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Nov 19, 2012
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#41

God established ALL of the dates for His feast days in Lev.23. There was no need to keep repeating the dates in the OT nor the NT.

God's Sabbath is always in the 7th day.
God's Feast of Passover is always in the 14th day of His first month.
God's Feast of Unleavened Bread is always on the 15th day of His first month.

And so on for the rest of God's High Days.

God tells us these Feast's are to be kept FOREVER at the appointed time!


In the book of Zech. we find that ALL nations will keep the feast of Tabernacles when Jesus returns. There is no need to repeat the date because we have the 23rd chapter of Lev. to refer to if needed. And Lev. tells us that the Feast of Tabernacles is commanded to be kept on the 15th day of God's seventh month for (7) days;

Lev.23
[34] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, The fifteenth day of this seventh month shall be the feast of tabernacles for seven days unto the LORD.

And so it is with ALL of God feast days.

No dates needed to be given in the NT for God's Passover, for it had been kept on the 14th day of the first of God's month's for centuries.



OT material...again who keeps them today?



I find the verse you quoted interesting;

Matt.24
[35] Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.


So even when the heavens and earth, as we know them, are no longer the following will remain forever;


Exod.12
[14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.
[17] And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.



Lev.23
[2] Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
[3] Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

[4] These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.
[5] In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD's passover.
[6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
[15] And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete:
[16] Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD.
[24] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
[27] Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be a day of atonement: it shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall afflict your souls, and offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD.
[34] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, The fifteenth day of this seventh month shall be the feast of tabernacles for seven days unto the LORD.
[36] Seven days ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD: on the eighth day shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD: it is a solemn assembly; and ye shall do no servile work therein.


So even after the heavens and the earth are no more God's words above will remain;


His 7th day Sabbath will remain! Lev.23:2-3
His Feast of Passover will remain! Lev.23:5
His Feast of Unleavened Bread will remain! Lev.23:6
His Day of Pentecost will remain! Lev.23:15-16
His Memorial of the Blowing of the Trumpets will remain! Lev.23:24
His Day of Atonement will remain! Lev.23:27
His Feast of Tabernacles will remain! Lev.23:34
And His Great 8th day will remain! Lev.23:36




God said His words would not pass away and that His Feasts were to be kept forever at the appointed time....that means on the dates that He commanded.

Now do you think God was fibbing when He said this!


Specific dates and times are not important today...that is why you keep posting OT material.

The Son fulfilled the OT Law for us....thus, of what importance are they now...?
 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#42


OT material...again who keeps them today?

Specific dates and times are not important today...that is why you keep posting OT material.

The Son fulfilled the OT Law for us....thus, of what importance are they now...?

And yet many years AFTER the death of Christ we find Paul, not only keeping God's feast days, but teaching others to keep then as well;

Paul cared about dates;

Acts 18
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

1 Cor.5
[8] Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.



So tell me.....do you think Paul kept God's feast days as God commanded....or did he keep them whenever he wanted?


And if they were no longer to be kept....why did he keep them? Why did he say, "...I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem...", if they were done away with and dates were no longer important?


Interestingly......you say that dates are not important and yet you say;


"....
can we say that we are under a more stern law than they not to celebrate similarly?"


Make up your mind.....are OT feast day dates not important, while the celebration of the dates for X-Mas and Astarte are?


Paul kept God's feast days! Paul taught others to keep God's feast days in their appointed season.

And you say "dates" are not important!


.
 
Nov 19, 2012
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#43

And yet many years AFTER the death of Christ we find Paul, not only keeping God's feast days, but teaching others to keep then as well;

Paul cared about dates;

Acts 18
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

1 Cor.5
[8] Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.



So tell me.....do you think Paul kept God's feast days as God commanded....or did he keep them whenever he wanted?

And if they were no longer to be kept....why did he keep them? Why did he say, "...I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem...", if they were done away with and dates were no longer important?







If he kept them, then when were they?



Interestingly......you say that dates are not important and yet you say;


"....
can we say that we are under a more stern law than they not to celebrate similarly?"




No.

This was never stated.

In your haste, you have confused conversations.


