What "Scriptures" tell us about the dead and where they are???

[garee]

This is not addressing the state of the "soul", but the body. Nowhere is mentioned "only believers".

Ecclesiastics addresses the wage of sin, a dying creation who spirit. . . the essence of life is corrupted along with the body. Believers are given a new spirit and new heart by which they can commune with the soul of God as two walking together in a greement.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.[/QUOTE}

God's eternal Spirit is described (Job 23) as being of one mind and always does whatsoever his soul as a will pleases. For he performs that which is appointed to us. (Philippians 2:12-13)

It is his soul and spirit work working in us that can make our hearts soft at rest when we do mix faith the unseen in what we do hear or see. Called walking by faith. The soul walk.

In that way Christ demonstrated, through the Son of man that Jesus has sat in the judgment seat of Christ. And as a living suffering paid the sin debt in full.

Men will not literally rise as corrupted flesh and blood resurrected and judged as Zombies. . According to John 3: 188 that judgment is already made. . satisfying the just demand of the letter of the law.. by the law of faith (the unseen) . Making the law perfect or complete.

For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not "is condemned already, because he hath not believed" in the name of the only begotten Son of God. John3:17-18

There will be no second trial or double jeopardy. On the last day death in respect to the letter of the law that kills will be tossed in the fiery judgement of God . . never to rise and condemn a whole creation ever again .

Those who have ben given a new spirt and heart will rise and receive the promise of our living hope that surpasses all human hope or faith a new incorruptible body .

A soul is simply a means of expressing a persons desire it cannot exist apart from a spirit. A broken spirit can cause separation . But a soul without a spirit can do nothing . Its simply silence.

 

[MattforJesus]

I am thinking until an understand about "the dead" we can not understand the Word of God or "rightly divide" the events in these end times.

Right now, alive and in terrestrial bodies, and on the earth, are the "spiritually alive" and the "spiritually dead".

Right now, alive and in celestial bodies, in heaven, are the "spiritually alive" and the "spiritually dead".

There are no dead "souls" in the earth, just old dead "carcasses" , in which souls were once housed, that will never be used again.

No one soul has died. Not one. And the Word proves it.


Words used in the bible for "dead"

nekros (Noun and Adjective)
1. With the Article (hoi nekroi) denotes dead bodies, or corpses, or carcasses in the grave, apart from the personality they once had. OT idiom also.
Gen 23.3,4,6,8. Deut 18.11; 28.26 Jer 7.33, 9.22, 19.7 Ezek 37.9 ( Matt 22.3, 1 Cor 15.35)

The soul will live on forever whether with God or not.

All spirits go back to God whether with God or not and the spirit is not part of anybody when they die physically.

The flesh will be put off the saints, and the wicked, and the saints will have a glorified body, and the wicked will feel the affects of the body forever.

In the Old Testament the dead know nothing, but in the New Testament they might have conscience as in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man but that might be for people that rejected the truth concerning the rich man, and for other people that did not know they could know nothing.

The wicked shall go to the lower parts of the earth, and those who die in Christ are with Jesus for to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

And there are souls under the altar that ask Jesus when He will avenge them and He said when all the saints are with Him, but I do not believe they have their glorified body yet.

Which when the resurrection happens the dead rise first which probably means they will receive their glorified body first for their soul is already with Jesus, which the souls are in heaven with Jesus waiting for the rest of the saints to be with them, and then those that remain shall be caught up and they receive their glorified bodies.

Jesus will reign with all the saints on earth for 1000 years and then the dead shall rise and be judged.

 

[garee]

The soul will live on forever whether with God or not.

All spirits go back to God whether with God or not and the spirit is not part of anybody when they die physically.

The flesh will be put off the saints, and the wicked, and the saints will have a glorified body, and the wicked will feel the affects of the body forever.

In the Old Testament the dead know nothing, but in the New Testament they might have conscience as in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man but that might be for people that rejected the truth concerning the rich man, and for other people that did not know they could know nothing.

