Declaring you are saved? What does scripture say?

[Raistlin]

Philippians 3:11-21

.....11 >If by any means i might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 >Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect, but i follow after, if that i may apprehend that for which also i am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 >Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing i do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before.

14 >I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Jesus Christ.

So far, the subject is not to presume we have already attained salvation in our own minds, not to presume that we are already saved :

Example:
12> Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect
13 > Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended (salvation),

15 >Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

16 >Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

Here Paul is telling us straightly that even though one is confident of salvation as one could be, do not go declaring it, instead, act as though you are still hoping for salvation, don't go declaring you are saved, or even thinking that way, for it will lead to complacency, and complacency will lead to carelessness, and carelessness to a fall.
Remember, We don't decide our own judgment/salvation, God does.

17 >Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 >For many walk, of whom i have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ.

19 >Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.

So, the subject once again: don't go declaring that you are already saved...instead keep the mindset of hope...hope will encourage diligence, diligence encourages constant self examining, which will ensure constant awareness of faults, which will encourage change with wrestlings, ..which leads to growth, which produces fruit worthy of acceptance.

And since the subject deals with not to go around declaring you are saved, what do you suppose v18 means?
Please think about that.

 

[Cobus]

Excelent POST! I would rather say I am from Satan and prove to be the holiest, than say I am from God and live the most against the cross! One thing that really puts new Christians off, is hypocracy and NO HOPE preaching! You see people avoid hypocracy to say they are only human. Well not a single Child of God is HUMAN!! They are not of this world, humans are worldly (sinning) people! God's children are HIS CHILDREN from HIS KINGDOM! Jesus says they are like the wind! What human is like the wind?

These "wind-people" are truly from God, becasue they are BORN OF GOD! Like Jesus was born of GOD! The ONLY SEED you will find in them is God's! And they are HID FROM THE WORLD IN GOD WITH CHRIST! The world CANNOT see them for what they are. They do not walk around screaming... I AM CHRISTIAN!!!... No Jesus says by their FRUIT you shall know them... THEY CANNOT BEAR BAD FRUIT! Just like humans CANNOT bear good fruit!

So you humans can scream as much and as loud as you want that you are saved and Christian, we will judge your spirit, and if it is found to be NOT the Spirit of Christ, we will not believe you!

A lemon tree that shouts he is an apple tree, will ALWAYS disapoint when proofed! It will be a sour affair! Same with hypocrates pretending to be Christians! It is a sad affair!

 

[zone]

Well not a single Child of God is HUMAN!!

They are not of this world, humans are worldly (sinning) people!

God's children are HIS CHILDREN from HIS KINGDOM!

Jesus says they are like the wind! What human is like the wind?

These "wind-people" are truly from God, becasue they are BORN OF GOD!

Like Jesus was born of GOD! The ONLY SEED you will find in them is God's!

And they are HID FROM THE WORLD IN GOD WITH CHRIST! The world CANNOT see them for what they are.

No Jesus says by their FRUIT you shall know them... THEY CANNOT BEAR BAD FRUIT! Just like humans CANNOT bear good fruit!

So you humans can scream as much and as loud as you want that you are saved and Christian, we will judge your spirit, and if it is found to be NOT the Spirit of Christ, we will not believe you!

A lemon tree that shouts he is an apple tree, will ALWAYS disapoint when proofed! It will be a sour affair! Same with hypocrates pretending to be Christians! It is a sad affair!

Cobus.
maybe you should find a simple pastor to talk to about reality, about the basics of the christian faith, and above all hear the Gospel. what you're missing is that salvation is not from/of you - its the work of God. He is able.

saying born again believers are not human is bizarre.

calling these non-human saved entities "wind-people" is a misunderstanding of the passage you're using:

John 3
You Must Be Born Again
1Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. 2This man came to Jesusa by night and said to him, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him.” 3Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born againb he cannot see the kingdom of God.” 4Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?” 5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

the WIND reference is about The Holy Spirit and the new birth: its about the Power and Sovereignty of God in the new birth.

this passage (or any other) does not ever even suggest born again believers are non human wind-people.

