The Royal Law Confuse with the Animal Sacrificial Law.

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BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
898
161
43
#1
First let me say that God had Peter to clearly warn us about some of Paul’s writing. (2Peter:3:15-16) (v.15) And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; (v.16) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. So Let’s start at the beginning and work our way up to Paul time, so we can get’s some understanding.

Most of our present day Christian preachers teach against the Law, Prophets and most important Jesus Himself. By making statements such as, "we don't have to keep that old law its been nailed to the cross." These preachers use the books of Paul to make that statement. If that were true, that would mean no one would be able to sin. Why? Paul says in Romans 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. In other words if there is no law there is no sin. Sin is not imputed or no blame can be accredited to any person when there is no law. Now, let’s see what Sin is according to the Bible in I John 3:4 it states, "whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." So if the law was nailed to the cross that would mean its okay to use the Lords name in vain, put other gods before HIM, make graven images and bow before them, pollute the Sabbath day, steal, commit murder, commit adultery and bear false witness. If all these things are okay to commit, then we might as well throw the Bible out the back door and do what ever feels good to us. Today we will find out what law was nailed to the cross. We will see that Paul was in fact a law keeper and how he preached out of the Law and the Prophets.

Now let's begin by taking a look at both of the laws and how they worked together. We will see there were two laws given to Moses, they were the commandments and the sacrificial law. Watch how they worked together. And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a soul shall sin through ignorance against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and shall do against any of them: (Leviticus 4:1-2) The law in the scriptures above is the commandments.

Notice something else very important in these two scriptures. It states, "if a soul shall sin through ignorance." Notice that the scripture did not says on purpose. Why? There is no sacrifice for a sin that is committed willfully. Let's find out what was to be done if a person committed a sin against the Lord unintentionally. Let's skip down to the 27th verse and take a look at the second law (which is the sacrificial law).

And if any one of the common people sin through ignorance, while he doeth somewhat against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and be guilty; Or if his sin, which he hath sinned, come to his knowledge: then he shall bring his offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for his sin which he hath sinned. And he shall lay his hand upon the head of the sin offering, and slay the sin offering in the place of the burnt offering. And the priest shall take of the blood thereof with his finger, and put it upon the horns of the altar of burnt offering, and shall pour out all the blood thereof at the bottom of the altar. (Leviticus 4:27-30)

When the common people sinned through ignorance and it came to their knowledge, what did they have to do? They brought an offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for their sin which they had committed, then the priest would offer the animal to the Lord. Think about this for a moment. If an animal was killed for a person that committed sin, what will happen to us today if we a trespass against the Lord? We will find that out later. Now we see how the sacrificial law was used when a person broke a commandment unintentionally.

Let's go into Paul's writings and take another look at both of these laws. We will go into the Book of Galatians chapter 3. This is one of the chapters that the majority of Christian preachers use to do away with the Lord's commandments. Now, let's read carefully!

Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. (Galatians 3:19)

Take heed to what Paul's says above, "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions." What is transgression? Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. (I John 3:4) Transgression is braking of the commandments. What law was added because of the braking of the law? The sacrificial law! Paul is simply asking these Gentiles, "why perform the sacrificial law? It was added because of sin until the seed should come. Who is the seed? Let's back up in this chapter and find out.

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, and to thy seed, which is Christ. (Galatians 3:16) Who is the SEED? CHRIST! So, this law was added (which is the sacrificial law) until Christ came. What was the sacrificial law used for until Christ came? Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (Galatians 3:24)

The sacrificial law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. Before we continue, we must clear one thing up. Are we justified by faith alone? Let's see. Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. (Romans 3:31) What law is established? Certainly not the sacrificial law, we have seen above that it was added because of transgression until the Seed came (which was Christ). The Royal law to be established forever which are the Ten Lords commandments!
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,705
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#2
"we don't have to keep that old law its been nailed to the cross."
Amen! :)
Jesus fulfilled that Old Law. All we need to do now was summed up by Jesus Himself...
Matthew 22:
37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus nailed them to the cross.
 

Ted01

Well-known member
May 14, 2022
1,055
447
83
#3
I don't recall any Scriptures that break the Mosaic Laws into groups.
Moral law, Royal law, Ceremonial Law, Sacrificial Law, etc. Where do people keep coming up with this stuff?

It seems that legalist/Judaizers just try to make the same old message more palatable...?