The wicked shall go to the lower parts of the earth, and those who die in Christ are with Jesus for to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

And there are souls under the altar that ask Jesus when He will avenge them and He said when all the saints are with Him, but I do not believe they have their glorified body yet.

Which when the resurrection happens the dead rise first which probably means they will receive their glorified body first for their soul is already with Jesus, which the souls are in heaven with Jesus waiting for the rest of the saints to be with them, and then those that remain shall be caught up and they receive their glorified bodies.

Jesus will reign with all the saints on earth for 1000 years and then the dead shall rise and be judged.

The reference in Ecclesiastics is not limited to the old testament. But remains under the Sun the temporal time keeper that will disappears in the new heavens and earth .There will be no night God's glory the light. . Alzheimer's as memory loss is universal part of corruption aging preparing our new spirits in the new heaven and earth drying the tears from under the Sun never to be remembered or come to mind forever more. Aging provide no mercy under the sun Some suffer one aspect or another .Alzheimer's a terrible tribulation of corruption especially with the younger.

Ecclesiastes 12 :1-7 King James Version (KJV) Remember now thy Creator in the days of thy youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw nigh, when thou shalt say, I have no pleasure in them; While the sun, or the light, or the moon, or the stars, be not darkened, nor the clouds return after the rain: In the day when the keepers of the house shall tremble, and the strong men shall bow themselves, and the grinders cease because they are few, and those that look out of the windows be darkened, And the doors shall be shut in the streets, when the sound of the grinding is low, and he shall rise up at the voice of the bird, and all the daughters of musick shall be brought low; Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets: Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Ecclesiastes 1:10-12 King James Version (KJV) Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us.There is no remembrance of former things; neither shall there be any remembrance of things that are to come with those that shall come after.

Isaiah 65:17For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Now is the time we can love one a another. The time we can remember the good works of those who worked with the gospel in his name . Give the widows a jingle while we can.

Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun. Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.Eccl 9: 6-7

 

[garee]

I am thinking until an understand about "the dead" we can not understand the Word of God or "rightly divide" the events in these end times.

Right now, alive and in terrestrial bodies, and on the earth, are the "spiritually alive" and the "spiritually dead".

Right now, alive and in celestial bodies, in heaven, are the "spiritually alive" and the "spiritually dead".

There are no dead "souls" in the earth, just old dead "carcasses" , in which souls were once housed, that will never be used again.

No one soul has died. Not one. And the Word proves it.


Words used in the bible for "dead"

nekros (Noun and Adjective)
1. With the Article (hoi nekroi) denotes dead bodies, or corpses, or carcasses in the grave, apart from the personality they once had. OT idiom also.
Gen 23.3,4,6,8. Deut 18.11; 28.26 Jer 7.33, 9.22, 19.7 Ezek 37.9 ( Matt 22.3, 1 Cor 15.35)

The soul is the desire of a will or mind. Corrupted mankind as to a soul that could commune with the soul of God is dead in its trespasses and sin without the soul of God working in them to both will and do his good pleasure. New creatures given a new spirit that will never die and new heart open the lines of communication. Marvel not.. . we have the power in these earthen bodies of death but they are not of us.

 

[DeighAnn]

The reference in Ecclesiastics is not limited to the old testament. But remains under the Sun the temporal time keeper that will disappears in the new heavens and earth .There will be no night God's glory the light. . Alzheimer's as memory loss is universal part of corruption aging preparing our new spirits in the new heaven and earth drying the tears from under the Sun never to be remembered or come to mind forever more. Aging provide no mercy under the sun Some suffer one aspect or another .Alzheimer's a terrible tribulation of corruption especially with the younger.

It's funny how different we (as in everyone, not just you and I) see the same parts of the Bible.