Make up your mind.....are OT feast day dates not important, while the celebration of the dates for X-Mas and Astarte are?

December 25 was selected to blot-out the worship of the Iranian sun-god of the same exact date.

Looks like it worked...
 
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Eccl12and13

Guest
#44



If he kept them, then when were they?


Paul kept God's feast days according to the commandment of God. He kept them on the same date as God commanded;

Paul cared about dates;

Acts 18
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

1 Cor.5
[8] Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.



Now let's read again when God commanded His feast days to be kept;

Exod.12
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying,
[2] This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.
[5] Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats:
[6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.

[11] And thus shall ye eat it; with your loins girded, your shoes on your feet, and your staff in your hand; and ye shall eat it in haste: it is the LORD's passover.
[14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.

And let's confirm this;

Num.9
[2] Let the children of Israel also keep the passover at his appointed season.
[3] In the fourteenth day of this month, at even, ye shall keep it in his appointed season: according to all the rites of it, and according to all the ceremonies thereof, shall ye keep it.
[4] And Moses spake unto the children of Israel, that they should keep the passover.
[5] And they kept the passover on the fourteenth day of the first month at even in the wilderness of Sinai: according to all that the LORD commanded Moses, so did the children of Israel.



So we find that God commanded His Passover be kept on the 14th day of the first month and it was to be kept forever. This is why Paul said,
"...I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem..."


Now let's read what feast Paul kept on the following day....the 15th day of the first month;


Lev.23
[6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.


Now let's confirm;

Num.28
[17] And in the fifteenth day of this month is the feast: seven days shall unleavened bread be eaten.
[18] In the first day shall be an holy convocation; ye shall do no manner of servile work therein:



Paul kept God's feast days in their appointed times. There was no need to write the dates in the NT for the nation of Israel had been observing God's feast days for centuries......all in their appointed seasons at their appointed times.


And again....God said His feast days were to be kept forever.....now is part of forever!


Now again concerning the following questions;


"How is it possible that the death and resurrection of Christ ALWAYS fall on a Friday and Sunday year after year?"

"And why did it take over 300 years to create the calculation and establish this date for observation?"

"Is observing the death and resurrection of Christ each and every year on a Friday and Sunday worshiping the Lord in truth.....according to the word of God?"



Any comments concerning the above questions....which is the topic of this OP?


.
 
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stek

Guest
#45


Let's get back to the topic of this OP by asking again the following questions;


"How is it possible that the death and resurrection of Christ ALWAYS fall on a Friday and Sunday year after year?"


Christ was killed on the 14th day as you pointed out in one of your post as the the next day the 15 was of the month was the Feast of the Tabernacle and also more importantly it was the Sabbath. The Sabbath back then was Saturday. We celebrate or recognize his death each year on a Friday because of the significance of the day in relation to the Sabbath. The reason it can differ from on date from year to year is because the calendar back then only consisted of 360 days in a year not 365. Again we recognize the significance of his death in accordance with the pass over. In essence observing the death and resurrection of Christ each and every year on a Friday and Sunday is worshiping the Lord in truth.....according to the word of God!!

[/QUOTE]
"And why did it take over 300 years to create the calculation and establish this date for observation?"[/QUOTE]

HMMMMM I don't know for sure but think back then Israel was under Roman rule any celebratio of holidays would have been established by the government. Note that many jews back then and today do not accept Jesus as the Meshiah


[/QUOTE]
"Is observing the death and resurrection of Christ each and every year on a Friday and Sunday worshiping the Lord in truth.....according to the word of God?"[/QUOTE]

Yes, I believe so if you consider the significance of the Passover and Sabbath in relationship to his death.


 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#46
Christ was killed on the 14th day as you pointed out in one of your post as the the next day the 15 was of the month was the Feast of the Tabernacle and also more importantly it was the Sabbath. The Sabbath back then was Saturday.

