Could Trump do anything to make you stop supporting him?

At best, we can hope he's just an attention hog.

At worst, he's a mocker of the Lord.

Ignore is best for his like.

Jesus is Lord

I believe all of this debate over Trump is under the Lord's sovereignty.

When you compare Trump with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden it exposes all those calling for his imprisonment because why have you ignored Clinton and Biden?

Others will avoid the alleged crimes and complain that he is immoral and a jerk. Again, with what judgement you judge you shall be judged. All of us got saved by the merciful redeemer who is our first love. Leaving that and becoming a self righteous holier than thou person is despicable.

If you complain that he has violated the ten commandments, then again, what president hasn't? As Christians we are not here to condemn the world but that through our witness they would come to the Lord and be saved from their sins. It is foolish to think that anyone in the world, much less those running for president are not sinners.

Instead there is a very simple way to look at this.

The election after 4 years is a referendum on the four years. Did they get us into a war? If yes vote them out. If no, did they do a good job with the economy? If yes you give them four more years, if no you can opt for the other candidate, your call. What may not be "good for the economy" for one person may be good for another.

I agree that there is a difference between being the executive leader on the state and federal level. However, how does one gain experience unless they are elected in? Trump has 0 executive on the federal or state level prior to 2016... DeSantis is more polished and more experienced than Trump was. Furthermore, their differences politically are marginal so I struggle to see any case against DeSantis in favor of Trump.

ThereRoseaLamb said:

I'm going to come at this another way. The first time vote was Trump vs Biden and it may come around to the same thing again. I don't know where Trump stands with God, if Biden has any faith it doesn't come in to play in his politics. So we look at one vs the other. Biden is for abortion at any stage in pregnancy and now even a newborn, that's infanticide. If we think God will stand by and allow that to happen, He won't. Biden is for gay marriage all the way, light up the WH. Biden is for transgenders, supports bearing breasts on the WH lawn. Biden is for transgender surgery for under age children. Biden is for open borders that is allowing sex trafficking to flourish. One woman has testified on the hill that one underage child had evidence within them of 67 different partners, that is beyond criminal, my dog has better sense than that. So maybe you can understand why I don't have a lot of tolerance for picking apart Trump when Biden supports all this. If these two run again, I don't know how a Christian can sit back and allow Biden to get into office again.

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There is no doubt that most of us agree politically with Trump over Biden. But like the VPN guy in this thread tries to do, why frame Trump against Biden when we haven't even had the Republican primary? We can get this right before the presidential election. The argument isn't Trump vs Biden... I think with the exception of a few people in this forum, we almost unanimously agree Trump is the lesser evil/better candidate. The million dollar question is why Trump over DeSantis? The counter to this question is to reframe the argument of Trump vs Biden and I don't understand why...

ThereRoseaLamb said:

I don't know what he claims or what his understanding is. Many people think if I'm a basically good person, I don't kill anyone, I don't hurt anyone, I do good works I'm on my way to heaven. I have a family member that was a new Christian and said to me "but they are a good person", I had to explain that it's not about good works it's about the cross and accepting Jesus as Savior. So I don't know his understanding. Biden hasn't either repented, so again, it's a matter of understanding.

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Completely agree. Nevertheless, I can understand if being an unrepentant serial adulterer is a disqualifier for some people. I may not entirely agree with all their moral qualifiers, but I don't believe it to be an irrational or arbitrary standard.

ThereRoseaLamb said:

Umm humm and Bidens daughter wrote of her father taking showers with her long beyond the age he should and wondered if that was the reason she was so "messed up" now. Trump was back handed in what he said in saying his daughter was beautiful. Bidens daughter comes out with that comment and no one blinks an eye. smh Like I say, rich people have all kinds of people in their circle. Clinton was on the island, no evidence that Trump ever was or that he knew the guy was messing with underage girls. Thats what made him an alligator.

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Once again, two things can be true: Trump has stated he would date his daughter if she wasn't his daughter and Biden took showers with his daughter way too long in her childhood.

Speaking of Trump and Biden perversions... Has DeSantis ever said anything this disgusting? I know we don't want to compare DeSantis because he isn't flashy, controversial, a degenerate, hang out with alligators, pushing 80 years old, etc... But this guy seems to have policies similar to Trump (which we all prefer over Biden) without any of the baggage of Trump or Biden.

ThereRoseaLamb said:

Polarizing? We don't need to be friends with the left. And they will find or make controversy with DeSantis, they are already saying he is worse than Trump. I think you highly underestimate the Dems.

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100% disagree. We aren't enemies. I think that is what perpetuates the division. Here is a quote by Abraham Lincoln during a time which was more controversial and polarizing than today:

"We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature. "

They will definitely come after DeSantis if he is the nominee. Fortunately, there isn't much ammunition to do so (at least that I'm aware of).

ThereRoseaLamb said:

That's fine, but what if it's the same two? What then?

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If we ignore the better candidate who has the same politics as Trump but with none of the baggage and it ends up being Trump and Biden again? Well, I can understand why people will vote for Trump in that scenario, just as they did in 2020.

I don't have to vote for Trump or Biden if I feel they fit into some disqualifiers though. I can "waste" my vote and vote for someone I actually believe in. I don't view it as "wasting" though... I am trying to vote for someone I can get behind that I feel is morally sound and trustworthy.