Ecclesiastes to "the man who walks under the sun"

Ecclesiastes 11:7 Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for the eyes to behold the sun
(To be young with good eyesight is sweet)
Ecclesiastes 11:8 But if a man live many years, and rejoice in them all yet let him remember the days of darkness for they shall be many. All that cometh is vanity.
(But old age is coming and it can last a long time)
Ecclesiastes 11:9 Rejoice, O young man, in thy youth; and let thy heart cheer thee in the days of thy youth, and walk in the ways of thine heart, and in the sight of thine eyes: but know thou, that for all these things God will bring thee into judgment.
(Enjoy that youth, but best be doing it Gods way)
Ecclesiastes 11:10 Therefore remove sorrow from thy heart, and put away evil from thy flesh: for childhood and youth are vanity.
(Youth is fleeting)
Ecclesiastes 12:1 Remember now thy Creator in the days of thy youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw nigh, when thou shalt say, I have no pleasure in them
(Getting old just isn't near as fun)
Ecclesiastes 12:2 While the sun, or the light, or the moon, or the stars, be not darkened, nor the clouds return after the rain
Ecclesiastes 12:3 In the day when the keepers of the house shall tremble, and the strong men shall bow themselves, and the grinders cease because they are few, and those that look out of the windows be darkened,
(muscles start to weaken, posture isn't near as upright, teeth are starting to fall out, eyesight waning)
Ecclesiastes 12:4 And the doors shall be shut in the streets, when the sound of the grinding is low, and he shall rise up at the voice of the bird, and all the daughters of musick shall be brought low
(don't want to go out as much, losing appetite, sleeping during day, losing hearing)
Ecclesiastes 12:5 Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets
(falling down becoming scary, gardening a problem???, personal desire just not the same, friends dying around you)
Ecclesiastes 12:6 Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern.
(and finally this very clay pot fashioned by God that holds our souls while here on earth itself dies)
Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
(and goes back to the dust, and our spirit or "our soul and spiritual body" return to God)
Ecclesiastes 12:8 Vanity of vanities, saith the preacher; all is vanity.
(and the only thing that matters in the end, the only things we take with us are our works for God and how we lived our lives)
Ecclesiastes 12:9 And moreover, because the preacher was wise, he still taught the people knowledge; yea, he gave good heed, and sought out, and set in order many proverbs.
Ecclesiastes 12:10 The preacher sought to find out acceptable words and that which was written was upright, even words of truth.
Ecclesiastes 12:11 The words of the wise are as goads, and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies, which are given from one shepherd.
Ecclesiastes 12:12 And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.
Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments for this is the whole duty of man.
Ecclesiastes 12:14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
(and if that don't tell you that the "soul" that goes on to heaven doesn't take and have a complete memory of what they did here in this life, I don't know what would).

The flesh holds our soul while on earth, the celestial body is for the kingdom of God and all have one. At least that is what God says.

All will stand before God for judgment. And into the lake of fire will go the "body and soul". If we didn't all have that second body upon death, heaven would have those with bodies and those without and then at some point God would have to spend time putting all those "without souls" into bodies for judgment and since there is going to be preaching of the everlasting gospel and trips to the temple for sacrifice and worship during millennium, that would be just, weird)

Matthew 10:26 Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known.
Matthew 10:27 What I tell you in darkness, that speak ye in light and what ye hear in the ear, that preach ye upon the housetops.
Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

SOUL 5590 psuche
the vital breath, breath of life, the soul as the seat of affections and will, the self, a human person, an individual

to breathe, blow which is the root of the English words "psyche, psychology" - soul, a person's distinct identity (unique personhood) i.e. individual personality

the seat of the feelings, desires, affections, aversions, (our soul, heart etc.)

the soul as an essence which differs from the body and is not dissolved by death

BODY 4983 a body
body, flesh, the body of the Church

both of men and animals
the living body
the body consisting of flesh
bodies celestial "our heavenly bodies"
bodies terrestrial "our earthly bodies"

tropically is used of a large or small number of men closely united into one society or family (social, ethical, mystical)
of the church

Judgement will be on "what you thought and what you did, who you are and all that takes memory. in fact our memory will be much better not having any afflictions associated with the flesh, like Alzheimer's.
It is only the dead flesh that knows nothing. Spirit is that what "animates" the body and when it leaves the flesh body it then animates the celestial one.

