Ukraine & The American Right

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Should the American Government support Ukraine?

  • They should, its morally correct to do so.

    Votes: 4 33.3%
  • They shouldn't, its morally wrong to interfere.

    Votes: 5 41.7%
  • They should, but we have our own probelms.

    Votes: 1 8.3%
  • America first, let Europe solve its own probelms...

    Votes: 2 16.7%
  • Im not sure...im confused on who is the "good" guys

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    12
P

Polar

Guest
#22
The majority of this is conspiracy talking points. Im a fan of Trump, but Afghanistan was his deal. Biden and co just made a damn mess of it.

You arent fighting any wars, your providing support to Ukraine. You know that 800B P/A military complex needs paid, that money goes back into American corporations.

Again this is the idea that America cant both fix its border issues and other domestic issues, while also having a pro-active foreign policy.
This country has been fighting wars since its inception. It even fought with itself. Current "America" is on a path to destruction from within. God is not interested in our politics....there is a much underlying issue that is rotting the fabric of this country, whether or not that sounds like mere cliche it is nonetheless true.

What many seem to forget, is that what we can sense with our 5 senses, is terminal. Either we grasp the spiritual significance and reality around us or we assume that God is bored with it all and has said all He is going to say. It is already too late for many to change direction and they are so embedded in their own way of thinking they cannot look through the clouds even while saying they can.

Fan of Trump? Not so much actually. Would I vote for him though should that chance rise? Certainly. I am no democrat but not particularly a fan of the GOP either.

I am honestly not certain Trump in office again would be a good thing. I know those who support him think so, but look at what has already been done to keep him out of office. On the other hand, more of the current admin cannot be sustained by this country
 
P

Polar

Guest
#23
ditto

I would ask who do you think you are as you now make it apparent you seem to think you have the answers when others who are living it, are not sure

pretty disappointing frankly

think I will pass on further communication with you as you have bought into what agrees with you and are not open for actual discussion unless you agree with what is said
 
Sep 18, 2022
17
5
3
#24
ditto

I would ask who do you think you are as you now make it apparent you seem to think you have the answers when others who are living it, are not sure

pretty disappointing frankly

think I will pass on further communication with you as you have bought into what agrees with you and are not open for actual discussion unless you agree with what is said
Not true, I have answered actual points. I dont expect to change minds, but im looking for insights more than fox news talking points.

"who do you think you are" really? Its a discussion on Ukraine and thats what to expect a discussion. Your post stating with that condescending arrogance that i shouldnt believe everything on social media, would warrant the response you have just made.
 

SomeDisciple

Well-known member
Jul 4, 2021
1,826
815
113
#25
More like "dismissed actual points".

The American christian-right is not trusting in some "new world order" pact with Sheol, or even in our own military strength. Our projection of power across the globe would dissolve anyway if we don't take care of some important domestic issues.


The politics of the Russia-Ukraine war don't seem so one-sided to me. Dismissing concerns that we are supporting the wrong side as "whataboutism" is not really answering the point- especially when your counter point is irrelevant. The US invades other nations as we see fit without regard to westphalian war morality, so it doesn't make sense for us to react with outrage when Russia does the same.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,426
12,911
113
#26
1) Its in American interests to see Russia fail, why? To ensure China doesnt move on Tiawan. (The real threat to american dominance)
It is in America's interest to mind its own business. Every time the US had interfered in the business of other countries, it has made a mess. As to Taiwan, if push comes to shove, the US will simply stand by and allow Taiwan to be annexed to China, since it has already handed world dominance to China.
2) America is the global superpower; they lead the west. Not the other way around.
No one believes this any more after the American debacles in Iraq and Afghanistan. America is the laughingstock of the Muslim world after Biden handed Afghanistan to the Taliban (along with billions of dollars worth of materiel, building, vehicles, etc). And now Biden is trying to hand Iran nuclear capability on a silver platter so that it can destroy Israel. Of course Israel will make sure that Iran pays a price for this threat.

And now that the military has gone Woke, chosen to remove Christians and conservatives from its ranks, promoted transgenderism and every kind of sexual perversion, lowered the standards to accommodate women, and allowed treasonous generals to remain in office, while firing hundreds of thousands who refused the jab, China must be simply laughing at these shenanigans. A global superpower does not hand over its southern border to Mexican drug cartels and allows Venezuelan (and other) criminals and gangsters to flow in freely. A global superpower does not allow its citizens to be killed with illegal fentanyl flowing across its border daily. The biggest drug lord and human trafficker is Joseph Biden.

The West has absolutely no leadership since all Western leaders have betrayed their own countries and committed treason. No wonder the World Economic Forum can now hold the world hostage while its promotes its evil agenda.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
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India
#27
I have a question regarding Christian Americans and their views on the Ukraine conflict, specifically the financial and military aid provided by the USA. Essentially Billions of foreign aid and weapons.

Going on twitter and the various talking heads on that platform, the American right pundits seem mostly against this aid being provided. My question is why? It feels the American right is trending towards isolationism.
I believe isolationism is wrong. At least there should be complete and outright condemnations of naked Russian aggression, and imperialist style attempts at annexation. If possible, humanitarian and military aid should be sent as well.

