spirit of His mouth sanctifies all things which are worthy of sanctification . . . ” (Roberts and Donaldson, Ante-Nicene Fathers, Vol. 4, p. 255, de Principii., I. iii. 7).

https://carm.org/doctrine-and-theology/early-trinitarian-quotes-the-doctrine-of-the-trinity/

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Ignatius a.d. 30–107

Since, also, there is but one unbegotten Being, God, even the Father; and one only-begotten Son, God, the Word and man; and one Comforter, the Spirit of truth; and also one preaching, and one faith, and one baptism;
The Epistle of Ignatius to the Philadelphians Chapter IV

But the Holy Spirit does not speak His own things, but those of Christ, and that not from himself, but from the Lord; even as the Lord also announced to us the things that He received from the Father. For, says He, “the word which ye hear is not Mine, but the Father’s, who sent Me.” And says He of the Holy Spirit, “He shall not speak of Himself, but whatsoever things He shall hear from Me.” And He says of Himself to the Father, “I have,” says He, “glorified Thee upon the earth; I have finished the work which, Thou gavest Me; I have manifested Thy name to men.” And of the Holy Ghost, “He shall glorify Me, for He receives of Mine.”
The Epistle of Ignatius to the Ephesians Chapter IX

For if there is one God of the universe, the Father of Christ, “of whom are all things;” and one Lord Jesus Christ, our [Lord], “by whom are all things;” and also one Holy Spirit, who wrought in Moses, and in the prophets and apostles;
The Epistle of Ignatius to the Philippians Chapter I

Justin Martyr a.d. 110–165

For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Saviour Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water.
The First Apology Chapter LXI

Ireneaus a.d. 120–202

The Church, though dispersed through our the whole world, even to the ends of the earth, has received from the apostles and their disciples this faith: [She believes] in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are in them; and in one Christ Jesus, the Son of God, who became incarnate for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit, who proclaimed through the prophets the dispensations of God, and the advents, and the birth from a virgin, and the passion, and the resurrection from the dead, and the ascension into heaven in the flesh of the beloved Christ Jesus, our Lord, and His [future] manifestation from heaven in the glory of the Father “to gather all things in one,” . . .
Against Heresies Book I Chapter X

The rule of truth which we hold, is, that there is one God Almighty, who made all things by His Word, and fashioned and formed, out of that which had no existence, all things which exist. Thus saith the Scripture, to that effect “By the Word of the Lord were the heavens established, and all the might of them, by the spirit of His mouth.” And again, “All things were made by Him, and without Him was nothing made.” There is no exception or deduction stated; but the Father made all things by Him, whether visible or invisible, objects of sense or of intelligence, temporal, on account of a certain character given them, or eternal; and these eternal things He did not make by angels, or by any powers separated from His Ennœa.
For God needs none of all these things, but is He who, by His Word and Spirit, makes, and disposes, and governs all things, and commands all things into existence,—He who formed the world (for the world is of all),—He who fashioned man,—He [who] is the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, above whom there is no other God, nor initial principle, nor power, nor pleroma,—He is the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, as we shall prove.
Book I Chapter XXII

Therefore neither would the Lord, nor the Holy Spirit, nor the apostles, have ever named as God, definitely and absolutely, him who was not God, unless he were truly God; nor would they have named any one in his own person Lord, except God the Father ruling over all, and His Son who has received dominion from His Father over all creation, as this passage has it: “The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit Thou at my right hand, until I make Thine enemies Thy footstool.” Here the [Scripture] represents to us the Father addressing the Son; He who gave Him the inheritance of the heathen, and subjected to Him all His enemies. Since, therefore, the Father is truly Lord, and the Son truly Lord, the Holy Spirit has fitly designated them by the title of Lord.
Against Heresies Book III Chapter VI

For with Him were always present the Word and Wisdom, the Son and the Spirit, by whom and in whom, freely and spontaneously, He made all things, to whom also He speaks, saying, “Let Us make man after Our image and likeness;” He taking from Himself the substance of the creatures [formed], and the pattern of things made, and the type of all the adornments in the world.
Against Heresies Book IV Chapter XX

Clement of Alexandria a.d. 153–217

O mystic marvel! The universal Father is one, and one the universal Word; and the Holy Spirit is one and the same everywhere, . . .
The Instructor. Book I Chapter VI

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Tertullian a.d. 145–220

In the course of time, then, the Father forsooth was born, and the Father suffered, God Himself, the Lord Almighty, whom in their preaching they declare to be Jesus Christ. We, however, as we indeed always have done (and more especially since we have been better instructed by the Paraclete, who leads men indeed into all truth), believe that there is one only God, but under the following dispensation, or οἰκονομία , as it is called, that this one only God has also a Son, His Word, who proceeded from Himself, by whom all things were made, and without whom nothing was made. Him we believe to have been sent by the Father into the Virgin, and to have been born of her—being both Man and God, the Son of Man and the Son of God, and to have been called by the name of Jesus Christ; we believe Him to have suffered, died, and been buried, according to the Scriptures, and, after He had been raised again by the Father and taken back to heaven, to be sitting at the right hand of the Father, and that He will come to judge the quick and the dead; who sent also from heaven from the Father, according to His own promise, the Holy Ghost, the Paraclete, the sanctifier of the faith of those who believe in the Father, and in the Son, and in the Holy Ghost.
But keeping this prescriptive rule inviolate, still some opportunity must be given for reviewing (the statements of heretics), with a view to the instruction and protection of divers persons; were it only that it may not seem that each perversion of the truth is condemned without examination, and simply prejudged; especially in the case of this heresy, which supposes itself to possess the pure truth, in thinking that one cannot believe in One Only God in any other way than by saying that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost are the very selfsame Person. As if in this way also one were not All, in that All are of One, by unity (that is) of substance; while the mystery of the dispensation is still guarded, which distributes the Unity into a Trinity, placing in their order the three Persons—the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost: three, however, not in condition, but in degree; not in substance, but in form; not in power, but in aspect; yet of one substance, and of one condition, and of one power, inasmuch as He is one God, from whom these degrees and forms and aspects are reckoned, under the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. How they are susceptible of number without division, will be shown as our treatise proceeds.
Against Praxeas Chapter II