 

[DeighAnn]

The soul is the desire of a will or mind. Corrupted mankind as to a soul that could commune with the soul of God is dead in its trespasses and sin without the soul of God working in them to both will and do his good pleasure. New creatures given a new spirit that will never die and new heart open the lines of communication. Marvel not.. . we have the power in these earthen bodies of death but they are not of us.

I don't understand, do you believe there are "souls" in the dirt of the earth?

I don't want you to think I am trying to "trap" you into saying anything. I am only interested in the TRUTH of Gods Word. So here is what I believe. We all are created by God. We all have 2 bodies. We are all either on earth in the flesh body or in heaven in the spirit body. In heaven means in paradise. Paradise has 2 sides, the right and the wrong.

When Jesus returns, all who have died "previous" to that return are in paradise. (to be absent, when the silver cord parts...)

So when He returns, at that very moment, the 2 witnesses who are "dead" flesh and have been for 3 1/2 days, will rise, 1st resurrection

There are those who have taken the mark of satan and they are therefore, "dead in Christ",

And there those who have not taken the mark, "alive in Christ" and they will be "changed", they are also of the 1st resurrection.

For the Lords Day, there will be all those who through out the last 6000yrs+ accepted our Lord and Saviour on one side, and all those who didn't on the other and ALL EVEN ANIMALS will be in "CELESTIAL BODIES". There will be no more flesh, for flesh and blood can not inherit the kindom of God.
Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
Isaiah 11:2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
Isaiah 11:3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:
Isaiah 11:4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.
Isaiah 11:5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.
Isaiah 11:6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
Isaiah 11:7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
Isaiah 11:8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
Isaiah 11:9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.
Isaiah 11:10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.
Isaiah 11:11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
Isaiah 11:12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Isaiah 11:13 The envy also of Ephraim shall depart, and the adversaries of Judah shall be cut off: Ephraim shall not envy Judah, and Judah shall not vex Ephraim.
Isaiah 11:14 But they shall fly upon the shoulders of the Philistines toward the west; they shall spoil them of the east together: they shall lay their hand upon Edom and Moab; and the children of Ammon shall obey them.
Isaiah 11:15 And the LORD shall utterly destroy the tongue of the Egyptian sea; and with his mighty wind shall he shake his hand over the river, and shall smite it in the seven streams, and make men go over dryshod.
Isaiah 11:16 And there shall be an highway for the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria; like as it was to Israel in the day that he came up out of the land of Egypt.

With Satan bound so no evil influence to cloud the truth, GODS WORD, the everlasting gospel will be preached while at the same time love and obedience to God will be taught. And those who are dead, well, spiritually dead, have to stay that way until the next time satan is let out to "test" for the last time.

Will there be some who are "just so bad" that they are not only on the "wrong" side, but don't even get to "hear" the everlasting gospel and will be held in some dark pit till they are tossed into the lake of fire?? I don't know. I haven't been given that information from the Word yet but God forgive me, I sure do hope so.

As "forever" , I think this, is the end of the Lords Day, considered a part of the 2nd earth age, so the end of the 2nd earth age.
Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

And this is the beginning of the 3rd Earth age,
Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And as such, the lake of fire is also passed away. All who went into the lake of fire, blotted out from ever having existed, at least for us in our memories. Their smoke going up forever and disappearing into the vastness of the universe. I think as a second witness this works really well

Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Ezekiel 28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

[garee]

I don't understand, do you believe there are "souls" in the dirt of the earth?

