What are these verses in Acts 15 talking about?

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persistent

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#1
#1
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
 
Evmur

Evmur

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persistent said:
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
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Christians have fallen into the mindset of the Jews, when Messias comes [Jesus returns] He will save us and kill everybody else. But the Millennial will be the time when the rest of men can seek the Lord.
 
Lucy-Pevensie

Lucy-Pevensie

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James is citing Amos 9 to show from scripture that God had always planned to use Israel to bring gentiles to himself.
 
Mem

Mem

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persistent said:
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Click to expand...
I started this morning's contemplation with a thought to determine the true meaning and implications of "falling away" and then seeing this verse leads me to the comparison of falling "away" and "down." At this point, while falling down implies condemnation, this retains the ability to return, but falling away implies "aside from" and, using my own words here, unable to return to favor (according to Gal 5:4). So, with this in mind, Acts 15:15 seems to be saying that, finding the tabernacle of David under condemnation, God will rebuild the ruins (by means of use of the remnants scattered on the ground? and) set it up (incorporating 'new material', i.e., gentiles).
 
notmyown

notmyown

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persistent said:
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Click to expand...
see what James says just before that?

“Brothers, listen to me! Simon has told us how God first visited the Gentiles to take from them a people to be His own. The words of the prophets agree with this, as it is written:

do you think James is talking about the Lord Jesus, the son of David? the Apostles and Christ often quote a passage from Hebrew Bible and tell us it's meaning.

could this be connected to Isaiah's prophecy, The people walking in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Is 9:2)

Matthew says this is fullfilled in Christ:
the people living in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Mt 4:16)

could James be saying God always had a plan to save Gentiles, and it's fulfillment is found in the Lord Jesus?
 
Researcher

Researcher

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I would say the verses are talking about this...

Zechariah 6:12-13 - "And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD: Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both."
 
oyster67

oyster67

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#7
May 24, 2014
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#7
Acts 15 is very simple and straightforward when read as a complete chapter. The disciples and apostles have come to the understanding that salvation is available for the Gentiles in the Church age. (Now)
 
P

persistent

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#8
#8
notmyown said:
see what James says just before that?

“Brothers, listen to me! Simon has told us how God first visited the Gentiles to take from them a people to be His own. The words of the prophets agree with this, as it is written:

do you think James is talking about the Lord Jesus, the son of David? the Apostles and Christ often quote a passage from Hebrew Bible and tell us it's meaning.

could this be connected to Isaiah's prophecy, The people walking in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Is 9:2)

Matthew says this is fullfilled in Christ:
the people living in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Mt 4:16)

could James be saying God always had a plan to save Gentiles, and it's fulfillment is found in the Lord Jesus?
Click to expand...
I have a sense that what you post here is accurate but I have a 'sense' that there is also some additional prophecy in these verses regarding the 'tabernacle of David...the ruins....which are fallen down...'. Seems the tabernacle of David wasn't much more than a tent.
Then could that mean something to do with 'Church in the wilderness..'. Maybe in the Revelation. Just gut feeling here. Not a permanent structure like Solomon built?
 
P

persistent

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#9
#9
Researcher said:
I would say the verses are talking about this...

Zechariah 6:12-13 - "And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD: Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both."
Click to expand...
Yea on these verses it seems to be referring to Jesus at possibly 1st and 2nd Advents. '....rule upon His Throne..' Sounds like 2nd Advent??? '.....The Branch....' sounds like 1st Advent. And see post #8. Maybe there is more to these verses than meets the eye????
 
oyster67

oyster67

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#10
May 24, 2014
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#10
persistent said:
15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Click to expand...
Verse 17 is a reference to this age, not the next.
 
P

persistent

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#11
#11
oyster67 said:
Acts 15 is very simple and straightforward when read as a complete chapter. The disciples and apostles have come to the understanding that salvation is available for the Gentiles in the Church age. (Now)
Click to expand...
I have a sense we pass over some things too easily. I know the NT has a lot of prophecy in it and it is certain that like the OT people at the time were blind to seeing it. I have seen on tv and internet many people trying to sell books about prophecy and probably a lot of those books refer to both NT and OT. But most of those books are just to make a buck. That I know because they even admit when things don't pan out that it was just a matter of timing. Just like a bad comedian.
 