Also there should be no equivocation and silly claims like "ah, both sides are to blame" or something like that. No, Russia has caused 10 Million people to suffer and be displaced from their homes, and 1000s more to die and suffer in other ways.

Putin said the fall of the Soviet Union was a catastrophe and he wants to rebuild it. That's what this annexation is about.

President Zelensky asked a good question: "Tomorrow if Russia invades Poland, and makes nuclear threats, will you let Russia take that over too?" If so, Europe will fall one by one. A united European and world response now is much better.

Btw, you may hear some false media reports that Zelensky is anti-Christian or something. He is not. He is from a Jewish background and believes in the Resurrection. On Easter, from St. Sophia's Cathedral in Kyiv, he declared, "Christ is Risen".

 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
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India
#28
Excerpt from the Prayer:

"
Great people of great Ukraine!

Today is a great holiday. And I’m in a great place. The Great St. Sophia Cathedral. In the cathedral, which was founded a thousand years ago, on the field of the sacred battle where the army of Kyivan Rus’-Ukraine defeated the Pechenegs. In the cathedral, which was not destroyed by the Horde invasion or the Nazi occupation, which withstood in spite of everything!

Today we all believe in a new victory for Ukraine. And we are all convinced that we will not be destroyed by any horde or evil.

We are enduring dark times. And on this bright day, most of us are not in bright clothes. But we are fighting for a bright idea. On the bright side. And the truth, people, the Lord and the holy heavenly light are on our side. The power of the patron saint of the human race – Oranta. She is above me. She is above us all.

The unshakable pillar of the Church of Christ, the unbreakable wall of the main stronghold – Kyiv, the Unbreakable Wall of the State. As long as there is Oranta, there is Sophia, and Kyiv stands with her, and the whole of Ukraine stands with them!

Above the image of Oranta are the words from the Psalms: “God dwells in that city; it cannot be destroyed. From the very break of day, God will protect it.” On this Great Day, we all believe that our dawn is coming soon.

Oranta in Latin means “one who prays”. We have all been praying for the last two months. And in the Resurrection of Christ, which symbolizes the great victory of life over death, each of us asks the Lord for one thing. And speaks the same words to heaven. The words of a great and united prayer.

Great and Only God! Save our Ukraine!

Protect those who protect us! Heaven, protect those who defend the native land. Strengthen the will of those who protect us from captivity. Save those who save Ukraine. These are our military, national guards, border guards, our territorial defense, intelligence. These and all our other warriors of light.

Help those who help them. These are volunteers and all people who care. From Ukraine and around the world. Give strength to all who give all their strength. May everyone who seeks always find. May everyone who is on the road always overcome it. And may everyone who does everything possible to save Ukraine never lose faith that everything is possible.

Save the lives of those who save the lives of others. These are all our medics. Our firefighters, rescuers, sappers. May the victory of life be a symbol not only of this holiday. May life win the battle against death every day ...

We believe, God, that in your judgment you will not forget them all. All those who have forgotten all your commandments.

You will not forget about Bucha, Irpin, Borodyanka, Hostomel. All those who survived brutal crimes. Give them and all our land human happiness.

You will not forget about Chernihiv, Mykolaiv, Kherson, Sumy, Kharkiv, Izyum, Kramatorsk and Volnovakha, Popasna. All other towns and villages that hear the terrible explosions. Let them and all of us hear the fireworks of victory.

You will not forget about Mariupol and its heroic defenders. One can destroy the walls, but can’t destroy the foundation on which the morale stands. The morale of our warriors. The morale of the whole country.

We see terrible scenes of war. Let us see a happy picture of peace ...

Last year we celebrated Easter at home because of the pandemic. This year we also celebrate the Resurrection of Christ not as we used to. Because of another virus. Because of the plague called war.

Both last year’s and the current threat are united by one thing – nothing can defeat Ukraine.

The great holiday today gives us great hope and unwavering faith that light will overcome darkness, good will overcome evil, life will overcome death, and therefore Ukraine will surely win!

And on Easter, we ask God for great grace to make our great dream come true – this is another great day – the day when great peace will come to Ukraine. And with it – eternal harmony and prosperity.

With faith and confidence in this – I congratulate all of you on Easter.

Take care of yourselves. Take care of your loved ones. Take care of Ukraine!

Christ is Risen!

He is Risen Indeed."
End of Speech.
God Bless.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,426
12,911
113
#29
At least there should be complete and outright condemnations of naked Russian aggression, and imperialist style attempts at annexation.
There is a fundamental law of nature which was ignored for a long time. A grizzly bear is a predator, not a pet. So condemnation of Russia is not the answer.

The Russian bear has always been the Russian bear. And when it saw that it could grab back many of the former Soviet satellites without a murmur from the West, it went after Chechnya, Georgia, and Crimea. And Obama's non-response to the invasion of Crimea meant that the West and NATO had no teeth. But Ukraine had another option, and over the past eight years it did nothing to build a defensive line against Russian aggression along with its neighbors (without NATO involvement).