And here is where most become confused. Let's go back to the beginning to find out more about this 15th day of the first month, or as God calls it, the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

Lev.23
[6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
[7] In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

[8] But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days: in the seventh day is an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

God commanded that not only was unleavened bread to be eaten from the first to the seventh day of the feast, but that the 1st day and the 7th day of this feast were to be observed as SABBATH days. So along with God's normal 7th day Sabbath, there were also other days that too were to be kept as Sabbath days throughout the year. This is why the scriptures referred to this day as a "...high day...". Let's confirm;

John 19
[31] The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

And what was it that the Jews were preparing for? The first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

So the day that followed the 14th day of the first month was always a Sabbath day, meaning there could have been TWO Sabbath days during the week of Jesus death, which there was; the Sabbath of the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, followed by God's regular 7th day Sabbath.

And how do we know this.....by searching God's word further and going to the book of Daniel. Let's read;

Dan.9
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


For as we know Jesus was "cut-off", or killed in the middle of both a prophetic week (3.5yrs) and a literal 7 day week, or Wed.

Passover began at the going down of the sun on Tue. evening going into Wed. That night, the 14th day of the month AND the middle of the week, Jesus ate the Passover meal with His disciples. Later that night, still on the 14th and still on the Passover He was arrested, convicted and beaten. And in the morning of the 14th.....still the Passover, still the middle of the week, was he hung on a tree. And before the sunset...before the 15th day of the month, which as we just read is ALWAYS a Sabbath, was He laid to rest.

Jesus was in the tomb from sunset Wed/Thur, to sunset Thur/Fri, which is (1) 24hr period.

And then from to sunset Thur/Fri to sunset Fri/Sat, was another 24hr period.

And finally from sunset Fri/Sat to sunset Sat/Sun, was yet a 3rd 24hr period.

Just as Jesus said, He was in the earth for exactly (3) days and (3) nights, or 72hrs.


This is why Jesus was gone when the women came while it was yet dark on the first day of the week....because remember.....the first day of the week actually began at sunset on Saturday.


The day Jesus was laid to rest was in fact before a Sabbath day, but it was a "high day", the 15th day of the first month, the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the day after the Passover which is ALWAYS a Sabbath day, one of God's annual Sabbath days, not His regular 7th day Sabbath.


If you notice even to this day God's Passover NEVER falls on the same DAY year after year after year.

And since we know that Jesus died on the Passover it is IMPOSSIBLE that the memorial of His death falls on the same day year after year.

So how is it possible to worship God in truth year after year by observing Christ death on the same day year after year after year?

.
 
Nov 19, 2012
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#47

Paul kept God's feast days according to the commandment of God. He kept them on the same date as God commanded;

Paul cared about dates;

Acts 18
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

1 Cor.5
[8] Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.








Again....no mention of any dates.

Perhaps you are getting confused over observing the event over that of observing the date...yes?


 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#48

Again....no mention of any dates.

Perhaps you are getting confused over observing the event over that of observing the date...yes?
Ok....let's see if this will work........

God commanded that His Feast of the Passover be observed on the 14th day of the first month. He also commanded that His Feast of Unleavened Bread be observed on the following day, the 15th day of the same first month. This had been done for centuries, as in over 3 thousand years!

And if that were not enough.....Jesus also observed the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread on the exact same dates; the 14th and 15th day of the first month respectively.

So when it was time for Paul to keep these Feast days, there was no need to print the date of these (2) feast days.....for they were well established.

For example.....do you really need to have the date to know what date X-Mas is celebrated? Or how about New Years Eve or New Years day? Nust thoses dates be printed in order to know on what date they fall?

So was it during Paul's day concerning the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. The dates were well established; they were and still are observed on the 14th and the 15th day of God's first month.


But again........any comments concerning the following;

"How is it possible that the death and resurrection of Christ ALWAYS fall on a Friday and Sunday year after year?"

"And why did it take over 300 years to create the calculation and establish this date for observation?"

"Is observing the death and resurrection of Christ each and every year on a Friday and Sunday worshiping the Lord in truth.....according to the word of God?"

Any comments concerning the above questions....which is the topic of this OP?

 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
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#49
Ok....let's see if this will work........

God commanded that His Feast of the Passover be observed on the 14th day of the first month. He also commanded that His Feast of Unleavened Bread be observed on the following day, the 15th day of the same first month. This had been done for centuries, as in over 3 thousand years!