The simple, indeed, (I will not call them unwise and unlearned,) who always constitute the majority of believers, are startled at the dispensation (of the Three in One), on the ground that their very rule of faith withdraws them from the world’s plurality of gods to the one only true God; not understanding that, although He is the one only God, He must yet be believed in with His own οἰκονομία . The numerical order and distribution of the Trinity they assume to be a division of the Unity; whereas the Unity which derives the Trinity out of its own self is so far from being destroyed, that it is actually supported by it. They are constantly throwing out against us that we are preachers of two gods and three gods, while they take to themselves pre-eminently the credit of being worshippers of the One God; just as if the Unity itself with irrational deductions did not produce heresy, and the Trinity rationally considered constitute the truth.
Against Praxeas Chapter III

But as for me, who derive the Son from no other source but from the substance of the Father, and (represent Him) as doing nothing without the Father’s will, and as having received all power from the Father, how can I be possibly destroying the Monarchy from the faith, when I preserve it in the Son just as it was committed to Him by the Father? The same remark (I wish also to be formally) made by me with respect to the third degree in the Godhead, because I believe the Spirit to proceed from no other source than from the Father through the Son.
Against Praxeas Chapter IV

Bear always in mind that this is the rule of faith which I profess; by it I testify that the Father, and the Son, and the Spirit are inseparable from each other, and so will you know in what sense this is said. Now, observe, my assertion is that the Father is one, and the Son one, and the Spirit one, and that They are distinct from Each Other. This statement is taken in a wrong sense by every uneducated as well as every perversely disposed person, as if it predicated a diversity, in such a sense as to imply a separation among the Father, and the Son, and the Spirit.
I am, moreover, obliged to say this, when (extolling the Monarchy at the expense of the Economy) they contend for the identity of the Father and Son and Spirit, that it is not by way of diversity that the Son differs from the Father, but by distribution: it is not by division that He is different, but by distinction; because the Father is not the same as the Son, since they differ one from the other in the mode of their being. For the Father is the entire substance, but the Son is a derivation and portion of the whole, as He Himself acknowledges: “My Father is greater than I.” In the Psalm His inferiority is described as being “a little lower than the angels.” Thus the Father is distinct from the Son, being greater than the Son, inasmuch as He who begets is one, and He who is begotten is another; He, too, who sends is one, and He who is sent is another; and He, again, who makes is one, and He through whom the thing is made is another.
Happily the Lord Himself employs this expression of the person of the Paraclete (Holy Spirit), so as to signify not a division or severance, but a disposition (of mutual relations in the Godhead); for He says, “I will pray the Father, and He shall send you another Comforter…even the Spirit of truth,” thus making the Paraclete distinct from Himself, even as we say that the Son is also distinct from the Father; so that He showed a third degree in the Paraclete, as we believe the second degree is in the Son, by reason of the order observed in the Economy. Besides, does not the very fact that they have the distinct names of Father and Son amount to a declaration that they are distinct in personality? For, of course, all things will be what their names represent them to be; and what they are and ever will be, that will they be called; and the distinction indicated by the names does not at all admit of any confusion, because there is none in the things which they designate. “Yes is yes, and no is no; for what is more than these, cometh of evil.”
Against Praxeas Chapter IX

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Origen a.d. 185–254

From all which we learn that the person of the Holy Spirit was of such authority and dignity, that saving baptism was not complete except by the authority of the most excellent Trinity of them all, i.e., by the naming of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and by joining to the unbegotten God the Father, and to His only-begotten Son, the name also of the Holy Spirit.
. . .
Nevertheless it seems proper to inquire what is the reason why he who is regenerated by God unto salvation has to do both with Father and Son and Holy Spirit, and does not obtain salvation unless with the co-operation of the entire Trinity; and why it is impossible to become partaker of the Father or the Son without the Holy Spirit.
Origen De Principiis. Book I Chapter III

But in our desire to show the divine benefits bestowed upon us by Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, which Trinity is the fountain of all holiness, we have fallen, in what we have said, into a digression, having considered that the subject of the soul, which accidentally came before us, should be touched on, although cursorily, seeing we were discussing a cognate topic relating to our rational nature. We shall, however, with the permission of God through Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, more conveniently consider in the proper place the subject of all rational beings, which are distinguished into three genera and species.
Origen De Principiis. Book I Chapter IV

For the end is always like the beginning: and, therefore, as there is one end to all things, so ought we to understand that there was one beginning; and as there is one end to many things, so there spring from one beginning many differences and varieties, which again, through the goodness of God, and by subjection to Christ, and through the unity of the Holy Spirit, are recalled to one end, which is like unto the beginning: all those, viz., who, bending the knee at the name of Jesus, make known by so doing their subjection to Him: and these are they who are in heaven, on earth, and under the earth: by which three classes the whole universe of things is pointed out, those, viz., who from that one beginning were arranged, each according to the diversity of his conduct, among the different orders, in accordance with their desert; for there was no goodness in them by essential being, as in God and His Christ, and in the Holy Spirit. For in the Trinity alone, which is the author of all things, does goodness exist in virtue of essential being; while others possess it as an accidental and perishable quality, and only then enjoy blessedness, when they participate in holiness and wisdom, and in divinity itself.
Origen De Principiis. Book I Chapter VI