Regardless, when Putin started making threats against Ukraine what did Biden and his officials do? They actually encouraged Putin by shutting down the oil and gas industry in North America and buying oil from Russia, and depleting America's oil reserves, thus increasing Russia's war chest. That was a signal to Putin to go to war since America was going to fund this war. So who should be the one under condemnation?
 

SomeDisciple

Well-known member
Jul 4, 2021
1,826
815
113
#30
"Ukraine did nothing wrong"

Why are people sitting and pretending Ukraine isn't a complete and total dumpster fire?
Come on... virtually the whole Ukrainian Navy defected to Russia. I'm not sure Crimea ever wanted to be part of Ukraine in the first place, and the Donetsk region debacle- while I see that there are Russian agitators, that's still a factor that comes from the Ukrainian side.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
544
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India
#31
There is a fundamental law of nature which was ignored for a long time. A grizzly bear is a predator, not a pet. So condemnation of Russia is not the answer.

The Russian bear has always been the Russian bear. And when it saw that it could grab back many of the former Soviet satellites without a murmur from the West, it went after Chechnya, Georgia, and Crimea. And Obama's non-response to the invasion of Crimea meant that the West and NATO had no teeth. But Ukraine had another option, and over the past eight years it did nothing to build a defensive line against Russian aggression along with its neighbors (without NATO involvement).

Regardless, when Putin started making threats against Ukraine what did Biden and his officials do? They actually encouraged Putin by shutting down the oil and gas industry in North America and buying oil from Russia, and depleting America's oil reserves, thus increasing Russia's war chest. That was a signal to Putin to go to war since America was going to fund this war. So who should be the one under condemnation?
Well, I'm talking of something like the below, which Trump said he would do:

"Donald Trump has said he would be able to keep Russian leader Vladimir Putin quiet on the ‘N’ word, a phrase he uses to refer to nuclear weapons, in an interview with Piers Morgan.

In response to Morgan’s question on how to handle Putin’s aggression towards Nato countries, the former president said he would tell Putin, “You cannot use the nuclear word ever again.”


I agree that both Obama and Biden etc have been weak on Putin's aggression. Putin invaded Georgia in 2008; he took Crimea in 2014 and now he's back for more in Ukraine in 2022. Only under Trump he was silent. Evidently, Trump threatened him in private that he would bomb the Kremlin or something, as per that interview with Morgan above.

As for the green agenda, anti-fossil fuels etc, that's also something commies etc promote to keep the west dependent on Russia. At least the UK, first under Johnson and now Truss, is slowly realizing that and trying to stop that. I pray Trump gets back in 2024, and there is strong leadership everywhere and if the Lord Wills, that we avoid catastrophic nuclear war.

God Bless.
 
4

49

Guest
#32
Well, I'm talking of something like the below, which Trump said he would do:

"Donald Trump has said he would be able to keep Russian leader Vladimir Putin quiet on the ‘N’ word, a phrase he uses to refer to nuclear weapons, in an interview with Piers Morgan.

In response to Morgan’s question on how to handle Putin’s aggression towards Nato countries, the former president said he would tell Putin, “You cannot use the nuclear word ever again.”


I agree that both Obama and Biden etc have been weak on Putin's aggression. Putin invaded Georgia in 2008; he took Crimea in 2014 and now he's back for more in Ukraine in 2022. Only under Trump he was silent. Evidently, Trump threatened him in private that he would bomb the Kremlin or something, as per that interview with Morgan above.

As for the green agenda, anti-fossil fuels etc, that's also something commies etc promote to keep the west dependent on Russia. At least the UK, first under Johnson and now Truss, is slowly realizing that and trying to stop that. I pray Trump gets back in 2024, and there is strong leadership everywhere and if the Lord Wills, that we avoid catastrophic nuclear war.

God Bless.
Zechariah 14:12 “And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.”

This convinces me there will be a nuclear chaos of some sort in the not too far future. I do not see the world existing much longer with the iniquity as it is today...
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
544
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India
#33
Well, let's see. I hope and pray nuclear war can be averted. 100s of Millions could die if there was a nuclear war, and maybe most of those would also lose their soul; so imo, Satan would love a nuclear war to happen. I hope we can avoid it.

Anyway, in other news, 1000s of Russians are fleeing Putin's mad mass military mobilization. Putin sent 150,000 Russian Invaders to try to crush and destroy Ukraine; and virtually everyone thought Ukraine would lose. Even US Military Intelligence estimated Ukraine would lose in a few days or few weeks at most. Yet, 7 months later, Russia has had 55,000 deaths and some 100,000 injured, so almost all the 150 K original troops are now out of action. Hence, more are needed.

"In the far west, Finnish border guards reported that traffic from Russia has more than doubled in the past 48 hours. Among those fleeing the draft was 34-year-old Nikita, who did not want to give his full name.

“I am afraid. Because it's a very big mistake, for Russia, for Europe, and of course for Ukraine citizens,” he told Reuters."

https://www.voanews.com/a/thousands...ation-as-anti-war-protests-erupt/6760669.html