Regardless, Jesus said, On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
898
161
43
#4
Amen! :)
Jesus fulfilled that Old Law. All we need to do now was summed up by Jesus Himself...
Matthew 22:
37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus nailed them to the cross.

Yep, and that is keeping the commandment, statues and Judgements. A man asked Jesus this very question, "...What good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?", and Jesus replied, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (Matthew 19:16-19).
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
898
161
43
#5
Let's continue....because most people really don't understand this.

Now, let's back up in this chapter to the third verses and point out the two sets of laws. Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? (Galatians 3:3)

The spirit in this case is the word of God, but pay close attention to what Paul says at the end of the verse. "Are ye now made perfect by the flesh?" Can we be made perfect by the flesh? What flesh is Paul talking about? Let's go to the book of Hebrews and find out. For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (Hebrews 10:1)

The flesh Paul spoke of was the animal sacrifices. Notice what the verse says, "never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect." That's pretty clear don't you think? Let's go back to Galatians chapter 3 and take note how Paul uses the word "law" but does not say this is the sacrificial law or the Commandments. But as we read further in the chapter we will see the difference between the two.

For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. (Galatians 3:10)

We have both Laws with in this verse. In the first part of the verse where it states, "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse:" This law is the sacrificial law, let's skip to the 13th verse and we will see this clearly. Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: (Galatians 3:13)

Notice what's being said, "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us." How was he made a curse for us? He took on our sins and redeemed us from the curse of the sacrificial law which could never take away sin. Now take a look at the next set of verses and we will see indeed that only the sacrificial law was nailed to the cross.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; (Colossians 2:13-14)

Notice this, "He quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross. Why was this law (which is the sacrificial law) contrary to us?

Notice this in Hebrews the 10th chapter; For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. (Hebrews 10:4) For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. That is why it was contrary to us. The sacrificial law simply could not make us perfect.


to be continue....
 

JohnDB

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2021
6,175
2,476
113
#6
I don't recall any Scriptures that break the Mosaic Laws into groups.
Moral law, Royal law, Ceremonial Law, Sacrificial Law, etc. Where do people keep coming up with this stuff?

It seems that legalist/Judaizers just try to make the same old message more palatable...?

Regardless, Jesus said, On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
I get it...

People have an easier time following rules than swallowing their pride and forming a relationship that insists upon sincere true humility.
And it's ridiculous...but then again forays into ridiculousness are part and parcel of the human condition.

How could Adam and Eve thought after so much time being naked that clothes were a good idea after sinning...much less fig leaves.

And if you go with the metaphoric interpretation of fig leaves...legalism is just as ridiculous. (Not that I'm promoting nudism or nudity...except in your relationship with God)
Dunno...but it's very popular with the heathen.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
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#7
First let me say that God had Peter to clearly warn us about some of Paul’s writing. (2Peter:3:15-16)
This statement itself shows how THOROUGHLY CONFUSED you are about everything. So it is now time to back off from your rants regarding dietary laws and time to get a grip on New Testament truth.

Peter actually equated all of Paul's epistles with the Holy Scriptures (the OT) and told us how some would try to twist his words because they could not understand what he was saying. And that is true to this day.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,769
113
#8
I don't recall any Scriptures that break the Mosaic Laws into groups.
Well you do not need Scriptures to do that. Spiritual discernment and common sense will tell you that that the Law of Moses consists of various groups of laws. The dietary laws are a group of laws within the Law of Moses. But within the Law of Christ they are NULL AND VOID. Indeed the Old Covenant has been replaced by the New Covenant, and this is explained in detail in Paul's epistle to the Hebrews.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#9
Amen! :)
Jesus fulfilled that Old Law. All we need to do now was summed up by Jesus Himself...
Matthew 22:
37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus nailed them to the cross.
That "old law" was written by God. It is in scripture as law and scripture isfrom God. Are you ly saying you are greater than God, you can decide that Jesus wiped out what his Father did rather than that Jesus and the Father are one. That is not scripture.