I don't want you to think I am trying to "trap" you into saying anything. I am only interested in the TRUTH of Gods Word. So here is what I believe. We all are created by God. We all have 2 bodies. We are all either on earth in the flesh body or in heaven in the spirit body. In heaven means in paradise. Paradise has 2 sides, the right and the wrong.

When Jesus returns, all who have died "previous" to that return are in paradise. (to be absent, when the silver cord parts...)

So when He returns, at that very moment, the 2 witnesses who are "dead" flesh and have been for 3 1/2 days, will rise, 1st resurrection

There are those who have taken the mark of satan and they are therefore, "dead in Christ",

And there those who have not taken the mark, "alive in Christ" and they will be "changed", they are also of the 1st resurrection.

For the Lords Day, there will be all those who through out the last 6000yrs+ accepted our Lord and Saviour on one side, and all those who didn't on the other and ALL EVEN ANIMALS will be in "CELESTIAL BODIES". There will be no more flesh, for flesh and blood can not inherit the kindom of God.
Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
Isaiah 11:2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
Isaiah 11:3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:
Isaiah 11:4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.
Isaiah 11:5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.
Isaiah 11:6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
Isaiah 11:7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
Isaiah 11:8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
Isaiah 11:9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.
Isaiah 11:10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.
Isaiah 11:11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
Isaiah 11:12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Isaiah 11:13 The envy also of Ephraim shall depart, and the adversaries of Judah shall be cut off: Ephraim shall not envy Judah, and Judah shall not vex Ephraim.
Isaiah 11:14 But they shall fly upon the shoulders of the Philistines toward the west; they shall spoil them of the east together: they shall lay their hand upon Edom and Moab; and the children of Ammon shall obey them.
Isaiah 11:15 And the LORD shall utterly destroy the tongue of the Egyptian sea; and with his mighty wind shall he shake his hand over the river, and shall smite it in the seven streams, and make men go over dryshod.
Isaiah 11:16 And there shall be an highway for the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria; like as it was to Israel in the day that he came up out of the land of Egypt.

With Satan bound so no evil influence to cloud the truth, GODS WORD, the everlasting gospel will be preached while at the same time love and obedience to God will be taught. And those who are dead, well, spiritually dead, have to stay that way until the next time satan is let out to "test" for the last time.

Will there be some who are "just so bad" that they are not only on the "wrong" side, but don't even get to "hear" the everlasting gospel and will be held in some dark pit till they are tossed into the lake of fire?? I don't know. I haven't been given that information from the Word yet but God forgive me, I sure do hope so.

As "forever" , I think this, is the end of the Lords Day, considered a part of the 2nd earth age, so the end of the 2nd earth age.
Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

And this is the beginning of the 3rd Earth age,
Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And as such, the lake of fire is also passed away. All who went into the lake of fire, blotted out from ever having existed, at least for us in our memories. Their smoke going up forever and disappearing into the vastness of the universe. I think as a second witness this works really well

Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Ezekiel 28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

Hi thanks for the reply.

I do not see "souls" as having to do with the lifeless, spiritless dirt of the earth . The soul is the unseen line of communication that one being has with another. The soul reveals ones inwards thoughts the things of the heart. . In that way we are informed in Job 23 that God is of one mind and always does whatsoever his soul desires . The soul that dies is a soul that has no living communication with God . This is because it is God who works in us to both will and empower us to do the good pleasure. A soulful work of His Spirit.He performs that which is appointed to us as we are yoked with him. When mankind sinned the soul of God departed . A man must be born again through the soulful work of God. The hearing of faith.

Both Job 23 and Philippian2 work together to show the soulful work of God .

Job 23 :13-16 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.For he performeth the thing that is appointed for me: and many such things are with him. Therefore am I troubled at his presence: when I consider, I am afraid of him. For God maketh my heart soft, and the Almighty troubleth me:

Philipiapins2: 12-13 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

 

[garee]

When Jesus returns, all who have died "previous" to that return are in paradise. (to be absent, when the silver cord parts...)