After these points, now, we proved to the best of our power in the preceding pages that all things which exist were made by God, and that there was nothing which was not made, save the nature of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that God, who is by nature good, desiring to have those upon whom He might confer benefits, and who might rejoice in receiving His benefits, created creatures worthy (of this), i.e., who were capable of receiving Him in a worthy manner, who, He says, are also begotten by Him as his sons. He made all things, moreover, by number and measure. For there is nothing before God without either limit or measure. For by His power He comprehends all things, and He Himself is comprehended by the strength of no created thing, because that nature is known to itself alone. For the Father alone knoweth the Son, and the Son alone knoweth the Father, and the Holy Spirit alone searcheth even the deep things of God.
Origen De Principiis. Book IV Chapter I.35

If the heavenly virtues, then, partake of intellectual light, i.e., of divine nature, because they participate in wisdom and holiness, and if human souls, have partaken of the same light and wisdom, and thus are mutually of one nature and of one essence,—then, since the heavenly virtues are incorruptible and immortal, the essence of the human soul will also be immortal and incorruptible. And not only so, but because the nature of Father, and Son, and Holy Spirit, whose intellectual light alone all created things have a share, is incorruptible and eternal, it is altogether consistent and necessary that every substance which partakes of that eternal nature should last for ever, and be incorruptible and eternal, so that the eternity of divine goodness may be understood also in this respect, that they who obtain its benefits are also eternal. But as, in the instances referred to, a diversity in the participation of the light was observed, when the glance of the beholder was described as being duller or more acute, so also a diversity is to be noted in the participation of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, varying with the degree of zeal or capacity of mind.
Origen De Principiis. Book IV Chapter I.36

Dionysius, Bishop of Alexandria a.d. 200–265

The individual names uttered by me can neither be separated from one another, nor parted. I spoke of the Father, and before I made mention of the Son I already signified Him in the Father. I added the Son; and the Father, even although I had not previously named Him, had already been absolutely comprehended in the Son. I added the Holy Spirit; but, at the same time, I conveyed under the name whence and by whom He proceeded. But they are ignorant that neither the Father, in that He is Father, can be separated from the Son, for that name is the evident ground of coherence and conjunction; nor can the Son be separated from the Father, for this word Father indicates association between them. And there is, moreover, evident a Spirit who can neither be disjoined from Him who sends, nor from Him who brings Him. How, then, should I who use such names think that these are absolutely divided and separated the one from the other?
(After a few words he adds:—)
Thus, indeed, we expand the indivisible Unity into a Trinity; and again we contract the Trinity, which cannot be diminished, into a Unity.
(From the Same Second Book.)
In the beginning was the Word. But that was not the Word which produced the Word. For “the Word was with God.” The Lord is Wisdom; it was not therefore Wisdom that produced Wisdom; for “I was that” says He, “wherein He delighted.” Christ is truth; but “blessed,” says He, “is the God of truth.”
(The Conclusion of the Entire Treatise.)
In accordance with all these things, the form, moreover, and rule being received from the elders who have lived before us, we also, with a voice in accordance with them, will both acquit ourselves of thanks to you, and of the letter which we are now writing. And to God the Father, and His Son our Lord Jesus Christ, with the Holy Spirit, be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
The Works of Dionysius. Extant Fragments. Part I Chapter IV

Cyprian a.d. 200–258

Finally, when, after the resurrection, the apostles are sent by the Lord to the heathens, they are bidden to baptize the Gentiles “in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” How, then, do some say, that a Gentile baptized without, outside the Church, yea, and in opposition to the Church, so that it be only in the name of Jesus Christ, everywhere, and in whatever manner, can obtain remission of sin, when Christ Himself commands the heathen to be baptized in the full and united Trinity?
Epistle LXXII.5.18

Novatian a.d. 210–280

And now, indeed, concerning the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit, let it be sufficient to have briefly said thus much, and to have laid down these points concisely, without carrying them out in a lengthened argument. For they could be presented more diffusely and continued in a more expanded disputation, since the whole of the Old and New Testaments might be adduced in testimony that thus the true faith stands. But because heretics, ever struggling against the truth, are accustomed to prolong the controversy of pure tradition and Catholic faith, being offended against Christ; because He is, moreover, asserted to be God by the Scriptures also, and this is believed to be so by us; we must rightly—that every heretical calumny may be removed from our faith—contend, concerning the fact that Christ is God also, in such a way as that it may not militate against the truth of Scripture; nor yet against our faith, how there is declared to be one God by the Scriptures, and how it is held and believed by us.
A Treatise of Novatian Concerning the Trinity. Chapter XXX.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Alexander, Bishop of Alexandria a.d. 273–326

Therefore, when the holy prophets, and all, as I have said, who righteously and justly walked in the law of the Lord, together with the entire people, celebrated a typical and shadowy Passover, the Creator and Lord of every visible and invisible creature, the only-begotten Son, and the Word co-eternal with the Father and the Holy Spirit, and of the same substance with them, according to His divine nature, our Lord and God, Jesus Christ, . .
Epistles on the Arian Heresy And the Deposition of Arius. Chapter I.7