To fulfill is to complete and make perfect, it does not mean to destroy and get rid of something.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,692
589
113
#10
BroTan---what is it that you can't understand about this Scripture below =====

You really want to do the works of the Laws and depend on Laws that show and enhance your sin --and makes you feel guilt and shame ---as you can't keep the laws --you will fail -----the laws are perfect but you are not -----and therefore your corrupt flesh can't keep the laws ------if you so much as think in your mind about committing adultery then Jesus said you have already broken the laws in your heart ====if you break one law you have broken them all ===the Law will never take away sin --the law will never justify you or make you in right standing with God ==only Faith in the Blood of Jesus can do that ---no Faith was needed to keep the laws ----it was through work which was trying to be obedient to try and keep the laws ----

Your taking pieces of Scripture and making up your own Doctrine by and through your own understanding and this is very dangerous for people to be doing -----If you claim to be a True Christian then you have the only person in you who has the ability to give you the right understanding od what the Scripture is saying -----you need to start using the guidance of the Holy Spirit to rightly divide the Word -------


Romans 3

Amplified Bible

20 For no [a]person will be justified [freed of guilt and declared righteous] in His sight by [trying to do] the works of the Law. For through the Law we become conscious of sin [and the recognition of sin directs us toward repentance, but provides no remedy for sin].

Context
There is No One Righteous
…19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God.

20Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the law. For the law merely brings awareness of sin.

I say ------The law was given to the Jews only -and keep them in Bondage ---------the Gentiles were never in bondage to keep the laws --------


Justification by Faith

21 But now the righteousness of God has been clearly revealed [independently and completely] apart from the Law, though it is [actually] confirmed by the Law and the [words and writings of the] Prophets.

I say --------This scripture is saying here that the law and the Prophets both testify ---give evidence to that God's righteousness comes from NOT Keeping the LAW but comes through Faith in Jesus Christ as said in verse 22 -----


22 This righteousness of God comes through faith in Jesus Christ for all those [Jew or Gentile] who believe [and trust in Him and acknowledge Him as God’s Son]. There is no distinction,

23 since all have sinned and continually fall short of the glory of God,

24 and are being justified [declared free of the guilt of sin, made acceptable to God, and granted eternal life] as a gift by His [precious, undeserved] [a]grace, through the redemption [the payment for our sin] which is [provided] in Christ Jesus,

25 whom God displayed publicly [before the eyes of the world] as a [life-giving] [b]sacrifice of atonement and reconciliation (propitiation) by His blood [to be received] through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness [which demands punishment for sin], because in His forbearance [His deliberate restraint] He passed over the sins previously committed [before Jesus’ crucifixion].

26 It was to demonstrate His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the One who justifies those who have faith in Jesus [and rely confidently on Him as Savior].

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So if the law was nailed to the cross that would mean its okay to use the Lords name in vain, put other gods before HIM, make graven images and bow before them, pollute the Sabbath day, steal, commit murder, commit adultery and bear false witness. If all these things are okay to commit, then we might as well throw the Bible out the back door and do what ever feels good to us.[/QUOTE]

Here you are showing your ignorance as to what this Phrase -----law was nailed to the cross -------is meaning -----it certainly does not mean that you can do any of those things you list here ----and if your a True Christian you will not want to grieve the Holy Spirit by doing those things as the Holy Spirit will convict your conscience as you even think in your mind about doing those things and we now have God's Grace to call upon to help us in our weakness moments to give us Strength to stay out of sin ----there is no need for the law as we have a greater influence in us to keep us in check -------

Cain killed his brother Able -----and there was no law for murder -----so no sin was imputed on him by God but God did punish Cain for what he did ---He banished him into the wilderness =====but no where today are there NO Laws ---you have a conscience and you will feel guilty and be in fear if you break the speed limit when your driving ---you will be very conscious of watching for police and watch how fast you slow to the speed limit if you see a cop car and if your caught speeding you will have consequences -----there are laws of the land if you break them you have sinned --
----
All sin has consequences------ Jesus took all sin for all people but when we sin we will reap what we sow ====guilt --shame ---jail time etc ===== if you take the Lords name in vain --you will feel bad ---guilt will indwell you -----the Holy spirit will see to it -----
 
P

pottersclay

Guest
#11
Why do some people complicate the law and its use and meaning?
Lets update this to todays ever changing world. I think it would be less confusing.
God said in the last days his meaning and mysteries would be revealed....so what have we learned?

It seems every day a law is passed in which we must follow here in the U.S. or be punished.
Most I would say are contrary to Gods word. Most has to deal with social justice, and entitlement.

Example:
Racism is a hate crime, can be prosecuted as a federal offence.
So i ask you does that stop racism?.......no.
Now if i follow the law but regard hatred in my heart toward a person by being kind to his or hers face but hating them for what ever reason have i followed the law?
Not according to Jesus....according to Jesus I've killed him. So the law has taught me that I have a issue in my heart that needs attention.

