Is this true and biblical?

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Seeker47

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Aug 7, 2018
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“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
 
I posted this a couple of days ago and I think it got buried in the stack. When I was little this issue was the major complaint my father had against the church. He could not accept sending millions to hell who had no chance to meet Christ.
 
“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
I posted this a couple of days ago and I think it got buried in the stack. When I was little this issue was the major complaint my father had against the church. He could not accept sending millions to hell who had no chance to meet Christ.
I understand many people feel that way. However, the Bible makes a point to tell us, not by accident, that in the days of the apostles, the gospel was preached to the entire world.

Colossians 1:6, “the truth of THE GOSPEL HAS COME TO YOU AS IT HAS IN ALL THE WORLD and is bringing forth fruit.”

Colossians 1:23, “…the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was PREACHED TO EVERY CREATURE UNDER HEAVEN of which I Paul became a minister.”

God saw that the whole world had the chance to hear the gospel; but obviously not many believed it and obeyed it. Then He says in…

Romans 1:18, “The wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men…because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world, His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood BY THE THINGS THAT ARE MADE, even his eternal POWER AND GODHEAD, so that THEY ARE WITHOUT EXCUSE, because although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God nor were thankful…therefor God gave them up…They did not like TO RETAIN GOD IN THEIR KNOWLEDGE…”. If men do not know God today, it absolutely is not God’s fault. The Holy Spirit puts the blame on Men, not God. He says they are without excuse. And I don’t care how much you might disagree with this—God’s word and God’s judgement stands and you will never convince God otherwise. He sees the “big picture”, we do not. He understands hearts and sees people, from early times on for 1000’s of years—we do not! And He says man is without excuse.

2 Thess. 1:7, “…”When the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those WHO DO NOT KNOW GOD, and on those WHO DO NOT OBEY THE GOSPEL of our Lord Jesus Christ..”. This is why we send missionaries and buy Bibles for every nation under heaven. The gospel is preached everywhere today and Bibles are available in every country and almost every language. Those who “SEEK”, Jesus will make sure they “FIND.”
 
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“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity

That would be grossly unfair. I guess you have not noticed my numerous posts explaining general revelation:

GRFS may be denoted by the use of the Greek word kerygma, meaning proclamation or preaching, referring to the good news (Gospel) concerning salvation to heaven and from a just hell (the DOD, cf. Rom. 1:16, Gal. 1:6-12, Col. 1:21-23). This Gospel was preached by Peter (in Acts 2:22-24) and summarized by Paul (in 1Cor. 15:1-8). The salient points they mentioned included: Jesus was a man, accredited by God (to be Messiah), who died on a cross, but who was raised or resurrected from the dead. Messiah is the Way to heaven.

An obvious question to ask at this point is, “What is GRFS for those who have never heard of Jesus?” (which includes everyone living B.C. and millions of people who have lived A.D.) If God loves the world (John 3:16) and wants everyone to be saved (1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11), then He must provide an opportunity. God’s just judgment is illustrated by Jesus in the Parable of the Talents (Matt. 25:14-29), which indicates that God will judge souls on the basis of the truth (Word = Christ per John 1:1f.) they have received.

There are two main ways God/Christ is encountered:

1. General revelation, which includes meditating on the natural world or God’s supernatural work and moral conscience. Paul said men are without excuse, both because God’s eternal power and divine nature (love) are manifested by creation (Rom. 1:20), and because a proto-gospel has been proclaimed to everyone under heaven implicitly or in pre-NT foreshadowings (Col. 1:23, Rom. 10:13-18, Gal. 3:8). He also taught that all normal humans have an inner conscience or “common” sense (Rom. 2:14-16), which manifests morality or a moral Authority in every culture, beginning with the Golden Rule (Matt. 7:12).