Therefore to the unbegotten Father, indeed, we ought to preserve His proper dignity, in confessing that no one is the cause of His being; but to the Son must be allotted His fitting honour, in assigning to Him, as we have said, a generation from the Father without beginning, and allotting adoration to Him, so as only piously and properly to use the words, “He was,” and “always,” and “before all worlds,” with respect to Him; by no means rejecting His Godhead, but ascribing to Him a similitude which exactly answers in every respect to the Image and Exemplar of the Father. But we must say that to the Father alone belongs the property of being unbegotten, for the Saviour Himself said, “My Father is greater than I.” And besides the pious opinion concerning the Father and the Son, we confess to one Holy Spirit, as the divine Scriptures teach us; who hath inaugurated both the holy men of the Old Testament, and the divine teachers of that which is called the New.
Epistles on the Arian Heresy And the Deposition of Arius. Chapter I.12

Augustine of Hippo a.d. 354–430

Those holy angels come to the knowledge of God not by audible words, but by the presence to their souls of immutable truth, i.e., of the only-begotten Word of God; and they know this Word Himself, and the Father, and their Holy Spirit, and that this Trinity is indivisible, and that the three persons of it are one substance, and that there are not three Gods but one God; and this they so know that it is better understood by them than we are by ourselves.
Augustine The City of God Book 11 Chapter 29

The true objects of enjoyment, then, are the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, who are at the same time the Trinity, one Being, supreme above all, and common to all who enjoy Him, if He is an object, and not rather the cause of all objects, or indeed even if He is the cause of all. For it is not easy to find a name that will suitably express so great excellence, unless it is better to speak in this way: The Trinity, one God, of whom are all things, through whom are all things, in whom are all things. Thus the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, and each of these by Himself, is God, and at the same time they are all one God; and each of them by Himself is a complete substance, and yet they are all one substance. The Father is not the Son nor the Holy Spirit; the Son is not the Father nor the Holy Spirit; the Holy Spirit is not the Father nor the Son: but the Father is only Father, the Son is only Son, and the Holy Spirit is only Holy Spirit. To all three belong the same eternity, the same unchangeableness, the same majesty, the same power. In the Father is unity, in the Son equality, in the Holy Spirit the harmony of unity and equality; and these three attributes are all one because of the Father, all equal because of the Son, and all harmonious because of the Holy Spirit.
On Christian Doctrine Book I. Chapter 5.5

Wherefore, our Lord God helping, we will undertake to render, as far as we are able, that very account which they so importunately demand: viz., that the Trinity is the one and only and true God, and also how the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are rightly said, believed, understood, to be of one and the same substance or essence; in such wise that they may not fancy themselves mocked by excuses on our part, but may find by actual trial, both that the highest good is that which is discerned by the most purified minds, and that for this reason it cannot be discerned or understood by themselves, because the eye of the human mind, being weak, is dazzled in that so transcendent light, unless it be invigorated by the nourishment of the righteousness of faith.
On the Trinity Book I. Chapter 2.4

And I would make this pious and safe agreement, in the presence of our Lord God, with all who read my writings, as well in all other cases as, above all, in the case of those which inquire into the unity of the Trinity, of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit; because in no other subject is error more dangerous, or inquiry more laborious, or the discovery of truth more profitable.
On the Trinity Book I. Chapter 3.5

All those Catholic expounders of the divine Scriptures, both Old and New, whom I have been able to read, who have written before me concerning the Trinity, Who is God, have purposed to teach, according to the Scriptures, this doctrine, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit intimate a divine unity of one and the same substance in an indivisible equality; and therefore that they are not three Gods, but one God: although the Father hath begotten the Son, and so He who is the Father is not the Son; and the Son is begotten by the Father, and so He who is the Son is not the Father; and the Holy Spirit is neither the Father nor the Son, but only the Spirit of the Father and of the Son, Himself also co-equal with the Father and the Son, and pertaining to the unity of the Trinity. Yet not that this Trinity was born of the Virgin Mary, and crucified under Pontius Pilate, and buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven, but only the Son. Nor, again, that this Trinity descended in the form of a dove upon Jesus when He was baptized; nor that, on the day of Pentecost, after the ascension of the Lord, when “there came a sound from heaven, as of a rushing mighty wind,” the same Trinity “sat upon each of them with cloven tongues like as of fire,” but only the Holy Spirit. Nor yet that this Trinity said from heaven, “Thou art my Son,” whether when He was baptized by John, or when the three disciples were with Him in the mount, or when the voice sounded, saying, “I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again;” but that it was a word of the Father only, spoken to the Son; although the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit, as they are indivisible, so work indivisibly. This is also my faith, since it is the Catholic faith.
On the Trinity Book I. Chapter 4.7

Some persons, however, find a difficulty in this faith; when they hear that the Father is God, and the Son God, and the Holy Spirit God, and yet that this Trinity is not three Gods, but one God; and they ask how they are to understand this: especially when it is said that the Trinity works indivisibly in everything that God works, and yet that a certain voice of the Father spoke, which is not the voice of the Son; and that none except the Son was born in the flesh, and suffered, and rose again, and ascended into heaven; and that none except the Holy Spirit came in the form of a dove. They wish to understand how the Trinity uttered that voice which was only of the Father; and how the same Trinity created that flesh in which the Son only was born of the Virgin; and how the very same Trinity itself wrought that form of a dove, in which the Holy Spirit only appeared. Yet, otherwise, the Trinity does not work indivisibly, but the Father does some things, the Son other things, and the Holy Spirit yet others: or else, if they do some things together, some severally, then the Trinity is not indivisible. It is a difficulty, too, to them, in what manner the Holy Spirit is in the Trinity, whom neither the Father nor the Son, nor both, have begotten, although He is the Spirit both of the Father and of the Son.
On the Trinity Book I. Chapter 5.8.

http://apostles-creed.org/confessio...theology/early-church-fathers-quotes-trinity/

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Jocund said:

History is read in Historical Context and there was only one Church back then. Some will call it Catholic. Others will call it just the Universal Church that later became or developed into the Western, Eastern Churches. If one reads the history of the Councils Constantine had did not speak in a theological manor at Nicene. He wanted the Church to define what they believed to be a glue for the Roman Empire.
In his speech, he simply greeted the Christians that came and excused himself from the proceedings. He had no influence of any kind in the Theological sense. If you wish, I can post the Edicts related to Religion back then.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Jocund said:

Lets let LDS speak for themselves,

"
Jess L. Christensen, Institute of Religion director at Utah State University, Logan, Utah. On first hearing, the doctrine that Lucifer and our Lord, Jesus Christ, are brothers may seem surprising to some—especially to those unacquainted with latter-day revelations. But both the scriptures and the prophets affirm that Jesus Christ and Lucifer are indeed offspring of our Heavenly Father and, therefore, spirit brothers. Jesus Christ was with the Father from the beginning. Lucifer, too, was an angel “who was in authority in the presence of God,” a “son of the morning.” (See Isa. 14:12; D&C 76:25–27.) Both Jesus and Lucifer were strong leaders with great knowledge and influence. But as the Firstborn of the Father, Jesus was Lucifer’s older brother. (See Col. 1:15; D&C 93:21.)

How could two such great spirits become so totally opposite? The answer lies in the principle of agency, which has existed from all eternity. (See D&C 93:30–31.) Of Lucifer, the scripture says that because of rebellion “he became Satan, yea, even the devil, the father of all lies.” (Moses 4:4.) Note that he was not created evil, but became Satan by his own choice.

When our Father in Heaven presented his plan of salvation, Jesus sustained the plan and his part in it, giving the glory to God, to whom it properly belonged. Lucifer, on the other hand, sought power, honor, and glory only for himself. (See Isa. 14:13–14; Moses 4:1–2.) When his modification of the Father’s plan was rejected, he rebelled against God and was subsequently cast out of heaven with those who had sided with him. (See Rev. 12:7–9; D&C 29:36–37.)

"https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org...-and-purposes-are-so-utterly-opposed?lang=eng

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Read to post 100, I will be back

justahumanbeing · May 16, 2021

TheLearner said:

No, I disagree. If there is a spirit of jealousy, a spirit of confusion, a spirit of frustration, a spirit of anger, a lying spirit, spirit of fear, spirit of unbelief, then there is surely a spirit of doubt. Because all these are human emotions which the evil one manipulates through his demons. What is positive about having doubt where you are supposed to believe in God by having faith in Him? In this case, it is negative to have doubt instead of trust. You cannot trust and doubt at the same time. You can either trust God or doubt Him. You cannot do both.

If we're saved by the grace of God, we are saved because we believe in God. That's the key reason for God to recognise us as righteous before His eyes.

Abram believed in God and it was reckoned to him as righteousness. And God makes a new covenant with Abram and calls him Abraham. A new person in God's eyes. Abraham didn't doubt.

Time and time again the Bible shows us in both the Old and New Testament that many of God's children doubted Him and His promises. And the Bible also tells us what happened to those people. Right from the Israelites whom God rescued from the hands of Pharoah to the Pharisees and Saducees and people of Jesus' time. Not everybody believed Jesus when He came to them. Not everyone accepted Him. But we as believers in Christ accept Jesus for who He is and who He reveals Himself to us as. "The Son of God". For God to work in your life, it is essential that you believe in Him without doubting Him.

Thomas, one of the twelve disciples of Jesus doubted Him. And Jesus showed Him proof and He says,"You believe because you see. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe." So, God wants us to believe in Him without doubting Him so that we have no blockage in receiving His blessings as His children. And Thomas says," Lord, I believe, help my unbelief." And Thomas says that to counter the doubt which he previously had.

Doubting about God's word is the same for a believer and God in his or her relationship with the Creator as a husband doubting his wife or a wife doubting her husband in a marital relationship. Okay if there is some doubt for sometime. We're all human beings. But doubt should not last a lifetime. There should not be doubts often. It must be resolved. There has to be an end to doubt somewhere and as a believer you have to believe and live a life of faith. Be wary of the spirit of unbelief. Be wary of the spirit of doubt. Rebuke them in the name of Jesus and by His precious blood so that all may be well in your life of faith and your relationship with God.

If I sound a little extreme or if you feel I'm trying to prove something, I'm not. It is my understanding of God's word and what has been revealed to us through the Bible. It is my belief that I share with you. God bless you.

0000000 · May 16, 2021

PC123 said:

The Spirit through Him made Intercession for Him.

This is what took place in the garden of Gethsemane?

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

justahumanbeing said:

No, I disagree. If there is a spirit of jealousy, a spirit of confusion, a spirit of frustration, a spirit of anger, a lying spirit, spirit of fear, spirit of unbelief, then there is surely a spirit of doubt. Because all these are human emotions which the evil one manipulates through his demons. What is positive about having doubt where you are supposed to believe in God by having faith in Him? In this case, it is negative to have doubt instead of trust. You cannot trust and doubt at the same time. You can either trust God or doubt Him. You cannot do both.

If we're saved by the grace of God, we are saved because we believe in God. That's the key reason for God to recognise us as righteous before His eyes.

Abram believed in God and it was reckoned to him as righteousness. And God makes a new covenant with Abram and calls him Abraham. A new person in God's eyes. Abraham didn't doubt.

Time and time again the Bible shows us in both the Old and New Testament that many of God's children doubted Him and His promises. And the Bible also tells us what happened to those people. Right from the Israelites whom God rescued from the hands of Pharoah to the Pharisees and Saducees and people of Jesus' time. Not everybody believed Jesus when He came to them. Not everyone accepted Him. But we as believers in Christ accept Jesus for who He is and who He reveals Himself to us as. "The Son of God". For God to work in your life, it is essential that you believe in Him without doubting Him.