These "wind-people" are truly from God, becasue they are BORN OF GOD!
Like Jesus was born of GOD! The ONLY SEED you will find in them is God's! !

here's the thing keeping you from actually entering into The Lord's Rest Cobus: this deadly belief that these non human wind people are identical to Jesus is sad.
and blasphemous.

just accept the simple Gospel Cobus.

as for people not being encouraged to know and to declare they are saved by Grace through Faith, that they are children of the Most High....well, you've missed that part too:

1 John 2:25
And this is what he promised us--even eternal life.

1 John 5:11
And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.

John 3:15
So that every person who believes in him shall not be lost, but shall have eternal life.

John 5:24
"I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.

John 6:40
For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand.

John 20:31
But these things are also written that you may believe that Yeshua is The Messiah, the Son of God, and when you believe, you shall have eternal life in his name.


do you trust Jesus' words? what about the disciple Jesus loved (John) to tell you the truth, Cobus? what about Paul?


Ephesians 2:5
made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,

Romans 3:24
and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

Romans 9:16
It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy.

Colossians 2:13
When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,


i wish you peace Cobus.


John 14:1
"Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in me.

John 14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give to you. Not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your hearts be troubled, neither let them be afraid.

 

[hilchin]

It is by grace(Ep 2.10) we are saved not works. Salvation is 2 parts - God`s part & man`s part....We are completely saved in God`s part....if it is not so then Jesus died in vain ....

 

[AnandaHya]

17 >Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 >For many walk, of whom i have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ.

19 >Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.

So, the subject once again: don't go declaring that you are already saved...instead keep the mindset of hope...hope will encourage diligence, diligence encourages constant self examining, which will ensure constant awareness of faults, which will encourage change with wrestlings, ..which leads to growth, which produces fruit worthy of acceptance.

And since the subject deals with not to go around declaring you are saved, what do you suppose v18 means?
Please think about that.
[/FONT]

quite simply it refers to these type of men " who mind earthly things."

now Paul exhorts with these words "Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample."

and what does Paul declare?

2 Corinthians 2:14-16
New King James Version (NKJV)
14 Now thanks be to God who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and through us diffuses the fragrance of His knowledge in every place. 15 For we are to God the fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing. 16 To the one we are the aroma of death leading to death, and to the other the aroma of life leading to life. And who is sufficient for these things?

 

[AnandaHya]

Declare or not declare what you like. as for me I will proclaim my trust in my Lord and Savior and His ability to save, even me in my weakness His strength enables me to overcome and be a light unto the world for the glory of His name. I will declare In Christ Jesus,With the blessings of God all things are possible if you follow the Lord and where He leads.

 

[Raistlin]

quite simply it refers to these type of men " who mind earthly things."

now Paul exhorts with these words "Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample."

and what does Paul declare?

2 Corinthians 2:14-16
New King James Version (NKJV)
14 Now thanks be to God who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and through us diffuses the fragrance of His knowledge in every place. 15 For we are to God the fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing. 16 To the one we are the aroma of death leading to death, and to the other the aroma of life leading to life. And who is sufficient for these things?

Not so.
You need to read it again and again til you can hear his message.
Also, i was not quoting 2 Corinthians.
Nevertheless: among those who are being saved.
Being saved is a process, a race, a continuing walk. It is not to be taken for granted as though you have already finished the race. For only at the end do we receive the prize.

If this offends you, just remember:

Luke 7:23 > And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in Me.

 

[Raistlin]

Declare or not declare what you like. as for me I will proclaim my trust in my Lord and Savior and His ability to save, even me in my weakness His strength enables me to overcome and be a light unto the world for the glory of His name. I will declare In Christ Jesus,With the blessings of God all things are possible if you follow the Lord and where He leads.

Declare or not declare what you like.

Actually, it was the Apostle who declared it.

as for me

They will shut their ears to the truth...

I will proclaim

And turn to fables.

 

[Raistlin]

1 John 2:25
And this is what he promised us--even eternal life.

1 John 5:11
And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.


1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.


