Whose job is it to provide this training?

What is Continuationism?

Whose job is it to provide this training?



Jeremiah 10:21 For the pastors are become brutish, and have not sought the LORD: therefore they shall not prosper, and all their flocks shall be scattered.



Jeremiah 12:10 Many pastors have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness. 11.They have made it desolate, and being desolate it mourneth unto me; the whole land is made desolate, because no man layeth it to heart.



Jeremiah 23:1.Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. 2Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. 3And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase. 4And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the LORD.



God makes it clear that the job of training up the flock begins with the Pastor. The only problem is that most Pastors, fail through sin or lack of faithfulness. The most important duty of a pastor is to work hard at preaching and teaching. By his sermons and his teaching, he shows his love to God and to the congregation. It will be obvious in the messages a pastor preaches when he is not growing in his walk with God and is not spending many hours in scripture. The apostles did not have time for administration and neither do pastors today. In fact, some of the centralization of power with pastors would disappear if administrative duties were turned over to other elders and deacons The priority of the apostles was the teaching of the scriptures – the Bible. When the Bible is seriously taught book-by-book and verse-by-verse, Christians will be warned about sin, be encouraged in the faith, learn how to live the Christian life, and best of all discover the character of God.



It is sad that people set in church for years and have no clue as to what God expects of them. Some of the saddest word in scripture are said by Jesus to “Christians”

We are going to look at Matthew 7 13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.



15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Do you know what tree your fruit is coming from? You better become an expert fruit inspector if you expect to make it.



21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Verses 22 and 23 make it clear that these people thought that they were Christians yet they did not really know Jesus. Have we not prophesied “taught”

in your Name, cast out devils, and done many wonderful works? What does Jesus tell them? Depart from Me. I never know you.



Is your church teaching you that there are 7 seals and that they are given in order of importance and not in numerical order? That there are also 7 trumpets they are given in order and there 7 vials that will be poured out on the earth. Satan comes at the 6th trump, 6th seal and the 6th vial = 666. Does your church teach you that at the 5th trump there is an army turned lose Revelation 9:1-6 1And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. 2And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. 3And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. 4And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. 5And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. 6And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.



Does your church teach you that this was the message preached by Peter and the others on the Day of Pentecost? Acts chapter 2 4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.5And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. 7And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? 8And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born 9Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. 12And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this? 13Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine. 14But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: 15For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day. 16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

17And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:18And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: Joel 2:28-31.

We could go on and on like this but I am sure you have got the point I am making.

In closing I just want to say that weather you have been saves 2 weeks, 2 years or 20+ years your Pastor should be feeding you all at your level in one way or another.

Eph chapter 4 and 1Cor chapter 12 are gift to the church for the perfecting of the saints. However
The full responsibility falls on the Husband/Father of the home.

Proverbs1:8 says :
My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and forsake not the law of thy mother:

addition after you have been taught by your father and mother The responsibility falls on you. You and I are accountable for what we know and obey it.

On this issue, I fully agree with you. We are a kingdom of priests where each part is given a measure of grace for the benefit of the body as a whole.

There also needs to be some mention of elders and their care of the people. All elders are pastors but not all pastors are elders. We can note that elders are charged with the care of the saints.

It seems to me, in my reading, that pastors are not necessarily given to preaching. Furthermore, having a “pastor of some function of the church (music, elder care, children’s programs) is a tradition not found in scripture. Pastors are always connected to specific people. In a godly design, this will always fall to an elder within a family.

As far as spiritual gifts, I wouldn't dare presume to state God does not bestow them as he wills.

I think it dangerous for us to presume to believe in sovereign God and yet not trust he is always so.

Eph chapter 4 and 1Cor chapter 12 are gift to the church for the perfecting of the saints. However
The full responsibility falls on the Husband/Father of the home.

Proverbs1:8 says :
My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and forsake not the law of thy mother:

addition after you have been taught by your father and mother The responsibility falls on you. You and I are accountable for what we know and obey it.

What are you trying to say? God says He gives them as He wills. How is asking for or using a gift that God gives you call into question His sovereignty? If this is something your church teaches it just makes my point.

And if you were not raised in a christian home how are you going to raise up a child in the way he or she should go? What if you are 35 married with 2 kids and you get saved. Whose job is it to train you up so that you can become the proper head of your household?