Thomas, one of the twelve disciples of Jesus doubted Him. And Jesus showed Him proof and He says,"You believe because you see. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe." So, God wants us to believe in Him without doubting Him so that we have no blockage in receiving His blessings as His children. And Thomas says," Lord, I believe, help my unbelief." And Thomas says that to counter the doubt which he previously had.

Doubting about God's word is the same for a believer and God in his or her relationship with the Creator as a husband doubting his wife or a wife doubting her husband in a marital relationship. Okay if there is some doubt for sometime. We're all human beings. But doubt should not last a lifetime. There should not be doubts often. It must be resolved. There has to be an end to doubt somewhere and as a believer you have to believe and live a life of faith. Be wary of the spirit of unbelief. Be wary of the spirit of doubt. Rebuke them in the name of Jesus and by His precious blood so that all may be well in your life of faith and your relationship with God.

If I sound a little extreme or if you feel I'm trying to prove something, I'm not. It is my understanding of God's word and what has been revealed to us through the Bible. It is my belief that I share with you. God bless you.

I just checked "spirit of doubt" is not in scripture.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

My favorite is spirit of wisdom

Wisdom 7
Good News Translation
A King Is Like Everyone Else
1-2 Like every human being, I am mortal. I am a descendant of that first man, who was made from the soil. I was conceived from the sperm of a man, in the pleasure of intercourse. For nine months my flesh took shape in the blood of my mother's womb. 3 When I was born, I came into the world like anyone else. I began to breathe the same air we all breathe; and like everyone else, the first sound I made was a cry. 4 I was wrapped in cloths and cared for. 5 No king ever began life differently. 6 For all of us, there is one way into life, and there is one way out.

Solomon Declares His Love for Wisdom
7 Realizing that I was only human, I prayed and was given understanding. The spirit of Wisdom came to me. 8 I regarded her more highly than any throne or crown. Wealth was nothing compared to her. 9 Precious jewels could not equal her worth; beside Wisdom all the gold in the world is a handful of sand, and silver is nothing more than clay. 10 I valued her more than health and good looks. Hers is a brightness that never grows dim, and I preferred it to any other light.

11 When Wisdom came to me, all good things came with her. She brought me untold riches. 12 I was happy with them all, because Wisdom had brought them to me. I had not realized before that she was the source of all these things. 13 I was sincere in learning from her, and now I am glad to share what I learned. 14 No one can ever exhaust the treasures of Wisdom. Use those treasures and you are God's friends; he approves of what you learn from her.

15 I pray to God that my thoughts may be worthy of what I have learned, and that I may speak according to his will. He is Wisdom's guide; he gives correction to those who are wise. 16 We are under his power and authority—we ourselves, our words, all our understanding and skills. 17 It is he who gave me true knowledge of the forces of nature: what the world is made of; how the elements behave; 18 how the calendar is determined by the movements of the sun, the changing seasons, 19 the constellations, and the cycles of years. 20 He has taught me about the nature of living creatures, the behavior of wild animals, the force of the winds, the reasoning powers of human beings, the different kinds of plants, and the use of their roots as medicine. 21 I learned things that were well known and things that had never been known before, 22 because Wisdom, who gave shape to everything that exists, was my teacher.

The Nature of Wisdom
The spirit of Wisdom is intelligent and holy. It is of one nature but reveals itself in many ways. It is not made of any material substance, and it moves about freely. It is clear, clean, and confident; it cannot be harmed.[a] It loves what is good. It is sharp and unconquerable, 23 kind, and a friend of humanity. It is dependable and sure, and has no worries. It has power over everything, and sees everything. It penetrates every spirit that is intelligent and pure, no matter how delicate its substance may be.

24 Wisdom moves more easily than motion itself; she is so pure that she penetrates everything. 25 She is a breath of God's power—a pure and radiant stream of glory from the Almighty. Nothing that is defiled can ever steal its way into Wisdom. 26 She is a reflection of eternal light, a perfect mirror of God's activity and goodness. 27 Even though Wisdom acts alone, she can do anything. She makes everything new, although she herself never changes. From generation to generation she enters the souls of holy people, and makes them God's friends and prophets. 28 There is nothing that God loves more than people who are at home with Wisdom. 29 Wisdom is more beautiful than the sun and all the constellations. She is better than light itself, 30 because night always follows day, but evil never overcomes Wisdom.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Looking at "spirit of " proof texts with better translations of each passage.

Numbers 5:14

Easy-to-Read Version

14 But the husband might begin to think that his wife sinned against him, whether she has or not. He might become jealous. He might begin to believe that she is not pure and true to him.

2 Kings 2:15
Easy-to-Read Version
The Prophets Ask for Elijah
15 When the group of prophets at Jericho saw Elisha, they said, “Elijah’s spirit is now on Elisha!” They came to meet Elisha. They bowed very low to the ground before him.

Does this text really mean that Elisha was possessed by Elijah?

1 Chronicles 5:26
Easy-to-Read Version
26 The God of Israel made King Pul of Assyria want to go to war. He was also called Tiglath Pileser. He fought against the tribes of Manasseh, Reuben, and Gad. He forced them to leave their homes and made them prisoners. Pul took them to Halah, Habor, Hara, and near the Gozan River. Those tribes from Israel have lived in those places since that time until today.

2 Chronicles 21:16
Easy-to-Read Version
16 The Lord caused the Philistines and the Arabs living near the Ethiopians to be angry with Jehoram.