John 3:15
So that every person who believes in him shall not be lost, but shall have eternal life.

John 5:24
"I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.

Romans 11:21
For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
These believed in Christ.
Where is the guarantee of grace here?

John 6:40
For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand.

John 20:31
But these things are also written that you may believe that Yeshua is The Messiah, the Son of God, and when you believe, you shall have eternal life in his name.

Romans 11:22
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
These believed in Christ.
Where is the guarantee of grace here?

Ephesians 2:5
made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,

Romans 3:24
and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

Grace can be given, & grace can be taken away unless you continue and bear fruit.
So these scriptures are for those who bear fruit (gradually change by the power of the Spirit given).
We do not come to Christ and stay in that first condition.
We are expected to bear fruit through the Holy Spirit.

Romans 9:16
It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort , but on God's mercy.

Colossians 2:13
When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

Yes the slate is wiped clean when we come to Him.
It does not mean we continue in our old ways with no change.
Remember, Satan believes also, and he trembles.

 

[damombomb]

Rev:says to him that overcometh will I :
Give to eat from the tree of life
He will not be hurt by the second death
Give him hidden manna and a new name
I will give power over the nations
I will give him the morning star
I will not blot out his name, he shall be clothed in white raimnent,I will confess him before my Father
I will write upon him the name of my God, and make him a pillar in the temple of my God
I will grant to set with me in my throne, even as i am set down in my Fathers throne

 

[zone]

Actually, it was the Apostle who declared it.


They will shut their ears to the truth...


And turn to fables.

ok. you are Arminian.
that's fine.
many are.

many are not.
if you think Christ's PROMISE to save, the EARNEST/down payment/pledge of the Holy Spirit is NOT a guarantee of the future inheritence in full, that's fine: but please don't call what God has said FABLES.

 

[Grandpa]

To those that are being saved. The Lords "little ones". Like me. And like you. How were you saved to begin with? You asked the Lord Jesus to save you. That is also how you are saved in the end. You call on the Lord Jesus. The Lord is Faithful and True, He will not forsake you. We can have confidence in our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ. None can pluck us from His Hand. Amen.

God Bless You

 

[notIbutChrist]

Philippians 3:11-21

.....11 >If by any means i might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 >Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect, but i follow after, if that i may apprehend that for which also i am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 >Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing i do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before.

14 >I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Jesus Christ.

So far, the subject is not to presume we have already attained salvation in our own minds, not to presume that we are already saved :

Example:
12> Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect
13 > Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended (salvation),

15 >Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

16 >Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

Here Paul is telling us straightly that even though one is confident of salvation as one could be, do not go declaring it, instead, act as though you are still hoping for salvation, don't go declaring you are saved, or even thinking that way, for it will lead to complacency, and complacency will lead to carelessness, and carelessness to a fall.
Remember, We don't decide our own judgment/salvation, God does.

17 >Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 >For many walk, of whom i have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ.

19 >Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.

So, the subject once again: don't go declaring that you are already saved...instead keep the mindset of hope...hope will encourage diligence, diligence encourages constant self examining, which will ensure constant awareness of faults, which will encourage change with wrestlings, ..which leads to growth, which produces fruit worthy of acceptance.

And since the subject deals with not to go around declaring you are saved, what do you suppose v18 means?
Please think about that.

Excellent post

 

[Bloodwashed]

How you going to overcome by The Blood of The Lamb, & The Word of Your Testimonie, if you can not declare that you are saved?--Mark--

 

[cronjecj]

How you going to overcome by The Blood of The Lamb, & The Word of Your Testimonie, if you can not declare that you are saved?--Mark--

Yes very good question there.

Our robes are washed by the BLOOD OF THE LAMB. <believe it>

It's not about going around declaring one's salvation, nay, but to stay in humility.

Love.

 

[cronjecj]

Philippians 3:11-21

.....11 >If by any means i might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 >Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect, but i follow after, if that i may apprehend that for which also i am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 >Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing i do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before.

14 >I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Jesus Christ.

