God decides who wins in games of chance?

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Jocund

Jocund

Banned
#21
Jan 14, 2021
1,599
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#21
WannabeWinner said:
Does God control who wins in gambling games?

Proverbs 16:33 (New Living Translation)
We may throw the dice, but the Lord determines how they fall.

So there's no need to be upset when we lose because that is what God decided.

1 Timothy 6:8

And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.

I play poker tournaments which is a form of gambling. I'm starting to drift away from trying to win money but to actually enjoying playing the game itself. Tonight I'm playing free poker tournaments on the internet. I am to finish first in them.

1 Corinathians 9:24

Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize.

I treat poker tournaments like running a race. I also run myself 5km daily. I am to win a prize which is 1st place.

1 Corinthians 10:31

So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.

I don't get the glory when I win a tournanment. God gets the glory. He created everything. He gets the glory.

What your guys thoughts on this?
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The more I think about this, the more it seems that if you don't actually care for the money and it is just the game itself that you are drawn to, I don't see any reason there would be anything wrong or contrary to Biblical teachings in doing so.

Very interesting topic.
 
R

Runningman

Banned
#22
Mar 4, 2020
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#22
Mii said:
Notice it was not mentioned again. Did Pentecost happen before or after that?


I've rolled dice before to make decisions and somehow it felt like testing the Lord. If I have the Holy Spirit, can I not listen?

*End my direct reply*
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Good question. Jesus' disciples were given the Holy Spirit before Pentecost, prior to His ascension:

John 20:20-24
20And when he had so said, he shewed unto them his hands and his side. Then were the disciples glad, when they saw the Lord. 21Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. 22And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

I don't know that listening to the Holy Spirit is the only option available for discerning God's will since the apostles had the Holy Spirit before Pentecost and still opted to cast lots. That means that praying then casting lots is a valid option when discerning God's will for people with the Holy Spirit, according to Sola Scriptura.

I've also been able to do some pretty incredible things when it comes to poker but in a "real game" you either get cleaned or you clean others out. Doesn't sound like a very Godly activity. Low stakes, but high enough for people to be invested.

"Clean" meaning you take others money if you win or you lose all yours. People don't like to lose...

If you are going to play, be VERY careful with who you play with. Don't look for marks and don't get conned. There is something to be gained by learning to read people's body language but it only takes a few games in a lifetime to pick up on that. Also there are other ways to learn that skill. Intuition develops naturally as we mature.

Also the precept of "testing the Lord" comes into play regarding gambling. For some this could be super serious and for others not as much (if at all). You know who you are. Some people shouldn't play. Most all probably. I've played a handful of times for low stakes and I'm actually pretty good at it.


Just like drinking though. I'm not going to state unilaterally that the bible is against it. Might be 90% against it, but that isn't fair to the percentage that can have a glass of wine or a beer with a meal on a date night and it not get out of hand.

Note: I don't mean totally out of control, I just mean out of hand. The "other 10%" drinking = totally out of control. (*percentages arbitrary*)

Feel like it's kind of similar to games of chance. Be that monopoly, slots, poker, or sports betting.

Monopoly is still gambling with your time "if" you are only playing to win.


but I'm not going to try to dissect non-monetary gambling although I do feel it is relevant.




Obviously, like drinking, wisdom would advise not to indulge or engage at all unless a clear ministerial objective presents itself. Like being invited by a group of non-believers for a friendly game or something, which could be an open door. Even then though...it depends on the person.
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I don't drink. Those who do drink should never get drunk in my opinion.

There's a difference between wasting money and spending money. While there's a possibility of winning in a gamble, the odds are normally against the gambler. Long term profits in something sure are usually a safer, and wiser, option the high risk short term gains.
 
Mii

Mii

Well-known member
#23
Mar 23, 2019
2,059
1,320
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#23
Runningman said:
Good question. Jesus' disciples were given the Holy Spirit before Pentecost, prior to His ascension:
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Yes, I am familiar but the outpouring had not occurred yet. I'd have to go back and read and since this is just a pretty minor discussion I don't feel inclined. Weren't they told to tarry until...? I don't quite recall but I do at least know that the only instance of lots occurring in the NT (excepting lots for Jesus clothing) happened prior to Pentecost and is not mentioned again in the NT (which is an additional modifier but not a "shoe in" because some things aren't reiterated)

So for me it "lends" itself to no longer being "sanctioned" in the way it was during the OT. That doesn't mean it's "sin" to do so, but why use analog when there is digital?

Not super clear either way. As I said, it feels like testing the Lord to me. If I feel a leading and I say "ok, but only if I roll a 6." and then follow things that way because God clearly can prove it via consecutive dice rolls and he doesn't want to, does it make my leading invalid? Not necessarily.

Note: I do believe there are very narrow uses for analog where it is superior to digital and that "may" translate spiritually.
 
R

Runningman

Banned
#24
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,679
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#24
Mii said:
Yes, I am familiar but the outpouring had not occurred yet. I'd have to go back and read and since this is just a pretty minor discussion I don't feel inclined. Weren't they told to tarry until...? I don't quite recall but I do at least know that the only instance of lots occurring in the NT (excepting lots for Jesus clothing) happened prior to Pentecost and is not mentioned again in the NT (which is an additional modifier but not a "shoe in" because some things aren't reiterated)

So for me it "lends" itself to no longer being "sanctioned" in the way it was during the OT. That doesn't mean it's "sin" to do so, but why use analog when there is digital?

Not super clear either way. As I said, it feels like testing the Lord to me. If I feel a leading and I say "ok, but only if I roll a 6." and then follow things that way because God clearly can prove it via consecutive dice rolls and he doesn't want to, does it make my leading invalid? Not necessarily.

Note: I do believe there are very narrow uses for analog where it is superior to digital and that "may" translate spiritually.
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I can see how that could feel like testing the Lord. I guess testing God and a sincere humble request look visually similar, atleast externally to people.

Asking God with a pure heart for Him to break the tie between two well-qualified candidates for apostleship isn't testing God in my opinion.

What I see as testing God is forcing God to prove Himself by forcing Him to act. A way to test God would be to deliberately sin with the goal of provoking a response from the Holy Spirit. Or maybe even sinning with the goal of making grace abound. Only God and the individual know when they are attempting to test God, unless he or she makes it known to others.

Just my thoughts on that.
 
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