But this is why I want people to consider DeSantis and not just ignore him for Trump. Aside from having 4 years experience, what does Trump have over DeSantis?

ThereRoseaLamb said:

And again, that's fine. But if we end up with the same two, how do you make the choice then? I've got to go get my day started, headed to FL for vacation. Have to clean my house because my MIL is going to be coming to babysit my German Shepard. I'll give DeSantis a good word for you if I see him

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Please do! Thanks for the good discussion.

Wow another smear just for posting a view that’s not the major narrative of many here.

Are you sure you’re not sharing Zuck’s playbook, of trying to smear and cancel dissent?

Yet another often used smear tactic. Accusing someone of only wanting attention.

I need to revise my statement about if it does end up being Trump vs Biden again... If Trump is smart and he wins the nominee (most likely scenario), he would select DeSantis as his running mate. That may be the only way I ever vote for the Trump ticket. It wouldn't change my sentiments of Trump, but at least I would be voting for someone I can get behind (DeSantis). It would be an interesting good cop-bad cop dynamic to say the least.

I am not in agreement with his vague generalities, but I think he listing pastors on the opposite extremes.

An attempt to be clever/funny I guess.

Again not true, when you make broad sweeping statements like this you loose credibility.

No one should follow any leader blindly or put any politician on a pedestal... always proceed with caution.

Yes, I see some people who support Trump are unwavering and look the other way on some of his political choices (not personal we are talking about him as leader unlike @true_believer who cannot seem to wrap his mind around that, lol).

But really what choice did American patriots have in 2016 ... Hilary Clinton ugh!!

Now there are other strong contenders presently, but I think Trump on some level did prove himself to be a patriot so of course he has a following.

But who are you attacking Trump or his followers I think there is a distinction.

@seed_time_harvest, you know what, your dislike of Trump is just as extreme as those who support him.

How about a bit of moderation on your part?

Seems to me anti-Trump people are just as brainwashed as those who follow Trump blindly and believe he can do no wrong.

Watching MSM will do that to a brain, fact.

I think Trump seems okay, but what exactly did he do as President to make half of Americans decide to vote for Biden instead?

Its what the mainstream media/legacy media did that is the consideration.

Whoever breaks the law at any point Is guilty of breaking the whole law so then to me and you abortion Is worse than lying but to GOD they are both just as bad.

Seriously this is not true at all.
Jesus spoke of the greater sin.

There is only ONE dividing line right now that I can see.

Is Trump (any politician) an insider (the WEF clan) or is he an outsider.
So far I have not seen any evidence that he is part of the World Economic Forum clan.

Wow you down play abortion like @JTB in a very weak effort to justify your dislike of Trump.
Abortion is disgusting.. beyond belief that a comparison is made.

I am kind of surprised, he seems to be struggling. I certainly believe he has done good things for FL. But it's anyone's guess how all this will turn out.

As I said, I really thought DeSantis would be further ahead. Maybe his support of the Ukraine war? I really haven't looked deeply into it.


I think we should open up the records, let's see who has paid to keep things on the down low. Clear the air. But did you notice how quickly "believe all women" disappeared when Biden hit office?!

Yet again, the people don't seem to be leaning his way. Maybe someone here has a better idea as to why?


Sorry, different age in time. There is no way we can be united with a party that pushed to take God from their platform. A party that agrees with infanticide, gay marriage, transgenders and surgery for underage children. With open borders that promote child sex trafficking. I could go on with much more. That old Dem party is gone. They are nothing but radicals now.

Good, we agree there. But I think there are some RINOs that need to find a new job too.



Well that's the great thing about America, but I caution this, if it does come down to those two, and Biden is allowed in office again, America is going to be shocked and will feel the pain of letting this man back in office. He is a figure head and they will further drive this country into the ground. I believe it will be a blow we will not recover from. Yet maybe it is God's timing, and Israel will come forward.



I surely will!! No, thank you, I think we probably agree on quite a bit. I guess now we pray and wait on the Lord.

Appointed three pro life judges

How is that a reason to vote for Biden or Clinton?

I don't agree with voting for a democrat but the republicans are not right either.

So then your debate is not about Trump, it is about whether or not Christians should vote for a person to be president. Are unbelievers the only ones who get to vote and select a president?

Does that mean the anti-Trumpers wanted to kill unborn babies?

The mere presence of a question like this displays the significant cult like following of Trump.

The answer to this question if it regarded pretty much anyone else, would be so obvious, it wouldn’t even need to be asked.

For most any other candidate, it would be obvious that you’d no longer support a candidate if they did X thing(s).

Why isn’t this also obvious for a significant amount of Trump supporters?

Because for them, it’s about loyalty or disloyalty to a person, not loyalty and disloyalty of ideas, what’s right and wrong, or personal conduct.

For so many this is like a cult or the mob(mafia).

And if I hear one more statement about how he gathers large crowds, and others don’t, therefore he IS the preference of most, I’m going to eat my keyboard.

Most people don’t build an identity or a life around a political candidate. Most people don’t follow candidates like fangirls followed The Beatles. To most a candidate is just a candidate, they’re not a lifestyle choice or some sort of mascot to enshrine your life over, at least not to the extent to HAVE to go hear them speak and wait in line all day.