So far, the subject is not to presume we have already attained salvation in our own minds, not to presume that we are already saved :

Example:
12> Not as though i had already attained, either were already perfect
13 > Brethren, i count not myself to have apprehended (salvation),

15 >Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

16 >Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

Here Paul is telling us straightly that even though one is confident of salvation as one could be, do not go declaring it, instead, act as though you are still hoping for salvation, don't go declaring you are saved, or even thinking that way, for it will lead to complacency, and complacency will lead to carelessness, and carelessness to a fall.
Remember, We don't decide our own judgment/salvation, God does.

17 >Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

18 >For many walk, of whom i have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ.

19 >Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.

So, the subject once again: don't go declaring that you are already saved...instead keep the mindset of hope...hope will encourage diligence, diligence encourages constant self examining, which will ensure constant awareness of faults, which will encourage change with wrestlings, ..which leads to growth, which produces fruit worthy of acceptance.

And since the subject deals with not to go around declaring you are saved, what do you suppose v18 means?
Please think about that.

Armor of God (Ephesians 6:11-18 KJV)

Lions girt with TRUTH.

breast plate of RIGHTEOUSNESS.

feet shod for the preparation of THE GOSPEL OF PEACE.

shield of FAITH.

Helmet of SALVATION.

sword of the spirit, which is THE WORD OF GOD.

 

[Cobus]

Raistlin, did you ever think this post will get such responce? Again, saved people do not need slavation, Saved means they already are saved! This is a beautiful passage on how God adds to the Body the SAVED people! There is a differance between BEING saved and SAVED! As long as a person need the BLOOD OF JESUS, that person nees salvation. A saved man, does not need the Blood Of Christ, That man was already advanced to the next phase of salvation. Baptised with the Spirit of God! A person that LIVES in Christ, has passed the phase of cleansing! This person is clothed with Christ. This person is SEALED in Christ! And in Christ is NO SIN! No sin, no need for forgiveness!

The wicket toucheth these people NOT! There is NO SIN in these people, becasue they are NOT FLESH PLEASING PEOPLE! They are Spirit DRIVEN people and they please God ALL the time. Even their mortal bodies are quickened to OBEY only God! Father says His love is perfected in them, and they LACK NOTHING AND WANT NOTHING!

About the likeness to JEsus that is "blasphemy in some people's eyes... Look what Gos says here.... 1 John 4:17... Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

AS HE IS SO ARE WE IN THIS WORLD! This is the beautiful TRUTH! God makes us as God is in this world! Perfect, Holy and EXACTLY from the SAME HOLY Spirit! Just how alike Jesus is this NEW HOLY MAN that God baptize into His Kingdom here on earth..... This is how alike!... James warnes us about the power of our words.... The tongue and how bad that little fella can be....

I ask are there men that are to the similitude of God, here on earth? YES! Look what James says... James 3:9... Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.... Men made after the similitude of God! WOW! One more proof of how Special a saved person is.... Eph 4:13 says it best..... Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Imagine a man here on earth, that came to the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the MEASURE of the STATURE of the FULNESS of CHRIST! WOW! Now how awesome is God's salvation? God saves His people to the fulness of Christ! Why? Because He is faithful, and He is God, He does as He pleases.

Who would hate it if God does this to a man, the World and their god, Satan! Who teaches that God does not do this... the false teachers! Why? Who cares why, but the Bible does say why... Because they perish in their own corruption! And they mislead way more souls than the Truth preachers converts to the Gospel. The GOOD NEWS!

Here is the GOOD NEWS.... God has a way out of sin! Please do not misunderstand this... God has a way OUT OF SIN! And His way out is out of sin INTO HIM! From sinner to Holy Spirit driven man! That is the Good news! And NOTHING any person says, will shange that! All saved people are MOVED by the Spirit God baptized them with when HE concluded HIS grace on them! Nothing they did, all about HIM! Every MOVE these people make is a move that the Holy Spirit planned!

God says this and maybe we should all just do this.... 2 Peter 3:14 to 18.... Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. 2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness. 2Pe 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.