The Prophet Isaiah wrote Three Persons in One Trinity (Isaiah 48).

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Chuckt

Guest
#1
The prophet Isaiah wrote, “Listen to Me, O Jacob, and Israel, I called: I am He, I am the First, I am also the Last. Indeed My hand has laid the foundation of the earth, and My right hand has stretched out the heavens” (Isa. 48-12-13). The One speaking identifies Himself as the eternal Creator of the world.


The speaker continues, “Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit have sent Me” (v. 16).


So the speaker clearly is God. Yet He says “the Lord God and His Spirit” sent Him. The three persons of the Godhead all appear in this verse: The One being sent is God, and the Ones doing the sending are God. Together, they constitute the true and living triune God of Israel: “And now the Lord God [the Father], and His Spirit [the Holy Spirit], have sent Me [the Son].”


Isaiah then identified the speaker: “Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy one of Israel” ‘I am the LORD your GOD’” (v. 17). The speaker is the Redeemer, the Messiah.

I found this in my Onedrive Documents. I forget where I got it or who to attribute parts of it to.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#2
i think it's clear that when Isaiah, or another prophet writes "this is what the Lord says:"
that it's the prophet speaking that part, and what follows is what the Lord says. so not the entire text of chapter 48 is the direct words of God -- some of it is interjections from Isaiah.

for example, see how the NIV translators chose to put the quotation marks here in Isaiah 48:16-17

Come near me and listen to this:

“From the first announcement I have not spoken in secret;
at the time it happens, I am there.”

And now the Sovereign Lord has sent me,
endowed with his Spirit.
This is what the Lord says your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel:

“I am the Lord your God,
who teaches you what is best for you,
who directs you in the way you should go."


this makes Isaiah the speaker saying 'come near and listen" and that he is sent by the Lord, endowed with His Spirit.
i think this is a legitimate and right way to put the quotation marks - it makes more sense. that sort of punctuation isn't in the Hebrew; it's to be understood from context.




 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,691
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#3
that said -- look at Isaiah 48:12-13

Listen to me, Jacob,
Israel, whom I have called:
I am He;
I am the first and I am the last.
My own hand laid the foundations of the earth,
and my right hand spread out the heavens;
when I summon them,
they all stand up together.​

this is without doubt God the Father speaking.
and who else says "
I am the first and the last" ?
Jesus Christ - the Alpha and the Omega.
so the Father and the Son are One God -- here, together with Revelation 22:13, is scripture showing clearly the divinity of Jesus.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,691
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#4
another evidence of Christ's divinity is here in 48:11 --

For my own sake, for my own sake, I do this.
How can I let myself be defamed?
I will not yield my glory to another.

He will not yield His glory to another. but compare Jesus' prayer in John 17:5 --

And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.

Jesus the Christ shared His glory. the conclusion is that in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. that Christ and the Father are One, and One God.
 
Dec 1, 2014
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#5
Chuckt.....many times in the old testament, a manifestation of JESUS CHRIST Himself is present. This is one of them. This is clearly JESUS speaking...not GOD, His Father.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,691
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#6
and also look at this! -- from 48:17, YHWH the Father is the One who teaches us & directs us in the way we should go:

“I am the Lord your God,
who teaches you what is best for you,
who directs you in the way you should go."​

but in John 14:26 we read:

But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

-- so the Holy Spirit is the one who teaches & directs us in all things -- and He is sent by the Father, in Jesus' name -- so here is the trinity, after all, in this chapter (together with some other scripture) :)

.. i just think that what you quoted in the first post there may not be accurate about who is the speaker in Isaiah 48:16 -- like i put in my first reply.
 
Last edited:
Sep 4, 2012
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#7
The prophet Isaiah wrote, “Listen to Me, O Jacob, and Israel, I called: I am He, I am the First, I am also the Last. Indeed My hand has laid the foundation of the earth, and My right hand has stretched out the heavens” (Isa. 48-12-13). The One speaking identifies Himself as the eternal Creator of the world.


The speaker continues, “Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit have sent Me” (v. 16).


So the speaker clearly is God. Yet He says “the Lord God and His Spirit” sent Him. The three persons of the Godhead all appear in this verse: The One being sent is God, and the Ones doing the sending are God. Together, they constitute the true and living triune God of Israel: “And now the Lord God [the Father], and His Spirit [the Holy Spirit], have sent Me [the Son].”


Isaiah then identified the speaker: “Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy one of Israel” ‘I am the LORD your GOD’” (v. 17). The speaker is the Redeemer, the Messiah.

I found this in my Onedrive Documents. I forget where I got it or who to attribute parts of it to.
I think verse 17 refers to GOD the father, rather than Jesus because in the Hebrew the word is YHWH, not lord. It is the same as verse 16 (YHWH, not lord). So IMO in verse 17 Jesus is speaking YHWH's words, which is the only thing he ever did. He never spoke for himself, just like the spirit never speaks for itself.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#8
I think verse 17 refers to GOD the father, rather than Jesus because in the Hebrew the word is YHWH, not lord. It is the same as verse 16 (YHWH, not lord). So IMO in verse 17 Jesus is speaking YHWH's words, which is the only thing he ever did. He never spoke for himself, just like the spirit never speaks for itself.
Elohime is used when speaking of God Plural.

YHWH is used when one member of the godhead are being referred to.

The creator is the one speaking, he is also the redeemer.
 
May 15, 2013
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#9
Genesis 1:26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.” 27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

Psalm 82:1 God presides in the great assembly; he renders judgment among the “gods”:
2 “How long will you defend the unjust
and show partiality to the wicked?
3 Defend the weak and the fatherless;
uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
4 Rescue the weak and the needy;
deliver them from the hand of the wicked.
5 “The ‘gods’ know nothing, they understand nothing.
They walk about in darkness;
all the foundations of the earth are shaken.
6 “I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
7 But you will die like mere mortals;
you will fall like every other ruler.”

John 10:34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’?
 
Feb 11, 2016
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#10
Jesus (in John) is pointing out what is written in their law (referencing Isaiah's words there)

As is written in Isaiah (that exact way) which says,

Isaiah 82:6 I have said, "Ye"are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

After quoting that (from Isaiah) Jesus continues saying,

John 10:35 If he called "them" gods,
unto whom "the word of God" came,
and the scripture cannot be broken;

John 10:36 Say ye "of him", whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world,
Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God
?

Jesus is pointing out that he was saying he is "the Son of God"
whereas they are saying (in his doing that) as they understood it "that he
blasphemes"
because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God John 10:33
When it is written in their own law
Isaiah 82:6 Have I not said, "Ye"are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

And that is what he quotes to them in the context of that confrontation.

So one could wonder, what was their particular beef with him "in that" if what is shown equally so (as it is in Isaiah) even as Jesus chose to quote that there (which says) "Ye are gods" which depics the same in respects to the children of the most high there? If He himself is saying "I am the Son of God" (the one the Father has sanctified and sent) who they believed not>

So if that saying was true of children (which are as rulers) how much more would that be most especially true of in respects to Jesus Christ (the Son of God). Not to mention as Heb 1:8 shows Psalm 45:6-7 in respects to Christ being ascended there as well. Which verse of scripture Christ did not bring in at that particular point of time (as we are given to see it after the fact).