2. Special revelation (1Pet. 1:8-12), which refers mainly to divinely inspired NT teaching regarding God’s history of salvation. Again, the Parable of the Talents indicates that souls are saved via faith in God/ Christ as revealed (cf. 1Cor. 10:1-5). Truthseekers around the world in all times are pilgrims at various places along the road of life, and all true roads eventually lead to the Way to eternal life in heaven (John 14:6, Acts 24:14, Phil. 2:10-11). All truth leads to One Way.

Recently I have realized that because truth is one, the Gospel is contained in every atom/word of truth, like a fractal design,
and the essence of each truth is divine love (2Thes. 2:10, 1John 4:8), manifested most universally/logically as the Golden Rule.
Thus, anyone with common sense at all times in all corners of the world could be saved--even we who keep floundering
and flaying away at each other on CC seeking the truest interpretation of God's Word, because seeking is salvific (Matt. 7:7).
 
Maybe I didn't know when I was well off....

Thanks for the thoughtful responses. I have lots to consider.
 
I posted this a couple of days ago and I think it got buried in the stack. When I was little this issue was the major complaint my father had against the church. He could not accept sending millions to hell who had no chance to meet Christ.

It sounds unfair to us, but considering God is perfectly righteous and just, I accept that God makes the correct judgement in every single case. We can confidently leave the judgement of others in His hands knowing nothing happens apart from His will -

Ps 7:11 God is a righteous judge,
And a God who shows indignation every day.

Ps 11:7 For the Lord is righteous, He loves righteousness;
The upright will see His face.

Ps 145:17 The Lord is righteous in all His ways,
And kind in all His works.

Ps 9:7 But the Lord sits as King forever;
He has established His throne for judgment,
8 And He will judge the world in righteousness;

He will execute judgment for the peoples fairly.

Acts 17:30 So having overlooked the times of ignorance, God is now proclaiming to mankind that all people everywhere are to repent, 31 because He has set a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all people by raising Him from the dead.”

Rev 19:1 “Hallelujah! Salvation, glory, and power belong to our God, 2 because His judgments are true and righteous;
 
“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
Lewis voices a real emotional concern, but the way he frames it creates a problem Scripture itself does not create.
The Bible never teaches that people are condemned because they “never had a chance”; it teaches that all people reject the revelation God has already given them through creation, conscience, and providence.
Salvation is always through Christ, but condemnation is never based on lack of information — it is based on universal human rebellion. Lewis tries to soften that tension by suggesting possibilities Scripture never affirms, but the apostles are explicit: salvation comes through Christ proclaimed, believed, and received.
Your father’s discomfort is understandable, yet the biblical answer is not that millions are lost because they lacked access, but that all stand accountable because they suppress the truth they do have.
Lewis offers comfort; Scripture offers clarity — and the clarity is what ultimately resolves the concern.
 
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“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity

Faith is a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender, not believing in what you know about Him.

True faith is simply a correct response to the call of the Father. So if called, anyone can respond correctly.
 
“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
In Galatians, Paul warns about a different gospel being preached by angels. Since God is just, there are a myriad of ways to reach people, like Angels. Also, have you heard of the countless people in Muslim countries having dreams about Jesus? Since God is just and is love, He is going to make sure people have opportunities to turn to Him or reject Him. Because also, scripture says every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Christ is Lord. How will you do that if you've never heard of Him?
 
“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Rev 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

God wants all people to be saved so every person has a chance to be saved whether they heard the word of God or not.

Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

God is love and is fair so He will not condemn people that have not heard for it is not their fault.

Should they miss out on salvation because no person reached them with the truth.

People say only by accepting Jesus can a person be saved but this is not true.

The Bible says if they reject the Son they are condemned but how can they reject the Son if they have not heard.

Those that have not heard cannot reject Jesus or the word of God.

Rom 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Rom 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

So there is a chance for those that have not heard to be saved although there is an advantage of hearing the truth and have the Spirit to love which love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.

Creation testifies that there is higher power that created the things they see and of His attributes which one of them is love.

For He provided food, and the means to make clothing, and shelter, and testify of the 2 greatest laws love God, and love people.