Accepting homosexual and transgenderism,
We all know what GOD says about this, so are we to hate these people and do them harm? Or are we to seek first the kingdom of GOD and his righteousness which is a commandment also.
Ever notice that God destroyed sodom..... not his chosen?

God said he has no pleasure in the death of the wicked....do we?
Jesus said I have not come to destroy but to save....but soon the lion of judah who has all authority will come.

Even though i am kind and consider another as myself yet go out of my way because of lustful desire am i fulfilling the law? ......no ....for i am considered a adulterer......against man and against GOD.
Issues with my heart.

The law being a mirror reflecting the impefection in us.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,692
589
113
#12
The spirit in this case is the word of God, but pay close attention to what Paul says at the end of the verse. "Are ye now made perfect by the flesh?" Can we be made perfect by the flesh? What flesh is Paul talking about?
Again Your just speaking on your own understanding here -----The spirit in this case is the word of God

No----the Spirit here is speaking of the Holy Spirit ---------again you are taking Galatians 3:3 without reading the first part of this Scripture -----verse 2 tells you it is the Holy Spirit -----


This is the first part of this scripture ---which gives you more information ---


Galatians 3 AMP
Faith Brings Righteousness


3 O you foolish and thoughtless and superficial Galatians, who has bewitched you [that you would act like this], to whom—right before your very eyes—Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified [in the gospel message]?

2 This is all I want to ask of you: did you receive the [Holy] Spirit as the result of obeying [the requirements of] the Law, or was it the result of hearing [the message of salvation and] with faith [believing it]?

3 Are you so foolish and senseless? Having begun [your new life by faith] with the Spirit, are you now being perfected and reaching spiritual maturity by the flesh [that is, by your own works and efforts to keep the Law]?

4 Have you suffered so many things and experienced so much all for nothing—if indeed it was all for nothing?

5 So then, does He who supplies you with His [marvelous Holy] Spirit and works miracles among you, do it as a result of the works of the Law [which you perform], or because you [believe confidently in the message which you] heard with faith?
 
Jun 5, 2020
941
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#13
Let's continue....because most people really don't understand this.

Now, let's back up in this chapter to the third verses and point out the two sets of laws. Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? (Galatians 3:3)

The spirit in this case is the word of God, but pay close attention to what Paul says at the end of the verse. "Are ye now made perfect by the flesh?" Can we be made perfect by the flesh? What flesh is Paul talking about? Let's go to the book of Hebrews and find out. For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (Hebrews 10:1)

The flesh Paul spoke of was the animal sacrifices. Notice what the verse says, "never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect." That's pretty clear don't you think? Let's go back to Galatians chapter 3 and take note how Paul uses the word "law" but does not say this is the sacrificial law or the Commandments. But as we read further in the chapter we will see the difference between the two.

For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. (Galatians 3:10)

We have both Laws with in this verse. In the first part of the verse where it states, "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse:" This law is the sacrificial law, let's skip to the 13th verse and we will see this clearly. Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: (Galatians 3:13)

Notice what's being said, "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us." How was he made a curse for us? He took on our sins and redeemed us from the curse of the sacrificial law which could never take away sin. Now take a look at the next set of verses and we will see indeed that only the sacrificial law was nailed to the cross.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; (Colossians 2:13-14)

Notice this, "He quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross. Why was this law (which is the sacrificial law) contrary to us?

Notice this in Hebrews the 10th chapter; For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. (Hebrews 10:4) For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. That is why it was contrary to us. The sacrificial law simply could not make us perfect.


to be continue....
a) "The flesh Paul spoke of was the animal sacrifices" is totally wrong.

Romans 7:5, "For while we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work our members to bear fruit for death. " They were not living in animal sacrifices.

Romans 7:18, "For I know that the good does not dwell within me, that is, in my flesh. For the desire to do the good lies close at hand, but not the ability." Did Paul own animals?

Romans 8:3, "For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and to deal with sin, he condemned sin in the flesh" It's beyond absurd to say that Jesus was in the likeness of an animal!!!

and course there are many more examples of your error!