2 Chronicles 36:22
Easy-to-Read Version
22 During the first year that Cyrus[a] was king of Persia, the Lord caused Cyrus to make a special announcement. He did this so that what the Lord promised through Jeremiah the prophet would really happen. Cyrus sent messengers to every place in his kingdom. They carried this message:

Job 20:3
Easy-to-Read Version
3 You insulted me with your answers!
But I am wise and know how to answer you.

Psalm 76:12
Easy-to-Read Version
12 God defeats great leaders;
all the kings on earth fear him.

Proverbs 18:14

Easy-to-Read Version

14 A good attitude will support you when you are sick, but if you give up, nothing can help.

Ecclesiastes 10:4
Easy-to-Read Version
4 Don’t quit your job simply because the boss is angry with you. If you remain calm and helpful, you can correct even great mistakes.

Isaiah 4:4
Easy-to-Read Version
4 The Lord will wash away the filth from the daughters of Zion. He will wash away the blood from Jerusalem. With a spirit of judgment that burns like fire, he will make everything pure.

"spirit of judgement" refers to God, not humans.

Isaiah 19:3
Easy-to-Read Version
3 The Egyptians will be afraid and confused. They will ask their false gods and wise men what they should do. They will ask their wizards and magicians, but I will ruin their plans.”

Isaiah 29:10
Easy-to-Read Version
10 The Lord will make you sleepy.
He will close your eyes. (The prophets are your eyes.)
He will cover your heads. (The prophets are your heads.)

Isaiah 57:15
Easy-to-Read Version
15 God is high and lifted up.
He lives forever.
His name is holy.
He says, “I live in a high and holy place,
but I also live with people who are humble and sorry for their sins.
I will give new life to those who are humble in spirit.
I will give new life to those who are sorry for their sins.

Isaiah 61:3
Easy-to-Read Version
3 those in Zion who mourn. I will take away the ashes on their head, and I will give them a crown. I will take away their sadness, and I will give them the oil of happiness. I will take away their sorrow, and I will give them celebration clothes. He sent me to name them ‘Good Trees’ and ‘The Lord’s Wonderful Plant.’

Jeremiah 51:11
Easy-to-Read Version
11 Sharpen the arrows!
Get your shields!
The Lord has stirred up the kings of the Medes
because he wants to destroy Babylon.
The army from Babylon destroyed his Temple in Jerusalem,
so he will give them the punishment they deserve.

Ezekiel 1:20
Easy-to-Read Version
20 They went wherever the spirit wanted them to go, and the wheels went with them, because the power that moved the living being was in the wheels.

Daniel 4:8
Easy-to-Read Version
8 Finally, Daniel came to me. (I gave Daniel the name Belteshazzar to honor my god. The spirit of the holy gods is in him.) I told him about my dream.

Hosea 4:12
Easy-to-Read Version
12 My people are asking pieces of wood for advice. They think those sticks will answer them! They have chased after those false gods like prostitutes and have left their own God.

We do know that demons are behind idols.

Haggai 1:14
Easy-to-Read Version
14 Zerubbabel son of Shealtiel was the governor of Judah. Joshua son of Jehozadak was the high priest. The Lord made them and the rest of the people excited about working on the Temple of their God, the Lord All-Powerful.

Zechariah 12:1
Easy-to-Read Version
This is a message from the Lord about Israel. The Lord is the one who made the earth and the sky, and he put the human spirit in people. And this is what the Lord said:

Zechariah 12:10
Easy-to-Read Version
10 I will fill David’s family and the people living in Jerusalem with a spirit of kindness and mercy. They will look to me, the one they stabbed, and they will be very sad. They will be as sad as someone crying over the death of their only son, as sad as someone crying over the death of their firstborn son.

Luke 4:33
Easy-to-Read Version
33 In the synagogue there was a man who had an evil spirit from the devil inside him. The man shouted loudly,

Yes a possessed human, not a Christian.

Luke 13:11
Easy-to-Read Version
11 A woman was there who had an evil spirit inside her. It had made the woman crippled for 18 years. Her back was always bent; she could not stand up straight.

John 14:17
Easy-to-Read Version
17 The Helper is the Spirit of truth. The people of the world cannot accept him, because they don’t see him or know him. But you know him. He lives with you, and he will be in you.

We know that the Spirit of Truth is the Holy Spirit.

Acts 16:16
Easy-to-Read Version
One day we were going to the place for prayer, and a servant girl met us. She had a spirit[a] in her that gave her the power to tell what would happen in the future. By doing this she earned a lot of money for the men who owned her.

Acts 16:16 spirit A spirit from the devil that gave special knowledge.

Romans 1:4
Easy-to-Read Version
3-4 The Good News is about God’s Son, Jesus Christ our Lord. As a human, he was born from the family of David, but through the Holy Spirit he was shown to be God’s powerful Son when he was raised from death.

Romans 8:15
Good News Translation
15 For the Spirit that God has given you does not make you slaves and cause you to be afraid; instead, the Spirit makes you God's children, and by the Spirit's power we cry out to God, “Father! my Father!”

Romans 11:8
Easy-to-Read Version
8 As the Scriptures say,

“God caused the people to fall asleep.”

“God closed their eyes so that they could not see,
and he closed their ears so that they could not hear.
This continues until now.”

1 Corinthians 2:12
J.B. Phillips New Testament
9-10a But as it is written: ‘Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, nor have entered into the heart of man the things which God has prepared for those who love him’. But God has, through the Spirit, let us share his secret.

1 Corinthians 4:21
Easy-to-Read Version
21 Which do you want: that I come to you with punishment, or that I come with love and gentleness?