To be absent of the body is the separation of spirit and flesh as well as faith from the ability work. Dead forever never to rise.

The dead cannot work. The corrupted flesh subject to death according the law returns to the spiritless dirt it was formed from and the spirit subject to the law returns to the Father of all Spirit life. You could say to the bosom of Abraham or called Paradise referred to as the father's House of many mansions. The invisible Holy unseen place of God's glory called "the city of God" named after his bride who he named "Christian" a word with no other meaning added literally means "Residents of the city of Christ". Named after her husband. . Christ. Its one of those words that seems to have lost the part of the meaning that I would think help understand some of the more difficult language in Revelation 21 as well as other places that speak of His eternal bride the church. Like another reference "lively stones that make up the spiritual house of God the church". Followers of Christ is a name given to it which is true. Christians as residents of the city of Christ as the bride of Christ it would seem to speak more to the new creation . They follow their unseen husband by faith

For those who believe not they will not hear the wake up call on the last day and rise to new life given a incorruptible body .

So when He returns, at that very moment, the 2 witnesses who are "dead" flesh and have been for 3 1/2 days, will rise, 1st resurrection

Two or three represents the witness of God. Two or three working together as one . A cord of three is not easily broken etc

The two witness are the law and the prophets signified by Moses to represent the letter of the law and Elias the unseen Spirit of the law. . called the law of faith . You could say the law of all things written in the entire body 66 books. When working together they make up the perfect law. Apart from each other . . death .

The gospel of peace will be silenced for a period of time

There are those who have taken the mark of satan and they are therefore, "dead in Christ",
Romans 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:

I would say dead in Adam. 666 the number of unconverted mankind . "Life in Christ"

Romans 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:

 

[DeighAnn]

Hi thanks for the reply.

I do not see "souls" as having to do with the lifeless, spiritless dirt of the earth . The soul is the unseen line of communication that one being has with another. The soul reveals ones inwards thoughts the things of the heart. . In that way we are informed in Job 23 that God is of one mind and always does whatsoever his soul desires . The soul that dies is a soul that has no living communication with God . This is because it is God who works in us to both will and empower us to do the good pleasure. A soulful work of His Spirit.He performs that which is appointed to us as we are yoked with him. When mankind sinned the soul of God departed . A man must be born again through the soulful work of God. The hearing of faith.

Both Job 23 and Philippian2 work together to show the soulful work of God .

Job 23 :13-16 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.For he performeth the thing that is appointed for me: and many such things are with him. Therefore am I troubled at his presence: when I consider, I am afraid of him. For God maketh my heart soft, and the Almighty troubleth me:

Philipiapins2: 12-13 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

If you could, give me somethin from anywhere other than in Job 1- 38, but Philippians works on it own pretty much think. I think you and I may look at soul and spirit opposite. I don't believe there is any death to any soul until the lake of fire and God is the only one who can kill a soul, yet we can be spiritually dead, (but soulfully dead?? IDK, I have never even heard the term, I don't think. But all souls belong to God and we can't do anything with it as far as life and death are concerned. The soul is the being God creates, the spirit is the "what we make of the life given us". But I do agree, once a soul is cast into the lake of fire, there is no communication with anyone ever again, not even itself. And yes, we are definitely 180 on the soul and spirit thing.

Last 2 or three sentences before "hearing of faith, and hearing of faith? little funny for me. Gods will is "that all should come to repentance and be saved. They wont. God works "in us" and "through us" but doesn't work "for us" or do "the work" for us. Something of wording doesn't feel quite right, or true to the truth. His spirit works in me so that I may follow His will and work in ways that please Him.

The Greek "
God for is the {One} working in you both to will and work according to {His} good pleasure

Well, we will see if everyone on the Lords Day is in their " celestial body or not". The Word says to everyone their own seed and everyone has two bodies. I am going with that.