I won't continue to correct you, but I could cite many more examples from Scripture.

b) Every time I read something like "most people really don't understand this" I realize that the author is setting themself up as the sole bearer of the truth, judging others whom s/he has never met. It is clearly self-deception.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,769
113
#14
To fulfill is to complete and make perfect, it does not mean to destroy and get rid of something.
The Bible says -- GOD SAYS -- that the Old Covenant has been ABOLISHED. Done away with. But you are wiser than God it would seem. Yes, God gave Israel the Old Covenant through Moses. But He rendered it NULL AND VOID through Christ. So you are actually questioning the wisdom of God and Christ (no matter how spiritual you sound).
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,705
113
#15
Are you ly saying you are greater than God, you can decide that Jesus wiped out what his Father did
I am acknowledging the Truth, confessing and believing that Jesus satisfied the price that His Father required.

Hebrews 9:22 “And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.”

Matthew 26:28 “For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”

Have a Joyous Christmas, Blik. :)
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,878
5,621
113
#16
Amen! :)
Jesus fulfilled that Old Law. All we need to do now was summed up by Jesus Himself...
Matthew 22:
37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus nailed them to the cross.
“Jesus nailed them to the cross.”

amen

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:4-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:13-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Some can’t see it though because

“But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: how shall not the ministration of the spirit ( John 6:63) be rather glorious?

and not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: but their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭3:7-8, 13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when we read Moses from Sinai we aren’t really seeing jesus it’s like we’re standing with those people far away and see smoke and fire and wrath and thunder and power and we fear and say this

“Now therefore why should we die? for this great fire will consume us: if we hear the voice of the LORD our God any more, then we shall die.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We can’t approach God through Moses word it’s designed to keep people away from him but when a person looks at Jesus and sees God they see a humble savior who came to dwell
Among them though his glory is far above them , he came to speak to them love them heal them free them and give freely eternal Life to the. Who had already failed so when we hear the New Testament we hear d react to this opposite perception

from this hearing Moses

Now therefore why should we die? for this great fire will consume us: if we hear the voice of the LORD our God any more, then we shall die.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭5:25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

to hearing Christ and the New Testament ministration of spirit and life

It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬


The two covenant laws are as different as life and death
 

Komentaja

Active member
Jul 29, 2022
450
235
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#17
First let me say that God had Peter to clearly warn us about some of Paul’s writing. (2Peter:3:15-16) (v.15) And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; (v.16) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. So Let’s start at the beginning and work our way up to Paul time, so we can get’s some understanding.

Most of our present day Christian preachers teach against the Law, Prophets and most important Jesus Himself. By making statements such as, "we don't have to keep that old law its been nailed to the cross." These preachers use the books of Paul to make that statement. If that were true, that would mean no one would be able to sin. Why? Paul says in Romans 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. In other words if there is no law there is no sin. Sin is not imputed or no blame can be accredited to any person when there is no law. Now, let’s see what Sin is according to the Bible in I John 3:4 it states, "whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." So if the law was nailed to the cross that would mean its okay to use the Lords name in vain, put other gods before HIM, make graven images and bow before them, pollute the Sabbath day, steal, commit murder, commit adultery and bear false witness. If all these things are okay to commit, then we might as well throw the Bible out the back door and do what ever feels good to us. Today we will find out what law was nailed to the cross. We will see that Paul was in fact a law keeper and how he preached out of the Law and the Prophets.

Now let's begin by taking a look at both of the laws and how they worked together. We will see there were two laws given to Moses, they were the commandments and the sacrificial law. Watch how they worked together. And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a soul shall sin through ignorance against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and shall do against any of them: (Leviticus 4:1-2) The law in the scriptures above is the commandments.

Notice something else very important in these two scriptures. It states, "if a soul shall sin through ignorance." Notice that the scripture did not says on purpose. Why? There is no sacrifice for a sin that is committed willfully. Let's find out what was to be done if a person committed a sin against the Lord unintentionally. Let's skip down to the 27th verse and take a look at the second law (which is the sacrificial law).

And if any one of the common people sin through ignorance, while he doeth somewhat against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and be guilty; Or if his sin, which he hath sinned, come to his knowledge: then he shall bring his offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for his sin which he hath sinned. And he shall lay his hand upon the head of the sin offering, and slay the sin offering in the place of the burnt offering. And the priest shall take of the blood thereof with his finger, and put it upon the horns of the altar of burnt offering, and shall pour out all the blood thereof at the bottom of the altar. (Leviticus 4:27-30)

When the common people sinned through ignorance and it came to their knowledge, what did they have to do? They brought an offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for their sin which they had committed, then the priest would offer the animal to the Lord. Think about this for a moment. If an animal was killed for a person that committed sin, what will happen to us today if we a trespass against the Lord? We will find that out later. Now we see how the sacrificial law was used when a person broke a commandment unintentionally.

