Revolution in Iran

HeIsHere said:

So they had free will the first time and did not accept Christ but the second time they will, how convenient for the dispensationalist system. lol

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The succinct precise grammar in the infallible Greek is perfectly clear: a matter of WHEN not IF....

The short answer is yes. From a linguistic standpoint, the Greek construction of the disciples' question and Jesus' subsequent answer strongly implies that the restoration of the kingdom is a certainty, even if the timing was withheld.

The precision of the Greek in Acts 1:6–7 provides three key grammatical markers that support the literal restoration of the nation:

1. The Verb Apokathistanis (Restore)
The disciples use the word ἀποκαθιστάνεις (apokathistaneis).
The Meaning: This is a compound of apo (back again) and kathistēmi (to set in order). In classical and Septuagint Greek, it specifically refers to reconstitution or returning something to its original, rightful state.
The Implication: You cannot "restore" something that never existed. By using this word, the disciples are referring to the specific, national, Davidic kingdom of the Old Testament. If Jesus intended to replace Israel with a "spiritual church," this would be a "replacement" or "new creation," not a restoration.

2. The Use of "Israel" (tō Israēl)
The disciples specify the beneficiary of this restoration: τῷ Ἰσραήλ (tō Israēl).
The Specificity: In the New Testament, when "Israel" is used without qualification in a historical or political context, it refers to the ethnic/national progeny of Jacob.
Jesus’ Non-Correction: Most tellingly, Jesus does not correct their terminology. He does not say, "You misunderstand; there is no kingdom for Israel." Instead, He addresses the chronology ("It is not for you to know times or seasons"). In logic, to dispute the timing of an event is to concede the reality of the event itself.

3. The Noun Chronos vs. Kairos (Times and Seasons)
In verse 7, Jesus says it is not for them to know the χρόνους (chronous) or καιρούς (kairous).
The Distinction: Chronos refers to chronological time (minutes, days, years), while kairos refers to "epochal" time or "the right moment."
The Fulfillment: By saying these times are "fixed by the Father's own authority," Jesus affirms that the "restoration" is a scheduled event on the Father’s calendar. If the restoration were never going to happen, there would be no "time or season" to keep secret.

cv5 said:

Oh look, there it is........verse 39!
And it just so happens that this verse once again proves that the "dispensationalist" view:
"in that day", in the latters days, the Nation Israel will undoubtedly RECEIVE their King, Jesus Messiah.

Mat 23:38
Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Mat 23:39
For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, ***till*** ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

In Fruchtenbaum’s system, Matthew 23:39 is one of the decisive New Testament texts establishing that the Second Coming is contingent upon a future, corporate Jewish acknowledgment of Jesus as Israel’s Messiah.


Christ has just pronounced judgment upon “this generation” and Jerusalem, but then says:




Fruchtenbaum takes the word “till” seriously. It does not mean Israel will never see Him again; it establishes the condition under which they will see Him again. The nation that officially rejected Him must someday officially receive Him.


The quotation is from Psalm 118:26, part of the Egyptian Hallel Psalms (Psalms 113–118), traditionally associated with the Passover season. But in Matthew 23 it is no longer merely a festive greeting. In Fruchtenbaum’s reading, Jesus turns it into Israel’s future confession:




That is, Israel’s surviving remnant—and, ultimately, the nation in its representative leadership—will recognize that Jesus is the One sent by YHWH and will petition Him to return. Fruchtenbaum explicitly states that Jesus “will not come back to the earth until the Jews and the Jewish leaders ask Him to come back,” identifying Matthew 23:39 as the basis for that conclusion.

• It is not merely that individual Jews become believers during the Tribulation.
• It is that Israel, in a national and representative sense, turns to Messiah Jesus.
• That confession occurs in the end-time distress commonly called Jacob’s Trouble.
• The national plea for Messiah’s return is answered by the visible Second Coming.

Fruchtenbaum normally connects Matthew 23:39 with passages such as:

• Leviticus 26:40–42 — Israel confesses her iniquity, and God remembers His covenant with Jacob, Isaac, Abraham, and the land.
• Deuteronomy 30:1–10 — after dispersion and tribulation, Israel returns to the LORD and is regathered.
• Hosea 5:15 — “I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me early.”
• Zechariah 12:10 — Jerusalem looks upon the One whom they pierced and mourns.
• Zechariah 13:8–9 — the refined remnant says, “The LORD is my God.”
• Isaiah 53:1–9 — in Fruchtenbaum’s future-remnant reading, Israel finally confesses that the rejected Servant bore our sins.
• Romans 11:25–27 — after the present partial hardening, “all Israel shall be saved,” in connection with the Deliverer coming out of Zion.

Thus Matthew 23:39 is not, for Fruchtenbaum, a vague statement that there will always be some Jewish believers somewhere. It is a prophetic pledge that the rejected King will remain absent from Israel in His visible earthly presence until Israel says the words of Psalm 118 with faith and recognition. Then He comes—not to begin the Church age, but to deliver the repentant remnant, judge His enemies, restore Israel, and inaugurate the Messianic Kingdom.