Which they are without excuse if they do not love this higher power and love people for He loves people.

Which love works no ill towards their neighbor therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;).

1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The saints will be judged prior to the millennial reign and will be saved.

After the millennial reign the dead shall rise to be judged.

If they rejected the truth not believing in a higher power, or rejected Jesus, or rejected the word of God, or offended people without care then they are not saved.

If they believed the truth but were a hypocrite which they were not caught up in the resurrection going to the second resurrection they are not saved.

If they did not hear the truth or not sufficiently they will be judged on their belief in a higher power and believe He is love and good and their conscious if they cared about doing good and not offending people and caring about their needs to help them.

And ask God for forgiveness if they do wrong and if anything is amiss for they would not have any input from Him.

If they meet the requirements they can be saved at that time for it is a time of judgement of their works for all who did not make it in the first resurrection.

They cannot be with Jesus at the first resurrection and in the millennial reign for they did not know about Jesus but they can be saved at the second resurrection for they sufficiently abided by love God, and love people to be saved.

Which the 2 greatest laws is love God, and love people, and love is the fulfilling of the law which if done right is good enough for them to be saved by those that have not heard the word of God and Jesus.

Because charity, love in action, is greater than faith and hope which a saint is saved because of their love which is by the Spirit.

The disadvantage is they do not have the Spirit to help them.

But in the Old Testament they could not receive the Spirit either to help them.

But they had the words of God but those that have not heard nature teaches the law which is written in their heart which their conscious knows right from wrong for it bears witness.

And if they believe in a higher power that is love and loves people and does not want to offend people they have a fighting chance even if they have not heard.

For whether people believe the word of God or have not heard they still know right from wrong and offending people is wrong.

Even atheists can have morality and speak out against the immorality of the world and their bad treatment of people.

How much more for people that have not heard but believe in a higher power and believes he wants them to love people wanting to please him.

They have the word of God causing them to believe but those that have not heard they have creation that testifies of love God, and love people.

Which the 2 greatest laws is love God, and love people, and all the law and prophets hang on those 2 laws.

So creation and conscious are sufficient to love God, and love people for those that have not heard God.

God is love and fair and will not toss people aside that have not heard the truth but they have a chance to be saved too.

And for OSAS people God said He wants all people to be saved.

And predestination means God already had the plan to give mankind salvation from the foundation of the world but this salvation i to whoever wants it.
 
“Is it not frighteningly unfair that this new life should be confined to people who have heard of Christ and been able to believe in Him? But the truth is God has not told us what His arrangements about the other people are. We do know that no person can be saved except through Christ. We do not know that only those who know Him can be saved by Him.”

C. S. Lewis
From: Mere Christianity
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Rev 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

God wants all people to be saved so every person has a chance to be saved whether they heard the word of God or not.

Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

God is love and is fair so He will not condemn people that have not heard for it is not their fault.

Should they miss out on salvation because no person reached them with the truth.

People say only by accepting Jesus can a person be saved but this is not true.

The Bible says if they reject the Son they are condemned but how can they reject the Son if they have not heard.

Those that have not heard cannot reject Jesus or the word of God.

Rom 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Rom 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

So there is a chance for those that have not heard to be saved although there is an advantage of hearing the truth and have the Spirit to love which love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.

Creation testifies that there is higher power that created the things they see and of His attributes which one of them is love.

For He provided food, and the means to make clothing, and shelter, and testify of the 2 greatest laws love God, and love people.

Which they are without excuse if they do not love this higher power and love people for He loves people.

Which love works no ill towards their neighbor therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;).

1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The saints will be judged prior to the millennial reign and will be saved.

After the millennial reign the dead shall rise to be judged.

If they rejected the truth not believing in a higher power, or rejected Jesus, or rejected the word of God, or offended people without care then they are not saved.

If they believed the truth but were a hypocrite which they were not caught up in the resurrection going to the second resurrection they are not saved.