Let's go into Paul's writings and take another look at both of these laws. We will go into the Book of Galatians chapter 3. This is one of the chapters that the majority of Christian preachers use to do away with the Lord's commandments. Now, let's read carefully!

Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. (Galatians 3:19)

Take heed to what Paul's says above, "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions." What is transgression? Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. (I John 3:4) Transgression is braking of the commandments. What law was added because of the braking of the law? The sacrificial law! Paul is simply asking these Gentiles, "why perform the sacrificial law? It was added because of sin until the seed should come. Who is the seed? Let's back up in this chapter and find out.

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, and to thy seed, which is Christ. (Galatians 3:16) Who is the SEED? CHRIST! So, this law was added (which is the sacrificial law) until Christ came. What was the sacrificial law used for until Christ came? Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (Galatians 3:24)

The sacrificial law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. Before we continue, we must clear one thing up. Are we justified by faith alone? Let's see. Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. (Romans 3:31) What law is established? Certainly not the sacrificial law, we have seen above that it was added because of transgression until the Seed came (which was Christ). The Royal law to be established forever which are the Ten Lords commandments!
Great post, could you tell me if there is a verse that says what did people do in the old testament times when they sinned willfully? Since no sacrifice was there, what should they do to be forgiven?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,878
5,621
113
#18
Great post, could you tell me if there is a verse that says what did people do in the old testament times when they sinned willfully? Since no sacrifice was there, what should they do to be forgiven?


they saw figures and foreshadows of Christ and the gospel and were given an earthly pattern of this

“And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭13:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

jesus sacrifice is eternal all forgiveness from the beginning is based upon the life in his blood

moses was taken up onto Sinai for fourty days where he was shown a pattern of the eternal things to make so the people could see something to worship and start learning about the gospel

“Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.

For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law: who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭8:1-2, 4-6‬ ‭

moses whole law is a figure and prophetic pattern of Christ and the gospel He was shown a vision of the heavenly things and given a pattern to make everything he saw for an earthly tabernacle mirroring the one in heaven from the tabernacle to the altar table of shewbread ect it’s just a pattern of the real things in heaven

so you had such things as animal sacrofices that worked not to do force tbier sins but to remind them constantly of thier sins the law is a shadow it’s showing the shapes and figures of what Jesus would come to do in the gospel

“For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭10:1, 3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

When jesus came forward we’re seeing the reality of all those patterns in the law from the mediator to the sacrifice to the high priest to the word spoken it’s all the reality in the gospel and all the pattern and foreshadowing in the law
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
898
161
43
#19
Great post, could you tell me if there is a verse that says what did people do in the old testament times when they sinned willfully? Since no sacrifice was there, what should they do to be forgiven?
Let's go into Genesis 3: 9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? 10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. 11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat? 12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. 13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

So let's see when the first animal got sacrifice in the beginning, let's skip down to verse 21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them. Read the chapter all the way through from the beginning, I just skip around for time sake.
Let's go to 1 Timothy 2: 13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
898
161
43
#20
a) "The flesh Paul spoke of was the animal sacrifices" is totally wrong.

Romans 7:5, "For while we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work our members to bear fruit for death. " They were not living in animal sacrifices.

Romans 7:18, "For I know that the good does not dwell within me, that is, in my flesh. For the desire to do the good lies close at hand, but not the ability." Did Paul own animals?

Romans 8:3, "For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and to deal with sin, he condemned sin in the flesh" It's beyond absurd to say that Jesus was in the likeness of an animal!!!

and course there are many more examples of your error!

I won't continue to correct you, but I could cite many more examples from Scripture.

b) Every time I read something like "most people really don't understand this" I realize that the author is setting themself up as the sole bearer of the truth, judging others whom s/he has never met. It is clearly self-deception.
And this is why I started out with Peter to clearly warn you about some of Paul’s writing. (2Peter:3:15-16) (v.15) And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; (v.16) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. Take heed to this warning, you can’t ignore all the bible and just concentrate on a hand full of verses out of the writings of Paul. Because some of Paul’s writing is hard to be understood. This is also why you didn't quote these verses from Paul in (Rom. 7:7,12) (v.7) What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, THOU SHALT NOT COVET.

Paul asked a question, is the law sin? He said God forbid, he said the only way that he knew what sin was, was by the law.
(v.12) Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Why in the world would a Christian want to do away with something that God said is holy.

Paul says in (Rom. 4:15) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. If there is no law there is no sin.