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So in conclusion, ethnic Israel now just commit all the sin that you want, no worry, when your time comes, you will repent. Actually the more sin you commit today, the better to help Jesus 2nd coming.

Is this what you teach your people?

Today don't come to Jesus, reject Him all you want.

What kind of twist is this?

This is a true curse to ethnic Israel.

True blessing is telling them to repent and accept Jesus as Lord and savior.

Churchgoer said:

So in conclusion, ethnic Israel now just commit all the sin that you want, no worry, when your time comes, you will repent. Actually the more sin you commit today, the better to help Jesus 2nd coming.

Is this what you teach your people?

Today don't come to Jesus, reject Him all you want.

What kind of twist is this?

This is a true curse to ethnic Israel.

True blessing is telling them to repent and accept Jesus as Lord and savior.

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The penchant to hurl baseless unfounded accusations in the face of legitimate Bible scholarship is yet another aspect of the obstinate willfully ignorant biblically illiterate supersessionist mindset.

All men should repent IMMEDIATELY. If course this is always the objective.

Nevertheless, the next OPPORTUNITY to repent given (as a gracious merciful gift) will NOT be squandered by Israel.
Rather, the Nation Israel in their great duress will capitalize on it, repent in sincerity, and the nation will be redeemed.
Afterward, the kingdom will be restored to them under the leadership of the Greater David.
And Israel will be RECOMMISSIONED to their original mandate, to be witnesses and priests to the gentile world.
This time faithfully and unfailingly.

That's the way it is. If you actually care to study and accept what God is saying in Scripture.
If you care to reject this teaching, suffer the consequences.

I figure that those who truly despise prophecy and Israel will end up smack dab in the tribulation.
And when the man of sin aka the lie aka the lawless one aka anti-Christ aka the counterfeit aka the Satan-man offers
a POLITICAL SOLUTION to the supposed "Israel problem", they (the frauds posing as Christians) will RECEIVE him (the Satan-man) and praise him for it.

And it gets infinitely worse for them from there.......

cv5 said:

The penchant to hurl baseless unfounded accusations in the face of legitimate Bible scholarship is yet another aspect of the obstinate willfully ignorant biblically illiterate supersessionist mindset.

All men should repent IMMEDIATELY. If course this is always the objective.

Nevertheless, the next OPPORTUNITY to repent given (as a gracious merciful gift) will NOT be squandered by Israel.
Rather, the Nation Israel in their great duress will capitalize on it, repent in sincerity, and the nation will be redeemed.
Afterward, the kingdom will be restored to them under the leadership of the Greater David.
And Israel will be RECOMMISSIONED to their original mandate, to be witnesses and priests to the gentile world.
This time faithfully and unfailingly.

That's the way it is. If you actually care to study and accept what God is saying in Scripture.
If you care to reject this teaching, suffer the consequences.

I figure that those who truly despise prophecy and Israel will end up smack dab in the tribulation.
And when the man of sin aka the lie aka the lawless one aka anti-Christ aka the counterfeit aka the Satan-man offers
a POLITICAL SOLUTION to the supposed "Israel problem", they (the frauds posing as Christians) will RECEIVE him (the Satan-man) and praise him for it.

And it gets infinitely worse for them from there.......

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I am glad we see some light in this conversation.
Agree all man should take opportunity today while still alive, repent and come to Jesus. We might not have tomorrow.

Do not support any political system that is against Jesus commandments. GOD is in control. Just as the day God put Jesus on the cross, do not support the jew leaders as the crowd, as Judah ischariot.

All we should do is obey God's commandments. Do not play God's role.

Beekeeper said:

I think of all the victim stories and "justifications" you would have to keep repeating to us until you are an old lady.

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No, no, no, you're not going to re-write history. I said that was the land God has given to the Jews. I did not say they should go and take it. There are disputed parts of the land because of war. But I'm telling you that is the land God will restore to the Jews.

Churchgoer said:

I am surprised the map didn't include usa, China, Russia, new Zealand....

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It's defined by the borders God gave, not me.

Churchgoer said:

Jesus said to preach Gospel to the end of world. All nations!!!

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And who said you shouldn't?

He converted to Christianity, got caught praying by his father, and ran, three years underground in Iran's home-church network before fleeing to Turkey ahead of the arrests.

Who is the liar, if it is not the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, who denies the Father and the Son.
1 John 2:22

The peace talks between Israel and Lebanon progress actually pretty decently. Like the actual serious ones discussed before the actual government of Lebanon doesn't want to be a cult proxy with a foreign terrorist group that is just a tentacle of the IRGC wrecking their State for another half a century. If the Hezbollah necromancers can be exorcisized from Lebanon and have peace with Israel and Syria actually this could be the beginning of a sorta Solomon-Hiram relationship and the glorious cedars make peace with Israel, this could bring about a more soft power regional peace more akin to Solomon-Hiram era rather than a fringe idea like Greater Israel. Still a tense situation of high stakes geopolitics I guess, but this is pretty good signs praise Jesus.