And if that were not enough.....Jesus also observed the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread on the exact same dates; the 14th and 15th day of the first month respectively.

So when it was time for Paul to keep these Feast days, there was no need to print the date of these (2) feast days.....for they were well established.

For example.....do you really need to have the date to know what date X-Mas is celebrated? Or how about New Years Eve or New Years day? Nust thoses dates be printed in order to know on what date they fall?

So was it during Paul's day concerning the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. The dates were well established; they were and still are observed on the 14th and the 15th day of God's first month.



Dates are not important.

The event is important.

Remember Dec 25th was NOT Jesus' B-day...this date was selected to stamp-out competing pagan gods already assigned to that very same date.




But again........any comments concerning the following;

"How is it possible that the death and resurrection of Christ ALWAYS fall on a Friday and Sunday year after year?"

"And why did it take over 300 years to create the calculation and establish this date for observation?"


Artificial.






"Is observing the death and resurrection of Christ each and every year on a Friday and Sunday worshiping the Lord in truth.....according to the word of God?"


Again....worshipping in Truth refers to Jesus...as all through the NT, whenever TRUTH is mentioned Jesus is the subject!

A simple word search proves this.

You are hung-up on attempting to combine scripture in a way that was never meant nor does it even matter...

 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#50
Dates are not important.


You claim dates are not important, when God's word tells us they are. Let's read of a date that God said is to be kept FOREVER;

Exod.12
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying,
[2] This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.

[6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.



So God has given us a date. The date is the 14th day of the first of His months. Let's continue...


[
14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.



So God, not me, said that the 14th day of the first month is to be a memorial and this feast is to be observed FOREVER!


Sounds like a pretty important date if God said it will be kept FOREVER!

Why would God tell us to remember a date, the 14th day of the first month, FOREVER?

Has FOREVER ended? Had this date been forgotten in Jesus time?

Did not Jesus keep this very important date?

Did not Paul, after the death of Jesus, keep this very important date?

Will not this date yet be kept when Jesus returns?

.


 
Nov 19, 2012
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#51


You claim dates are not important, when God's word tells us they are. Let's read of a date that God said is to be kept FOREVER;

Exod.12
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying,
[2] This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.

[6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.



So God has given us a date. The date is the 14th day of the first of His months. Let's continue...


[
14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.



So God, not me, said that the 14th day of the first month is to be a memorial and this feast is to be observed FOREVER!


Sounds like a pretty important date if God said it will be kept FOREVER!

Why would God tell us to remember a date, the 14th day of the first month, FOREVER?

Has FOREVER ended? Had this date been forgotten in Jesus time?

Did not Jesus keep this very important date?

Did not Paul, after the death of Jesus, keep this very important date?

Will not this date yet be kept when Jesus returns?

.





Gal 4.8 - 11


But then, indeed, not knowing God, you served as slaves to the ones by nature not being gods. But now, knowing God, but rather being known by God, how do you turn again to the weak and poor elements to which you desire again to slave anew? You observe days and months and seasons and years. I fear for you, lest somehow I have labored among you in vain.



Again...observing dates are NOT important...what matters is your connection with God.

The above passge tells us that those STUCK on date observance did absolutely NOTHING for their relationship with God!






 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#52
Gal 4.8 - 11


But then, indeed, not knowing God, you served as slaves to the ones by nature not being gods. But now, knowing God, but rather being known by God, how do you turn again to the weak and poor elements to which you desire again to slave anew? You observe days and months and seasons and years. I fear for you, lest somehow I have labored among you in vain.



Again...observing dates are NOT important...what matters is your connection with God.

The above passge tells us that those STUCK on date observance did absolutely NOTHING for their relationship with God!



The following scriptures are to those that used to worship idol and false gods;

Gal.4
[8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
[10] Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.


Paul is speaking about astrology.

Because the same Paul that said the above also said this;

Acts 18
[20] When they desired him to tarry longer time with them, he consented not;
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.



Paul tells us that he could not stay with those that wished he would because he HAD to make it to one of God's feast days.