What are you trying to say? God says He gives them as He wills. How is asking for or using a gift that God gives you call into question His sovereignty? If this is something your church teaches it just makes my point.

No if someone rejects the word of God it is not the Pastors faut. It is the pastors fault when people are not given the tools to grow, are not tought how to use the tools to become that master builder that need not be ashamed.

Was this in reference to my question?

Or saying that "not having time" is a different issue than what was described of overseers in OT times?

So wait until the opening post is approved and then add to the thread. State clearly in the first post that you will continue it.

So wait until the opening post is approved and then add to the thread. State clearly in the first post that you will continue it.

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”

So I'm curious what role and what tools are you talking about?

Who did Paul blame for the lack in the Christian church in Corinth who were under the New Covenant in Christ? Did He blame the pastor? Or was the blame laid on the people for not seeking to grow in Christ?

"And you still aren’t ready, 3 for you are still controlled by your sinful nature. You are jealous of one another and quarrel with each other. Doesn’t that prove you are controlled by your sinful nature? Aren’t you living like people of the world?" 1 Corinthians 3:1-3

You keep bringing up the old covenant for your points, but while we receive edification, encouragement etc from the church and they help us, the onus is still on us to grow in our own faith and walk.

I have loved those who have helped me learn how best to word the things I know, and I still have more to learn in this regard, and I love the support I get from my brethren in Christ and the things they remind me of and help me to consider...

But in the end, if I don't grow after having been given understanding from God, that's all on me. Not any pastor.

And if you were not raised in a christian home how are you going to raise up a child in the way he or she should go? What if you are 35 married with 2 kids and you get saved. Whose job is it to train you up so that you can become the proper head of your household?

Whose job is it to provide this training?



Jeremiah 10:21 For the pastors are become brutish, and have not sought the LORD: therefore they shall not prosper, and all their flocks shall be scattered.



Jeremiah 12:10 Many pastors have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness. 11.They have made it desolate, and being desolate it mourneth unto me; the whole land is made desolate, because no man layeth it to heart.



Jeremiah 23:1.Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. 2Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. 3And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase. 4And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the LORD.



God makes it clear that the job of training up the flock begins with the Pastor. The only problem is that most Pastors, fail through sin or lack of faithfulness. The most important duty of a pastor is to work hard at preaching and teaching. By his sermons and his teaching, he shows his love to God and to the congregation. It will be obvious in the messages a pastor preaches when he is not growing in his walk with God and is not spending many hours in scripture. The apostles did not have time for administration and neither do pastors today. In fact, some of the centralization of power with pastors would disappear if administrative duties were turned over to other elders and deacons The priority of the apostles was the teaching of the scriptures – the Bible. When the Bible is seriously taught book-by-book and verse-by-verse, Christians will be warned about sin, be encouraged in the faith, learn how to live the Christian life, and best of all discover the character of God.



It is sad that people set in church for years and have no clue as to what God expects of them. Some of the saddest word in scripture are said by Jesus to “Christians”

We are going to look at Matthew 7 13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.



15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Do you know what tree your fruit is coming from? You better become an expert fruit inspector if you expect to make it.



21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Verses 22 and 23 make it clear that these people thought that they were Christians yet they did not really know Jesus. Have we not prophesied “taught”

in your Name, cast out devils, and done many wonderful works? What does Jesus tell them? Depart from Me. I never know you.



Is your church teaching you that there are 7 seals and that they are given in order of importance and not in numerical order? That there are also 7 trumpets they are given in order and there 7 vials that will be poured out on the earth. Satan comes at the 6th trump, 6th seal and the 6th vial = 666. Does your church teach you that at the 5th trump there is an army turned lose Revelation 9:1-6 1And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. 2And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. 3And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. 4And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. 5And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. 6And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.



Does your church teach you that this was the message preached by Peter and the others on the Day of Pentecost? Acts chapter 2 4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.5And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. 7And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? 8And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born 9Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. 12And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this? 13Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine. 14But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: 15For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day. 16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

17And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:18And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: Joel 2:28-31.

We could go on and on like this but I am sure you have got the point I am making.

In closing I just want to say that weather you have been saves 2 weeks, 2 years or 20+ years your Pastor should be feeding you all at your level in one way or another.

. I can from the bible tell you within 1/2 day 12 hours, 720 minutes when Jesus ill return.