Shroud of Turin—real or fake, and why?

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Aug 23, 2024
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I tried to watch that "documentary".... which actually is mostly, from what I saw, sensationalized propaganda.... I got to the point where the "expert" stated as fact that the shroud is "the most studied archeological discovery of all time"..... which sounded wrong to me.... a quick goober search showed that the shroud actually doesn't even make the top 10 studied "finds"...
This alone would be enough to justify dismissing this whole video as promotional clap-trap... but they have also enhanced the pictures of the shroud, through "scientific technologies" to "show" wounds, bruises, etc... all to fit their narrative...

I am not saying the shroud is not real... but there is just no evidence that "proves" it... it's interesting to study, and ponder, but unless you are simply wanting to believe it, there is no evidence that would lead you conclusively to that point.
You might like Dr Campbell better.

Personally, I think the shroud of Turin is real and other artifacts from Jesus's time exist. while there are people that won't believe even if they see such as in Luke 16:28-31
There are also people who will see and believe like Thomas (who has a bad rap) because we all know there are many such people in the world.

28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. John 20:28-29
 
Nov 12, 2021
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I say --This shroud could be Fake or Real ---the video just gives what they believe -----

Here is the thing ----
What makes us think that Jesus couldn't leave His imprint in this Shroud He was wrapped in -----
God spoke out of a burning bush that didn't burn -----He got a coin out of a fishes mouth ---He made wine out of water -----He brought the dead back to life -----He fed 5 thousand with a 2 piece fish dinner -etc---

And we have a problem with thinking that this imprint could most definitely not be Jesus --- : He could have used the same method as the fire in the burning bush to burn His imprint in the Shroud ---if He wanted to --who Knows ---but it is a fascinating subject ---With God nothing is impossible --RIGHT

And it is definitely an Imprint of a Man ---that is clear as MUD -----who is it and how in this time would this be possible to do ----what method used to get this result ----NOT ONE PERSON ==all the theologians ---all the Scientist ---all the great Scholars etc --etc ----has no answers --- on how this was done -----

So this Shroud is thought provoking at best ------what we choose to believe is up to us -----

It Is at Best A

1735995301840.png
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
37,699
6,960
113
I say --This shroud could be Fake or Real ---the video just gives what they believe -----

Here is the thing ----
What makes us think that Jesus couldn't leave His imprint in this Shroud He was wrapped in -----
God spoke out of a burning bush that didn't burn -----He got a coin out of a fishes mouth ---He made wine out of water -----He brought the dead back to life -----He fed 5 thousand with a 2 piece fish dinner -etc---

And we have a problem with thinking that this imprint could most definitely not be Jesus --- : He could have used the same method as the fire in the burning bush to burn His imprint in the Shroud ---if He wanted to --who Knows ---but it is a fascinating subject ---With God nothing is impossible --RIGHT

And it is definitely an Imprint of a Man ---that is clear as MUD -----who is it and how in this time would this be possible to do ----what method used to get this result ----NOT ONE PERSON ==all the theologians ---all the Scientist ---all the great Scholars etc --etc ----has no answers --- on how this was done -----

So this Shroud is thought provoking at best ------what we choose to believe is up to us -----

It Is at Best A

View attachment 271759
On the contrary, at best the Shroud of Turin is like letting doubting Thomas put his fingers into the wounds on Jesus and not be unbelieving. At worst you are seeing the work of the greatest forger in human history, except unlike the great deception the purpose is to help people study and focus on the crucified Christ. Also unlike all false prophets whoever made this forgery never tried to make merchandise of you.
 
Jan 18, 2016
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On the contrary, at best the Shroud of Turin is like letting doubting Thomas put his fingers into the wounds on Jesus and not be unbelieving. At worst you are seeing the work of the greatest forger in human history, except unlike the great deception the purpose is to help people study and focus on the crucified Christ. Also unlike all false prophets whoever made this forgery never tried to make merchandise of you.
That is a possibility, but also consider those "doubters" that see the story of the shroud, and think to themselves... "this COULD be a proof that Jesus was crucifed".... then continue to study, only to find that there are many, MANY reputable scientists and archeologists that don't see any hard evidence (proof) that it is, indeed, real... those doubters will very likely drop any and all interest in learning about Jesus, because their original doubts were found to be "true"....