And God commanded His feast days to be kept on the exact date that He gave in the 23rd chapter of Lev. Here they are again;


His 7th day Sabbath! Lev.23:2-3
His Feast of Passover! Lev.23:5
His Feast of Unleavened Bread! Lev.23:6
His Day of Pentecost! Lev.23:15-16
His Memorial of the Blowing of the Trumpets! Lev.23:24
His Day of Atonement! Lev.23:27
His Feast of Tabernacles! Lev.23:34
And His Great 8th day! Lev.23:36


God commanded that ALL of His feast be kept at the time He gave;


Lev.23
[4] These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Paul did not have an option as to when to observe God's feast days. He had to keep them on the prescribed DATES, in their seasons!

Just as the one presented here;

Exod.12
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying,
[2] This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.

[6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.
[14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.


Can you please explain just how long God commanded His Feast of Passover is to last?

And did God say that His Feast of Passover could be observed on any day other than the 14th day of the 1st month or 14th day of the 2nd month?

Jesus kept the Feast of the Passover on the exact date as God commanded!
Paul kept the Feast of the Passover on the exact date as God commanded!


You keep claiming that dates are not important but yet you never address the fact that God commanded His feasts days to be kept in their season and He said they are to be observed FOREVER!

Why would God command that His feast days be observed FOREVER at their appointed time and in their appointed season if He did not deem them important?

The fact that some do NOT observe God's feast days is why they do not know God's plan for man!

That is why He gave us His feast days; to know His ultimate plan for man and the salvation that will come.

Why do you think He wants us to remember the blowing of the Trumpets?

"And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."

"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

"And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound."



And so it is with ALL of God's feast days! They were given to man so that man would know the plan God has for him.


Does God give us ANYTHING in vain?


Again I ask, "Why did God give us a date that is to be remembered FOREVER?"



.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
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#53


The following scriptures are to those that used to worship idol and false gods;

Gal.4
[8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
[10]
Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Paul is speaking about astrology.

Because the same Paul that said the above also said this;

Acts 18
[20] When they desired him to tarry longer time with them, he consented not;
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.



Paul tells us that he could not stay with those that wished he would because he HAD to make it to one of God's feast days.

Time is demarked by the heavenly bodies in the first place.

Paul is not referring to 'astrology'...rather, he is showing us that 'observing' the dates is NOT important.





And God commanded His feast days to be kept on the exact date that He gave in the 23rd chapter of Lev. Here they are again;


His 7th day Sabbath! Lev.23:2-3
His Feast of Passover! Lev.23:5
His Feast of Unleavened Bread! Lev.23:6
His Day of Pentecost! Lev.23:15-16
His Memorial of the Blowing of the Trumpets! Lev.23:24
His Day of Atonement! Lev.23:27
His Feast of Tabernacles! Lev.23:34
And His Great 8th day! Lev.23:36


God commanded that ALL of His feast be kept at the time He gave;


Lev.23
[4] These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

Paul did not have an option as to when to observe God's feast days. He had to keep them on the prescribed DATES, in their seasons!

Just as the one presented here;

Exod.12
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying,
[2] This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.

[6] And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.
[14] And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.


OT dates were for people under the Law.





Can you please explain just how long God commanded His Feast of Passover is to last?

And did God say that His Feast of Passover could be observed on any day other than the 14th day of the 1st month or 14th day of the 2nd month?

Jesus kept the Feast of the Passover on the exact date as God commanded!
Paul kept the Feast of the Passover on the exact date as God commanded!


You keep claiming that dates are not important but yet you never address the fact that God commanded His feasts days to be kept in their season and He said they are to be observed FOREVER!

Why would God command that His feast days be observed FOREVER at their appointed time and in their appointed season if He did not deem them important?

The fact that some do NOT observe God's feast days is why they do not know God's plan for man!

That is why He gave us His feast days; to know His ultimate plan for man and the salvation that will come.

Why do you think He wants us to remember the blowing of the Trumpets?

"And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."

"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

"And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound."



And so it is with ALL of God's feast days! They were given to man so that man would know the plan God has for him.


Does God give us ANYTHING in vain?


Again I ask, "Why did God give us a date that is to be remembered FOREVER?"



