Romans 10 Question

[LeeLoving]

Romans 10
King James Version
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

I was just wondering if Paul is continuing his thought here that he is making in verse 4 in verse 9 and that is why the "requirements for salvation" are not believing the gospel. If he's completing his thought then he is making the assumption that the one who confesses with their mouth Jesus is Lord believes the gospel, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth". This really clears up verse 9 for me, because it has caused me difficulties why someone would only need to confess Jesus is Lord and believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead when elsewhere it says that the Corinthians were saved by believing Paul's gospel. Just wondering other's thoughts on this.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Isn't that the gospel, ie, that the lord died and rose from the dead?

 

[LeeLoving]

Isn't that the gospel, ie, that the lord died and rose from the dead?

Well 1 Corinthians 15 says,

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 King James Version
15 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

And also that he appeared to many people. So I would say no. I think it's important to include that he died for our sins as that is good news ("gospel") because it justifies us before God.

Isaiah 53:11 King James Version
11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

 

[homwardbound]

Romans 10
King James Version
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

I was just wondering if Paul is continuing his thought here that he is making in verse 4 in verse 9 and that is why the "requirements for salvation" are not believing the gospel. If he's completing his thought then he is making the assumption that the one who confesses with their mouth Jesus is Lord believes the gospel, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth". This really clears up verse 9 for me, because it has caused me difficulties why someone would only need to confess Jesus is Lord and believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead when elsewhere it says that the Corinthians were saved by believing Paul's gospel. Just wondering other's thoughts on this.

To begin with, it is not Paul's Gospel, it is Father and Son's for us to be saved by God through belief in our hearts to God, that Son took care of the sin issue first in that one time death only. it is finished (John 19:30) (2 Cor 5:16-20) So Father can now enter us and teach us each personally new life given us to love all in the same mercy and truth given us by Son first, who went willingly to death for us all first on that cross. To give new life in his risen Life, Born again
Believe God in risen Son for you, God gives you new life, People do not, people fight, kick and scream at you, playing God over you, not good for me to ever do that to anyone, since Daddy, PaPa, Father forgave me through Son too, as has done once for everyone first, before anyone could be given new life from Daddy , PaPa, Father. Seek John 4:23-24 please as I see you are doing in your post. This is a personal journey between God and you first, to be revealed this love beyond understanding to any first born nature. Then one will share their dependence on God 100% leading them in the same love and mercy given them through risen Son for them
Just ask Father God, for the new life and believe Daddy, will reveal it to you too, it takes time, willingness to continue, even as a Job in the book of Job, and deeper in Jesus going willingly to death without any flesh fight back
Can, you put down that sword? The one Peter pulled out and cut off the ear of Malchus, who was there to take Jesus away to the Pharisees and be tried, unrighteously
I trust Father will reveal the truth to you as Father is willing for us all to get set free and love each other sincerely, not taking away anyone's free choice in the process of learning new from Father, Daddy, PaPa, the Holy Spirit of God
God loves us all, otherwise Son Jesus, would not have gone to that cross without fighting back you think? I now know, thanks to Daddy's love for us all given for us all through Son

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

And also that he appeared to many people. So I would say no. I think it's important to include that he died for our sins as that is good news ("gospel") because it justifies us before God.
.

But does a person have to believe or even know that their sins are forgiven if they believe that Jesus is the son of God and that he died and rose again? Only God can impart that heart belief, and if a person believes that and acknowledges it, then he is saved IMO.

 

[LeeLoving]

But does a person have to believe or even know that their sins are forgiven if they believe that Jesus is the son of God and that he died and rose again? Only God can impart that heart belief, and if a person believes that and acknowledges it, then he is saved IMO.

It's not clear to me what a person needs to believe, but I would think it would be the gospel, sort of hence the thread. Jesus talks about believing in his name in John 3, John Piper wrote in an article if I'm not mistaken where he said that name goes hand in hand with fame, so believing what Jesus is famous for, if I'm understanding that word correctly, hence why someone would need to believe the gospel. If you don't believe Jesus died for your sins I don't know if you're saved. Those who believe in Jesus are forgiven, I don't know if you need to believe that to be saved though.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

If you don't believe Jesus died for your sins I don't know if you're saved. Those who believe in Jesus are forgiven, I don't know if you need to believe that to be saved though.

I didn't have a clue my sins were forgiven when I first believed in Christ. But I understood later as I read

 

[homwardbound]

Isn't that the gospel, ie, that the lord died and rose from the dead?

