Does God desire the salvation of all mankind?

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kaylagrl

Guest
#943
#943
WillB said:
Of course you are allowed to make your points.

When you respond asserting that I have "a pat answer etc" this indicates to me your defensiveness that you may not be able to answer my legitimate questions...and the fact that you haven't given any explanation but simply made very bold statements is further evidence that you may not be able to answer those questions.

And if you can't offer explanations then it's the case that you have a dogmatic view and not a position that can be reasonably explained.

So, you really need to address that issue and if you can't or won't do so you may just want to examine what it is you believe and why you believe what you believe.

By the way, what is a "pat" answer?
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No, it means you have your mind made up, what I say won't change it.

Come to me, all you who are burdened and heavy laden. Drink of this water and you will never thirst.
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

All speak of free will. There are more, but the example and point remain the same.
 
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WillB

Member
#944
Oct 12, 2021
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#944
kaylagrl said:
No, it means you have your mind made up, what I say won't change it.

Come to me, all you who are burdened and heavy laden. Drink of this water and you will never thirst.
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

All speak of free will. There are more, but the example and point remain the same.
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OK. As you can't or won't give an explanation for the distinction between sin and depravity and can't or won't illustrate depravity, I won't pursue this further and will leave you to your dogmatic view which you can't defend.
 
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WillB

Member
#945
Oct 12, 2021
165
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#945
Nehemiah6 said:
This is a common misconception. No one can keep the Law PERFECTLY and all have sinned and come short of the glory of God.

But even the Gentiles who do not have the Law can do righteous deeds. Thus saith the Holy Spirit through Paul:

ROMANS 2: TOTAL DEPRAVITY IS TOTALLY FALSE
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another,
16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
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OK. As you are another one in this forum who makes dogmatic statements which you can't or won't answer and refuse to address relevant questions which go to the heart of your personal interpretation of Scripture, I will call it a day and leave you to your unsubstantiated opions.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#946
#946
WillB said:
OK. As you can't or won't give an explanation for the distinction between sin and depravity and can't or won't illustrate depravity, I won't pursue this further and will leave you to your dogmatic view which you can't defend.
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I just gave it to you using Scripture. You can respond, you do have free will. Everyone here knows what we are talking about. Why say repent, come, drink it TD is true?! Stop blowing at the fur and get to the hide. We all know what we're talking about, it's been done to death here a million times. smh
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#947
#947
WillB said:
OK. As you are another one in this forum who makes dogmatic statements which you can't or won't answer and refuse to address relevant questions which go to the heart of your personal interpretation of Scripture, I will call it a day and leave you to your unsubstantiated opions.
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And there you go again. Like I said, you have a pat answer no matter who answers you. So you have nothing to add to the conversation. Why bother?
 
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Runningman

Banned
#948
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
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#948
WillB said:
OK. As you are another one in this forum who makes dogmatic statements which you can't or won't answer and refuse to address relevant questions which go to the heart of your personal interpretation of Scripture, I will call it a day and leave you to your unsubstantiated opions.
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Romans 2:10-16 isn't a dogmatic opinion. It debunks total depravity.

Why not just go with what the Bible says?
 
Bob-Carabbio

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
#949
Jun 24, 2020
1,272
616
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#949
Magenta said:
And yet after sinning, their eyes were opened; Adam and Eve became fearful, and sought to hide from God.

That looks like a change in their nature to me...
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Only a consequence of their sinful actions. Something definitly CHANGED - but not their nature, which led them to sin to begin with.
 
Bob-Carabbio

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
#950
Jun 24, 2020
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#950
Magenta said:
We are born after Adam, not after Christ. That is why we must be born again. Jesus said so :)

A proclivity to sinful, self-willed conduct is the state of the natural man. Original sin is the
Christian doctrine that holds that humans inherit a tainted nature in need of regeneration.

It seems you deny the need of regeneration, though. You call it a fantasy.
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Depends on what "Regeneration" you're speaking of. Calvinist "regeneration" is a "twilight state" which enables a person to become "Born Again of the Spirit".

Everybody else's regeneration IS being Born again, and becoming a Christian. My "Human nature" has never changed. However the infilling of the Holy Spirit turns on a LOT of lights that were off when I was an unregerate. And James 1:14-16 operates in a Born again Christian just like it does in everybody else (including Adam and Jesus). Being Born again gives you tools to resist it's effects.
 
Bob-Carabbio

Bob-Carabbio

Well-known member
#953
Jun 24, 2020
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#953
Cameron143 said:
Thanks. I've read God's perspective. I was hoping for yours.
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Why would mine be different??? I don't have a "systematic theology" to defend.

There's no such thing as "Original sin", our HUMAN NATURE never changed, and only TWO THINGS were "Cursed": the earth, and the serpent. Adam and ever were NOT cursed, BUT did have to bear the fruits of their rebellion (not a good idea to toss God under the bus in favor of satan).
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#954
Mar 1, 2022
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#954
Bob-Carabbio said:
Why would mine be different??? I don't have a "systematic theology" to defend.

There's no such thing as "Original sin", our HUMAN NATURE never changed, and only TWO THINGS were "Cursed": the earth, and the serpent. Adam and ever were NOT cursed, BUT did have to bear the fruits of their rebellion (not a good idea to toss God under the bus in favor of satan).
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Sometimes people expound. But I'll find joy in your brevity. Thanks again.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#955
Jul 18, 2017
24,607
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#955
WillB said:
OK. As you are another one in this forum who makes dogmatic statements which you can't or won't answer and refuse to address relevant questions which go to the heart of your personal interpretation of Scripture, I will call it a day and leave you to your unsubstantiated opions.
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Looks like you do not like the Bible's dogmatic assertions, since my posts are substantiated by Scripture.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#957
Jul 18, 2017
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#957
Cameron143 said:
I just think on this particular subject you could be better informed.
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Well since there is no better source for Reformed Theology than the Westminster Confession of Faith, I believe I have a very good understanding of their false gospel. At the same time all Christians can agree with many of the teaching in that document apart from TULIP. And when you read Calvin's commentaries on key Gospel verses, you will see that Calvin had no choice except to speak the truth. But then he turned around 180 degrees to cater to Reformed Theology in his Institutes (which I have also read).
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#958
Mar 1, 2022
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#958
Nehemiah6 said:
Well since there is no better source for Reformed Theology than the Westminster Confession of Faith, I believe I have a very good understanding of their false gospel. At the same time all Christians can agree with many of the teaching in that document apart from TULIP. And when you read Calvin's commentaries on key Gospel verses, you will see that Calvin had no choice except to speak the truth. But then he turned around 180 degrees to cater to Reformed Theology in his Institutes (which I have also read).
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Fair enough
 
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