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Show us the word rendered as 'forever'....
 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#54
OT dates were for people under the Law.


Then why did Paul keep God's feast days in their appointed time?

Acts 18
[20] When they desired him to tarry longer time with them, he consented not;
[21] But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

And why will God have ALL nations keep His Feast of Tabernacles in the future;

Zech.14
[1] Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
[2] For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
[3] Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
[4] And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.


Now let's read what will be kept in the FUTURE;

[16] And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
[17] And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
[18] And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
[19] This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.


God said that His feast days were to be observed forever....and just as we read above, even when the Lord returns His feast days will yet be kept.

And they will be kept on the dates that God commanded them to be kept in the 23rd chapter of Lev.


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S

stek

Guest
#55

And here is where most become confused. Let's go back to the beginning to find out more about this 15th day of the first month, or as God calls it, the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

Lev.23
[6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
[7] In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

[8] But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days: in the seventh day is an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

God commanded that not only was unleavened bread to be eaten from the first to the seventh day of the feast, but that the 1st day and the 7th day of this feast were to be observed as SABBATH days. So along with God's normal 7th day Sabbath, there were also other days that too were to be kept as Sabbath days throughout the year. This is why the scriptures referred to this day as a "...high day...". Let's confirm;

John 19
[31] The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

And what was it that the Jews were preparing for? The first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

So the day that followed the 14th day of the first month was always a Sabbath day, meaning there could have been TWO Sabbath days during the week of Jesus death, which there was; the Sabbath of the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, followed by God's regular 7th day Sabbath.

And how do we know this.....by searching God's word further and going to the book of Daniel. Let's read;

Dan.9
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


For as we know Jesus was "cut-off", or killed in the middle of both a prophetic week (3.5yrs) and a literal 7 day week, or Wed.

Passover began at the going down of the sun on Tue. evening going into Wed. That night, the 14th day of the month AND the middle of the week, Jesus ate the Passover meal with His disciples. Later that night, still on the 14th and still on the Passover He was arrested, convicted and beaten. And in the morning of the 14th.....still the Passover, still the middle of the week, was he hung on a tree. And before the sunset...before the 15th day of the month, which as we just read is ALWAYS a Sabbath, was He laid to rest.

Jesus was in the tomb from sunset Wed/Thur, to sunset Thur/Fri, which is (1) 24hr period.

And then from to sunset Thur/Fri to sunset Fri/Sat, was another 24hr period.

And finally from sunset Fri/Sat to sunset Sat/Sun, was yet a 3rd 24hr period.

Just as Jesus said, He was in the earth for exactly (3) days and (3) nights, or 72hrs.


This is why Jesus was gone when the women came while it was yet dark on the first day of the week....because remember.....the first day of the week actually began at sunset on Saturday.


The day Jesus was laid to rest was in fact before a Sabbath day, but it was a "high day", the 15th day of the first month, the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the day after the Passover which is ALWAYS a Sabbath day, one of God's annual Sabbath days, not His regular 7th day Sabbath.


If you notice even to this day God's Passover NEVER falls on the same DAY year after year after year.

And since we know that Jesus died on the Passover it is IMPOSSIBLE that the memorial of His death falls on the same day year after year.

So how is it possible to worship God in truth year after year by observing Christ death on the same day year after year after year?

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If you would go back to Exodus 12, The Passover and the feast of Leavened bread were Given to Moses. The month of Abib being his his (Moses) first year his first month. No where is there anything that says this is a sabbath. Note that in Lev. it talks about the the appointed festival, The Sabbath, the feast of unleavend bread, and some more. It never calls the the 15th day of Abib a Sabath it refers to as a day of memorial or celbration. Their are some similarities between the two, But God specifically stated the seventh day is the Sabbath and to do NO WORK OF ANY KIND, this is not true in either Ex. or Lev. with the feast of the leavened bread which says no regular work or laborious work.