P

persistent

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#12
#12
oyster67 said:
Verse 17 is a reference to this age, not the next.
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This verse I know has the word 'Edom' in place of 'men' in certain translations and that may signify some different understanding.

“That they may possess the remnant of Edom and of all the heathen which are called by my name.” Ellicott

so that the rest of humanity might seek the LORD, including the Gentiles--all those I have called to be mine. The LORD has spoken--NLT

17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things...KJV
 
P

persistent

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#13
#13
Mem said:
I started this morning's contemplation with a thought to determine the true meaning and implications of "falling away" and then seeing this verse leads me to the comparison of falling "away" and "down." At this point, while falling down implies condemnation, this retains the ability to return, but falling away implies "aside from" and, using my own words here, unable to return to favor (according to Gal 5:4). So, with this in mind, Acts 15:15 seems to be saying that, finding the tabernacle of David under condemnation, God will rebuild the ruins (by means of use of the remnants scattered on the ground? and) set it up (incorporating 'new material', i.e., gentiles).
Click to expand...
It seems to indicate some yet future time from now for this to take place and also see post #12 where it may be two different groups of people indicated. Depends on the translation to show this difference????Ellicott shows 'That they...' who is he talking about???Maybe he is way off??
 
Komentaja

Komentaja

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#14
Jul 29, 2022
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#14
Evmur said:
Christians have fallen into the mindset of the Jews, when Messias comes [Jesus returns] He will save us and kill everybody else. But the Millennial will be the time when the rest of men can seek the Lord.
Click to expand...
That is actually what the bible teaches.

Psalm 110:
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.

6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.

7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.
 
oyster67

oyster67

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persistent

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#16
#16
Komentaja said:
That is actually what the bible teaches.

Psalm 110:
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.

6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.

7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.
Click to expand...
I am going to investigate Psalm 110 a bit more. Thnx for posting that.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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#17
Jul 3, 2015
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#17
notmyown said:
see what James says just before that?

“Brothers, listen to me! Simon has told us how God first visited the Gentiles to take from
them a people to be His own. The words of the prophets agree with this, as it is written:

do you think James is talking about the Lord Jesus, the son of David? the Apostles
and Christ often quote a passage from Hebrew Bible and tell us it's meaning.

could this be connected to Isaiah's prophecy, The people walking in darkness have seen
a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Is 9:2)

Matthew says this is fullfilled in Christ:
the people living in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. (Mt 4:16)

could James be saying God always had a plan to save Gentiles, and it's fulfillment is found in the Lord Jesus?
Click to expand...

Isaiah 9:2 + Matthew 14:27
So lovely to see you again!:)
 
P

persistent

Guest
#19
#19
Komentaja said:
That is actually what the bible teaches.

Psalm 110:
5 The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath.

6 He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries.

7 He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.
Click to expand...
Psalm 110 is the 2nd Advent........Almost certain.......Acts 15 verses seem to do with time just preceding 2nd Advent. My 'sense' is some kind of 'split' or 'raising up' a group, maybe Jews, other than NT Church???? '....fallen tabernacle of David'????...At David's time tabernacle was a tent???....Acts 15:15 refers to Amos 9:
11“On that day I will raise up
The tabernacle of David, which has fallen down,
And [j]repair its damages;
I will raise up its ruins,
And rebuild it as in the days of old;
12That they may possess the remnant of Edom,[k]
And all the Gentiles who are called by My name,”
Says the Lord who does this thing.
New KJV
 
P

persistent

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#20
#20
persistent said:
That they may possess the remnant of Edom,[k]
And all the Gentiles who are called by My name,”
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Who are 'they' in this verse? And 'they' possess #1 remnant of Edom, who are these people? #2..Gentiles who are called by My (Jesus) name. NT Church here..
 
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