No one 'converts' to Christianity, Jesus saves you.

cv5 said:

The penchant to hurl baseless unfounded accusations in the face of legitimate Bible scholarship is yet another aspect of the obstinate willfully ignorant biblically illiterate supersessionist mindset.

All men should repent IMMEDIATELY. If course this is always the objective.

Nevertheless, the next OPPORTUNITY to repent given (as a gracious merciful gift) will NOT be squandered by Israel.
Rather, the Nation Israel in their great duress will capitalize on it, repent in sincerity, and the nation will be redeemed.
Afterward, the kingdom will be restored to them under the leadership of the Greater David.
And Israel will be RECOMMISSIONED to their original mandate, to be witnesses and priests to the gentile world.
This time faithfully and unfailingly.

That's the way it is. If you actually care to study and accept what God is saying in Scripture.
If you care to reject this teaching, suffer the consequences.

I figure that those who truly despise prophecy and Israel will end up smack dab in the tribulation.
And when the man of sin aka the lie aka the lawless one aka anti-Christ aka the counterfeit aka the Satan-man offers
a POLITICAL SOLUTION to the supposed "Israel problem", they (the frauds posing as Christians) will RECEIVE him (the Satan-man) and praise him for it.

And it gets infinitely worse for them from there.......

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Have you read the Book of Hebrews.. seriously.. your theology negates Christ Jesus at every turn.
Subtle but still dangerous.

Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.
Hebrews 4:14-16

HeIsHere said:

Have you read the Book of Hebrews.. seriously.. your theology negates Christ Jesus at every turn.
Subtle but still dangerous.

Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.
Hebrews 4:14-16

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Get a clue. Hebrews was written to address...... Hebrews.

The message therein remains an inscrutable puzzle to you, this much is true. A conundrum easily solved if you were willing.

Keyword: Arnold Fruchtenbaum.

cv5 said:

Get a clue. Hebrews was written to address...... Hebrews.

The message therein remains an inscrutable puzzle to you, this much is true. A conundrum easily solved if you were willing.

Keyword: Arnold Fruchtenbaum.

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Isreal state probably love this guy.

Key word should be Jesus.

Churchgoer said:

Isreal state probably love this guy.

Key word should be Jesus.

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If you desired to "hear" Jesus, you would actually endeavor to understand His word including the book of Hebrews.

Those who blithely chant " Jesus" while stopping their ears to what He is actually saying will suffer the inevitable consequences.

Wait until you read Hebrews 6 and learn the correct theology about the immutability of God and his promises.

SonJudgment said:

Wait until you read Hebrews 6 and learn the correct theology about the immutability of God and his promises.

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Agree. Arnold Fruchtenbaum, Stephen Chronister among many other insightful scholars have all of the right answers to Hebrews chapters 6 and 10.

And the fact is: the more Hebrew your inclination and perspective, the more correct you will be.
The Reformers and so many other who were trammeled and ossified by Western thought processes struck
out badly and were utterly clueless as to the intended message of the text.

cv5 said:

Agree. Arnold Fruchtenbaum, Stephen Chronister among many other insightful scholars have all of the right answers to Hebrews chapters 6 and 10.

And the fact is: the more Hebrew your inclination and perspective, the more correct you will be.
The Reformers and so many other who were trammeled and ossified by Western thought processes struck
out badly and were utterly clueless as to the intended message of the text.

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I'm more on the direct source material reader myself. I'm not against the jews nor ignorant of their downsides either. You do make the better case though against the preterists, but really it is all just side issue and distraction as they scurry and move those goalposts worse than their jumbling of the secular Roman timeline as they are trying to save the IRGC pagans in vain and try to frantically retroactive rewrite even modern history that had already been written into the tablet of destiny with Heaven's pen of iron. Job 19:23-27

cv5 said:

Agree. Arnold Fruchtenbaum, Stephen Chronister among many other insightful scholars have all of the right answers to Hebrews chapters 6 and 10.

And the fact is: the more Hebrew your inclination and perspective, the more correct you will be.
The Reformers and so many other who were trammeled and ossified by Western thought processes struck
out badly and were utterly clueless as to the intended message of the text.

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Too many early church fathers were fresh out of the Catholic beliefs, hatred of the Jews. That's why I wasn't surprised at what Mel Gibson said, hes an old style Catholic.

SonJudgment said:

I'm more on the direct source material reader myself. I'm not against the jews nor ignorant of their downsides either. You do make the better case though against the preterists, but really it is all just side issue and distraction as they scurry and move those goalposts worse than their jumbling of the secular Roman timeline as they are trying to save the IRGC pagans in vain and try to frantically retroactive rewrite even modern history that had already been written into the tablet of destiny with Heaven's pen of iron. Job 19:23-27

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No one has jumbled the Roman timeline, you are just not able to make the correct connections because of you limited understanding which is by choice.

cv5 said:

If you desired to "hear" Jesus, you would actually endeavor to understand His word including the book of Hebrews.

Those who blithely chant " Jesus" while stopping their ears to what He is actually saying will suffer the inevitable consequences.

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The irony is really just too much sometimes.