Then why did Paul keep God's feast days in their appointed time?
And why will God have ALL nations keep His Feast of Tabernacles in the future;

these do not make it a Sabbath or the Sabbath, Exodus 21:14 [SUP]14 [/SUP]And this day shall be to you for a memorial. You shall keep it as a feast to the Lord throughout your generations, keep it as an ordinance forever.
 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#56
No where is there anything that says this is a sabbath. Note that in Lev. it talks about the the appointed festival, The Sabbath, the feast of unleavend bread, and some more. It never calls the the 15th day of Abib a Sabath it refers to as a day of memorial or celebration. Their are some similarities between the two, But God specifically stated the seventh day is the Sabbath and to do NO WORK OF ANY KIND, this is not true in either Ex. or Lev. with the feast of the leavened bread which says no regular work or laborious work.
Did you not know that God commands others days to also be observed as 'sabbath' days along with His commanded 7th day Sabbath?

Did you know that on some sabbath days God does allow certain work to be done?

Do you know what constitutes a sabbath day from any other day in the week?


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S

stek

Guest
#57
Do you know what constitutes a sabbath day from any other day in the week?


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No could not find anything in the bible as th what made a day a sabbath other than the Sabbath itself
 
E

Eccl12and13

Guest
#58
No, could not find anything in the bible as to what made a day a sabbath other than the Sabbath itself


Well.....as always, let's go to the source of all of our doctrine and see if God's word has given us any insight on what constitutes a sabbath day;

Exod.16
[23] And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.
[25] And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field.
[26] Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
[28] And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?
[29] See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
[30] So the people rested on the seventh day.


Let's take note of a few facts read above;

- God did NOT command that no fires be started. He only commanded that cooking is not to be
done on the sabbath.

- God also commanded that no gathering of food was to be done on the sabbath day, so the
people rested.


Let's continue in God's word;

Exod.20
[8] Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[9] Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
[10] But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


Again note what God commanded concerning His sabbath day;

- First God tells us to keep His sabbath day holy, then He proceeds to tell us how to keep it holy.
- Not only are we to do no work, but no one in our household, including people we may have
working for us, nor any animals that perform work may work.

Let's continue;


Exod.35
[3] Ye shall kindle no fire throughout your habitations upon the sabbath day.

Now....we already read above that God commanded that no food was to be cooked on the sabbath day. And we also know that during the winter months the area that is known to be the area of the wilderness get's cold, even freezing, during the winter. So, using common sense, is it likely that the above scripture is referring to no fire for cooking, or did God mean that no fire whatsoever could be started, even in the winter? The above is for cooking only!

Let's find more of God's commandments and laws for His sabbath;


Lev.23
[3] Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.


And now we find that we are to have a holy convocation of God's sabbath. Let's read more;


Neh.10
[28] And the rest of the people, the priests, the Levites, the porters, the singers, the Nethinims, and all they that had separated themselves from the people of the lands unto the law of God, their wives, their sons, and their daughters, every one having knowledge, and having understanding;
[29] They clave to their brethren, their nobles, and entered into a curse, and into an oath, to walk in God's law, which was given by Moses the servant of God, and to observe and do all the commandments of the LORD our Lord, and his judgments and his statutes;


Above we read of not only the nation of Israel going into an agreement with the Lord, but ALL people that decided to separate themselves from the people of the land. And this agreement was to do ALL of the laws of God that He gave to Moses. Let's read what laws of God the people agreed to keep;

Neh.10
[31] And if the people of the land bring ware or any victuals on the sabbath day to sell, that we would not buy it of them on the sabbath, or on the holy day: and that we would leave the seventh year, and the exaction of every debt.

So one of the laws for God's sabbath that the people agreed to keep was not to buy items on the Lord's sabbath day OR holy day. Let's continue;


Neh.13
[15] In those days saw I in Judah some treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all manner of burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified against them in the day wherein they sold victuals.
[16] There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem.
[17] Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What evil thing is this that ye do, and profane the sabbath day?
[18] Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet ye bring more wrath upon Israel by profaning the sabbath.
[19] And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.

So not only did God command that item not be bought on His sabbath, but no items were to be sold either. Let's read just how serious Nehemiah was about not profaning God's sabbath day;

[21] Then I testified against them, and said unto them, Why lodge ye about the wall? if ye do so again, I will lay hands on you. From that time forth came they no more on the sabbath.
[22] And I commanded the Levites that they should cleanse themselves, and that they should come and keep the gates, to sanctify the sabbath day. Remember me, O my God, concerning this also, and spare me according to the greatness of thy mercy.



