Prophetic Time

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L

Laodicea

Guest
#1
Reason # 1:
The expressions “time, times and the dividing of time”, “42 months”, “1260 days”, and
“70 weeks”, are very peculiar. They could have been expressed in literal language but
instead they are given a symbolic flavor. Notice, for example, that Luke 4:25 and
James 5:17 refer to the period when there was no rain in the days of Elijah as “three
years and six months”. This is the normal way of expressing time (see also, Acts 18:11;
II Samuel 2:11; I Samuel 27:7).It is significant that every measurement of time in
prophecy is given a symbolic flavor: hour (Revelation 17:12; 9:13), day (Revelation
12:6), week (Daniel 9:2427),
month (Revelation 13:5), year (Daniel 7:25). It is also
significant that nonapocalyptic
prophecies express time in literal language: 70 years
(Jeremiah 25:1112),
400 years (Genesis 15:1315),
120 years (Genesis 6:3) with literal
persons performing literal actions!

Reason # 2:

The symbolic time periods are always found within the context of apocalyptic passages
where symbols predominate. For example, the three and one half times are found in
the context of four symbolic beasts, a symbolic sea, symbolic winds, symbolic clouds,
symbolic horns, and a symbolic little horn. Similarly, the 1260 days are found in a
context where a symbolic woman, clothed with a symbolic sun, stands on a symbolic
moon, with 12 symbolic stars on her head. She is persecuted by a symbolic dragon
who has seven symbolic heads, ten symbolic horns and who casts a third of the
symbolic stars to the earth.
In Revelation 13, the 42 months are found within a context where a symbolic
composite beast, with ten symbolic horns, receives its power from a symbolic dragon.
It also arises from a symbolic sea and later uses a symbolic image beast to impose a
symbolic mark! The same could be said about Daniel 8. There we have a symbolic
ram, a symbolic hegoat,
and a symbolic little horn. It only stands to reason that if the
scenes where these time periods are found in are symbolic, then the time periods must
also be symbolic!!

Reason # 3:

The little horn of Daniel 7 arose among the ten horns on the head of the fourth beast
(Rome). It is clear from history that the Roman empire was fragmented when the
barbarians came from the northern sector of the empire and carved it up. Daniel 7
makes it clear that there are no gaps in the historical flow of nations. The lion is
succeeded immediately by the bear, the bear is immediately succeeded by the
leopard, the leopard is immediately succeeded by the dragon beast, the dragon beast
then sprouts the ten horns and the little horn then arises among the ten. Now, if the
little horn arose among the ten and the ten were complete in 476 A. D., and the little
horn ruled until the judgment (in 1844), then the three and one half times of dominion
of the little horn must be 1260 years, and not literal days. If the days were literal, then
the little horn would have ruled only from 476-479 A. D. But the fact is that the Roman
Catholic Church ruled for 1260 years!!

Reason # 4:

The vision of Daniel 8:12
covers the whole period of the ram, the he goat,
the little horn until the cleansing of the sanctuary. In Daniel 8:13 the question is asked: “Until
when shall the vision be?” The context indicates that the word vision includes the
totality of what Daniel has seen in Daniel 8 to that point. Then, in Daniel 8:15 we are
told that Daniel wished to comprehend the vision. The question is which vision? The
answer is simple: It must be the totality of the vision of Daniel 8 because when the
Angel Gabriel comes to explain the vision in answer to Daniel’s request, he begins with
Persia and then continues with Greece, the little horn, and culminates with the
conclusion of the 2300 days when the sanctuary is to be cleansed.
Thus it is clear that the 2300 days which cover the whole vision of Daniel 8 must
involve CENTURIES and not literal days, (that is, six and one half literal years).
Incidentally, this explains the reason why Daniel 8 begins with Persia and not with
Babylon. The 2300 days begin when Persia gives the decree to restore and build
Jerusalem and that is why the vision begins with Persia. Thus, Daniel 8 and 9 must be
connected in order to comprehend the 2300 day prophecy.
Notice the following illustration:
Vision = Ram + He goat
+ Pagan Rome + Papal Rome + Judgment
How Long? 2300 Days/Years

Reason # 5:

In the historical books of the Old Testament, days and years are used in a parallel
fashion. Notice the following illustrations:
. Exodus 13:10 reads literally in Hebrew that the Passover was to be celebrated
“from days to days”. Obviously this means from year to year.
. I Samuel 20:6 the
Hebrew literally reads “sacrifice of the days” but the context
clearly shows it refers to the yearly sacrifice.
. I Samuel 2:19 literally reads, “from days to days”
. I Samuel 1:21 literally reads, “sacrifice of the days”
. Judges 11:40 literally reads, “from days to days, four days each year”
. I Samuel 27:7 literally reads, “days and four months”
. I Kings 1:1 says that David was stricken “in days” but it means “years”.
. Genesis 47:9 is an interesting verse in that Jacob speaks of “the days of my
years”
. Genesis 5:5 states that the days that Adam lived were 930 years.
. Genesis 6:3 is the first time prophecy in the Bible where days are linked with
years.
In Old Testament poetry, days and years are employed in synonymous parallelism.
Please notice the following examples: Job 10:5; 15:20; 32:7; Deuteronomy 32:7;
Psalm77:5.
A very interesting text is Psalm 90:910
where the translation, “years of our lives”
literally reads in Hebrew, “the days of our years”. In every place where the Old
Testament couples days with years, the word “day” is in the “A” line and the word
“year” is in the “B” line. Regarding this, the Old Testament scholar, William Shea
comments:
“When we come to the occurrence of the word ‘days’ in the time prophecies, therefore,
an ancient Semite whose mind was steeped in this parallelistic type of thought would
naturally have made an association of ‘years’ with the ‘days’ found in a symbolic
context, just as he naturally would have identified ‘years’ as the Bword
that would
follow the Aword
‘days’ in its occurrence as part of a wellknown
parallel pair.”
(William H. Shea, Selected Studies in Prophetic Interpretation, p. 69).
We noted that the pope was taken prisoner in 1798 near the end of the French
Revolution. It was a time of struggle for freedom from oppression by the monarchy and
by the church which worked to support it. This clear low point marks the end of more
than a thousand years of church dominance. Recalling that the 1260 prophetic days
represent 1260 literal years, we ask more about what event(s) in 538 started that
period.
The siege of Rome began in 537. The Gothic army which surrounded the city cut
aqueducts among other things. Food was scarce for both those inside the city and
those outside. To draw the Goths away from Rome, an army was sent to the Gothic
capital and took it. The Goths retreated. "Thus the siege of Rome, which had lasted for
a year and nine days, came to an end about the middle of March, A.D. 538.
"
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#2
the 'day-year theory' is nonsense...and as you just showed...you are starting with a preconceived doctrine and then insisting on an interpretation that agrees with your doctrine...

you aren't supposed to bend scripture through an interpretive system to make fit your doctrine...you are supposed change your doctrine to fit the plain meaning of scripture!
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#3
the 'day-year theory' is nonsense...and as you just showed...you are starting with a preconceived doctrine and then insisting on an interpretation that agrees with your doctrine...

you aren't supposed to bend scripture through an interpretive system to make fit your doctrine...you are supposed change your doctrine to fit the plain meaning of scripture!
The year/day is in the Bible. Do some research.
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#4
The year/day is in the Bible. Do some research.
i have done research...the arguments for the 'day-year principle' do not stand up to scrutiny...

like i said...you hold to the day-year interpretation because it agrees with your doctrine...and then you even pick some dates that are more or less arbitrary to make history fit into your day-year theory...

you are going about it -completely- backwards...
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#5
i have done research...the arguments for the 'day-year principle' do not stand up to scrutiny...

like i said...you hold to the day-year interpretation because it agrees with your doctrine...and then you even pick some dates that are more or less arbitrary to make history fit into your day-year theory...

you are going about it -completely- backwards...
If you do not agree with the year/day principle then the final week in Daniel 9 would be 7 days instead of 7 years
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
589
113
#6
Reason # 1:
The expressions “time, times and the dividing of time”, “42 months”, “1260 days”, and
“70 weeks”, are very peculiar. They could have been expressed in literal language but
instead they are given a symbolic flavor. Notice, for example, that Luke 4:25 and
James 5:17 refer to the period when there was no rain in the days of Elijah as “three
years and six months”. This is the normal way of expressing time (see also, Acts 18:11;
II Samuel 2:11; I Samuel 27:7).It is significant that every measurement of time in
prophecy is given a symbolic flavor: hour (Revelation 17:12; 9:13), day (Revelation
12:6), week (Daniel 9:2427),
month (Revelation 13:5), year (Daniel 7:25). It is also
significant that nonapocalyptic
prophecies express time in literal language: 70 years
(Jeremiah 25:1112),
400 years (Genesis 15:1315),
120 years (Genesis 6:3) with literal
persons performing literal actions!

Reason # 2:
The symbolic time periods are always found within the context of apocalyptic passages
where symbols predominate. For example, the three and one half times are found in
the context of four symbolic beasts, a symbolic sea, symbolic winds, symbolic clouds,
symbolic horns, and a symbolic little horn. Similarly, the 1260 days are found in a
context where a symbolic woman, clothed with a symbolic sun, stands on a symbolic
moon, with 12 symbolic stars on her head. She is persecuted by a symbolic dragon
who has seven symbolic heads, ten symbolic horns and who casts a third of the
symbolic stars to the earth.
In Revelation 13, the 42 months are found within a context where a symbolic
composite beast, with ten symbolic horns, receives its power from a symbolic dragon.
It also arises from a symbolic sea and later uses a symbolic image beast to impose a
symbolic mark! The same could be said about Daniel 8. There we have a symbolic
ram, a symbolic hegoat,
and a symbolic little horn. It only stands to reason that if the
scenes where these time periods are found in are symbolic, then the time periods must
also be symbolic!!