There is plenty of proof that Jesus DID live, and WAS crucified, so the shroud actually "proves" nothing that has not already been proven through many historians' records of that time in history.

What doubters need "proof" of is that Jesus not only lived and was crucifed, but that he was indeed raised from the dead. THAT is the part of the story that is most important.... the shroud does not prove that at all.
Having the shroud that Jesus was wrapped in is no "evidence" that he rose from the dead. The Romans and Jews of that time, who witnessed all of it, still did not believe it... they believed that Jesus' body was stolen by his disciples, to make people think he had risen.
This shroud could have been saved through history by those disciples that were trying to keep the "myth" alive...

No, I still believe that @studentoftheword assessment is the best description of the shroud's existence.
 
Dec 16, 2016
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That includes ALL things since He gave us dominion in the first chapter, even being in required relationship as opposed to only holding an outward form of Godliness denying the power He died to provide us.
He is great at preserving His own and His word, the Holy Land as well, when the diaspora took place it stopped raining, and the land was desolate until His Own returned, now it is a land of abundance, and it's people well educated, prosperous and inventive. I recall Netanyahu speaking of how at that year only Canada had more new companies on the NYSE than Israel, and they continue to prosper and be a light unto the world, even though the adversaries minions surround and fight them in these Ezekiel 38 times.:)(y):coffee:
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
37,699
6,960
113
That is a possibility, but also consider those "doubters" that see the story of the shroud, and think to themselves... "this COULD be a proof that Jesus was crucifed".... then continue to study, only to find that there are many, MANY reputable scientists and archeologists that don't see any hard evidence (proof) that it is, indeed, real... those doubters will very likely drop any and all interest in learning about Jesus, because their original doubts were found to be "true"....

There is plenty of proof that Jesus DID live, and WAS crucified, so the shroud actually "proves" nothing that has not already been proven through many historians' records of that time in history.

What doubters need "proof" of is that Jesus not only lived and was crucifed, but that he was indeed raised from the dead. THAT is the part of the story that is most important.... the shroud does not prove that at all.
Having the shroud that Jesus was wrapped in is no "evidence" that he rose from the dead. The Romans and Jews of that time, who witnessed all of it, still did not believe it... they believed that Jesus' body was stolen by his disciples, to make people think he had risen.
This shroud could have been saved through history by those disciples that were trying to keep the "myth" alive...

No, I still believe that @studentoftheword assessment is the best description of the shroud's existence.
There is no contradiction between my analysis and Studentoftheword's analysis other than to neglect to mention the Lord's word that it is more blessed to believe in the Lord without this physical evidence.

My use of the word contrary did not mean I was contradicting him, it simply meant I was giving a different view of the same thing.
 
Aug 23, 2024
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You know the shroud is real because otherwise it would have never been made. The world is evil all that is promoted is superficial materialistic things that lead people away from the Lord and the truth. After all you don't know if the miracle of Christ rising caused that print on the linen. There fabric that have survived. Tarkhan dress is 5000 year old.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
37,699
6,960
113
You know the shroud is real because otherwise it would have never been made. The world is evil all that is promoted is superficial materialistic things that lead people away from the Lord and the truth. After all you don't know if the miracle of Christ rising caused that print on the linen. There fabric that have survived. Tarkhan dress is 5000 year old.
That is an interesting point, I have heard testimonies of researchers who were atheists but after studying the shroud they became believers. However, I have not heard of anyone who was a believer who because of the Shroud became a backslider.
 
Aug 23, 2024
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That is an interesting point, I have heard testimonies of researchers who were atheists but after studying the shroud they became believers. However, I have not heard of anyone who was a believer who because of the Shroud became a backslider.
I don't see how the shroud of Turin could make anyone backslide. They would have to be people that didn't believe to begin with.