2 Corinthians 4:13
Easy-to-Read Version
13 The Scriptures say, “I believed, so I spoke.”[a] Our faith is like that too. We believe, and so we speak.

Galatians 6:1
Easy-to-Read Version
Help Each Other
6 Brothers and sisters, someone in your group might do something wrong. You who are following the Spirit should go to the one who is sinning. Help make that person right again, and do it in a gentle way. But be careful, because you might be tempted to sin too.

Ephesians 1:13
Easy-to-Read Version
13 It is the same with you. You heard the true message, the Good News about the way God saves you. When you heard that Good News, you believed in Christ. And in Christ, God put his special mark on you by giving you the Holy Spirit that he promised.

Ephesians 1:17
Easy-to-Read Version
17 I always pray to the great and glorious Father, the God of our Lord Jesus Christ. I pray that he will give you the Spirit, who will let you know truths about God and help you understand them, so that you will know him better.

Ephesians 4:23
Easy-to-Read Version
23 You must be made new in your hearts and in your thinking.

Hebrews 10:29
Easy-to-Read Version
29 So think how much more punishment people deserve who show their hate for the Son of God—people who show they have no respect for the blood sacrifice that began the new agreement and once made them holy or who insult the Spirit of God’s grace.

1 John 4:3
Easy-to-Read Version
3 Another spirit refuses to say this about Jesus. That spirit is not from God. This is the spirit of the enemy of Christ. You have heard that the enemy of Christ is coming, and now he is already in the world.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

justahumanbeing said:

No, I disagree. If there is a spirit of jealousy, a spirit of confusion, a spirit of frustration, a spirit of anger, a lying spirit, spirit of fear, spirit of unbelief, then there is surely a spirit of doubt. Because all these are human emotions which the evil one manipulates through his demons. What is positive about having doubt where you are supposed to believe in God by having faith in Him? In this case, it is negative to have doubt instead of trust. You cannot trust and doubt at the same time. You can either trust God or doubt Him. You cannot do both.

If we're saved by the grace of God, we are saved because we believe in God. That's the key reason for God to recognise us as righteous before His eyes.

Abram believed in God and it was reckoned to him as righteousness. And God makes a new covenant with Abram and calls him Abraham. A new person in God's eyes. Abraham didn't doubt.

Time and time again the Bible shows us in both the Old and New Testament that many of God's children doubted Him and His promises. And the Bible also tells us what happened to those people. Right from the Israelites whom God rescued from the hands of Pharoah to the Pharisees and Saducees and people of Jesus' time. Not everybody believed Jesus when He came to them. Not everyone accepted Him. But we as believers in Christ accept Jesus for who He is and who He reveals Himself to us as. "The Son of God". For God to work in your life, it is essential that you believe in Him without doubting Him.

Thomas, one of the twelve disciples of Jesus doubted Him. And Jesus showed Him proof and He says,"You believe because you see. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe." So, God wants us to believe in Him without doubting Him so that we have no blockage in receiving His blessings as His children. And Thomas says," Lord, I believe, help my unbelief." And Thomas says that to counter the doubt which he previously had.

Doubting about God's word is the same for a believer and God in his or her relationship with the Creator as a husband doubting his wife or a wife doubting her husband in a marital relationship. Okay if there is some doubt for sometime. We're all human beings. But doubt should not last a lifetime. There should not be doubts often. It must be resolved. There has to be an end to doubt somewhere and as a believer you have to believe and live a life of faith. Be wary of the spirit of unbelief. Be wary of the spirit of doubt. Rebuke them in the name of Jesus and by His precious blood so that all may be well in your life of faith and your relationship with God.

If I sound a little extreme or if you feel I'm trying to prove something, I'm not. It is my understanding of God's word and what has been revealed to us through the Bible. It is my belief that I share with you. God bless you.

Search for...;

spirit of confusion https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=spirit+of+confusion&version=KJV
spirit of frustration https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=spirit+of+frustration&version=KJV
spirit of anger without quotes https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=spirit+of+anger&version=KJV
spirit of anger with quotes https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch="spirit+of+anger"&version=KJV
spirit of unbelief https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=spirit+of+unbelief&version=KJV
spirit of doubt https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=spirit+of+doubt&version=KJV

spirit of fear 2 Timothy 1:7 one verse in kjv

2 Timothy 1:7
The Spirit God gave us does not make us afraid. His Spirit is a source of power and love and self-control.

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

What does it mean to have a spirit of?
in the spirit of: in the attitude of, in the essence of. It's not in the spirit of teamwork to betray one another. That's not the essence of working together at all. in the Christmas spirit showing enthusiasm and enjoyment for Christmas.

Definition In the spirit of | Gymglish
https://www.gymglish.com ›

spirit noun (WAY OF FEELING)
B2 [ S or U ]
a particular way of thinking, feeling, or behaving, especially a way that is typical of a particular group of people, an activity, a time, or a place:
The players have a very strong team spirit (= loyalty to each other).
As rock musicians in the 1960s, they were very much part of the spirit of the age/times.
We acted in a spirit of cooperation.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/spirit

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/capture-the-spirit-of

in the spirit of: in the attitude of, in the essence of
idiom
It's not in the spirit of teamwork to betray one another. That's not the essence of working together at all.
in the Christmas spirit showing enthusiasm and enjoyment for Christmas
Team spirit is required for this job. The successful candidate will enjoy working with others.

https://www.gymglish.com/en/gymglish/english-translation/in-the-spirit-of

TheLearner · May 16, 2021

Wife is home, done for day

God Bless All

Looking forward to more input from you all.

Who was Jesus praying to in the garden of Gethsemane?

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Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

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Guest

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member