If they did not hear the truth or not sufficiently they will be judged on their belief in a higher power and believe He is love and good and their conscious if they cared about doing good and not offending people and caring about their needs to help them.

And ask God for forgiveness if they do wrong and if anything is amiss for they would not have any input from Him.

If they meet the requirements they can be saved at that time for it is a time of judgement of their works for all who did not make it in the first resurrection.

They cannot be with Jesus at the first resurrection and in the millennial reign for they did not know about Jesus but they can be saved at the second resurrection for they sufficiently abided by love God, and love people to be saved.

Which the 2 greatest laws is love God, and love people, and love is the fulfilling of the law which if done right is good enough for them to be saved by those that have not heard the word of God and Jesus.

Because charity, love in action, is greater than faith and hope which a saint is saved because of their love which is by the Spirit.

The disadvantage is they do not have the Spirit to help them.

But in the Old Testament they could not receive the Spirit either to help them.

But they had the words of God but those that have not heard nature teaches the law which is written in their heart which their conscious knows right from wrong for it bears witness.

And if they believe in a higher power that is love and loves people and does not want to offend people they have a fighting chance even if they have not heard.

For whether people believe the word of God or have not heard they still know right from wrong and offending people is wrong.

Even atheists can have morality and speak out against the immorality of the world and their bad treatment of people.

How much more for people that have not heard but believe in a higher power and believes he wants them to love people wanting to please him.

They have the word of God causing them to believe but those that have not heard they have creation that testifies of love God, and love people.

Which the 2 greatest laws is love God, and love people, and all the law and prophets hang on those 2 laws.

So creation and conscious are sufficient to love God, and love people for those that have not heard God.

God is love and fair and will not toss people aside that have not heard the truth but they have a chance to be saved too.

And for OSAS people God said He wants all people to be saved.

And predestination means God already had the plan to give mankind salvation from the foundation of the world but this salvation i to whoever wants it.
 
After prayerfully studying the responses to my OP, the following conclusions become apparent.

  • God’s desire is for all to be saved.
  • There are two common ways to salvation identified:
    • General Revelation – God’s law is easily identified by the natural world.
    • Special Revelation: - God’s law identified in Yeshua and supported by the Holy Spirit.
  • We should leave “Judgement” to God.
  • Only those who consciously reject General or Special Revelation are condemned.
  • Special Revelation is the preferred method of salvation for Christians who will gain assistance from the Holy Spirit.
There was no discussion of doctrinal issues. This surprised me. In my father’s case the issue was entirely driven by church doctrine.

There are some really fascinating issues that flow from these conclusions. In consideration of courtesy, that discussion may be pursued in another post.

I learned a great deal. Thank you all for your very helpful insight and comments.
 
After prayerfully studying the responses to my OP, the following conclusions become apparent.

  • God’s desire is for all to be saved.
  • There are two common ways to salvation identified:
    • General Revelation – God’s law is easily identified by the natural world.
    • Special Revelation: - God’s law identified in Yeshua and supported by the Holy Spirit.
  • We should leave “Judgement” to God.
  • Only those who consciously reject General or Special Revelation are condemned.
  • Special Revelation is the preferred method of salvation for Christians who will gain assistance from the Holy Spirit.
There was no discussion of doctrinal issues. This surprised me. In my father’s case the issue was entirely driven by church doctrine.

There are some really fascinating issues that flow from these conclusions. In consideration of courtesy, that discussion may be pursued in another post.

I learned a great deal. Thank you all for your very helpful insight and comments.

Thanks for your good questions, and allow me to clarify the last conclusion:

God's preference is for all truthseekers to learn the Gospel/Truth (1Tim. 2:3-4), invite Christ's Holy Spirit into their hearts (Rev. 3:20) and cooperate with His guidance by reflecting His love (Rom. 5:5) aka doing good/godly works or being fruitful (Eph. 2:10, Gal. 5:22-23).
 
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