Nehemiah was serious enough to the point that he would have fought to keep from breaking God's sabbath laws. Let's read more of the do's and don'ts of God's sabbath;



Isa.58
[13] If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
[14] Then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.


So now we find that we are not to engage in our own pleasure or ways or even thinking on the Lord's sabbath day....we are to be focusing as much as we can on God and God alone.


So let's review God's laws and how we are commanded to keep His sabbath day holy;


- God's sabbath is for rest and not work...nor can we have anyone work for us.

- We are to have a holy convocation of the sabbath.

- We are not to cook on God's sabbath.

- We are not to buy or sell on God's sabbath.

- We are not to engage in any of our own pleasures on God's sabbath.


Now that we know God's laws concerning His sabbath day....let's find out what days are to be kept as sabbath days;


Exod.20
[8] Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[9] Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
[10] But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


Exod.31
[15] Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.

Exod.35
[2] Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

Lev.23
[3] Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.


So.....there should be no question as to what day God considers His sabbath day to be; the 7th day of the week. For us that would be Saturday. And as we know God's day begins and ends at the going down of the sun, so His 7th day sabbath actually begins at sundown on Friday.

But let's not forget something we read above.....

"
And if the people of the land bring ware or any victuals on the sabbath day to sell, that we would not buy it of them on the sabbath, or on the holy day:..." Neh.10:31

So there are "other" days that God declares to be "holy days" where it is to be treated as a sabbath day. Let's find these holy days that are to be observed as God's 7th day sabbath;


Lev.23
[24] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
[25] Ye shall do no servile work therein: but ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD.



Please take note....God did not say on the 7th day of the week to have a sabbath....He commanded that a sabbath was to be had on the 1st day of the 7th month.....and that day can fall on ANY day of the week and not always on the 7th day or Sat.

So no matter what day of the week the 1st day of the 7th month falls on God commands that it be observed as a sabbath day. Let's continue;

Lev.23
[27] Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be a day of atonement: it shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall afflict your souls, and offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD.
[28] And ye shall do no work in that same day: for it is a day of atonement, to make an atonement for you before the LORD your God.
[30] And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people.
[31] Ye shall do no manner of work: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.
[32] It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.


So now we have yet another sabbath day that does not always fall on the 7th day of the week. The above sabbath is commanded by God to be observed on the 10th day of the 7th month.

Also note how these sabbath days are commanded to be kept; "...
an holy convocation...", "...Ye shall do no manner of work...", "...shall do no servile work therein..."


Now....let's go back and read how God commands the 15th day of His first month is to be observed;


Lev.23
[6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.
[7] In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.



Num.29
[12] And on the fifteenth day of the seventh month ye shall have an holy convocation; ye shall do no servile work, and ye shall keep a feast unto the LORD seven days:


Just as God commanded His 7th day be kept holy and observed as a sabbth day, so are the rest of God's holy days to be kept and observed as sabbath days.

And as we just read above, the day AFTER the 14th day of the month (Passover), which is the 15th day of the month, it too is to be kept as a sabbath day.



That is why it is IMPOSSIBLE to keep ALL of God's days holy! Because God gave us specific instructions for the observance of His sabbath and holy days;


- God's sabbath is for rest and not work...nor can we have anyone work for us.

- We are to have a holy convocation of the sabbath.

- We are not to cook on God's sabbath.

- We are not to buy or sell on God's sabbath.

- We are not to engage in any of our own pleasures on God's sabbath.


We cannot keep ALL of the days of the week holy, for if we did we would get no work done......and that includes having babies; (...
nor finding thine own pleasure...)



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J

jody50

Guest
#59
You're using the Bible to help you learn how to worship God in Spirit and truth.
That Bible has man made additions to it called chapter and verse markers.
You seem quite fine with those man made additions.
The chapter numbers and verse numbers don't change or add anything to the Bible. It just makes it easier to refer to passages. No words are added.