Rose from the dead, to me is the vocal point for new life getting given us from Father, Daddy, PaPa
There is no life in death, which had to happen first for reconciliation to us all first. Since that is done now by Son, and Father approving it, raising Son form the dead for new life to get given us, the one's that sincerely believe God get it, love to all, not a few as religion only does, to this day, only loves those that follow them, and acts as if loves all. yet, then when get even one Proselyte in what happens? You question these religionists, they get mad, and say you are to believe as they believe, making God Father and Son Liars. Making people better than other people, (Luke 18:9-14) when Daddy has no respect of persons, we are all equal in Daddy's sight
In the first Testament before Son Jesus as "Sinners"
In Beleif to the risen Son Jesus given us, In Daddy's sight though Son we are made new as perfect as if never sinned, amazing! Perfect, What?
Colossians 1:22
in the body of his flesh through death, topresent you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
What? Yes
John 19:28-30
After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst. Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put it upon hyssop, and put it to his mouth. When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Father, Daddy, PaPa, is ready to give new life right now, once anyone does believe God in risen Son for them too, Father seals you to see Eph 1:13, 6,7, and trust Daddy Phi; 1:6

Now see, to not take for granted this gift and learn to let go of wrong doings (Not try to stop sin on your own or with help from God or others as well), trust God 100% be dependent on God alone, then one anyone will stop accusing, abusing and excusing self and see humility and just love all in God's truth, not this worlds. As those of flesh will come after you in doing truth

James 1:15
Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
So, ask Father to teach you truth, not yourself or anyone else. Daddy loves us all y'all, otherwise Son Jesus would not have ever gone to that cross willingly ever, yet he did and is risen form the dead to give each one new life that believes and stands in it no matter what others do or not do, thank you

 

[LeeLoving]

I didn't have a clue my sins were forgiven when I first believed in Christ. But I understood later as I read

Acts 10:43 King James Version
43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

 

[homwardbound]

But does a person have to believe or even know that their sins are forgiven if they believe that Jesus is the son of God and that he died and rose again? Only God can impart that heart belief, and if a person believes that and acknowledges it, then he is saved IMO.

yep, you got that from Daddy, PaPa, Father, God loves in truth the first born flesh only love those that love them
God loves us all, time to say thank you and not have to get purged from sin knowing it, Wow

1. Hebrews 1:3
   who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Hebrews 9:22
   And almost all things are by the law purgedwith blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
3. Hebrews 10:2
   For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

The born new by God Father in risen Son have no conscience of sin, until religion steps in
Thank you I just got taught deeper, by Father through you

 

[Ouch]

Romans 10
King James Version
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

I was just wondering if Paul is continuing his thought here that he is making in verse 4 in verse 9 and that is why the "requirements for salvation" are not believing the gospel. If he's completing his thought then he is making the assumption that the one who confesses with their mouth Jesus is Lord believes the gospel, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth". This really clears up verse 9 for me, because it has caused me difficulties why someone would only need to confess Jesus is Lord and believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead when elsewhere it says that the Corinthians were saved by believing Paul's gospel. Just wondering other's thoughts on this.

First Paul preached the same gospel as the rest of JESUS disciples.

Second if you keep things in context you can see the first word Romans 10:1 Brethren.

He is not speaking to the unsaved but to his church where his brothers in Christ are.

If you keep reading he is telling them to get out and Preach.

Romans 10.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Verse 9 is a perfect example of proving not once saved always saved.

What good are we if you don't work for him, and peached the gospel?

Paul was baptized in JESUS name, Paul spoke in tongues.

I ask you as Paul asked people in Ephesus Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed??

This was app 20 AFTER the day of Pentecost.

Acts 19
King James Version
19 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

 

[p_rehbein]

it says that the Corinthians were saved by believing Paul's gospel. Just wondering other's thoughts on this.

Paul did not have a Gospel. Paul preached the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

As well, the Book of Romans is a continuous message that must be read together to fully understand the meaning of a passage in one Chapter. I suggest you start with Chapter 8 and read through Chapter 10 to see this is true.

Paul did not, nor did he profess to have the power to save. Paul ALWAYS stressed the blood of Jesus and our belief in Him was where salvation came from.

 

[Gideon300]

Romans 10
King James Version
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

I was just wondering if Paul is continuing his thought here that he is making in verse 4 in verse 9 and that is why the "requirements for salvation" are not believing the gospel. If he's completing his thought then he is making the assumption that the one who confesses with their mouth Jesus is Lord believes the gospel, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth". This really clears up verse 9 for me, because it has caused me difficulties why someone would only need to confess Jesus is Lord and believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead when elsewhere it says that the Corinthians were saved by believing Paul's gospel. Just wondering other's thoughts on this.

There are two salvations, that's the difficulty with verse 9. Another example is John 1:12 & 13,

"But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God— children born not of blood, nor of the desire or will of man, but born of God.…"

The second salvation is the salvation of the soul. To be born again is instant and eternal. This is the basis for "OSAS" belief. The salvation of the soul (1 Peter 1:9, James 1:21) is progressive and conditional. The soul consists primarily of mind, emotion and will. The soul is not the spirit. There is a life within the soul that is the natural life that Adam had when he was created. This life is in opposition to the new life of Christ that is in the spirit of the believer. As we turn away from the natural life and trust Christ, we will gradually be transformed.

A big part of this transformation is maintaining our confession of Christ as Lord. Too often, believers get discouraged and put more faith in their thoughts and feelings than in Jesus and God's word. We need always to stay on the truth that God raised Jesus from the dead. If God can raise Jesus from the dead, what problem can we have that God cannot solve?

Peter tells us that the salvation of our souls is the goal of our faith. A goal is something to strive for, not something settled. James tells us that humbly accepting God's word in our hearts saves our souls. While Christians put more faith in their feelings than God's word, they will make no progress. If we do nothing but complain about the hard times we go through, that also will hinder us. (1 Peter 1: 3-9)