Reason # 3:
The little horn of Daniel 7 arose among the ten horns on the head of the fourth beast
(Rome). It is clear from history that the Roman empire was fragmented when the
barbarians came from the northern sector of the empire and carved it up. Daniel 7
makes it clear that there are no gaps in the historical flow of nations. The lion is
succeeded immediately by the bear, the bear is immediately succeeded by the
leopard, the leopard is immediately succeeded by the dragon beast, the dragon beast
then sprouts the ten horns and the little horn then arises among the ten. Now, if the
little horn arose among the ten and the ten were complete in 476 A. D., and the little
horn ruled until the judgment (in 1844), then the three and one half times of dominion
of the little horn must be 1260 years, and not literal days. If the days were literal, then
the little horn would have ruled only from 476-479 A. D. But the fact is that the Roman
Catholic Church ruled for 1260 years!!

Reason # 4:
The vision of Daniel 8:12
covers the whole period of the ram, the he goat,
the little horn until the cleansing of the sanctuary. In Daniel 8:13 the question is asked: “Until
when shall the vision be?” The context indicates that the word vision includes the
totality of what Daniel has seen in Daniel 8 to that point. Then, in Daniel 8:15 we are
told that Daniel wished to comprehend the vision. The question is which vision? The
answer is simple: It must be the totality of the vision of Daniel 8 because when the
Angel Gabriel comes to explain the vision in answer to Daniel’s request, he begins with
Persia and then continues with Greece, the little horn, and culminates with the
conclusion of the 2300 days when the sanctuary is to be cleansed.
Thus it is clear that the 2300 days which cover the whole vision of Daniel 8 must
involve CENTURIES and not literal days, (that is, six and one half literal years).
Incidentally, this explains the reason why Daniel 8 begins with Persia and not with
Babylon. The 2300 days begin when Persia gives the decree to restore and build
Jerusalem and that is why the vision begins with Persia. Thus, Daniel 8 and 9 must be
connected in order to comprehend the 2300 day prophecy.
Notice the following illustration:
Vision = Ram + He goat
+ Pagan Rome + Papal Rome + Judgment
How Long? 2300 Days/Years

Reason # 5:
In the historical books of the Old Testament, days and years are used in a parallel
fashion. Notice the following illustrations:
. Exodus 13:10 reads literally in Hebrew that the Passover was to be celebrated
“from days to days”. Obviously this means from year to year.
. I Samuel 20:6 the
Hebrew literally reads “sacrifice of the days” but the context
clearly shows it refers to the yearly sacrifice.
. I Samuel 2:19 literally reads, “from days to days”
. I Samuel 1:21 literally reads, “sacrifice of the days”
. Judges 11:40 literally reads, “from days to days, four days each year”
. I Samuel 27:7 literally reads, “days and four months”
. I Kings 1:1 says that David was stricken “in days” but it means “years”.
. Genesis 47:9 is an interesting verse in that Jacob speaks of “the days of my
years”
. Genesis 5:5 states that the days that Adam lived were 930 years.
. Genesis 6:3 is the first time prophecy in the Bible where days are linked with
years.
In Old Testament poetry, days and years are employed in synonymous parallelism.
Please notice the following examples: Job 10:5; 15:20; 32:7; Deuteronomy 32:7;
Psalm77:5.
A very interesting text is Psalm 90:910
where the translation, “years of our lives”
literally reads in Hebrew, “the days of our years”. In every place where the Old
Testament couples days with years, the word “day” is in the “A” line and the word
“year” is in the “B” line. Regarding this, the Old Testament scholar, William Shea
comments:
“When we come to the occurrence of the word ‘days’ in the time prophecies, therefore,
an ancient Semite whose mind was steeped in this parallelistic type of thought would
naturally have made an association of ‘years’ with the ‘days’ found in a symbolic
context, just as he naturally would have identified ‘years’ as the Bword
that would
follow the Aword
‘days’ in its occurrence as part of a wellknown
parallel pair.”
(William H. Shea, Selected Studies in Prophetic Interpretation, p. 69).
We noted that the pope was taken prisoner in 1798 near the end of the French
Revolution. It was a time of struggle for freedom from oppression by the monarchy and
by the church which worked to support it. This clear low point marks the end of more
than a thousand years of church dominance. Recalling that the 1260 prophetic days
represent 1260 literal years, we ask more about what event(s) in 538 started that
period.
The siege of Rome began in 537. The Gothic army which surrounded the city cut
aqueducts among other things. Food was scarce for both those inside the city and
those outside. To draw the Goths away from Rome, an army was sent to the Gothic
capital and took it. The Goths retreated. "Thus the siege of Rome, which had lasted for
a year and nine days, came to an end about the middle of March, A.D. 538."
Taken from Reasons #1, #2, #3, #5, #9, #10, #17, see Here
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
#7
If you do not agree with the year/day principle then the final week in Daniel 9 would be 7 days instead of 7 years
in the hebrew those 'weeks' are literally just called 'sevens'...they could easily be seven of -anything- and not necessarily seven days...

the ancient jews had a concept of a 'week of years' which consisted of six years plus a sabbath year...and this is the most natural interpretation of the 'sevens' given the messianic nature of the prophecy...

so this prophecy does not require the 'day-year principle' since the hebrew text does not mention 'days' in the first place...